What does a 17th level commoner look like?

[rg9000]

I was running through the DMG's town generation, and according to the setup, I should have a 17th level commoner. What are some ideas for a backstory behind someone who has that much experience, but is only a commoner. Builds? Wealth? Why isn't he an aristocrat with level 17 WBL?

Can someone help me brainstorm?

[LordBlade]

He could be someone who's gained a lot of "non-combat xp" like a nobleman or merchant who's done a ton of deals and negotiations (basically done a ton to help the town behind the scenes as opposed to the heroes who go out to kill monsters and such).

Could also be a hunter of some sort. Someone who knows the land around the town like the back of his hand, knows all the critters that can pop up in the area, and has fought many of them to keep the town safe.

Or perhaps a world traveller bard who's taken up residence?
Oh, or maybe the madame of the local brothel who might have come up through the thieves' guild in some big town and is now hiding out in the country? :)

[Silva Stormrage]

See most of the ideas for "Regular person but super competent" that would fit a 17th level character are really experts or aristocrats. A commoner shouldn't have very many skills or abilities to speak of, which makes it odd that he is so high level.

Best idea that came to my mind is that he was an old friend/pack mule of a high level adventurer who died to stop a horrendous evil. Not someone who really participated but just someone who carries stuff/asks questions around town for the adventurer that sort of thing. Imagine a 1 silver/day hireling that a PC party liked so much they kept him around and just due to sheer exposure to adventures the commoner kept on leveling.

Also it gives some plot hooks, maybe the horrendous evil is coming back and he has the most information about it.

[Kelb_Panthera]

I would expect it to be the mayor or one of his closest aids unless the settlement is ruled by nobility. In that case I'd expect it to be the majordomo of one of the more influential or highest ranking nobles. Definitely middle-aged, at least.

Think Alfred from Batman.

[Crake]

Let's look at the average statistics for a level 17 commoner:

Their base saves are +5/+5/+5, on par with a 6th level monk, or someone who's multiclassed (those base saves are potentially obtainable by level 3 with two classes that have all good saves, or level 2 if you use fractional saves), so nothing particularly out of the ordinary.

D4 HD, and 10/11 con. If we assume he got up to 12 con (he'd want to spend his 4 level up points to round up his 11s to 12s most likely), that gives him, on average, 59hp, a pretty respectable amount, but nothing out of the ordinary, again, about on par with a 6th level fighter, give or take depending on con scores.

Skill points, again, if we assume 12 int after an ability boost, and that, generously, we did this at the earliest point possible, level 4, he would have 73 skill points (assuming human as well). That's less than some level 1 rogues have, but still a respectable amount in general. They have the feats to open up extra class skills, and the points to spread, so they could be highly trained in one or two skills, or decently trained in an assortment of skills. About on par with a 6+1 int+1 human skillpoint class at level 6 if spreading out points.

Class features, none, but they have 7 feats (again, assuming human), which we could almost call their class features, if you compare them to a fighter, who, at level 6 would have 8 feats.

Their bab is a respectable 8, but they only have proficiency with 1 weapon, so most weapons will be at +4/-1, but they have 1 weapon that they fight decently with at +8/+3, which is roughly the same has having some kind of favoured weapon, or simulating higher ability scores on a full bab 6th level character.

Adding all that up, yeah... a 17th level commoner looks like a pretty decent 6th level adventurer, but one who's had to work really hard to get to where he is. He has no innate talent, he's nothing special, he's just a regular joe. If you've ever read history's strongest disciple kenichi.... that's him.

[Berenger]

He is his cities version of Marco Polo.

[zlefin]

I can envision some ideas, sort of. though they'd be a bit less common in town; I'd expect it more from the tough old hermit who lives on a small farm in a dangerous area who's just managed to survive for a long time. In particular facing some natural disasters is worth XP; someone who's seen a lot of them could rack up muhc xp from them. Though getting to 17 would be difficult. probably more likely for a fisherman. the grizzled old fisherman who's seen it all: dozens of monsters, hurricanes, etc.

Or maybe just that one guy who's had a long string of bad luck but didn't die from it.

[MaxiDuRaritry]

He has a magical ho, instead of a regular hoe. And he has gold teeth and a pimpin' hat.

ALL THE BLING!

[Telonius]

He's the owner of the town pub. He's had a regular supply of vastly over-CR'd encounters and survived. (And by that, I mean that a steady stream of adventurers has visited his pub, and he's managed not to have the place burn down).

[Fouredged Sword]

Yeah, pub owner. Those high CR non-letal social encounters with adventuring parties add up even at half exp.

[Resileaf]

Have you ever seen that little three or four-panel comic about Skyrim where a commoner is telling the Dovakhiin about his woes, but then a dragon shows up and the commoner rips off his shirt and he's super ripped underneath and he just looks at the dragon all "Bring it on"?
Something like that, I'd wager.

[TIPOT]

One thing to note is he's probably venerable, like oldest man in the city type thing? So he's probably some cranky dude on a rocking chair.

[denthor]

Older. Has some sort of magic (ring or cloak) family heirloom has no idea it is magical. Over the years he has been quite a bit of adventure survived due to the magic item. The difference between characters and commoners is training. He has no training.

Stats

Str 15 in teens subtact for age

Dex 13 subtract for age

Con 16 subtract for age

Int 11 add for age

WIS 9 add for age

CHA. 9 add for age

Magical bit give + ? For saves

She has stories about great-great grandmother being some sort of minor scrapes all the time.

Just survived and met thing that should have killed him was in a caravan that went to places to get better prices from undersigned towns.

[Segev]

He's the guy that the experienced guards in town don't mess with, because despite just being ol' Farmer Pete, he can kick any four of their butts (since they're pretty much 1st level warriors).

He's the bartender who is much tougher than he looks, and can handle those high-on-their-class-features low-level adventuring parties that think they can cause trouble in his tavern.

His wealth is invested in magic items that protect his tavern: alarm spells, glyphs of warding, a magical quarterstaff; all gifts from adventurers to whom his hospitality and providence of a safe space when they were low level were welcome boons, and who took umbrage when some BBEG sent minions to torment their favorite pub owner.

His wealth is invested in land that he personally farms, as a level 17 Commoner, with stamina and skill in Craft(plants) and Profession(Farmer) and Animal Handling that let him work harder and longer and more efficiently than anybody would believe.

For a pop culture reference, he's Applejack or Big Mac.

He's a wealthy merchant who travels the high-risk, dangerous paths to maximize his wealth. He hires mid-to-high level adventurers, and while he can't handle the threats his caravans face, directly, he can survive them while his high-level hirelings hold off the ogres riding dragons long enough for him to get his wagon(s) through the pass. And when the paltry bandits of the low plains attack him because he "came without his guards," he is the one who has a store of specialized magic items and who can take and dish out a beating to demonstrate to them that not all merchants are helpless.

She's the head of the kitchens in the manor house of the great lord, ruling the servants with an iron fist and taking no guff even from the low-level adventurers who swooped in and thought they were above the lowly servants.

He's the wrinkled old man in the kung fu film who kicks the butts of the hoodlums, and then, when asked where he trained, says he's not the warrior-monk...they live in the monastery over that way. He just lived near them long enough that he knows how to handle their young whippersnappers who think they're hot stuff just because they have a fancy technique or two, and don't appreciate the value of experience over style.

[Darrin]

It looks like a shimmering rainbow-colored cube (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=8187767&postcount=7), floating tranquilly in the middle of a battle-scorched plain, surrounded by smoldering craters and lifeless bodies.

[Thurbane]

https://dubteeff.files.wordpress.com/2008/05/superhobo.jpg

[Nifft]

I was running through the DMG's town generation, and according to the setup, I should have a 17th level commoner. What are some ideas for a backstory behind someone who has that much experience, but is only a commoner. Builds? Wealth? Why isn't he an aristocrat with level 17 WBL?

Can someone help me brainstorm?

So, for a backstory, you probably want to have this high-level Commoner repeatedly encountering non-lethal / non-combat challenges.

What's a good non-combat challenge?

Negotiating with other high-CR people.

What sort of people have a high-CR? The other level 10+ Commoners with whom this NPC competes.

Basically, they level up together, by competing against each other in various endeavors.

This is why every village has a level-pyramid for Commoners: they're the ones who kept winning over the years.

[enderlord99]

I'd say "Nodwick" but it's entirely likely that he's actually a rogue and the ones who are officially adventurers don't realize it.

[Goaty14]

Do mind that the NPC in question should have at least 100k GP by pure WBL. For reference, nobles tend to have 1k GP at any given time per the DMG.

I'd imagine he'd be in the same place as a mid-level aristocrat, though not being raised into the position.

[Darth Ultron]

A character of level 15-20 is a famous person, no matter their class.

So a 20th level Commoner is simply a famous, non combative, normal person and also someone good at whatever they do.

In our ''modern terms'' they would be Times most 100 influential people in the world today.




Surrolph Hlakken, a horsemaster as well as an information gatherer for the vigilante group known as the Red Sashes, From the Waterdeep book is a 16th level Commoner.

[Kelb_Panthera]

Do mind that the NPC in question should have at least 100k GP by pure WBL. For reference, nobles tend to have 1k GP at any given time per the DMG.

I'd presume that 1k is liquid assets. The other 99k is tied up in his home and business in various ways. Security leaps to mind.

[Doctor Awkward]

He could be someone who's gained a lot of "non-combat xp"...


See most of the ideas for "Regular person but super competent" that would fit a 17th level character are really experts or aristocrats. A commoner shouldn't have very many skills or abilities to speak of, which makes it odd that he is so high level.


ALL THE BLING!


Older. ...

The difference between characters and commoners is training. He has no training.

Stats

Str 15 in teens subtact for age

Dex 13 subtract for age

Con 16 subtract for age

Int 11 add for age

WIS 9 add for age

CHA. 9 add for age

She has stories about great-great grandmother being some sort of minor scrapes all the time.



He's the guy that the experienced guards in town don't mess with, because despite just being ol' Farmer Pete, he can kick any four of their butts (since they're pretty much 1st level warriors).
...
He's the wrinkled old man in the kung fu film who kicks the butts of the hoodlums, and then, when asked where he trained, says he's not the warrior-monk...they live in the monastery over that way. He just lived near them long enough that he knows how to handle their young whippersnappers who think they're hot stuff just because they have a fancy technique or two, and don't appreciate the value of experience over style.


Do mind that the NPC in question should have at least 100k GP by pure WBL. For reference, nobles tend to have 1k GP at any given time per the DMG.

I'd imagine he'd be in the same place as a mid-level aristocrat, though not being raised into the position.


A character of level 15-20 is a famous person, no matter their class.

So a 20th level Commoner is simply a famous, non combative, normal person and also someone good at whatever they do.

In our ''modern terms'' they would be Times most 100 influential people in the world today.


*thinks*

...


Got him:
https://steemitimages.com/DQmYXKQUCqpNRzzEAehWKJCAYaRp7TdUmX5qr6EWdeY2Lod/fire-down-below.jpg





For real though:
A very long-lived and world famous theater actor who claims to be a retired adventurer, and that the plays he puts on are all based on his previous adventures.
The secret is he is really and everything about his previous life is totally made up. And he is in deep debt to a thieve's guild for... <researches problems actors keep having> ...a drug habit.
But they are hesitating to confront him for their money because they still think he's everything he claims to be.... for now.

[Bohandas]

John Henry (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Henry_(folklore)) springs to mind. Possibly also Paul Bunyan

[Bohandas]

A character of level 15-20 is a famous person, no matter their class.

So a 20th level Commoner is simply a famous, non combative, normal person and also someone good at whatever they do.


The issue is that as they become successful you would expect them to multiclass into expert or noble (or if their stats qualify and it's relevant to their profession, adept or magewright)

[Prime32]

One of those plot device characters who people want to kidnap for their vaguely-defined "special power".

A 17 HD humanoid can serve as great raw material for the various soul- and undead-related magics in D&D, and it's way easier to steal a commoner's soul than a legendary hero's (assuming the setting even has any characters with 17 levels in a PC class in the first place). E.g. barghests can only grow by consuming creatures with HD equal to or greater than their own.

Incidentally, while this "special power" doesn't directly help the commoner in combat, observers may notice that they seem very in-tune with their surroundings - they're perceptive, good with animals, and seem to move through water or up cliffs as easily as walking (due to high ranks in commoner class skills). They never seem to have problems with money either.

Combat-wise, a lv17 commoner is roughly equivalent to a lv8 warrior... but far more resilient, since they have better saves, get twice as many hp from their Con modifier, and are immune to some HD-based effects like cloudkill and Frightful Presence which could disable the warrior instantly. Despite having a "sense for fighting" slightly beyond what's possible in the real world (which may or may not be notable depending on the setting), they somehow don't know how to use weapons properly... and if they do learn to use one, it will probably be something exotic.

[ShurikVch]

Note: one of official books already almost have such example:
Surrolph Hlakken: Surrolph (CG male commoner 16/vigilanteCA 1) is a fat, balding man with thick fingers who wears fine robes that have long since lost their original sheen. Surrolph is a horse dealer at the Hlakken stables (S17) and the chief information gatherer for the Red Sashes.

[Uncle Pine]

There was a greentext about a commoner deciding to one day stand up against a couple 1st-level adventurer trying to steal his wheel of cheese, getting lucky and killing them. From the adventurers the commoner would've gained a few xp, equipment and a little gold, which he used to add some minor improvements to his house (nothing fancy, just a few wooden spikes on the door and maybe a pit trap in the garden). Seeing the commoner so busy fortifying his house, other 1st-level chumps would try to attack the house and steal the commoner's wheel of cheese. Suppose he got lucky a second time and killed the adventurers. With the small wealth accrued, the commoner could easily add enough traps to reliably defend himself from other 1st-level adventurers despite his weaker abilities and nonexistent class features. And so he did. Slowly but surely, salvaging equipment and gold out of low level adventurers would lead the commoner to have a pretty defendable position, good enough to maybe protect his wheel of cheese from an adventurer owning a minor magic item, then another one, and so on... 60 years later, Bob the commoner wakes up in his fortified chambers, buried deep at the end of an intricate network of tunnels guarded by mercenaries and riddled with traps. Soon a young valet approaches him, bringing words from the patrols: a cleric, a fighter, a rogue, and a wizards are headed their way and will likely cross the first outer ring in three hours. The hardened old man gives a brief look at the large plate beside his bed and the cheese it contains, then takes a long, tired breath: "Send the bulettes. They haven't exercised in a while."

[denthor]

*thinks*

...


Got him:
https://steemitimages.com/DQmYXKQUCqpNRzzEAehWKJCAYaRp7TdUmX5qr6EWdeY2Lod/fire-down-below.jpg





For real though:
A very long-lived and world famous theater actor who claims to be a retired adventurer, and that the plays he puts on are all based on his previous adventures.
The secret is he is really and everything about his previous life is totally made up. And he is in deep debt to a thieve's guild for... <researches problems actors keep having> ...a drug habit.
But they are hesitating to confront him for their money because they still think he's everything he claims to be.... for now.


That was great

[Goaty14]

[snip]

Very cool! Though at some point that wheel of cheese will become an artifact with everybody wanting it :smallbiggrin:

[Remuko]

There was a greentext about a commoner deciding to one day stand up against a couple 1st-level adventurer trying to steal his wheel of cheese, getting lucky and killing them. From the adventurers the commoner would've gained a few xp, equipment and a little gold, which he used to add some minor improvements to his house (nothing fancy, just a few wooden spikes on the door and maybe a pit trap in the garden). Seeing the commoner so busy fortifying his house, other 1st-level chumps would try to attack the house and steal the commoner's wheel of cheese. Suppose he got lucky a second time and killed the adventurers. With the small wealth accrued, the commoner could easily add enough traps to reliably defend himself from other 1st-level adventurers despite his weaker abilities and nonexistent class features. And so he did. Slowly but surely, salvaging equipment and gold out of low level adventurers would lead the commoner to have a pretty defendable position, good enough to maybe protect his wheel of cheese from an adventurer owning a minor magic item, then another one, and so on... 60 years later, Bob the commoner wakes up in his fortified chambers, buried deep at the end of an intricate network of tunnels guarded by mercenaries and riddled with traps. Soon a young valet approaches him, bringing words from the patrols: a cleric, a fighter, a rogue, and a wizards are headed their way and will likely cross the first outer ring in three hours. The hardened old man gives a brief look at the large plate beside his bed and the cheese it contains, then takes a long, tired breath: "Send the bulettes. They haven't exercised in a while."

ive never quite heard that version of it before but yeah ive heard about the person who "accidentally" becomes the BBEG due to almost identical circumstances.

[Uncle Pine]

For real though:
A very long-lived and world famous theater actor who claims to be a retired adventurer, and that the plays he puts on are all based on his previous adventures.
The secret is he is really and everything about his previous life is totally made up. And he is in deep debt to a thieve's guild for... <researches problems actors keep having> ...a drug habit.
But they are hesitating to confront him for their money because they still think he's everything he claims to be.... for now.
Isn't that basically Mr. Satan from Dragonball?

[Doctor Awkward]

Isn't that basically Mr. Satan from Dragonball?

Well... only the bull**** about his past adventures part...

Mr. Satan never retired from anything (fought in WMA tournaments for decades after the Cell Games), wasn't in debt to anyone (one of the richest people on the planet), didn't have a drug habit that I'm aware of, and was universally beloved by the planet's population (which I guess you could write into your own game).

[Fouredged Sword]

Mt Satan is what you get when a level 20 fighter tries to join a game of exalted.

[Warchon]

An easy way to sidestep the WBL problem would be to give him a vow of poverty. Or a lifelong gambling problem.

[theAui]

Bilbo Baggins comes to mind. Although everybody seems to call him thief, i doubt i would build him with rogue levels. He sure gained some Exp and WBL after his adventure and he is well known and leads a good commoner life for 50 years. He cant do anything special.

[Remuko]

Bilbo Baggins comes to mind. Although everybody seems to call him thief, i doubt i would build him with rogue levels. He sure gained some Exp and WBL after his adventure and he is well known and leads a good commoner life for 50 years. He cant do anything special.

yeah a lot of his rogue-like qualities are actually just hobbit racial traits from the sounds of it to me.

[JyP]

As he is a 17th level commoner in a world where most commoners remain 1st level all their lives, I would say he got cursed to never die - with an uncanny knack to avoid troubles, he lived many commoner lives, never reaching for wars, magic, nobility or even real cutting edge skills. He may be the best sheepherder in the world, who never got troubles with wolves & bandits. According to his current fancy, he can follow any job - simply enjoying life without adventures troubles.