3.5 saving throw examples

[jdizzlean]

if you somehow have epic levels of bonus's to a saving throw, be it FORT, REF, or WILL

what would be some examples of things you could outright ignore at say DC's of say 20, 25, 30, 35, etc?

I'm curious about this for 3.5

[Buufreak]

I don't think you could, because autofail on a 1 is still a thing.

[jdizzlean]

lets assume you can for the sake of this discussion however.

standard spell dc's are 10+lvl+stat modifier, that means 9th's are somewhere around 24-25 for most instances yes? which means you could ignore all 9th level spells, provided the save is the one you have in relation to the above.

but aside from that, is there an example of a spell or effect that would require any saving throw that would have a higher than 25 dc, and if so, what might that be?

[Efrate]

Any good caster that uses saves should have 30 plus saves pre epic. Plus many spells dont offer saves. Epic level handbook has traps, hazards and monsters whose save dcs exceed that quite a bit.

Epic skills might be more to your speed, since you can't fail a skill Check on a 1. There are a few feats and maneuvers that let you not fail saves on 1 by replacing them with a skill check, so if you find save dcs that are below some baseli e you could be immune to various discrete x things.

[Deophaun]

what would be some examples of things you could outright ignore at say DC's of say 20, 25, 30, 35, etc?
I just want to say that Epic levels are not necessary to get a save bonus over 40 without dipping into theoretical optimization.

[noob]

Example: someone multiclass in 20 different classes with strong will saves.
Then have as low as 30 wisdom.
It already makes +50 to will saves.

[GreatDane]

I like what you're getting at here. This is similar to getting 14 ranks in Tumble so you can't fail the DC 15 check to avoid attacks of opportunity. Assuming you can get around the "automatically fail on a natural 1" thing...


If you can reliably make a DC 20 Fortitude save, you're immune to natural wind effects!
Most saves to avoid catching fire are DC 15.


The main difficulty with compiling a list like this is that most saving throws scale with whatever's forcing them. Unlike skills, which often have flat DC, bigger and badder monsters/enemies will have higher DCs thanks to their higher ability scores and hit dice.

[heavyfuel]

Dodging falling objects is a DC 15 Reflex save, so you're immune to those

You're immune to most magic items that force a Saving Throw since they usually have really low Save DCs.

[Telonius]

At 20, you'd be immune to Lycanthropy, immune to the effects of all diseases in the DMG (including Mummy Rot - you'd still have it, just never take damage from it), and immune to all poisons in the DMG except Dragon Bile and Purple Worm Poison.

[jdizzlean]

I like what you're getting at here. This is similar to getting 14 ranks in Tumble so you can't fail the DC 15 check to avoid attacks of opportunity. Assuming you can get around the "automatically fail on a natural 1" thing...


If you can reliably make a DC 20 Fortitude save, you're immune to natural wind effects!
Most saves to avoid catching fire are DC 15.


The main difficulty with compiling a list like this is that most saving throws scale with whatever's forcing them. Unlike skills, which often have flat DC, bigger and badder monsters/enemies will have higher DCs thanks to their higher ability scores and hit dice.

true, but you can still baseline it. so if a 10th lvl character/monster/npc casts or does this thing, this would be the max dc you'd face, and etc.

but rather then go at it that way, i'm just curious from a standard DC check, what you could essentially ignore if you had a saving throw at various amounts regardless of your level. If i could pull off a non-optimized base save of 30 by level 15 for example, (and not by taking 15 class dips that grant +2 to the save as mentioned above, you still have to be a functional character!) what could i ignore.

that make sense?

[Khedrac]

true, but you can still baseline it. so if a 10th lvl character/monster/npc casts or does this thing, this would be the max dc you'd face, and etc.

but rather then go at it that way, i'm just curious from a standard DC check, what you could essentially ignore if you had a saving throw at various amounts regardless of your level. If i could pull off a non-optimized base save of 30 by level 15 for example, (and not by taking 15 class dips that grant +2 to the save as mentioned above, you still have to be a functional character!) what could i ignore.

that make sense?
At which point the question becomes "what do you mean by "ignore"?

If someone told you that you could walk into a room of spiders which would bite you but 19 times out of 20 you could completely ignore the bite while you picked up the cash scattered around the room, but the other 1 in 20 would mean a lengthy stay in hospital - how many spiders would have to be in the room before you refued to go in?

Unless you have a way of not failing on a natural 1, saving throws are not something one can ever "ignore". One always aims to have a save high enough that one should make the save, but they are always something to avoid because of natural 1s.

[jdizzlean]

sigh. must everything be taken so literally?

so yes, aside from the 5% chance of failure due to rolling a 1, that is what i mean by ignore...

[Vertharrad]

Apparently (http://dnd.arkalseif.info/feats/players-handbook-ii--80/steadfast-determination--2761/index.html) it's possible to not fail fort saves on a nat 1...

[flappeercraft]

Voidstone has a Fort save DC 25 against instant annihilation.