Adventurers League SCAG Cantrips

[Grear Bylls]

Question: If I have a Githyanki (MTOF) Wizard (PHB), can I learn any cantrips from the Sword Coast Adventurers Guide in AL?

[Belier]

Short answer is nope.

Long answer is PHB + 1 doesn't allow for SCAG and something else.

[leogobsin]

No, MToF or SCAG would both count as your +1 for the PHB+1 rule.

[Grear Bylls]

Got it. What about spells of 1 and up from Xanathars?

[leogobsin]

Xanathar's also counts as a +1.

[Grear Bylls]

Got it. What about spells of 1 and up from Xanathars?

Can I scribe these spells or cantrips?

[Mikal]

Can I scribe these spells or cantrips?

I believe you can, if you have someone willing to pay for downtime days to do so along with you spending your downtime days.

I don't know if you can use your own characters to do this.

I could be wrong though.

[PeteNutButter]

You can't scribe cantrips, just leveled spells. If you play with another wizard you can share spells as long as you spend the appropriate downtime and gold. The spells you copy need not be in your chosen +1 book.

[Grear Bylls]

You can't scribe cantrips, just leveled spells. If you play with another wizard you can share spells as long as you spend the appropriate downtime and gold. The spells you copy need not be in your chosen +1 book.

Thanks. Is there any way I can get access to Green Flame Blade or Booming Blade? If I got a wish, could I add it to my spell list permanently?

[Mikal]

Thanks. Is there any way I can get access to Green Flame Blade or Booming Blade? If I got a wish, could I add it to my spell list permanently?

1) Don't play a race from Mord's
2) Don't use options from Xanathar's
3) Don't play AL

[nickl_2000]

Thanks. Is there any way I can get access to Green Flame Blade or Booming Blade? If I got a wish, could I add it to my spell list permanently?

I don't see why not. That is not an overly powerful use of a 9th level spell. But considering the PHB specifically states that the DM has great latitude in ruling what occurs in such an instance..., it's pretty DM dependent. Are there any modules in AL that allow you to get the common magical items that would allows GFB/BB once per day?



1) Don't play a race from Mord's
2) Don't use options from Xanathar's
3) Don't play AL

While I agree with the sentiment about AL being overly restrictive, it's still not super helpful....

[PeteNutButter]

I don't see why not. That is not an overly powerful use of a 9th level spell. But considering the PHB specifically states that the DM has great latitude in ruling what occurs in such an instance..., it's pretty DM dependent. Are there any modules in AL that allow you to get the common magical items that would allows GFB/BB once per day?

While I agree with the sentiment about AL being overly restrictive, it's still not super helpful....

Using wish to bend a meta game rule is not within its scope. Even if you convinced a DM to do so, I doubt the rest of DMs you ever meet would recognize it. It’s a **** rule, but it’s a rule.

As far as I know there is no way to get a SCAG cantrip outside using the book as your +1. Best advice is to just play a damned variant human like all the other boring kids.

[Grear Bylls]

Using wish to bend a meta game rule is not within its scope. Even if you convinced a DM to do so, I doubt the rest of DMs you ever meet would recognize it. It’s a **** rule, but it’s a rule.

As far as I know there is no way to get a SCAG cantrip outside using the book as your +1. Best advice is to just play a damned variant human like all the other boring kids.

Ugh. I even just made a custom mini for this dude, given the point is a heavy armor greatsword Abjurer. Might as well go mountain dwarf. They should change this, given there are tons of races and spells from other books.

[PhoenixPhyre]

Ugh. I even just made a custom mini for this dude, given the point is a heavy armor greatsword Abjurer. Might as well go mountain dwarf. They should change this, given there are tons of races and spells from other books.

Not that I play AL, but that's exactly why they instituted that rule. To limit interactions between material published later (and to reduce DM overhead).

[Mikal]

I don't see why not. That is not an overly powerful use of a 9th level spell. But considering the PHB specifically states that the DM has great latitude in ruling what occurs in such an instance..., it's pretty DM dependent. Are there any modules in AL that allow you to get the common magical items that would allows GFB/BB once per day?




While I agree with the sentiment about AL being overly restrictive, it's still not super helpful....

Dude asked how he could play the character he wants with the cantrips he wants. I was just pointing out within the AL ruleset how he can do so, or how he can do so without the restrictions.

[nickl_2000]

Dude asked how he could play the character he wants with the cantrips he wants. I was just pointing out within the AL ruleset how he can do so, or how he can do so without the restrictions.

Fair enough, a mis-interpretation then

[PeteNutButter]

Ugh. I even just made a custom mini for this dude, given the point is a heavy armor greatsword Abjurer. Might as well go mountain dwarf. They should change this, given there are tons of races and spells from other books.

It's much stronger to just take first level in fighter (con saves and heavy armor as opposed to medium). Play whatever race you want.

[Grear Bylls]

It's much stronger to just take first level in fighter (con saves and heavy armor as opposed to medium). Play whatever race you want.

Yeah, I'm taking advantage of the rebuild

[sithlordnergal]

It’s a **** rule, but it’s a rule.

It's actually a pretty good rule if you think about it, as it prevents certain OP combos from happening. Imagine, if you will, the kind of shenanigans that could happen if you mixed any book. You could make a Yuan-Ti Paladin of the Ancients/Shadow Sorcerer with Booming Blade, Green Flame Blade, and all the Xanathar spells.

That would be insanely unbalanced. Advantage on all saves vs. Magical effects, resistance to all spell damage, the blade cantrips, being able to make darkness you can see in, and Shadow Blade make for a deadly combo.

As for the cantrips, no. You cannot get those cantrips any way other then having Sword Coast as your +1. But you can copy any spell from any spell list in the game, as long as it is a leveled spell

[AttilatheYeon]

I don't see why not. That is not an overly powerful use of a 9th level spell. But considering the PHB specifically states that the DM has great latitude in ruling what occurs in such an instance..., it's pretty DM dependent. Are there any modules in AL that allow you to get the common magical items that would allows GFB/BB once per day?




While I agree with the sentiment about AL being overly restrictive, it's still not super helpful....

This is incorrect. The guidance on wish for AL states what you can wish for, a cantrip isn’t there. Furthermore, a wish doesn’t last farther than the session. That’s not going to be worth having to chance wish stress. Unfortunately the sentiment is correct.

[Ganymede]

Using wish to bend a meta game rule is not within its scope.

I never thought of that as a possibility. I wonder if anyone has ever tried to use Wish to bring back THAC0 or Base Attack Bonus.

[Belier]

Thanks. Is there any way I can get access to Green Flame Blade or Booming Blade? If I got a wish, could I add it to my spell list permanently?

Wish effects in a AL game last for the scenario only. It resets when it's over. For instance, you could wish that you want to be the strong in every aspect, boosting all your attributes to 20, but then, at the end of the adventure, everything comes back to normal. Such effects put a huge stress on the caster.
With wish you could duplicate any level 8 spells but I'd keep it phb + 1 in AL since it is official ruling, wishing for something out of your +1 would put stress risk on your caracter.

[Naanomi]

Wish should be able to let you cast it once anyways... replicate that spell. Doesn’t seem worth the cost but whatever floats your boat

[Grear Bylls]

So there is effectively no way to gain access to these spells at all (excluding ONE wish cast for ONE cantrip cast)?

[Naanomi]

So there is effectively no way to gain access to these spells at all (excluding ONE wish cast for ONE cantrip cast)?
That is correct and, although annoying by some measures, intentional

[MisterSocrates]

It's actually a pretty good rule if you think about it, as it prevents certain OP combos from happening. Imagine, if you will, the kind of shenanigans that could happen if you mixed any book. You could make a Yuan-Ti Paladin of the Ancients/Shadow Sorcerer with Booming Blade, Green Flame Blade, and all the Xanathar spells.

The thing is, you can still make a Yuan Ti Paladin of Ancients / Shadow Sorcerer with Shadow Blade and a bonus feat and all Xanathar spells.
You miss out on the SCAG cantrips only, which does remove the Quickened Cantrip substitution for Extra Attack.

1. Roll up a VHuman with XGtE as your plus one
2. Play one of the two modules that turn you into a Yuan-Ti.
3. Congrats, you are a Yuan Ti with XGtE as your +1, and one of the two methods lets you retain the extra feat from being VHuman (while also gaining the Darkvision, Poison Immunity, Spell Resistance, etc of the Yuan Ti race).

Having the +1 restriction in place seems... odd, at best, when WotC then lets you cherry pick the most broken combination possible through in-game mechanics.

To OP's original question and the suggestion that you use Wish -- any effects from Wish expire at the end of the session if they aren't from a limited list of choices. Even if your DM gave you the cantrip, you would then lose it after the session wrapped.

[Naanomi]

The thing is, you can still make a Yuan Ti Paladin of Ancients / Shadow Sorcerer with Shadow Blade and a bonus feat and all Xanathar spells.
You miss out on the SCAG cantrips only, which does remove the Quickened Cantrip substitution for Extra Attack.

1. Roll up a VHuman with XGtE as your plus one
2. Play one of the two modules that turn you into a Yuan-Ti.
3. Congrats, you are a Yuan Ti with XGtE as your +1, and one of the two methods lets you retain the extra feat from being VHuman (while also gaining the Darkvision, Poison Immunity, Spell Resistance, etc of the Yuan Ti race).

Having the +1 restriction in place seems... odd, at best, when WotC then lets you cherry pick the most broken combination possible through in-game mechanics.

To OP's original question and the suggestion that you use Wish -- any effects from Wish expire at the end of the session if they aren't from a limited list of choices. Even if your DM gave you the cantrip, you would then lose it after the session wrapped.
Technically you don’t become the race yuan-ti from Volos, you just get the traits the module says

[Talionis]

I think AL should revisit its rules of one additional source book. Its not fair when XGtE has so many options and other books have so few.

It will pressure players not to buy the smaller books.

[Contrast]

I think AL should revisit its rules of one additional source book. Its not fair when XGtE has so many options and other books have so few.

It will pressure players not to buy the smaller books.

Pressure them? Certainly players are (very very slightly) less incentivised to buy books without much content for players in but...isn't that pretty expected?

[PhoenixPhyre]

I think AL should revisit its rules of one additional source book. Its not fair when XGtE has so many options and other books have so few.

It will pressure players not to buy the smaller books.

Not making players feel they need to buy all the books to stay relevant in AL is one of the design goals of the PHB+1 rule. So...that's not going to work as an argument.

[Talionis]

Not making players feel they need to buy all the books to stay relevant in AL is one of the design goals of the PHB+1 rule. So...that's not going to work as an argument.

If im trying to sell books it should be.

First off. Id like more books like XGtE... But im not buying anymore books unless they are close to the amount of content as XGtE. Specifically because of the current AL rule.

5E is almost unbreakable with the way things are designed. Im not worried about somethi g being broken.

But they have to balance the amou t of content in the new books if the AL rule doesnt change.

[Contrast]

You're assuming most people base their purchasing decisions on AL legal play. I don't think thats accurate (though I have no statistics about what percentage of play is AL).

Plus I'd point out the majority of books they publish (adventures, monsters manuals, DMG) aren't intended for 'player' purchase at all. The way they should make purchasing less comprehensive books attractive is by setting a lower price point.

[Exocist]

I never thought of that as a possibility. I wonder if anyone has ever tried to use Wish to bring back THAC0 or Base Attack Bonus.

I will try this with my DM once I get to 17th level and report back to you.

How could this wish possibly be misinterpreted in a way to screw me over? :smallbiggrin:

[Elissa]

There are few misconceptions in this thread.

You can utilize the Wish Spell's Spell Duplication function to duplicate any cantrip, regardless of source book, without suffering Wish stress.

[Contrast]

There are few misconceptions in this thread.

You can utilize the Wish Spell's Spell Duplication function to duplicate any cantrip, regardless of source book, without suffering Wish stress.

I believe the people talking about wish stress were thinking about using the spell to get the cantrip permanently (rather than just casting it once).

[Elissa]

I believe the people talking about wish stress were thinking about using the spell to get the cantrip permanently (rather than just casting it once).

And at any rate, reality would repair itself at the end of the session.

[Contrast]

And at any rate, reality would repair itself at the end of the session.

But the risk of losing access to wish is permanent making it a pretty poor solution to OPs problem unfortunately.

[mgshamster]

If im trying to sell books it should be.

A lot of times, common sense like this seems it would work.

But this is one of those occasions where the opposite is true. By limiting the amount of books to be used, they've managed to massively increase the amount of books they've sold. To the point where a year ago they had already exceeded the sales of core books from each of the pervious editions.

And to this day they're still the number 1 ranking on the quarterly industry reports. Not a single quarter has passed since the release that 5e has not been on top of the charts.

It's not the first time I've seen something massively succeed when the opposite of what seems like common sense or conventional wisdom was done.

[KorvinStarmast]

A lot of times, common sense like this seems it would work.

But this is one of those occasions where the opposite is true. By limiting the amount of books to be used, they've managed to massively increase the amount of books they've sold. To the point where a year ago they had already exceeded the sales of core books from each of the pervious editions.

And to this day they're still the number 1 ranking on the quarterly industry reports. Not a single quarter has passed since the release that 5e has not been on top of the charts.

It's not the first time I've seen something massively succeed when the opposite of what seems like common sense or conventional wisdom was done. Given how many spells they ported over from EE for the storm sorcerer, that they ported in the Sun Soul Monk, they ported over the swashbuckler, and they brought the storm sorcerer into XGtE ... am less than pleased that the four cantrips from SCAG didn't get folded into the XGtE. Sigh. Would not have been that much effort to plug those in.

[Ganymede]

I am less than pleased that the four cantrips from SCAG didn't get folded into the XGtE. Sigh. Would not have been that much effort to plug those in.

I strongly suspect this was on purpose.