Ethereal Filcher character (Critiques welcome!)

[Warchon]

BUILD DESCRIPTION IS FURTHER DOWN THE THREAD
I came across an interesting playable race, and it lends itself to a few character ideas, but not particularly well to any class. Curious how others world apply this race, as well as how you'd interpret the somewhat confusing description.

http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/fc/20060224a

With a massive SoH bonus and the racial love of "trinkets," a Filcher sounds like a good fit for a rogue--raise your UMD score and fill up with as many toys as you can find--but the Int penalty and the 5 racial HD with very poor skill selection and points provided would be crippling.

Obviously any class that relies heavily on spell casting is similarly out due to those same 5 hit dice.

The ability to move unhindered through enemy territory makes him sound like an ideal scout or wizardkiller, so maybe barbarian?

The monster manual entry explicitly denies him the use of any language at all, however, and there is nothing in the template entry to say that changes by becoming a PC--inability to speak isn't so bad, but being unable to even understand what is going on would make it really difficult to be useful to a party.

I'm also having trouble being sure I read the Ethereal Jaunt ability correctly--the wording (and the fluff for the sample character) suggests that the Filcher is -native- to the Ethereal Plane and -visits- the Material, but the ability reads like he lives on the Material and can only go ethereal for seconds at a time.

The thing has four arms, too, but am I correct in assuming that is essentially reduced to meaningless fluff without a Special Quality that explicitly does something with it?

[BowStreetRunner]

Not being able to speak and not being able to understand are two different things. Since it has no automatic languages and no bonus languages listed however, I would think that you would need to pick up a rank in Speak Language to be able to understand a language - and whether you could learn to produce the sounds might be a DM call, but I would think not. Note that this also potentially prevents spell-casting or even using command words.

The breakdown of the Ethereal Filcher (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/etherealFilcher.htm)'s time between the Material and Ethereal planes was always a bit confusing. "An ethereal filcher can shift from the Ethereal Plane to the Material Plane as part of any move action, and shift back again as a free action. It can remain on the Ethereal Plane for 1 round before returning to the Material Plane."

Its only natural attack is a bite, so apparently the number of arms doesn't help it in that case. However, while the multiattack feat requires three or more natural attacks, the multiweapon fighting feat only requires three or more hands (and Dex 13). So that would certainly be a possibility.

For a PC you should keep in mind that while the first five levels are going to only offer a meager number of skill points, once it picks up that sixth and higher levels in another class the max ranks in other class skills aren't going to be limited. So for a very tight build you could dump a bunch of points into a couple of skills at each level to catch them up.

For instance, assume a 12 Intelligence, taking max ranks in Listen, Spot, and Sleight of Hand for those five levels - 8 ranks each. Picking up Scout at 6th nets you 9 skill points, putting one into Speak Language to understand Common leaves you 8 for Hide. At 7th you take another level of Scout, on rank into Speak Language to understand Undercommon, and 8 for Move Silently. At 8th level you take your third level of scout and bring Listen, Spot, and Sleight of Hand all up to 11 ranks. At 9th level you now can put a rank each into Listen, Spot, and SoH and have three more to bring Hide and Move Silently up to 11 ranks. By 10th level you can now max out all 5 skills with two points left over. From 11th on you will have 4 points left over each turn. So eventually you'll be able to max out at least 6 skills this way.

I know it's not ideal, but an arrangement like this can make a very focused build possible. There really isn't going to be a great deal of flexibility in what it can do.

I think Scout makes more sense than Rogue simply because the Ethereal Filcher already has 40 ft movement from it's racial progression. That works pretty well with a Scout's skirmish.

[Rebel7284]

Ur Priest? Filching divine spells from the gods sounds like fun. Need one level of a class with a good fort save. Ideally with spellcraft. Knowledge devotion/educated/planar touchstone for easier knowledge skills a plus.

[Warchon]

I'm starting to make a build for this guy.
What I'm looking at right now is taking advantage of his four arms and ethereal jaunt ability to make a Pounce rogue who always gets into flanking* position by going right through people in his way. The 2 lost BAB points hurt, but with Ambidexterity (all but one hand are explicitly 'off hands' and therefore qualify for the +4) and Multiweapon fighting I think it can work.
I can't afford to lose any more BAB, hence Spirit Lion Barbarian dip instead of a Cleric dip.
If I swap out Evasion and Improved Evasion for the rogue talents that let you improve your AC versus spells and reflect missed spells, respectively, that should help shore up a big weakness for a character that otherwise is already very difficult to affect at all.

*might not need Flanking. Depends whether the DM agrees that not existing on this plane at all until the moment of the attack is as good as invisibility.

[Kelb_Panthera]

Ninja seems like a good fit. Ghost strike becomes -way- more useful when you're ethereal at will and it makes the question of visibility go away for sudden strike.

[Warchon]

Ninja seems like a good fit. Ghost strike becomes -way- more useful when you're ethereal at will and it makes the question of visibility go away for sudden strike.

Ninja is a good flavorful option, to be sure!


Not being able to speak and not being able to understand are two different things. Since it has no automatic languages and no bonus languages listed however, I would think that you would need to pick up a rank in Speak Language to be able to understand a language - and whether you could learn to produce the sounds might be a DM call, but I would think not. Note that this also potentially prevents spell-casting or even using command words.

I'm okay with never speaking intelligibility. Maybe I can talk the DM into allowing Speak Language to grant understanding and simple words, so that command words can still be a thing.
"I has trinket! I use trinket!" is probably gonna be an important to the little guy, it'd be a shame if he couldn't.

I like the Scout idea, but I'm still leaning Rogue (or, perhaps, Ninja) simply because with 5 (or 6) lost levels I want to start accruing those extra damage dice and try to regain some lost ground. In that vein, Scout feels like hybridizing a hybrid.



I'm also starting to think about how the Ethereal Plane even works. Does darkness matter there? A Darkness spell explicitly does not affect the EP, what about natural light? Is the "gray, indistinct" visual quality of the plane omnipresent, or do material sources of light simply shed light onto both planes?

[Thurbane]

This is one of those racial classes that I suspect were to enable the DM to use immature versions of the monsters as an encounter, rather than as a playable race. Similar to Ambush Drake (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/fc/20060728a).

Unless I'm missing something, no LA is mentioned, only CR.

Still, if the DM allows it as a playable race, more power to you.

[Kelb_Panthera]

I'm also starting to think about how the Ethereal Plane even works. Does darkness matter there? A Darkness spell explicitly does not affect the EP, what about natural light? Is the "gray, indistinct" visual quality of the plane omnipresent, or do material sources of light simply shed light onto both planes?

MotP covers that in detail. You can see both planes out to 60ft and no further regardless of lighting conditions on the material when you're on the ethereal.

That is:the natural, diffuse light of the ethereal allows you to see material locations and objects even if it's pitch black on the material and even broad daylight doesn't allow you to see further than 60ft.

[Silva Stormrage]

I see sleight of hand and immediately think of Shadow Caster.

Not sure how feasible the build is but some kind of shadow caster/ur priest mystic theruge build could be interesting if you grab the really good sleight of hand boosting mysteries.

Pretty MAD though and the end result isn't too elegant. You would get a veeeery interesting thief style character though. It might work better as an NPC than a party character.

[Warchon]

This is one of those racial classes that I suspect were to enable the DM to use immature versions of the monsters as an encounter, rather than as a playable race. Similar to Ambush Drake (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/fc/20060728a).

Unless I'm missing something, no LA is mentioned, only CR.

Still, if the DM allows it as a playable race, more power to you.


The MM3 gives it an LA of - and the link above includes a sample Filcher with monk levels and a cute little storyline. :)


I see sleight of hand and immediately think of Shadow Caster.

Not sure how feasible the build is but some kind of shadow caster/ur priest mystic theruge build could be interesting if you grab the really good sleight of hand boosting mysteries.

Pretty MAD though and the end result isn't too elegant. You would get a veeeery interesting thief style character though. It might work better as an NPC than a party character.

I'm a little leery of what looks like essentially a caster class on a chassis that obliterates five caster levels off the hop, but I have zero experience with Mysteries. I'll probably spend some time on my day off later and try to get a grasp on how it works!

[Silva Stormrage]

The MM3 gives it an LA of - and the link above includes a sample Filcher with monk levels and a cute little storyline. :)



I'm a little leery of what looks like essentially a caster class on a chassis that obliterates five caster levels off the hop, but I have zero experience with Mysteries. I'll probably spend some time on my day off later and try to get a grasp on how it works!

Really the Ur Priest is the only relevant casting part. Shadow Caster has some great low level mysteries that give massive boosts to sleight of hand and do things like let you steal objects through a stronger version of mage hand. So you don't really need high level shadowcaster levels for what I was suggesting.

[Warchon]

OK, so I'm actually doing up a build for this now, based both on feedback I've gotten in this thread and my own research. I'm not experienced at this, so I would greatly appreciate a critique, and any pointers on where it could have been better (or where I did well!).
The prospective campaign he'd enter is rigid 4d6 drop lowest, with one score-swap, but that's hard to simulate so I based this on a 28 point buy. I also love my fluff for him and want to share it, but I'll bury that in Spoilers so as not to annoy those who aren't interested.

I felt that the 5 RHD ruled out any casting class, and with a medium BAB that also kicks you out on a 0-BAB level, maximizing that the flurry of attacks available due to the 4 arms should be of paramount importance.

I thought I needed to have a focused build--do one thing really well--and I think I've accomplished that. The general strategy is to spend every round Charging an opponent while ethereal, manifest at the end of that charge to deliver a world of pain with a bevy of attacks that all get Sneak Attack dice, then zip off back into the EP to negate the penalties for charging (AC might be 7, but you can't hit what doesn't exist on this plane at all). Anyone hoping to hit the Filcher at all is going to either need a readied action, or the ability to see into the ethereal plane AND force attacks to do something about it, so the build is going to be severely glass cannon, relying on elusiveness to avoid retribution.

Starting Stats:

STR 10 (not terribly necessary for a sneak attack build)
DEX 16 (terribly necessary for a sneak attack build)
CON 12 (Not a dump stat, at least)
INT 16 (Shores up his awful RHD skill points)
WIS 10 (Essentially a dump stat, relying on Ethereal Jaunt to minimize the associated risks)
CHA 8 (Dump)


The first five levels for this race are required to be racial, which hurts, but they do provide an additional +4 to DEX, +2 to STR, and of course, Jaunt.

Advancement by level

1 - Multiweapon Attack, Murky-Eyed, Combat Expertise
-Rolling twice on concealment hurts, but it fits the fluff of a character who isn't used to trying to hit things on the material plane in the first place. More of an RP decision than an "I need this feat now" decision. Combat Expertise provides a little insurance for situations where the character may become unable to shift to the EP, or if something follows him in, due to a lack of general focus on AC or other defenses. It won't be used in most combats.
2 - No meaningful decisions to make
3 - Weapon Focus: Dagger?
- Daggers seem like an easy choice, mostly because this build has a delay on weapon finesse, and the option to throw them if I -need- that extra to-hit bonus is nice.
4 - +1 to dex
5 - No meaningful choices, but I'm finally done with the RHD and get my ugly claws on that at-will Jaunt.
6 - Spirit Lion Totem Barbarian, EWP - Bastard Sword
- For the Pounce that is integral to this build, of course. Although the availability of Rage is a nice bonus. The EWP is a feat tax, but there's no reason I can't primary it.
7 - Ronin
- Grab that first sneak attack die a little ahead of schedule than if I'd gone Rogue.
8 - Ronin, +1 dex
- The second level of Ronin comes along with the first iterative attack, and crucially, lets you dump AC on a charge. With 6 potential hits in a round at a bab of +6, that's a bonus of up to 36 damage, and you don't even really pay the AC price because you cease to exist as soon as you've done it. This is a big level.
9 - Sneak Attack Fighter, Craven
- We grab our second sneak attack and so far we've maintained full BAB since exiting RHD. And now there's another NINE damage on EACH sneak attack
10 - Swashbuckler
- Finally get that Weapon Finesse to boost your attack rolls by what is now a +6 DEX modifier.
11 - Swashbuckler (Shield of Blades ACF)
12 - Swashbuckler, Daring Outlaw, Dex +1
- We're going to stick with Swashbuckler from here on out, and now that it advances Sneak Attack as a rogue, we'll claim a die from 11 and at every odd numbered level. We're behind a standard, human TWF rogue by two and a half dice per attack, but we're now ahead on BAB and will stay there, and are doing more attacks per round with some fairly massive damage dice.

Skills suffer, but you've got some pretty big racial bonuses in the three big quintessential rogue skills, and a few points to spend on shoring something up to not be totally useless outside combat. Expect to be a big part of puzzle solving, since walls literally do not matter to you. I do recommend grabbing three proper Rogue levels at some point just to get your hands on Penetrating Strike, so you'll continue to be useful in fights against monsters that would otherwise be immune. Other than that there is no shortage of sneak attack feats to keep your damage output at least reasonable.

Some missed opportunities here include the Ninja class (who needs to wear armor anyway when your dex is ridiculous) and of course the lack of a PrC to go into. On some level I think I felt I would have been wasting the feat investment to make the Swashbuckler levels worth having. Perhaps on a more experienced build I'd just take Weapon Finesse directly and find other ways to gain full BAB and sneak attack together.

With a little rearrangement of stats, Dragonfire Strike also becomes a potentially viable way to replace Penetrating Strike. You'll require an extra feat to qualify for that, but you can avoid the Rogue "dip" and preserve your near-full BAB. it's not a bad way to go if you want to lean a little on UMD, which fits the fluff of a klepto-hoarder monster, even if it's not a class skill.

Regarding Character Fluff
Our existing party ran into an Ethereal Filcher that stole some inconsequential items, then ran away when the Duskblade made his spot check and walloped him with a big hammer on AoO.
I expect his next Adventurer encounter was against a high level Illumian wizard. (Illumian because they are literally made of language the same way you are made of biology and I think that is super appropriate for what happens next).
If you've read the MM entry, you'll know that Ethereal Filchers have no language. At all. It's as foreign to them as it is to a beetle, or a toaster. But I figure the wizard that catches our Filcher does something to cause him to temporarily be able to comprehend languages. I haven't bothered to look up a way for this to happen, since it's history-fluff, and we all know a clever wizard can damn well do anything he wants--probably by abusing PAO in some way. He then made a deal with the Filcher, some form of service and, presumably, his stuff back in exchange for his life. The wizard would also have made, or arranged to have made, whatever armor the Filcher shows up with, mainly because what other reason could possibly justify the fact that custom armor for this misshapen terror exists at all?
To the Filcher himself, the details of the deal are irrelevant. What's important is the astonishing fact that a deal was made. He's spent his whole life acquiring trinkets and treasures and now all of a sudden he has learned that there is a whole new type of trinket that he can obtain, that he can safely stow IN HIS OWN HEAD to admire at his leisure. Other Filchers can't steal it from him, and the adventurers he steals them from don't even get mad and try to kill him like they do when he tries to take their shinies!
A little fudging of the details of their arrangement later, and our new little friend has wandered off and abandoned his master, providing a justification for the Ronin class levels as well as a possible plot hook for the DM to use at his option at some time later int he campaign.
He still steals anything that isn't nailed down, of course, but would be beginning to comprehend the concept of personal property, and would also be obsessed with his new treasure: Words, thoughts, and ideas. This means both that his trinkets of choice would lean heavily into books and scrolls and maybe the occasional gem with Explosive Runes inscribed on them (oops!) but also that the party could keep his impulses in check during delicate moments simply by talking to him.
He won't try to steal the King's crown right off his head as long as somebody is telling him not to. Not because he respects the authority, of course, but simply because "A person is describing a thing!" is a much more valuable treasure to him than some shiny hat.

The Jaunt ability provides a serious challenge to the DM, of course, if unchecked. "I walk through the walls and grab the MacGuffin" will ruin the fun for everybody after too many iterations. But the character is barely competent in the idea that language is even a thing that exists, and complex concepts like "We're trapped in THIS room and we need to be in THAT room" will be too much to understand, particularly for somebody who dwells on the ethereal plane, for whom walls are literally just annoying clouds that you have to walk through to see what's on the other side of.

Of course his partial understanding of Common and his unbridled enthusiasm for learning more about it means he's going to be gibbering basically all of the time, excitedly yelling whatever words he knows. I can see every combat turn ending with him popping into existence, yelling "JABJABJABJABJAB!" while ventilating a foe, then disappearing, which is why I think Jabber is a super appropriate name.