Holy Fist Batman!!!

[Grear Bylls]

Quick question: let's say I'm playing a Paladin, and I have the tavern brawler feat. As a paladin, you get many abilities to make you better at using holy weapon attacks, like Smite and Sacred Weapon. The questions:

1. Does the Divine Smite work with an Unarmed Strike?
2. Do the Smite SPELLS work with Unarmed Strike?
3. Does the Sacred Weapon ability work on Unarmed Strike?
4. Do any of these work on Improvised Weapons too?
5. If you hit a creature with a magic object (ex. shield), does it do magical damage?

Just somethings I'm asking about for a character concept.

[Davrix]

Quick question: let's say I'm playing a Paladin, and I have the tavern brawler feat. As a paladin, you get many abilities to make you better at using holy weapon attacks, like Smite and Sacred Weapon. The questions:

1. Does the Divine Smite work with an Unarmed Strike?
2. Do the Smite SPELLS work with Unarmed Strike?
3. Does the Sacred Weapon ability work on Unarmed Strike?
4. Do any of these work on Improvised Weapons too?
5. If you hit a creature with a magic object (ex. shield), does it do magical damage?

Just somethings I'm asking about for a character concept.

Some yeses here and some no's. However I think you would be bettered serve asking your Dm to let you do this as a holy brawler sounds fun to me and bonus points if you make him a luchador paladin.

[Foxhound438]

Quick question: let's say I'm playing a Paladin, and I have the tavern brawler feat. As a paladin, you get many abilities to make you better at using holy weapon attacks, like Smite and Sacred Weapon. The questions:

1. Does the Divine Smite work with an Unarmed Strike?
2. Do the Smite SPELLS work with Unarmed Strike?
3. Does the Sacred Weapon ability work on Unarmed Strike?
4. Do any of these work on Improvised Weapons too?
5. If you hit a creature with a magic object (ex. shield), does it do magical damage?

Just somethings I'm asking about for a character concept.

1)yes. they require a "melee weapon attack", which unarmed strikes technically count for.
2)yes, as above.
3)No, unfortunately while attacking with your fist is a "melee weapon attack", this spell checks for a certain kind of object, not a certain kind of event. That said, if my player wanted to do it, I would be fine with it.
4)triple yes. If an object is used as an improvised weapon, it's treated as a weapon for as long as you're doing so
5)debatable. On the one hand, the (((weapon))) is a magical object, but on the other hand, you could argue that the magic you use to enchant a weapon is totally different to the magic you use to enchant armor. while both are technically a "+1" while also being a weapon, there may be an in-world difference between being a "+1 weapon" and being a "+1 shield". But if we're going total RAW, even if it's not getting a bonus to attack and damage, a magic shield used as a weapon would still be a weapon that's by some means magical, so a computer would probably say it's a "magical weapon" when checking for spells like "magic weapon" (this may be detrimental) or damage resistance of creatures (this would be good)- it's a double edged shield in that sense.

[Grear Bylls]

Some yeses here and some no's. However I think you would be bettered serve asking your Dm to let you do this as a holy brawler sounds fun to me and bonus points if you make him a luchador paladin.

That's actually exactly what he is! Combo of Barbarian, Bard, and Paladin to make a grappling, wrestling, supporting wrestler!

[Unoriginal]

That's actually exactly what he is! Combo of Barbarian, Bard, and Paladin to make a grappling, wrestling, supporting wrestler!

If you want to be good at wrestling, you could cut out the middle men and do a Barbarian/Rogue.

Sneak attack might work better than smite, maybe.

[Lapak]

If you want to be good at wrestling, you could cut out the middle men and do a Barbarian/Rogue.

Sneak attack might work better than smite, maybe.
Maybe if you want to make a rudo, but the OP is clearly shooting for a heroic luchador here. El Santo would never stoop to such tactics while fighting for the common man!

[Grear Bylls]

If you want to be good at wrestling, you could cut out the middle men and do a Barbarian/Rogue.

Sneak attack might work better than smite, maybe.

Originally was gonna do that, but I wanted to be the face. Besides, I was joining at 8th level. So far I'm still 5 Barb, 3 Swords Bard. Eventually gonna go to 6 barb, 5 Bard, 4 Devotion. Other than that, idk.

EDIT: I think I'll eventually wind up being 8 Bear Totem, 5 Swords Bard, 4 Devotion Paladin, 3 Champion. This would get me better crits, smites, maneuvers, speed, rage, spells, resistances, action surge, many fighting styles, lay on hands, and good stats with tavern brawler and athlete: 20 Str, 14 Dex, 14 Con, 10 Int, 8 Wis, 16 Cha. I would call this guy the Holy Fist. Originally a wrestler, but effectively becomes a superhero. Might be able to pick up Cloak of Protection, Bracers of Defense, Ring of Protection, etc. How does that sound?

[GlenSmash!]

1)yes. they require a "melee weapon attack", which unarmed strikes technically count for.
2)yes, as above.
3)No, unfortunately while attacking with your fist is a "melee weapon attack", this spell checks for a certain kind of object, not a certain kind of event. That said, if my player wanted to do it, I would be fine with it.
4)triple yes. If an object is used as an improvised weapon, it's treated as a weapon for as long as you're doing so
5)debatable. On the one hand, the (((weapon))) is a magical object, but on the other hand, you could argue that the magic you use to enchant a weapon is totally different to the magic you use to enchant armor. while both are technically a "+1" while also being a weapon, there may be an in-world difference between being a "+1 weapon" and being a "+1 shield". But if we're going total RAW, even if it's not getting a bonus to attack and damage, a magic shield used as a weapon would still be a weapon that's by some means magical, so a computer would probably say it's a "magical weapon" when checking for spells like "magic weapon" (this may be detrimental) or damage resistance of creatures (this would be good)- it's a double edged shield in that sense.

This.

On number 5. I would argue that an enchantment to make a shield more defensive does not make it more offensive. The Enchanter would have needed to have that in mind when enchanting the shield.

I would however allow it to bypass resistance or immunity to non-magical damage as I like to reward clever (or at least outside of the box) play.

Of course YMMV.

[Grear Bylls]

Also 1 more: how does dueling work with these? +2 to Damage on fist, improvised weapon, both, neither?

[leogobsin]

I would probably say Dueling works with an improvised weapon, but not an unarmed strike (Dueling gives a bonus to damage with a weapon, unarmed strikes are by definition not using a weapon).

[SirGraystone]

There's an ancient weapon call a Cestus which was a kind of battle glove or gauntlet. Probably would 1d4 Bludgeoning damage. If your DM can agree with that, it would be a weapon and you can just punch with it, so Smite and the spells would work on it.

[Kyrinthic]

Originally was gonna do that, but I wanted to be the face. Besides, I was joining at 8th level. So far I'm still 5 Barb, 3 Swords Bard. Eventually gonna go to 6 barb, 5 Bard, 4 Devotion. Other than that, idk.

EDIT: I think I'll eventually wind up being 8 Bear Totem, 5 Swords Bard, 4 Devotion Paladin, 3 Champion. This would get me better crits, smites, maneuvers, speed, rage, spells, resistances, action surge, many fighting styles, lay on hands, and good stats with tavern brawler and athlete: 20 Str, 14 Dex, 14 Con, 10 Int, 8 Wis, 16 Cha. I would call this guy the Holy Fist. Originally a wrestler, but effectively becomes a superhero. Might be able to pick up Cloak of Protection, Bracers of Defense, Ring of Protection, etc. How does that sound?


Swords bard? Boo! The single most wrestler like ability a bard can get is cutting words, and only lore bards get it. Insulting your foe to wrestle worse is awesome.

Mechanically my similar wrestler is just bear barb 6 (to lift stuff and attack more) and Lore bard 5 (so far) for cutting words and expertise. I have a belt of strength and a cloak of displacement though. The belt lets me focus on con for hp/ac, and cha for more cutting words uses, and the displacement cloak really helps not being hit, especially with cutting words available.

[Grear Bylls]

Swords bard? Boo! The single most wrestler like ability a bard can get is cutting words, and only lore bards get it. Insulting your foe to wrestle worse is awesome.

Mechanically my similar wrestler is just bear barb 6 (to lift stuff and attack more) and Lore bard 5 (so far) for cutting words and expertise. I have a belt of strength and a cloak of displacement though. The belt lets me focus on con for hp/ac, and cha for more cutting words uses, and the displacement cloak really helps not being hit, especially with cutting words available.

While I agree, I wanted to go this way more. I specifically needed a speed of 50 for a combo. Plus, the maneuvers are flavorful, and this one fits my character more. Your idea's cool, but doesn't fit me. Thx though!

[Kyrinthic]

While I agree, I wanted to go this way more. I specifically needed a speed of 50 for a combo. Plus, the maneuvers are flavorful, and this one fits my character more. Your idea's cool, but doesn't fit me. Thx though!

As long as you are having fun its all good, but man, cutting words is so much fun to use :)

[Grear Bylls]

As long as you are having fun its all good, but man, cutting words is so much fun to use :)

So is dropping an enemy from 20 feet in the air, then falling on them ;)

[Asmotherion]

Quick question: let's say I'm playing a Paladin, and I have the tavern brawler feat. As a paladin, you get many abilities to make you better at using holy weapon attacks, like Smite and Sacred Weapon. The questions:

1. Does the Divine Smite work with an Unarmed Strike?
2. Do the Smite SPELLS work with Unarmed Strike?
3. Does the Sacred Weapon ability work on Unarmed Strike?
4. Do any of these work on Improvised Weapons too?
5. If you hit a creature with a magic object (ex. shield), does it do magical damage?

Just somethings I'm asking about for a character concept.

In case you get issues, get a custom Brass Knuckles that deal 1d4 Bludgeoning Damage, and be done with the dilhema.

Or a Gauntlet, as an improvised weapon, if Brass Knuckles are a problem for your DM, which have special metal coating on the knuckles. You may even go for "wolverin gauntlets" instead, for slashing or piersing, depending on the length and use.

[Grear Bylls]

I'm actually working on a guide for the Unarmed fighter archetype that should come out shortly.

P.S. how do you add something to your sig?

[Xihirli]

Signature is under settings.