Grung DC scaling.

[suplee215]

I recently discovered grungs and I might be overly obsessed with them. That said, the unofficial grung player race seems a boring. The poison seems able to become irrelevant real quick. When the grung is touched, the creature must make a dc 12 con save or be poisioned or when the grung attacks with a piercing weapon it can deal 2d4 poison damage if the target fails the same dc 12 save. Is there any major reason for this save to not be 8+proficiency+con much like a dragonborn breath weapon. Asking from a point of view of a DM who might give his players the option of grung with this 1 added thing.

[Mith]

Personally, I would make it Dex over Con on the basis of the Grung slapping you with poison. It still is a Con save, but a high DC and low roll represents getting sprayed in the eyes or something like that.

[suplee215]

Personally, I would make it Dex over Con on the basis of the Grung slapping you with poison. It still is a Con save, but a high DC and low roll represents getting sprayed in the eyes or something like that.

Fair enough but the poison is created by the grung so I was going more by how potent it is. plus I could be wrong but a lot of monster stats suggests that those that naturally have poison use con for the DC.

[Lunali]

Yea, poisons are usually CON saves as by the time you're making the save you've generally already come into contact with the poison.

[suplee215]

Yea, poisons are usually CON saves as by the time you're making the save you've generally already come into contact with the poison.

Less about the save and more about how to make the DC.

[Mith]

The reason I have for using Dex is because Con is used for a lot of other things, and I like the idea of the grung flexing and retaliating. If it works to use 8+prof+Con from a consistency stand point, go for it.

It does give them something a little more useful then a Dragonborn breath weapon, but poison damage is commonly resisted, so it may balance out in the end.

[Grear Bylls]

The reason I have for using Dex is because Con is used for a lot of other things, and I like the idea of the grung flexing and retaliating. If it works to use 8+prof+Con from a consistency stand point, go for it.

It does give them something a little more useful then a Dragonborn breath weapon, but poison damage is commonly resisted, so it may balance out in the end.

I would argue Dex has FAR more uses than Con. Con affects HP and a save (and ale chugging). Dex helps initiative, stealth, attacks, and AC. I think making the Grung having to max Dex, then Con, should be interesting, making it so you have to choose between bumping all of the above in addition to Poison, versus poison and hp. My opinion

[suplee215]

The reason I have for using Dex is because Con is used for a lot of other things, and I like the idea of the grung flexing and retaliating. If it works to use 8+prof+Con from a consistency stand point, go for it.

It does give them something a little more useful then a Dragonborn breath weapon, but poison damage is commonly resisted, so it may balance out in the end.

I feel like making it Dex based limits the character more than Con. Dex based means it'll be a rogue, a monk, ranger, or dex based fighter 99% of the time. I feel like making it con will make a grappling focus str based character more often despite the stats. One could even make a barbarian. But making it dex based limits it to dex builds.

[Zippdementia]

I recently discovered grungs and I might be overly obsessed with them. That said, the unofficial grung player race seems a boring. The poison seems able to become irrelevant real quick. When the grung is touched, the creature must make a dc 12 con save or be poisioned or when the grung attacks with a piercing weapon it can deal 2d4 poison damage if the target fails the same dc 12 save. Is there any major reason for this save to not be 8+proficiency+con much like a dragonborn breath weapon. Asking from a point of view of a DM who might give his players the option of grung with this 1 added thing.

Here's my thoughts on why this ended up the way it did. First of all, this was an unofficial official mostly joke product. The Grung have always been played for humorous effect, so in building their class it just makes sense to go for humor above viability. The Grung is a challenge class, meant for people who want to have fun and joke around with a ridiculous character. You can definitely reach level 20 with it, but it is a handicapped class from the get-go. Optimizing it almost feels against the original intent.

The other thought is that their poison is a FAR more prevalent ability than, say, a Dragonborn's breath attack. The breath attack has limited uses per rest, while the Grung poison is UNLIMITED. I mean, consider this tactic:

I am playing a grung, I charge at the enemy and bodyslam him before stabbing him with my piercing weapon (let's say a spear).

That's at least one CON save, maybe two (if the DM rules the bodyslam counts as touching). One poisons the enemy and the other deals extra damage. I know that DC 12 is low, but do you know how many times I've rolled CON saves for crazy things like dragons and gotten a 2 or a 4? Until the higher levels lots of monsters lack huge CON bonuses. Even on a +5 bonus, I have a 30% chance of failing this roll. And if every turn you are attacking me with a piercing weapon (and potentially attacking twice due to off hand attacks or extra attacks) then eventually I am going to fail. In this light, you start to thank the gods it ISNT Prof + 8 + Mod. The Grung would be a walking typhoid Mary.

By the time this ability becomes more or less irrelevant, the Grung should be relying on more powerful class abilities, anyway.

[JNAProductions]

Yeah, this feature is just kinda out of whack. Flat DC 12 is odd, but unlimited use is a PROBLEM. If it was once per rest, then you could pretty easily have it be the standard formula. If it's unlimited use, it's OP even with a crap DC.

[Amdy_vill]

here is some stuff i came up with before that race came out but after the player sheet had come out.

Grung
+2 dex

Animal instincts
Grung have proficiency in athletics

Speed.
You have a speed of 25ft

You have a climb speed of 25 ft.

Size: small

Amphibious:You can breathe air and water.

Poisoner: You have proficiency with poisoner kit’s

Poison immunity: Immunities to poison and can not be poisoned

Poisonous Skin:Any creature that grapples you or otherwise comes into direct contact with your skin must succeed on a DC 12 Constitution saving throw or become poisoned for 1 minute. A poisoned creature no longer in direct contact with you can repeat the saving throw at the end of each of its turns, ending the effect on itself on a success. You can also apply this poison to any piercing weapon as part of an attack with that weapon, though when you hit the poison reacts differently. The target must succeed on a DC 12 Constitution saving throw or take 2d4 poison damage. No additional effects apply.

Standing Leap:Your long jump is up to 25 feet and your high jump is up to 15 feet, with or without a running start.

Water Dependency:If you fail to immerse yourself in water for at least 1 hour during a day, you suffer one level of exhaustion at the end of that day. You can only recover from this exhaustion through magic or by immersing yourself in water for at least 1 hour.

You can speak grung and common



Green
+1 con

Grung of nature: you gain proficiency in survival

Blue
+1 cha

Artist at heart: you gain proficiency with one artisan's tools

Purple
+1 wis

Supervises: you gain proficiency in Persuasion

Red
+1 int

Cantrip: you know one cantrip from the wizard spell list. You cast this with you int

Orange
+1 str

Mesmerizing chirr: you can make a chirr noise witch grung are immune to once per short rest. Any creature within 15 ft that can hear must make a wisdom saving throw. The DC is 8+int+ proficiency modifier. if a creature fails this saving throw they are stunted till the grungs next turn.

Gold

If you DM think you have performed a great feat of leadership they may award you with becoming a gold Grung.

+2 Cha

Grung inspiration: Grung look at you as a great hero and will respect you


never finished the gold grung