Sort of a Philosophical Question

[Some Android]

I have sort of an odd question. If your name is in the credits to something (and not as like a dedication to or special thanks to) does that mean you worked on it?

Okay now what if somebody has literally the exact same name as you and that person's name is in the credits to something - does that mean you worked on it?

I ask because somebody who worked on a Hollywood blockbuster has both the first and last name of me (both spelt the exact same way) and I want to know if I can win some bets by saying I worked on it if I phrase the language of the bet in just the right way.:smallwink:

[Peelee]

I have sort of an odd question. If your name is in the credits to something (and not as like a dedication to or special thanks to) does that mean you worked on it?

No (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8P_AnvUIvJs).

For reals, though, you'd lose the bet. Someone with your name worked on that thing. You didn't technically work on it any more than you technically paid that guy's taxes, no matter how you phrase it.

[Some Android]

No (https://i.redditmedia.com/O6FXl5vLW8CG4C3qURClgf0RsPMNK3zS9nh3Ulx5Y-c.jpg?w=320&).

For reals, though, you'd lose the bet. Someone with your name worked on that thing. You didn't technically work on it any more than you technically paid that guy's taxes, no matter how you phrase it.

What if the bet is "I bet you my name is on the credits to this film!"?

[Razade]

I have sort of an odd question. If your name is in the credits to something (and not as like a dedication to or special thanks to) does that mean you worked on it?

Okay now what if somebody has literally the exact same name as you and that person's name is in the credits to something - does that mean you worked on it?

I ask because somebody who worked on a Hollywood blockbuster has both the first and last name of me (both spelt the exact same way) and I want to know if I can win some bets by saying I worked on it if I phrase the language of the bet in just the right way.:smallwink:

So, I just want to get this right.

You don't really want to know if you worked on something if someone else with your name worked on it. You just wanted to know if you could bilk people out of money by being dishonest.

[Teddy]

What if the bet is "I bet you my name is on the credits to this film!"?

Then you'd win the bet, yes. However, people wouldn't be likely to accept such a bet in the first place, because you presumably knew the outcome of the bet before you proposed it, and you probably wouldn't propose it if it would have meant your loss.

[RazorChain]

This is kind of a childish bet. It's like "I'll bet I can fly" and then you show your used airplane tickets or you bet that you've been to outer space and then show a picture of earth floating in space.

If you want to do so far laughs...sure, but if you are doing this to try to scam friends/family/acquaintances out of money then it tells a lot about yourself and you might want to evaluate your direction in life.

[shawnhcorey]

Okay now what if somebody has literally the exact same name as you and that person's name is in the credits to something - does that mean you worked on it?

I ask because somebody who worked on a Hollywood blockbuster has both the first and last name of me (both spelt the exact same way) and I want to know if I can win some bets by saying I worked on it if I phrase the language of the bet in just the right way.:smallwink:

No. That's called plagiarism. Claiming someone else's work, even indirectly, is considered the worst form of evil. Seriously, don't do it. If you do, nobody in the arts will ever do anything with you.

[Strigon]

I have sort of an odd question. If your name is in the credits to something (and not as like a dedication to or special thanks to) does that mean you worked on it?

Okay now what if somebody has literally the exact same name as you and that person's name is in the credits to something - does that mean you worked on it?

I ask because somebody who worked on a Hollywood blockbuster has both the first and last name of me (both spelt the exact same way) and I want to know if I can win some bets by saying I worked on it if I phrase the language of the bet in just the right way.:smallwink:

I really have no idea why you would think this.
You're asking if you have to work on something, in order to have worked on it. Of course you do.
Sharing a name with someone is not the same as being that someone. It's not that rare an occurrence, either.

[Honest Tiefling]

I think you need to ask yourself, do you REALLY want to be that guy who brags about things to other people? That's not really how you impress people, and I doubt many people are going to care if your name is in the credits, especially if you have a common name.

[Telonius]

Yeah, in general I'd say don't do this for kicks or for bets. I have benefited from something like it professionally, though. I work at a science journal, and happen to have the same first and last name as a member of the National Academies. I always sign emails with my middle initial, but even so, authors tend to reply to my messages a lot more quickly than the rest of the people on my team.

[AMFV]

No. That's called plagiarism. Claiming someone else's work, even indirectly, is considered the worst form of evil. Seriously, don't do it. If you do, nobody in the arts will ever do anything with you.

It would be plagiarism if he were actually claiming real credit for the work. This is more like a magic trick, it's bull**** but probably not harmful bull**** unless he's actually involving like a real sum of money, like more than a couple bucks for a joke.

I will say this, if somebody bets me anything that sounds like the phrasing is carefully planned or like they've thought it out, I know instantly that they're up to something, and if your friends are bright they will too.

[Elanasaurus]

Claiming someone else's work, even indirectly, is considered the worst form of evil.Only slightly worse than torture, rape, or murder, though.
:elan:

[Fyraltari]

I have sort of an odd question. If your name is in the credits to something (and not as like a dedication to or special thanks to) does that mean you worked on it?

Okay now what if somebody has literally the exact same name as you and that person's name is in the credits to something - does that mean you worked on it?

I ask because somebody who worked on a Hollywood blockbuster has both the first and last name of me (both spelt the exact same way) and I want to know if I can win some bets by saying I worked on it if I phrase the language of the bet in just the right way.:smallwink:
You almost got me there, Android, but nope, I am not going to help you better impersonate humans as part of whatever nefarious plan you have to replace mankind.

[tomandtish]

Other people have covered the honesty part of it, so consider that said.

But even then, it's not YOUR name. it's the name of another person that happens to look the same as yours.

No different then if you buy a new car, and the exact same make/model/color/package is used in a movie. YOUR car isn't in the movie. just a car that looks like yours.

[Teddy]

Other people have covered the honesty part of it, so consider that said.

But even then, it's not YOUR name. it's the name of another person that happens to look the same as yours.

No different then if you buy a new car, and the exact same make/model/color/package is used in a movie. YOUR car isn't in the movie. just a car that looks like yours.

Well, now we're actually digging into some interesting philosophy. Can two identical names be not the same name? If the only attribute to a name is the sequence of letters that make it up, then no, for if there's nothing distinguishing two objects, then they are the same. But if a name also carries the attribute of the person who it belongs to, then yes, and in many cases we will be able to determine who of all people sharing the same identical letter sequence an instance of the name refers to based on context. But then there are those times when it's ambiguous, who does the name belong to then?

From a more practical standpoint, the way we talk about names seem to suggest that we consider every sequence of letters that matches our own name to be "my name".

[Algeh]

All that being said, my dad has a very common name, shared by, among many other people, both a current pro golfer and a pro basketball player in a previous generation (the basketball player's is spelled differently, the golfer's is not). We regularly discuss how "his" golf career is going whenever that player shows up on the leaderboard for some golf tournament we happen to see results for, because it is kind of ridiculous.

The difference being, of course, that both of us are in on the joke and he's not actually trying to trick me into thinking he's a professional golfer.

[Knaight]

Well, now we're actually digging into some interesting philosophy. Can two identical names be not the same name? If the only attribute to a name is the sequence of letters that make it up, then no, for if there's nothing distinguishing two objects, then they are the same. But if a name also carries the attribute of the person who it belongs to, then yes, and in many cases we will be able to determine who of all people sharing the same identical letter sequence an instance of the name refers to based on context. But then there are those times when it's ambiguous, who does the name belong to then?

From a more practical standpoint, the way we talk about names seem to suggest that we consider every sequence of letters that matches our own name to be "my name".

A name is generally considered a signifier for a person first and foremost though - the sequence of letters and/or sounds* that make up a name is secondary. This essentially creates two different definitions, where by one definition of "my name" the answer is no, and another definition of "my name" the answer is yes. It's less philosophy and more semantics. It's also a point where people can be real jerks with equivocation.

*Names clearly existed in illiterate societies.

[dps]

Can you win some bets on this? Sure, if the people who you are betting with are suckers, and even then you'll be cheating to win.

[Kyrell1978]

Can you win some bets on this? Sure, if the people who you are betting with are suckers, and even then you'll be cheating to win.

I'm going to second this.

[Jay R]

Ignoring the practical question ("Can I get away with this?"), I will take your thread title seriously and answer the philosophical question:

Can I honestly win a bet by being dishonest?

The answer is no. That is clearly philosophically self-inconsistent.

[AvatarVecna]

https://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/words_that_end_in_gry.png

[Anonymouswizard]

Only slightly worse than torture, rape, or murder, though.
:elan:

Don't plagiarise any of those though, is the only known easy to be eviler than Xykon.


On the thread topic, I can see using it as a joke, especially in the 'looking it up and bring disappointed out isn't you' serve, but that's the closest it gets to funny, and it's the other person is in on the joke a beer is just going to leave them pissed off (even if it's for nothing).

At the very least, it's like betting 10gp that my name appears in this forum. It''s stupid, because likelihood is I already know whether it does.

[5a Violista]

I have sort of an odd question. If your name is in the credits to something (and not as like a dedication to or special thanks to) does that mean you worked on it?

Okay now what if somebody has literally the exact same name as you and that person's name is in the credits to something - does that mean you worked on it?

I ask because somebody who worked on a Hollywood blockbuster has both the first and last name of me (both spelt the exact same way) and I want to know if I can win some bets by saying I worked on it if I phrase the language of the bet in just the right way.:smallwink:
No, if your name (or the name of someone with the same name as you) is in the credits, that doesn't mean you worked on it. It simply means you can find your name in the credits.

Simply being credited for something (or, alternatively, tricking somebody into thinking you're being credited for something) doesn't necessarily mean you deserved the credit, or that you worked on it. Saying that you worked on something that you actually didn't would just be a blatant lie. It'd be like saying "I was the first president of the United States" if your name is George Washington, or someone saying "You are a convicted murderer" if someone with the same as you was just convicted, or "I was at your funeral" if they were at someone else's funeral. (Granted, this could make a good joke (not bet) with the right tone of voice: while at a graveyard, I saw a gravestone with the same name as my brother-in-law, and we both found it funny when he was told "Hey, turns out you're actually dead, here's proof">)

"Someone named <my name> worked on this/was president/was convicted" is a way you could phrase it to make it true, but it would be a terribly un-clever statement and an awful bet.

On the other hand, you could bet "My name is in the credits" but, even then, it could be argued by the other person that the name technically isn't yours, it's someone else's name that's the same as yours. Depending on how well you can debate (and the mood of the other person) you could either win the bet and be seen as clever, or lose the bet and be seen as a scammer-wannabe-who-isn't-even-a-good-scammer.

A bet that you could do and be 100% honest could be (If your name is Fulana de Tal/John Smith/Whatevs, for example) "The name Fulana de Tal/John Smith/Whatevs appears in the credits". That wouldn't be a good thing to bet money on, though, because (1) the fact that you are wording it that way makes it kinda obvious you're trying to trick them especially if money's involved, and (2) it's kinda jerkish. It would be alright if it were a friendly bet (no collateral or favors involved, just bragging rights) or if it were with a close friend/family member.

So...
"I worked on this, see?" is not only lying, but also not even technically true, regardless of how you word it, but could possibly make a sarcastic joke.
"Someone with my name worked on this" is a statement of fact, but not clever at all.
"My name is here" is arguably true and possibly clever but really depends on various factors.
"This name that happens to be mine is here" is completely true, somewhat clever, but easily seen through and would make for a jerkish bet anyway, in most circumstances.

[snowblizz]

English doesn't have a specific word for "person with same name as I" does it?

[Jay R]

In his first credited role, Harrison Ford was listed as "Harrison J. Ford", because there was a silent screen star also named Harrison Ford.

The newer actor (Han, Indiana) didn't know about the older one until he happened on a star on the Hollywood Walk of Fame with his own name on it.

[Kyrell1978]

English doesn't have a specific word for "person with same name as I" does it?

The word "namesake" is used for that, although it gives the impression that one is named after the other.

[snowblizz]

The word "namesake" is used for that, although it gives the impression that one is named after the other.

Ah, yeah. I've heard that sometime. And you are right it does sound like it takes after someone else. Like a keepsake is a remembrence of someone/thing.

I see wiktionary lists it 1. named after someon 2. same name as someone.

[Lvl 2 Expert]

In his first credited role, Harrison Ford was listed as "Harrison J. Ford", because there was a silent screen star also named Harrison Ford.

The newer actor (Han, Indiana) didn't know about the older one until he happened on a star on the Hollywood Walk of Fame with his own name on it.

Harrison Ford is such a great actor, he's on the Hollywood Walk of Fame twice.

[vladimir520]

Lol if it makes you feel better