Reaction interpretation/ Will this Risky Cloud of Daggers combo play?

[Mattinthehat273]

Im currently playing a level 8 character (wizard 5, LOCK 3) and I'm trying to understand if this will play and I'm not necessarily sure if it will.

I have this small AOE spell "cloud of daggers" which states that a creature who enters the area or starts it's turn in the area will take damage.
My intentions are this if it plays:
-cast the spell on target within 5ft of me (of course not directed at me too)
-the target takes 6d4 as 3rd lvl spell
- I than would like to actually get risky and before finishing my turn move from the target (giving him an opportunity attack - reaction against me intentionally)
*Question*
*will this unprecedented extra action from the creature standing in an AOE allow damage again? *

Now if yes or no, the creature won't take damage from that AOE again until it starts it's next turn, correct?

I'm unsure if this is viable because spells describe specifically how they're cast, where "cloud of daggers" only states it allows damage to creatures entering area or starting their turn in area. (I truly believe that this technicality in description of the spell isn't taking account of this scenario I've thought of)

However this reaction is unprecedented and not officially a "turn" it is the creature interrupting my turn after spell cast and this creature is taking an extra action in combat overruling initiative "turns" (as reactions do) while standing in a cloud of daggers, logically I believe it should allow a damage roll.

I know everyone in combat gets only gets 1 turn consisting of movement, 1 action, & if possible 1 bonus action, and 1 reaction. Basically I'm almost considering (through interpretation of reactions) that a "reaction" could technically be considered as an extra turn in a single round of combat.

* Instead of specifically an "opportunity attack" but an "oppurtunity turn" if you will*

*question*
Is any of this plausible to some extent? I believe logically it should be allowed and there is no official rule for an "extra turn" and turns are controlled by an initiative, but a reaction could be just that though. Right?

It is the only combat action that can overrule initiative "turns" (other than legendary or maybe conditions) allowing them to be activated whenever necessary and even interrupt someone's turn regardless of your own actual turn; and because unless your player is specialized in some feat, spell or finds an opportunity you wouldn't be allowed any reaction otherwise.

Please I'm actually curious if this Is a logical interpretation of reaction in combat that could allow the scenario damage I described above.

Thanks

*However this is my full thought of combo for some serious damage if this does play lol*

Start my turn
-use bonus action "hex" on creature within 5 Ft of me (or use some but not full movement speed after hex to approach target)
-use main action to than cast "cloud of daggers" on target space
-roll damage from "cloud of daggers" as this is the first time creature is in AOE + additional hex damage for hit (6d4 +1d6)
-use remaining movement to walk away intentionally provoking an oppurtunity attack from target, target then attempts to melee attack me while still standing in AOE taking an extra action this round but also taking damage from daggers and hex again immediately (6d4 +1d6)
-if the targets opportunity attack hits me I will use my own reaction "hellish rebuke" on target-roll damage plus "hex" (3d10 +1d6)
-end turn (note if opp attack is a miss it will also end turn)
- initiative goes around and provided that creature still stands it starts it's next turn in AOE
-roll damage (6d4 +1d6)

Wouldn't this combo be amazing if it's allowed to play?! That is a tremendous amount of damage that could be done over the course of basically only 1 round.

Thoughts please, and if it's not allowed I totally understand.

[Lombra]

The creature only takes damage when the soell's conditions are met, so no, it doesn't work.

And hex only works with attacks, so not with spells that require a save.

[Mattinthehat273]

To specify I know that the only hole in my desired combo is the damage allowance during the opp attack- reaction. Otherwise the rest of this combo should, and does play with spell conditions. Right?

[Mattinthehat273]

COD doesn't have a save...

[Lombra]

COD doesn't have a save...

Doesn't have an attack roll either. Which is what hex works on.

[Mattinthehat273]

Ok I can understand that actually, in the rules "making an attack" states attack roll. So I suppose no extra d6 damage, might just throw bonus action "misty step" after than. However my real question is whether or not damage could apply during the opp attack. I know specifically conditions say first movement on turn in area or start of turn in area applies damage, and a reaction isnt the start of a turn. Logically though my argument above comparing reaction to some sort of "extra turn" is what I was trying to get at. I mean it's an extra unprecedented action in the rd after spell cast from a creature standing in an AOE, if it tries to hit me In that COD it should be taking damage. Idk I'm essentially trying to break the game lol I mean I can't officially find something stating against or for this scenario, other than specific spell conditions. However reactions don't say they can't be considered as an "extra turn" lol

[Vorpalchicken]

Using a reaction is not the same as starting a turn.

Also hex and cloud of daggers are both concentration spells (not that they would interact any way.)

[Mellack]

Reactions happen on the turn of the trigger, it is not the creature starting its turn, so no damage. Also note that you cannot misty step and cast CoD on the same turn as you can only combine cantrips on the same turn as a bonus action spell.

[Avonar]

However reactions don't say they can't be considered as an "extra turn" lol


"Certain special abilities, spells, and situations allow
you to take a special action called a reaction. A reaction
is an instant response to a trigger of some kind, which
can occur on your turn or on someone else's."

This is fairly set in stone and common sense. A reaction is an action you can perform on anyone's turn. It says nothing about allowing someone to take another turn.

I get trying to game the system but this one is fairly obvious. Not a chance.

[Lilobot]

This would not trigger it to take extra damage, however, you could grapple the target and drag them in and out with a readied reaction and on your turn, then you could apply the damage 3 times per round. If you did this to two targets (1 in each hand), you could create something pretty powerful.

[JLandan]

The best kind of combo with cloud of daggers is something that either reduces movement to 0, or something that moves the target back into the area of effect. Like entangle or lightning lure.

[Psyren]

Basically I'm almost considering (through interpretation of reactions) that a "reaction" could technically be considered as an extra turn in a single round of combat.

A reaction isn't an extra turn - it's the creature getting to do something on somebody else's turn (yours, in the case of you provoking an OA from that creature by moving away from it.) Since it's not their turn when they react, CoD won't damage them again on whoever's turn it is.


However reactions don't say they can't be considered as an "extra turn" lol

As a general rule, any time you find yourself saying "the rules don't say I can't" or some variation thereof, you've strayed into a incorrect interpretation.

[gloryblaze]

Everyone else has thoroughly covered that OAs do not, in fact, count as starting a turn, so I won't get into that.

The other key point that you seem to have missed is that casting cloud of daggers on an occupied space does not deal damage to creatures in that space. In 5e, the language "enters the area" means when a creature moves or is moved into an area, but not when an area is created on or is moved into a creature.

This means that to deal damage twice or more in a round with cloud of daggers (or similar spells, like spirit guardians) you need to cast them without overlapping your intended target's spaces, and then somehow push or pull them into the area (a common way to do this is the bonus action granted by the Telekinetic feat).

[schm0]

*However this is my full thought of combo for some serious damage if this does play lol*

Start my turn
-use bonus action "hex" on creature within 5 Ft of me (or use some but not full movement speed after hex to approach target)
-use main action to than cast "cloud of daggers" on target space
-roll damage from "cloud of daggers" as this is the first time creature is in AOE + additional hex damage for hit (6d4 +1d6)
-use remaining movement to walk away intentionally provoking an oppurtunity attack from target, target then attempts to melee attack me while still standing in AOE taking an extra action this round but also taking damage from daggers and hex again immediately (6d4 +1d6)
-if the targets opportunity attack hits me I will use my own reaction "hellish rebuke" on target-roll damage plus "hex" (3d10 +1d6)
-end turn (note if opp attack is a miss it will also end turn)
- initiative goes around and provided that creature still stands it starts it's next turn in AOE
-roll damage (6d4 +1d6)

Wouldn't this combo be amazing if it's allowed to play?! That is a tremendous amount of damage that could be done over the course of basically only 1 round.

Thoughts please, and if it's not allowed I totally understand.

This doesn't work for a bunch of reasons.


Cloud of daggers does not trigger until the start of the creature's turn or if a creature enters the area of the spell effect.
An opportunity attack against you does not trigger the damage from cloud of daggers in any way.
Hex only works on attacks.
You aren't hitting the creature with an attack, the spell effect is dealing damage to the creature. Thus, you can not deal hex damage unless you attack the creature.