Sublime Chord Gish Idea

[cartejos]

Gishing into Sublime Chord without casting levels before the Chord.

White Dragonspawn Human: LA+1 w/ buy-off
Grants casting as a 1st level sorcerer (Some cantrips and 1st level spells)

Fighter 4 (Darksong Knight ACF) - 1st level feats (without flaws) Precocious Apprentice, Power Attack, Able Learner
2nd level fighter feat: Cleave, 3rd level feat Earth Sense

Warblade 1 - Grab some handy-dandy maneuvers and stances

Barbarian 1 - Pounce, 6th level feat: Heighten Spell

Warrior Skald 1 - All bardic Music, qualify through Perform (Dancing) alternative to poetics, if DM disallows, build falls apart

Warblade +3 - Gets some more powerful Maneuvers and Stances, up to 4th level. 9th level feat: Earth Spell

Sublime Chord 2 - 12th level feat: Combat Casting

Abjurant Champion 5 - 15th level feat open

Last 3 levels: Undecided, but definitely full casting, 18th level feat open

Gets at least 16 BAB, 1st level sorcerer casting w/ one 2nd level spell per day and 4-9th level sublime chord spells

[AnimeTheCat]

Where are you getting the required level 3 spells for sublime chord?

[cartejos]

White dragonspawn gives 1st level sorcerer casting
Precocious apprentice gives a 2nd level spell slot
Earth Spell to heighten a 1st level spell into the 2nd level spell slot for "Able to cast 3rd level spells"

[Nifft]

White dragonspawn gives 1st level sorcerer casting
Precocious apprentice gives a 2nd level spell slot
Earth Spell to heighten a 1st level spell into the 2nd level spell slot for "Able to cast 3rd level spells"



Choose one 2nd-level spell from a school of magic you have access to. You gain an extra 2nd-level spell slot that must be used initially to cast only the chosen spell.


How do you heighten a level 1 spell into that slot, given the usage restriction on it?

[cartejos]

How do you heighten a level 1 spell into that slot, given the usage restriction on it?

When you become "Able to cast 2nd level spells" The Precocious spell slot turns into an Extra 2nd Level Spell Slot
The character is "Able to cast 2nd level spells" through the heightening of a 0th level spell into a 1st level slot to make a 2nd level spell

Failing that, Practiced Spellcaster raises your caster level by 4, up to a maximum of your character level, it normally doesn't qualify for other "Able to cast" requirements, but Precocious Apprentice specifies "Until your level is high enough to cast 2nd level spells" which with a lenient DM could simply refer to caster level, but without a lenient DM is just like Magikarp trying to use Splash... It has no effect... I'm a funny person, I promise

[Buufreak]

So you are qualifying for your first feat by using a loose reading of it, but more importantly using that same loose reading to abuse a feat that you won't have until level 6? Seems legit.

[Eldariel]

You're probably better off using Jacob's Ladder. Basically, Sanctum Spell feat [Complete Arcane] + Dragonsblood Pool magical location [Complete Mage]. Add Precocious Apprentice and you can first get a 2nd level slot from the Pool, which transforms your normal slot into a 2nd level slot, which you can use Sanctum Spell on to count as a 3rd level slot (make the Dragonsblood Pool your sanctum), which in turn lets you get a 3rd level slot from the Dragonsblood Pool. This gives you two third level spell slots.

[cartejos]

So you are qualifying for your first feat by using a loose reading of it, but more importantly using that same loose reading to abuse a feat that you won't have until level 6? Seems legit.

My first feat, precocious apprentice, is qualified for by the White Dragonspawn Template granting Sorc1 casting, that isn't a loose reading at all. The precocious apprentice caveat of not being able to use the spell slot for other spells was an oversight on my part, I overlooked it on my first reading and I did nought but to offer possible solutions to problems posed. However, on seeing many people use Earth Spell or similar methods to qualify for classes, why wouldn't the same apply to anything that needs qualifying?

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

White Dragonspawn is an acquired template, it can't be gained before your first character level, so it can't be used to qualify for your 1st level feat.

[WhamBamSam]

Sanctum Spell could be a workaround to the Precocious Apprentice issues. Earth Heighten a Sanctum cantrip within your sanctum and it'll come out as a 3rd level spell. Your DM might not be terribly happy with that either, but I think there's less issue with the RAW.

[Troacctid]

Or just take a single level of an arcane casting class and use taint to Heighten your 1st level spell up to 3rd without spending a feat.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Why even try to skip spellcasting classes when your qualifications are based on ambiguous-at-best rules?

Enter with something like BAB +6/ Suel Arcanamach 3/ Spellsinger 1, using the Otyugh Hole to get the Iron Will prerequisite, and Combat Casting is needed for Abjurant Champion anyway.

[Cosi]

This seems (as other has noted) like some dubious steps for a payoff that doesn't seem much better than other gish builds. Why not Bard 1/Duskblade 5/Barbarian 1/Warblade 3/Sublime Chord 2/Abjurant Champion 5/Incantatrix 3? Hell, why not something like Bard 1/Cleric 5/Dweomerkeeper 4/Sublime Chord 1/Mystic Theurge 9 with alternate spell source shenanigans and DMM (+18 BAB, double 9ths, and Supernatural Spell)? What are you getting for your Fighter levels? Why are you using so many dubious tricks to shuffle what kind of resources you spend around?

[Hiro Quester]

Sc has some steep skill prerequisites.

Knowledge (arcana) 13 ranks,
Listen 13 ranks
Perform (any) 10 ranks,
Profession (astrologer) 6 ranks,
Spellcraft 6 ranks.

13 ranks basically requires you to have listen, and knowledge arcana as in-class skills for all of your previous levels, and perform for most as well. That’s why bard is the usual preparation.

I’m not sure it’s doable with so many levels of classes for which these skills are cross-class; fighter and warblade have none of these prerequisites in-class; barbarian has only listen; Warrior skald has perform, listen, profession; none have KA or spellcraft as in-class skills.

Able learner decreases the cost of cross class skills, but it doesn’t remove the maximum for cross-class skills of 1/2(character level+3).

You can’t get to the prerequisites, such as 13 ranks in knowledge arcana, when it’s cross-class for all your previous classes.

[Vertharrad]

3.5 simplified but still muddied the simple skill system of 3.0 - if you have the skill as a class skill on 1 class the max is still at character level+3 you just spend skill points according to whether that particular level has it as a class or cross class skill.

[Troacctid]

3.5 simplified but still muddied the simple skill system of 3.0 - if you have the skill as a class skill on 1 class the max is still at character level+3 you just spend skill points according to whether that particular level has it as a class or cross class skill.
Right, and OP's build doesn't have the one class.

[Nifft]

If you need a broken NPC race from an obsolete setting, why not just use Phaerimm from Lost Empires of Faerun?

You get +1 Sorcerer casting per HD, so stock up on Ranger levels or whatever and then go into a caster-oriented PrC -- which doesn't need to advance casting, I'll note, since your Sorcerer casting advances every level anyway.

The baby ones only start with 1 RHD, and arguably that RHD disappears when you take a class.

[cartejos]

Right, and OP's build doesn't have the one class.

Darksong Knight has Perform as a class skill, and I was sure that if it was on 1 of your multiclass lists then you could get it to full lvl+3 ranks but would have to spend 2 skill points per level that doesnt have access to it, but I may be mistaken.