Ability Rip Questions?

[HeyThereImBear]

So, Ability rip lets me take the rejuvenation ability from Illurien (MM5 p 91).

Now, if I was to die, would I be transported to the designated location 2 days later, or would it result in (semi) perm. death?

IF, in the event that I am transported, would I keep the ability, or would I just be out of luck due to ability rip wearing off?

Similarly, If I was to rip that ability, kill the creature, make an astral seed, and then kill myself, would I be transported into the seed?

[BowStreetRunner]

The Illurien's Rejuvenation ability trips when you are slain, so I would say that it goes off before the Ability Rip spell drops off when you become a corpse. However, the Ability Rip does go away when you die, so you don't still have that Su ability after it resolves. Once the Rejuvenation does resolve you are sitting in the Athenaeum Nefarious and will have to deal with whatever is there. (The book mentions baleful traps, vile guardians, and several one-way portals to other planes. So any decent DM is going to give you one heck of a hard time on the other end, and if they don't they should be smacked on the head with their own DMG.)

As for what happens if you have both Rejuvenation and Astral Seed in place - they both trip when you are slain...but beyond that...I'm not sure how it would work out. I'll have to read both abilities over again and think about that one.

[HeyThereImBear]

The Illurien's Rejuvenation ability trips when you are slain, so I would say that it goes off before the Ability Rip spell drops off when you become a corpse. However, the Ability Rip does go away when you die, so you don't still have that Su ability after it resolves. Once the Rejuvenation does resolve you are sitting in the Athenaeum Nefarious and will have to deal with whatever is there. (The book mentions baleful traps, vile guardians, and several one-way portals to other planes. So any decent DM is going to give you one heck of a hard time on the other end, and if they don't they should be smacked on the head with their own DMG.)

As for what happens if you have both Rejuvenation and Astral Seed in place - they both trip when you are slain...but beyond that...I'm not sure how it would work out. I'll have to read both abilities over again and think about that one.

According to this thread:

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?519038-How-Do-You-Make-Ability-Rip-Permanent

You get to keep the ripped ability, though?

[BowStreetRunner]

According to this thread:

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?519038-How-Do-You-Make-Ability-Rip-Permanent

You get to keep the ripped ability, though?
The problem here is both Astral Seed and Rejuvenation have been triggered. So when you are slain, your soul transfers into the storage crystal. You now must spend ten days in uninterrupted solitude in order to grow a new body. However, after 2 days Rejuvenation is going to cause you to reappear in the Athenaeum Nefarious.

[HeyThereImBear]

The problem here is both Astral Seed and Rejuvenation have been triggered. So when you are slain, your soul transfers into the storage crystal. You now must spend ten days in uninterrupted solitude in order to grow a new body. However, after 2 days Rejuvenation is going to cause you to reappear in the Athenaeum Nefarious.

I'm curious if it wouldn't just transport the crystal ? There's no physical form for you to take, assuming the body is properly disposed of... This is simply speculation, but... If you're in the crystal, and that's the form your soul currently inhabits, then would it not transport that..?

I wish there was a rules hotline.

[RighteousPauper]

The problem here is both Astral Seed and Rejuvenation have been triggered. So when you are slain, your soul transfers into the storage crystal. You now must spend ten days in uninterrupted solitude in order to grow a new body. However, after 2 days Rejuvenation is going to cause you to reappear in the Athenaeum Nefarious.

I think that interaction would essentially allow you to keep the Rejuvenation ability (as per the effect of Astral Seed), and your body would be reincarnated in your Secret Library, thus fizzling the rest of the time needed for Astral Seed and ending its effects early. However, I’d much rather just go through with the Astral Seed than have to fight my way out of the Athenæum Nefarious lol

[Malimar]

I wish there was a rules hotline.
There used to be. It was hilariously terrible in every way.

At least Paizo is half on the ball in this regard, I suppose.

[HeyThereImBear]

I think that interaction would essentially allow you to keep the Rejuvenation ability (as per the effect of Astral Seed), and your body would be reincarnated in your Secret Library, thus fizzling the rest of the time needed for Astral Seed and ending its effects early. However, I’d much rather just go through with the Astral Seed than have to fight my way out of the Athenæum Nefarious lol


So, are you suggesting that the body would be complete?

And, I'm honestly not worried about getting out. (Greater) Plane shift is a thing.

[BowStreetRunner]

And, I'm honestly not worried about getting out. (Greater) Plane shift is a thing.Except it may not be a thing where you are going. Since the exact location of the Athenaeum Nefarious isn't known, you are taking a huge risk that any magic at all will work there. The Dispensary where Illurien can be called is only 100 miles from the central spire of the Outlands. That's Impeded Spells and Limited Spells for all 9 levels and All Divine Powers annulled.

[HeyThereImBear]

Except it may not be a thing where you are going. Since the exact location of the Athenaeum Nefarious isn't known, you are taking a huge risk that any magic at all will work there. The Dispensary where Illurien can be called is only 100 miles from the central spire of the Outlands. That's Impeded Spells and Limited Spells for all 9 levels and All Divine Powers annulled.

It specifically says that The Athenaeum Nefarious exists in a demi-plane / pocket dimension, non? I guess that's on some dm fiat. That being said, If magic doesn't work, getting out gets harder but certainly isn't impossible. Setting aside that little bit, I'm more curious if it sticks v anything else. Like, worse case scenario my character is trapped there but can't die? It doesn't need food or water so I'm not toooooo concerned about that. Or I just get ported to some random plane and then have to planeshift myself out?

[BowStreetRunner]

It specifically says that The Athenaeum Nefarious exists in a demi-plane / pocket dimension, non?Non. It says it is "well hidden in the wilderness of the Outlands". It's a library (repository) located on the Concordant Domain of the Outlands. You might have been thrown off because they toss the word extraplanar into the description, but the only place it has a defined meaning is when used as a creature descriptor (in which case an outsider is native on its own plane or extraplanar everywhere else). They use that word throughout the Manual of the Planes, Planar Handbook, and all of the other books whenever they refer to things having to do with planes other than the material.

Since it belongs to a Unique CR15 evil outsider, and the description distinctly mentions baleful traps and vile guardians, expect that not only will you have to deal with the planar traits of the Outlands, but also could face an encounter as soon as you arrive. (If you don't, you need a better DM. These sorts of things are supposed to be challenging, and it's no fun if it's just hand-waved with a 'sure, you do that!') Plan appropriately.

[Nifft]

According to this thread:

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?519038-How-Do-You-Make-Ability-Rip-Permanent

You get to keep the ripped ability, though?

Keep in mind that thread is TO (theoretical optimization), and thus not expected to withstand any sort of scrutiny.

There is no rule that Astral Seed makes temporary effects permanent. It might re-start the duration of any temporary effect on you when you die. It might ignore temporary effects as they are not you, and all it does is restore you -- not your gear, not your ongoing spells.

So, if this is for a real game, the first thing you have to do is ask your DM if he or she wants TO in the game, or not.

If it's not for a real game, then forget what I've said and go crazy.

[HeyThereImBear]

Non. It says it is "well hidden in the wilderness of the Outlands". It's a library (repository) located on the Concordant Domain of the Outlands. You might have been thrown off because they toss the word extraplanar into the description, but the only place it has a defined meaning is when used as a creature descriptor (in which case an outsider is native on its own plane or extraplanar everywhere else). They use that word throughout the Manual of the Planes, Planar Handbook, and all of the other books whenever they refer to things having to do with planes other than the material.

Since it belongs to a Unique CR15 evil outsider, and the description distinctly mentions baleful traps and vile guardians, expect that not only will you have to deal with the planar traits of the Outlands, but also could face an encounter as soon as you arrive. (If you don't, you need a better DM. These sorts of things are supposed to be challenging, and it's no fun if it's just hand-waved with a 'sure, you do that!') Plan appropriately.


Hm. This is an interesting point that I suppose I was overlooking. Acquisition of an ability I desire for strictly flavour reasons has suddenly become much more complex than at first pass through. Not impossible, but probably not probable. And there are much easier ways to achieve immortality, I suppose.



Keep in mind that thread is TO (theoretical optimization), and thus not expected to withstand any sort of scrutiny.

There is no rule that Astral Seed makes temporary effects permanent. It might re-start the duration of any temporary effect on you when you die. It might ignore temporary effects as they are not you, and all it does is restore you -- not your gear, not your ongoing spells.

So, if this is for a real game, the first thing you have to do is ask your DM if he or she wants TO in the game, or not.

If it's not for a real game, then forget what I've said and go crazy.


Our DM has said to be as ridiculous as possible, with all sources viable and allowed. My character is currently a gestalt master blaster that also can roughly pull of 20-30 attacks a round. So not only is this something that has already been okayed if I can make it work, I've already been tasked with figuring out an in-game way to swing this.