10 foot pole + Tavern Brawler

[nickl_2000]

What do you think, could you get a 10 foot reach at 1d4+strength if you were to have the tavern brawler feat and use a 10 foot pole as an improvised weapon?

[Lombra]

A 10ft pole most likely doesn't give you 10ft reach, since you have to actually hold it, tavern brawler or not, it doesn't feel reasonable to me.

[sophontteks]

They based thr tavern brawler around the improvised weapon, which is 1d4 without reach. If the weapon better resembles a real weapon, it is considered that weapon. I'd call a 10 foot pole a quarterstaff.

Interestingly, neither the quarterstaff, nor the spear have reach either.

[Cerefel]

Historically, most quarterstaves were only about 5-6ft long, so I think a 10ft pole having reach would be reasonable

[Willie the Duck]

Given that pikes* and halberds are in the same reach category, I think it's safe to say that things are a little vague. I'd say do what makes sense at the time. *which might be actually longspears, since you can conceivably fight with them outside of formation, but then again weigh enough to be actual pikes, and okay maybe I'm overthinking this

[sophontteks]

Historically, most quarterstaves were only about 5-6ft long, so I think a 10ft pole having reach would be reasonable
You are right, but the weapons themselves are vague. They are broad, sweeping generalizations. The rules for improvised weapons is that its either:
A: A 1d4 weapon without reach.
B: The closest matching weapon in the list

I think the closest match is a spear or a quarterstaff, but these don't have reach and it wouldn't be considered improvised anyway.

None of these options are going to allow the OP to do what he wants, which is likely to grapple targets at 10 feet. Improvised rules don't allow that.

[PeteNutButter]

You are right, but the weapons themselves are vague. They are broad, sweeping generalizations. The rules for improvised weapons is that its either:
A: A 1d4 weapon without reach.
B: The closest matching weapon in the list

I think the closest match is a spear or a quarterstaff, but these don't have reach and it wouldn't be considered improvised anyway.

None of these options are going to allow the OP to do what he wants, which is likely to grapple targets at 10 feet. Improvised rules don't allow that.

I don’t think that would work anyways. You’d still have to meet the normal rules from grappling something within the reach of your arms. If you threw a bottle at someone 20 feet away tavern brawler wouldn’t let you actually grab them (unless you closed the distance).

Since many halberds aren’t even 10 feet long I see no problem giving the pole reach. If you think about it, you functionally only need about 6 or 7 feet of reach to hit someone that is “10 feet away,” since you’re swinging at their nearest part.

[Laserlight]

I haven't tried it with a 10ft pole but I know from experience that with a 7ft spear and strong wrists, you can start with your right hand with a good grip on its rear end, and left hand loosely supporting it mid haft. Extend and lunge, recover, and you can get...well, disarmed. But if you catch him off guard, you can manage a surprising reach. If he's a trained fighter, I'd probably give him a reaction Disarm attempt, possibly at advantage. But against, I dunno, a gelatinous cube? Go for it.

[nickl_2000]

I don’t think that would work anyways. You’d still have to meet the normal rules from grappling something within the reach of your arms. If you threw a bottle at someone 20 feet away tavern brawler wouldn’t let you actually grab them (unless you closed the distance).

Since many halberds aren’t even 10 feet long I see no problem giving the pole reach. If you think about it, you functionally only need about 6 or 7 feet of reach to hit someone that is “10 feet away,” since you’re swinging at their nearest part.

That was my thought. Distance is a bit of an abstraction in D&D anyways, since I can stab someone 5 feet away with an 18 inch dagger. It was just a thought, the key was being able to get more reach on a melee weapon if possible, there certainly isn't a way that you could grapple with them afterwards.

[Willie the Duck]

That was my thought. Distance is a bit of an abstraction in D&D anyways

Position as well, as it treats people who would be constantly in motion during a fight as being stationary during each others' turns.

[NaughtyTiger]

allow the OP to do what he wants, which is likely to grapple targets at 10 feet.

OP never mentions grapple at any range.

[sophontteks]

OP never mentions grapple at any range.
I'm just assuming thats their thought process here. Thats the big draw from Brawler afterall.

[Eric Diaz]

Given that pikes* and halberds are in the same reach category, I think it's safe to say that things are a little vague. I'd say do what makes sense at the time. *which might be actually longspears, since you can conceivably fight with them outside of formation, but then again weigh enough to be actual pikes, and okay maybe I'm overthinking this

You're not overthinking it, you're right - the pike is nonsensical in 5e (as with the mace, morningstar and trident), there is no reason for something that heavy having the same reach as a halberd, nor is there a decent reason in the game for using a pike. I called the pike "half-pike", said it weight 6 pounds, and that's enough for me. A lance makes a better pike than a pike if you want one.


What do you think, could you get a 10 foot reach at 1d4+strength if you were to have the tavern brawler feat and use a 10 foot pole as an improvised weapon?

I'd allow it, mostly because of rule of cool, but also because the 10-foot pole weights almost the same as a reach weapon IIRC (except for the pike, see above). Provided the player wasn't trying something silly... but pushing and tripping people with a 10-foot pole? Heh, why not? Not exactly RAW (maybe; from a quick glance, I see no obstacle in RAW to tripping someone with a halberd, for example) but looks cool IMO and wouldn't break the game.

[JellyPooga]

You are right, but the weapons themselves are vague. They are broad, sweeping generalizations. The rules for improvised weapons is that its either:
A: A 1d4 weapon without reach.
B: The closest matching weapon in the list

Hmmm...not strictly true. I'm away from books so can't cite you a page reference, but improvised weapons do an appropriate amount of damage based on what it is. The "closest matching weapon" thing is just a hamdy guide, but improvised weapons can do anything from 1 damage (e.g. a brooch) to whatever you (usually the GM) think(s) (e.g. a massive boulder might deal 2d8 or more). Weapon properties like Reach and even Finesse can also be applied as appropriate.

[sophontteks]

Hmmm...not strictly true. I'm away from books so can't cite you a page reference, but improvised weapons do an appropriate amount of damage based on what it is. The "closest matching weapon" thing is just a hamdy guide, but improvised weapons can do anything from 1 damage (e.g. a brooch) to whatever you (usually the GM) think(s) (e.g. a massive boulder might deal 2d8 or more). Weapon properties like Reach and even Finesse can also be applied as appropriate.
You may be thinking of something else.
This is from the PHB on improvised weapons (I copy pasted from wiki for convenience. I'm pretty sure its the exact same wording.)
"Sometimes characters don't have their weapons and have to attack with whatever is at hand. An improvised weapon includes any object you can wield in one or two hands, such as broken glass, a table leg, a frying pan, a wagon wheel, or a dead goblin. Often, an improvised weapon is similar to an actual weapon and can be treated as such. For example, a table leg is akin to a club. At the GM's option, a character proficient with a weapon can use a similar object as if it were that weapon and use his or her proficiency bonus.An object that bears no resemblance to a weapon deals 1d4 damage (the GM assigns a damage type appropriate to the object). If a character uses a ranged weapon to make a melee attack, or throws a melee weapon that does not have the thrown property, it also deals 1d4 damage. An improvised thrown weapon has a normal range of 20 feet and a long range of 60 feet."

Its not a handy guide. Its very specific about what a weapon can do and the reason why this is important is because they player plans to combo it with a feat. The wording offers no flexibility. I think there is something about improvising other things in the DM guide, but throwing boulders and such isn't really what we are talking about here. I couldn't find it though. :smallfrown:

Now I agree that there isn't really a weapon that matches a 10-foot pole well, but I do think a 10 foot poll is really just a weapon. Its not something being re-purposed into a weapon, like a candlestick, or a broom.