Pathfinder Blood Magic Class

[Skyflare19]

I am planning to make a Blood Magic Based class. It is going to have a medium BAB, the one that ends at 15, and I am thinking a d8 for its HD. I also feel that 4 skill points per level is reasonable. If anyone disagrees with any of this, please let me know what to fix.

My biggest dilemma at the moment, though, is that I am debating between giving it the medium spell casting, or a unique spell formula. The alternative would be based on "Blood Points" which would be gained by inflicting damage to yourself. While i haven't decided in the abilities yet, they would essentially be spells. The class would only have access to a maximum of so many Blood Points based on its class level. And much like with other classes, some of the abilities connected with the Blood Points would have a minimum level requirement.

If anyone has suggestions about what die should be rolled for each Blood Point, a reasonable Max Points, or how many points should be roughly equivalent to each spell level, I am really looking for some help. Also, if there is another class with abilities like this that I missed, if someone could direct me to that, I would be grateful.

Thank you.

[BowStreetRunner]

So how would this new class fit in with the existing Blood Mage Wizard Archetype (https://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/wizard/archetypes/kobold-press-wizard-archetypes/blood-mage-wizard-archetype/) or the 3rd party Blood Caster Prestige Class (https://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/3rd-party-prestige-classes/4-winds-fantasy-gaming/blood-caster/)?

[Skyflare19]

So how would this new class fit in with the existing Blood Mage Wizard Archetype (https://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/wizard/archetypes/kobold-press-wizard-archetypes/blood-mage-wizard-archetype/) or the 3rd party Blood Caster Prestige Class (https://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/3rd-party-prestige-classes/4-winds-fantasy-gaming/blood-caster/)?

Something more akin to a full class alternative to the prestige class. Personally, I am not a fan of the archetype.

[JoshuaZ]

So how would this new class fit in with the existing Blood Mage Wizard Archetype (https://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/wizard/archetypes/kobold-press-wizard-archetypes/blood-mage-wizard-archetype/) or the 3rd party Blood Caster Prestige Class (https://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/3rd-party-prestige-classes/4-winds-fantasy-gaming/blood-caster/)?

There's also a first party blood based caster with a different name (https://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/prestige-classes/other-paizo/a-b/bloatmage/).

In any event, I'll be curious to see where this goes.

[legomaster00156]

I am sure that 99% of the time that people want a "blood magic" class, the Bloatmage is not what they have in mind for the character.

[Jack_Simth]

I am planning to make a Blood Magic Based class. It is going to have a medium BAB, the one that ends at 15, and I am thinking a d8 for its HD. I also feel that 4 skill points per level is reasonable. If anyone disagrees with any of this, please let me know what to fix.

My biggest dilemma at the moment, though, is that I am debating between giving it the medium spell casting, or a unique spell formula. The alternative would be based on "Blood Points" which would be gained by inflicting damage to yourself. While i haven't decided in the abilities yet, they would essentially be spells. The class would only have access to a maximum of so many Blood Points based on its class level. And much like with other classes, some of the abilities connected with the Blood Points would have a minimum level requirement.

If anyone has suggestions about what die should be rolled for each Blood Point, a reasonable Max Points, or how many points should be roughly equivalent to each spell level, I am really looking for some help. Also, if there is another class with abilities like this that I missed, if someone could direct me to that, I would be grateful.

Thank you.

There's a problem with using HP instead of spell slots to power casting: Healing can get cheap. Take Infernal Healing (https://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/i/infernal-healing/). At caster level 1, it restores 10 HP - which makes it great on a wand. If casting a 1st level spell costs, say, 1d6 HP... I can (on average) cast just shy of three spells off of one charge from my wand of Infernal Healing. And that spell is on a lot of lists. If you have the class use another class's list (which is usually recommended, due to how expansions work in Pathfinder) then Infernal Healing is likely on it. Even if it's not, UMD and wands are both common things, and you'll generally be playing with a party - one of whom is very likely to be able to cast your healing spells for you if you don't have them.

If you go much higher than that on the damage, though, the class is essentially unplayable without such tricks at low levels: You cast just one spell, and you're done for the day.

[Skyflare19]

I am sure that 99% of the time that people want a "blood magic" class, the Bloatmage is not what they have in mind for the character.

Yeah, I'm more in line for a "self-harm as a cost for dark magic" kind of character. My biggest problem at this point is balancing the self-inflicted injuries, the Blood Points received, and the HD of the class. I don't want it to be a constant risk of killing oneself, but over using the magic should definitely run that risk. The Archetype that exists is, while interesting, not really related to any type of blood magic that I have ever heard of.

[Peat]

The Holy Vindicator has a bleeding buff thing too. Again probably not that helpful.

Question - can the PC gain blood points just from themselves, or from anyone?

[Skyflare19]

The Holy Vindicator has a bleeding buff thing too. Again probably not that helpful.

Question - can the PC gain blood points just from themselves, or from anyone?

I just checked out the Holy Vindicator, but its Stigmata ability isn't quite what I'm looking for. Something more in line with the Blood Caster Prestige class, but instead of using Blood Points to regain expended spells, I want to use them as the basis of spells in the first place. The Holy Vindicator uses their blood to empower their own attacks, AC, or saves.

Also, I am planning for the concept behind the class to be using one's own life force to power their spell casting ability. Using someone else's blood defeats the purpose. Though I am considering giving the class something that might be able to restore a small amount of health, possibly in the form of a lower cost spell.

[Skyflare19]

There's a problem with using HP instead of spell slots to power casting: Healing can get cheap. Take Infernal Healing (https://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/i/infernal-healing/). At caster level 1, it restores 10 HP - which makes it great on a wand. If casting a 1st level spell costs, say, 1d6 HP... I can (on average) cast just shy of three spells off of one charge from my wand of Infernal Healing. And that spell is on a lot of lists. If you have the class use another class's list (which is usually recommended, due to how expansions work in Pathfinder) then Infernal Healing is likely on it. Even if it's not, UMD and wands are both common things, and you'll generally be playing with a party - one of whom is very likely to be able to cast your healing spells for you if you don't have them.

If you go much higher than that on the damage, though, the class is essentially unplayable without such tricks at low levels: You cast just one spell, and you're done for the day.

A counter to this could be that the healing used on this character can't counteract the loss from accruing Blood Points. Alternatively, the character can only heal himself, and cannot be healed by others. Beyond that, I am planning to set it up with the concept that rather than actually casting spells, the class would function off of spell-like abilities. They can still be countered just as normal spells, but it gives higher versatility at a cost.

As far as the damage taken, I was thinking each Blood Point being based off of a d4 for damage sounded reasonable, with the possibility of using higher dice in order to increase the benefit from each attempt. The number of Blood Points consumed per spell level would be the same as the bonus that the Blood Caster Prestige class receives. Any left over points are kept until a long rest is completed.

[Dr_Dinosaur]

The “casting traditions” mechanic from Spheres allows this. Just take Draining Casting (kineticist burn) and another drawback, then Fortified Casting as a boon (use CON as casting stat)