Sneak attacking with cantrips

[samuraijaques]

Hey guys, my monk died (eaten by a fungus giant) and I had to roll up a new character. I am playing a bladesinger/arcane trickster and loving it. It's an amazing multiclass and I would recommend it to anyone. Anyway, I played my first session with the new character today and realized that you can't sneak attack with spell attacks :(. I understand why they did this but it just feels like the arcane trickster of all classes should have had this little rider attached somewhere. I was thinking of just adding it to cantrips. It seems so thematically appropriate. Would this be overpowered?

[Spacehamster]

Hey guys, my monk died (eaten by a fungus giant) and I had to roll up a new character. I am playing a bladesinger/arcane trickster and loving it. It's an amazing multiclass and I would recommend it to anyone. Anyway, I played my first session with the new character today and realized that you can't sneak attack with spell attacks :(. I understand why they did this but it just feels like the arcane trickster of all classes should have had this little rider attached somewhere. I was thinking of just adding it to cantrips. It seems so thematically appropriate. Would this be overpowered?

Booming blade and green flame blade applied sneak attack as far as I know?

[Xihirli]

Hey guys, my monk died (eaten by a fungus giant) and I had to roll up a new character. I am playing a bladesinger/arcane trickster and loving it. It's an amazing multiclass and I would recommend it to anyone. Anyway, I played my first session with the new character today and realized that you can't sneak attack with spell attacks :(. I understand why they did this but it just feels like the arcane trickster of all classes should have had this little rider attached somewhere. I was thinking of just adding it to cantrips. It seems so thematically appropriate. Would this be overpowered?

Are you the DM and the player?

[CircleOfTheRock]

My question to your question - why do you want to Sneak Attack with cantrips? They do less damage than even a shortbow (assuming you have a decent Dex mod) and a lot less than a rapier with greenflame blade. What advantage do you get from using cantrips to attack at all?

[ProsecutorGodot]

Booming Blade and Green Flame Blade can in fact be used for Sneak Attack, as mentioned above. These spells require a weapon attack with the weapon, if that weapon is Finesse then it qualifies for Sneak Attack.

If you're using other cantrips, such as Firebolt or Shocking Grasp, I'm not sure about your reasoning since they're inferior to Shortbow(allowing Sneak Attack) and Cunning Action:Disengage.

[Lombra]

My question to your question - why do you want to Sneak Attack with cantrips? They do less damage than even a shortbow (assuming you have a decent Dex mod) and a lot less than a rapier with greenflame blade. What advantage do you get from using cantrips to attack at all?

They are better than any single attack after level 5.

[ProsecutorGodot]

They are better than any single attack after level 5.

I'm not sure if I'd consider a 2d10+Int Firebolt that much better than 1d6+Dex Shortbow with 2d6 Sneak Attack. Perhaps in other cases, but this character is at the very least Wizard 2/ Rogue 3. This actually depends quite heavily on whether the characters Int score is that much higher than Dex.

It would go quite a ways in explaining why they're a bit reluctant to be trying a ranged weapon over a ranged cantrip.

[Lombra]

I'm not sure if I'd consider a 2d10+Int Firebolt that much better than 1d6+Dex Shortbow with 2d6 Sneak Attack. Perhaps in other cases, but this character is at the very least Wizard 2/ Rogue 3. This actually depends quite heavily on whether the characters Int score is that much higher than Dex.

It would go quite a ways in explaining why they're a bit reluctant to be trying a ranged weapon over a ranged cantrip.

The point was:

If you could add sneak attack to a cantrip, it would be better (you don't add int to the damage rollof cantrips by the way) than a shortbow (post level 5).

[samuraijaques]

Sorry, I wasn't specific enough, I meant adding sneak attack to the attack cantrips that it can't already be applied to. Specifically in this instance I was looking at firebolt.


My question to your question - why do you want to Sneak Attack with cantrips? They do less damage than even a shortbow (assuming you have a decent Dex mod) and a lot less than a rapier with greenflame blade. What advantage do you get from using cantrips to attack at all?

After 5th level they start doing a lot more than a short bow even with 20 dex. The reason is just to have a ranged attack cantrip option that can utilize the rogue's main class feature.


I'm not sure if I'd consider a 2d10+Int Firebolt that much better than 1d6+Dex Shortbow with 2d6 Sneak Attack. Perhaps in other cases, but this character is at the very least Wizard 2/ Rogue 3. This actually depends quite heavily on whether the characters Int score is that much higher than Dex.

It would go quite a ways in explaining why they're a bit reluctant to be trying a ranged weapon over a ranged cantrip.

You don't get to add your casting stat to damage on cantrips unless you have one of a very specific set of class features. I'm not reluctant to use a ranged weapon, it just feels thematically more appropriate to me to have an arcane trickster using cantrips as their ranged attacks and I would like to be able to utilize the main rogue class feature while doing that.

Hopefully that helps clear up some of the confusion.

[hymer]

Would this be overpowered?
It would certainly be a bump. For one thing, you can focus on one ability for your at-will damage, and that ability will also be the casting stat for your spells. For another, the damage will eventually surpass that of the shortbow. And for a third, firebolt specifically would allow you to sneak attack out to 120', where the short bow gets disadvantage after 80.

So you're basically asking for a series of small-to-medium sized bonuses on your at will damage. If I were your DM, I'd say no. We could perhaps refluff something, though.

[ProsecutorGodot]

The point was:

If you could add sneak attack to a cantrip, it would be better (you don't add int to the damage rollof cantrips by the way) than a shortbow (post level 5).

I somehow got GFB's second hit stuck in my head and just slapped +int on there, I don't know exactly what I was thinking.

Even worse is that I went back to add that before I posted :smalleek:

[Grod_The_Giant]

A shortbow at 5th level does d6+4 (7.5), while a firebolt does 2d10 (11). It's a slight power boost, but not much of one, and the increased MAD (you still need Dex for AC and skills), opportunity cost (you could have taken Minor Illusion or Shape Water or something that grants new abilities), and the frequency of fire resistance are all points against it. I'd say it's fine overall, although I'm A) Not concerned with small DPR shifts and B) Generally in favor of allowing Sneak Attack with anything.

[Vogie]

If I was going to allow it, I'd probably only allow it to effect cantrips with a single ranged spell attack without the leveling factored in. So a firebolt would be a ranged attack with a 1d10, regardless of level.

[RSP]

Keep in mind "Yes add Sneak Attack to cantrips" makes a Warlock dip amazing for a Rogue.

[PhantomSoul]

Keep in mind "Yes add Sneak Attack to cantrips" makes a Warlock dip amazing for a Rogue.

I was thinking the same thing... that gets pretty crazy...

[nickl_2000]

I was thinking the same thing... that gets pretty crazy...

It only makes the chance of a sneak attack happening more likely. You can still apply a sneak attack to only 1 hit per round. From levels 5-10 you have 2 blasts, so it's the same amount of attacks as someone with 2 weapons or XBow Expert (yes I realize that both these options require a bonus attack). I mean yes, it's powerful, but is it really overwhelmingly so?

[PhantomSoul]

It only makes the chance of a sneak attack happening more likely. You can still apply a sneak attack to only 1 hit per round. From levels 5-10 you have 2 blasts, so it's the same amount of attacks as someone with 2 weapons or XBow Expert (yes I realize that both these options require a bonus attack). I mean yes, it's powerful, but is it really overwhelmingly so?

I don't think it's that overwhelming, just that it's further increasing the motivation to pillage a class that was already incredibly appealing to pillage.

(And yes, that's a pretty massive difference in practice even at levels 5-10, and it only gets bigger from level 11 on. It also means the stat you're using has completely changed, which could be good or bad, up to you. And you've avoided the entire [finesse/ranged] weapon restriction and -- for Eldritch Blast -- you can get all types of interactions. There's also the legitimate slippery slope questions to ask: (a) is it still and should it still be only cantrips out of spells, and (b) what other effects will you also add to spells? Eldritch Blast with Divine Smite sounds quite incredible -- where do lines get drawn and/or by what principles to lines get drawn? Because up to 4 chances at Sneak Attack instead of 1 without even using a bonus action and getting the potential for longer range with no required weapon at all is actually big.)

[nickl_2000]

I don't think it's that overwhelming, just that it's further increasing the motivation to pillage a class that was already incredibly appealing to pillage.

Oh I agree completely. The warlock dip is silly powerful, and I'm doing it with one of my characters that currently on hold so I'm guilty to. However, it's still a harder one since you would need to be using your charisma to attack, which isn't traditionally a stat you max out for a rogue.

Actually it may create some interestingly different Rogue characters

[RSP]

I don't think it's that overwhelming, just that it's further increasing the motivation to pillage a class that was already incredibly appealing to pillage.

A Rogue 10/Warlock 1 that maxed Cha rather than Dex can have 3 chances at 5d6 SA damage while still using their BA to Disengage, Dash, Hide, whatever.

A Rogue 11 has, at most, 2 chances to get SA and that second chance uses its BA.

I think that's a significant difference.

[PhantomSoul]

(And yes, that's a pretty massive difference in practice even at levels 5-10, and it only gets bigger from level 11 on. It also means the stat you're using has completely changed, which could be good or bad, up to you. And you've avoided the entire [finesse/ranged] weapon restriction and -- for Eldritch Blast -- you can get all types of interactions. There's also the legitimate slippery slope questions to ask: (a) is it still and should it still be only cantrips out of spells, and (b) what other effects will you also add to spells? Eldritch Blast with Divine Smite sounds quite incredible -- where do lines get drawn and/or by what principles to lines get drawn? Because up to 4 chances at Sneak Attack instead of 1 without even using a bonus action and getting the potential for longer range with no required weapon at all is actually big.)

My edit went up after the response, so I'll quote it and now it ends up in the right spot!

And you've probably given Sneak Attack VERY different damage types -- it's now Fire damage... or Force damage... Or whatever you're going for... And it's magic damage (whereas that, depending on the DM, likely depended on the weapon beforehand).

[RSP]

Oh I agree completely. The warlock dip is silly powerful, and I'm doing it with one of my characters that currently on hold so I'm guilty to. However, it's still a harder one since you would need to be using your charisma to attack, which isn't traditionally a stat you max out for a rogue.

Actually it may create some interestingly different Rogue characters

Why wouldn't Rogues have good Cha? It's usually the 2nd best score on the ones I've seen and usually highly needed for Deception and Persuasion, two important abilities of most Rogues. Every Rogue trope from Han Solo to Robin Hood is heavily based on Cha.

[nickl_2000]

My edit went up after the response, so I'll quote it and now it ends up in the right spot!

And you've probably given Sneak Attack VERY different damage types -- it's now Fire damage... or Force damage... Or whatever you're going for... And it's magic damage (whereas that, depending on the DM, likely depended on the weapon beforehand).

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying it should happen. I don't think you should be able to sneak attack with a Cantrip, the rogue is balanced around it using an actual weapon. I was simply playing devil advocate.

[Uzgul]

I would make a homebrew feat for this. Something like this:
- you learn one wizard cantrip, that requires an attack role.
- you may use sneak attack on wizard cantrips, that require an attack role.

Seems balanced to me. The average dpr should be lower than crossbow experts. In return you become more flexible with damage to types.

[PhantomSoul]

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying it should happen. I don't think you should be able to sneak attack with a Cantrip, the rogue is balanced around it using an actual weapon. I was simply playing devil advocate.

I'm with you there -- I just wasn't convinced by the devil in this occasion! ;)

(I guess I'm not getting that Warlock dip...)

[nickl_2000]

Why wouldn't Rogues have good Cha? It's usually the 2nd best score on the ones I've seen and usually highly needed for Deception and Persuasion, two important abilities of most Rogues. Every Rogue trope from Han Solo to Robin Hood is heavily based on Cha.

I didn't say they wouldn't have good Cha, I said that it would be a sacrifice. Your Dex is likely going to be the best for AC, saves, and normal attack. So you would still be using your secondary stats as an attacking stat. That will never be as good as using you main stat. Plus if Cha is your secondary stat, then you are sacrificing HP from Con, which can be pretty painful.

[nickl_2000]

I'm with you there -- I just wasn't convinced by the devil in this occasion! ;)

(I guess I'm not getting that Warlock dip...)

I rolled a 3 on my persuasion roll :smallcool:

[Contrast]

Why wouldn't Rogues have good Cha? It's usually the 2nd best score on the ones I've seen and usually highly needed for Deception and Persuasion, two important abilities of most Rogues. Every Rogue trope from Han Solo to Robin Hood is heavily based on Cha.

Particularly if you're going for a magical rogue you're typically going to want decent dex and int. Plus con because no-one wants to tank con.

People may want their talky rogues (whoo swashbuckler) but nothing in the base class particularly synergises with charisma. If anything the class encourages you to leave charisma mediocre as you can make up for an average stat by putting expertise in those skills if you want them.

[RSP]

I didn't say they wouldn't have good Cha, I said that it would be a sacrifice. Your Dex is likely going to be the best for AC, saves, and normal attack. So you would still be using your secondary stats as an attacking stat. That will never be as good as using you main stat. Plus if Cha is your secondary stat, then you are sacrificing HP from Con, which can be pretty painful.

Which matters much less if you can EB from 120', up to 4 times for that chance at SA, and still just BA to move further away from threats or Disengage to get out of danger.

It not only makes SA more effect (by offering more opportunities to get it), but also makes Cunning Action more effective (by removing some of the economy of action restrictions).

[RSP]

Particularly if you're going for a magical rogue you're typically going to want decent dex and int. Plus con because no-one wants to tank con.

People may want their talky rogues (whoo swashbuckler) but nothing in the base class particularly synergises with charisma. If anything the class encourages you to leave charisma mediocre as you can make up for an average stat by putting expertise in those skills if you want them.

Are there rogues that prioritize Int over Cha? Sure. But by and large the Rogue lines up very nicely with Cha. Deception and Rogue tend to go together as much as Stealth and Rogue (in that I'd say it's in the top 2 for Skills selected, and I'd say Intimidation and Persuasion are up there as well).

[Vogie]

Are there rogues that prioritize Int over Cha? Sure. But by and large the Rogue lines up very nicely with Cha. Deception and Rogue tend to go together as much as Stealth and Rogue (in that I'd say it's in the top 2 for Skills selected, and I'd say Intimidation and Persuasion are up there as well).

ATs will likely choose Int over Cha because they have wizardy bits
Swashbucklers already have an archetype feature that scales with charisma

[clash]

Where it breaks on the warlock dip is warlock 2/Rogue X. You are basically allowing two sets of scaling and competitive dpr to stack. Assuming a rogue maxed cha instead of dex lets do a comparison:
Level Rogue Rogue 1/Warlock 2/Rogue X
1 1d8 + 3 + 1d6 ~ 11 The same so far, maybe 1 less dpr because of lower dex
3 1d8 + 3 + 2d6 ~ 14.5 1d10 + 3 + 1d6 ~ 12 -> slightly behind here but not for long
5 1d8 + 4 + 3d6 ~ 19 1d10 + 3 + 2d6 + 1d10 + 3 ~ 24 -> Not a huge difference but also comes as force damage with 2 chances to hit by default, and possibly repels.
11 1d8 + 5 + 6d6 ~ 31.5 1d10 + 5 + 5d6 + (1d10 + 5) * 2 ~ 49 -> At this point EB completely outclasses the weapon attacking rogue.

It would be similiar to allowing rogues to just have a fighters extra attack progression by spending 2 levels in fighter. The only thing that prevents the warlock dip from being completely broken is that eb doesn't stack with most other things.

[RSP]

ATs will likely choose Int over Cha because they have wizardy bits
Swashbucklers already have an archetype feature that scales with charisma

Possibly. Having a 14 in both is quite doable after racials. Even an AT will need to talk their way out of, or into, something, and, at the end of the day, there's plenty of spells to select that don't heavily rely on Int modifiers. Could you Friends or Charm Person them? Sure, but you better be gone after a minute or be real good at Deception or Persuasion.

Plus, the entire point of my post was referencing a Rogue-Warlock dip, which is not specific to ATs, and has a Cha requirement, but no Int requirement. I'd say anyone doing this would choose Cha>Int.

[RSP]

Where it breaks on the warlock dip is warlock 2/Rogue X. You are basically allowing two sets of scaling and competitive dpr to stack. Assuming a rogue maxed cha instead of dex lets do a comparison:
Level Rogue Rogue 1/Warlock 2/Rogue X
1 1d8 + 3 + 1d6 ~ 11 The same so far, maybe 1 less dpr because of lower dex
3 1d8 + 3 + 2d6 ~ 14.5 1d10 + 3 + 1d6 ~ 12 -> slightly behind here but not for long
5 1d8 + 4 + 3d6 ~ 19 1d10 + 3 + 2d6 + 1d10 + 3 ~ 24 -> Not a huge difference but also comes as force damage with 2 chances to hit by default, and possibly repels.
11 1d8 + 5 + 6d6 ~ 31.5 1d10 + 5 + 5d6 + (1d10 + 5) * 2 ~ 49 -> At this point EB completely outclasses the weapon attacking rogue.

It would be similiar to allowing rogues to just have a fighters extra attack progression by spending 2 levels in fighter. The only thing that prevents the warlock dip from being completely broken is that eb doesn't stack with most other things.

You also have to factor in that after character lvl 5 the added attack from EB greatly increases damage as a miss with one attack equals=0% SA, while 1 hit=100% SA. The Rogue with 1 attack is at a significant disadvantage in dealing damage as it's all-or-nothing.

[bobofwestgate]

I would make a homebrew feat for this. Something like this:
- you learn one wizard cantrip, that requires an attack role.
- you may use sneak attack on wizard cantrips, that require an attack role.

Seems balanced to me. The average dpr should be lower than crossbow experts. In return you become more flexible with damage to types.

Maybe some sort of spell that creates/hurls a summoned dagger and does piercing damage to get around people's objections over doing all fire or force sneak attack

[DanyBallon]

I wouldn’t mind if attack cantrips are used to sneak attack, only if cantrip no longer scale.

This would add versatility to an AT or any rogue with MI, but would be a hard hit to any pure spellcaster.
Maybe allow Wizards, Clerics, Sorcerers and Warlock scale cantrip based on ther class level. But such a change add more complexity to the game without too much overall benefits, except maybe for the end of the Class X/Warlock 2 dip. :smallbiggrin:

[nickl_2000]

Maybe some sort of spell that creates/hurls a summoned dagger and does piercing damage to get around people's objections over doing all fire or force sneak attack

What about making a cantrip that uses a ranged attack instead, here are a few that I just came up with off the top of my head. Balance may not be the best, but it's a start.

Maddening Missile
Casting Time: 1 action
Duration: 1 round
Range: Self
Components: V M (A ranged missile weapon)

As part of the spell casting make a ranged weapon attack against your opponent. You imbue your projectile with eldritch whispers, when it strikes an opponent the whispers turn into screams in their head. During the creatures next turn, it will need to spend a bonus action to remove the weapon from their body ending the physic screams. If they do not, they take 1d8 physic damage.

At 5th level, the ranged attack deals an extra 1d8 physic damage to the target, and the extra damage increases to 2d8. Both damages increase by 1d8 at 11th and 17th level.



Shadow Shot
Casting Time: 1 action
Duration: 1 round
Range: Self
Components: V M (A ranged missile weapon)
As part of the spell casting make a ranged weapon attack against your opponent. A black and white shadow trail appears behind the missile as it flies towards the target. On strike the shadow melts into a pool beneath their feet. During their next round of combat, if they do not move the shadow under their feet causes 1d6 necrotic damage.

At 5th level, the ranged attack deals an extra 1d6 necrotic damage to the target, and the extra damage increases to 2d6. Both damages increase by 1d6 at 11th and 17th level.



Radiant Bolt
Casting Time: 1 action
Duration: 1 round
Range: Self
Components: V M (A ranged missile weapon)
As part of the spell casting make a ranged weapon attack against your opponent, a radiant light bursts from the missile. When it hits the target the holy energy bursts lighting up the a 5 foot radius bright light, and 5 feet dim light outside of that, until the start of your next turn.

At 5th level, the ranged attack deals an extra 1d8 radiant damage to the target, and the area is 10 feet bright light 10 feet dim. Damages increase by 1d8 and the light radius increases by 5 feet at 11th and 17th level.

[RSP]

I hadn't really thought too much about the differences in damage type until it was posted on here, but that needs to be considered as well.

Currently, SA is limited to weapon damage. Imagine an AT who can change that to match weaknesses in creatures. Granted, they'd still have a limited amount of options but having 3+ cantrips of different damage types that can exploit doubling SA damage, seperate from any crits, is an additional advantage that needs to be considered.
No to mention, would you then allow SA to be used with Save cantrips like Sacred Flame?

[Vogie]

Maybe some sort of spell that creates/hurls a summoned dagger and does piercing damage to get around people's objections over doing all fire or force sneak attack

That's actually not bad - It's a lesser version of Ice Knife or Shadow Blade. Probably just called Produce Knife or somesuch, and acts like a pointy version of Produce flame.


Produce Blade
Conjuration Cantrip
Casting Time 1 action
Duration 10 minutes
Range Self
Components V S

A dagger appears in your hand. It counts as a simple melee weapon that you're proficient with. It deals 1d4 piercing damage, and has the finesse, light, and thrown properties (range 20/60). The spell ends if you dismiss it as an action or if you cast it again. If you drop the weapon or throw it, it disappears at the end of the turn.

[samuraijaques]

So here's where I'm at with this. Booming blade already scales with your level and can apply sneak attack. And with the exception of eldritch blast all ranged attack cantrips only get one shot. So here is my solution. A single line added to the arcane trickster


Cantrips. You learn three cantrips: mage hand and two other cantrips of your choice from the wizard spell list. You learn another wizard cantrip of your choice at 10th level. You may apply your sneak attack damage to these cantrips if the conditions for sneak attack are met

This way it only works with wizard cantrips, and only if you use one of the 3 that you get from arcane trickster.

Let's do some math. Since attack bonuses will be basically the same across all of these I'm just calculating it as them all having hit. In reality firebolt will do slightly less damage due to intelligence not being maxed.

Damage breakdown level 5: 18 in dex 16 in int
- short bow+sneak atack: 18
- firebolt+sneak attack: 21.5
- booming blade+sneak attack: 23.5 (without them moving) 31 (if they do)
- eldritch blast+hex (18 cha): 26

So as you can see at level 5 firebolt only gives you a couple points of damage up on the short bow and still doesn't compete with booming blade or eldritch blast

Damage breakdown level 11: 20 in dex 18 in int
- short bow+sneak atack: 29.5
- firebolt+sneak attack: 37.5
- booming blade+sneak atack: 39.5 (without them moving) 52.5 (if they do)
- eldritch blast+hex (20 cha): 42

At level 11 as expected the short bow falls behind even more but once again firebolt can't compete with booming blade or eldritch blast.

So is it a damage boot to an arcane trickster's ranged damage? Sure. Is 8 points of damage on average at level 11 going to break your game when there are a plethora of better dps options some of which being available on that same arcane trickster? I don't think so.

So considering the fact that it's incredibly thematically appropriate and doesn't break DPR would you still consider this overpowered?

[PhantomSoul]

...
Let's do some math. Since attack bonuses will be basically the same across all of these I'm just calculating it as them all having hit. In reality firebolt will do slightly less damage due to intelligence not being maxed.
...


This is actually a case where looking at level 5 and 11 for comparisons actually hides a lot of the power -- Sneak Attack scales every two levels (and interacts with crit damage to boot!), and so at level 10 the sneak-attacking cantrip has increased in damage from level 5, but regular Eldritch Blast and Firebolt haven't, for example. (Then at levels 5 and 11 [and 17 of course] the cantrip itself goes up in damage... and the sneak-attack cantrip double dips on getting a sneak attack increase and the cantrip damage increase.) It's WAY less bad if you give a non-EB cantrip, and then slightly less abusable by severely limiting the cantrip options -- though I'd note magical piercing damage would actually be much more potent than magical fire damage, so changing the type of a weapon damage type actually can increase the problem instead of mitigating it. (That last bit obviously responds more to other suggestions than this one.)

[samuraijaques]

This is actually a case where looking at level 5 and 11 for comparisons actually hides a lot of the power -- Sneak Attack scales every two levels (and interacts with crit damage to boot!), and so at level 10 the sneak-attacking cantrip has increased in damage from level 5, but regular Eldritch Blast and Firebolt haven't, for example. (Then at levels 5 and 11 [and 17 of course] the cantrip itself goes up in damage... and the sneak-attack cantrip double dips on getting a sneak attack increase and the cantrip damage increase.) It's WAY less bad if you give a non-EB cantrip, and then slightly less abusable by severely limiting the cantrip options -- though I'd note magical piercing damage would actually be much more potent than magical fire damage, so changing the type of a weapon damage type actually can increase the problem instead of mitigating it. (That last bit obviously responds more to other suggestions than this one.)

Sure. But I think you're overestimating by how much.

at level 10 with 20's in primary stats (dex for rogues and cha for warlocks) and 18's in secondary (int for rogues) you end up like this
- short bow+sneak atack: 26
- firebolt+sneak attack: 28.5
- booming blade+sneak attack: 31.5 (without them moving) 40 (if they do)
- eldritch blast+hex (20 cha): 28

So again, it's all pretty comparable with booming blade being the obvious winner and shortbow the loser. Though, in the case of the shortbow, the gap is much smaller before 11th level.