Turn Undead

[Durendal]

I'm working on a Crusader going on Ruby Knight Vindicator and plan on taking several of the Combat Focus feats from the PH2. The problem I'm having is that in order to qualify for the RBV I need to be able to turn undead, which as far as I know means either 4 levels of paladin or 1 level of cleric. I dont want to waste four levels on Paladin and the 1 level of Cleric lowers my BAB by one and pushes back when I can take some of the Combat Focus feats.

So my question is, does anyone know of another way to get the ability to turn undead without taking levels in cleric or paladin. I'm looking for a way to preserve my full BAB so that I can keep taking the Combat Focus feats as early as possible.

[Leon]

Big List of Stuff - http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=662842

From reading it i think you'll just be best going for Cleric 1 and just being a lil slow on the BAB

[Darrin]

So my question is, does anyone know of another way to get the ability to turn undead without taking levels in cleric or paladin. I'm looking for a way to preserve my full BAB so that I can keep taking the Combat Focus feats as early as possible.

There is a way to get turning with feats, but it requires too many to be worthwhile.

Magical Training (from FRCS) gives you the ability to cast three 0-level spells, and a pseudo-caster level for determining spell effects, which may or may not allow you to take:
Precocious Apprentice (from Complete Arcane) gives you a 2nd level spell and may allow you to get into Jade Phoenix Mage, and:
Anarchic Bloodline (from Dragon #325/Dragon Compendium) gives you some undead ancestry, and once you take enough JPM levels to cast 3rd level spells:
Kin Mastery (also from Dragon #325/Dragon Compendium) gives you one turn attempt/day of your bloodline ancestors (undead).

The most troublesome requirement of Kin Mastery is the 3rd level spells. There are two base classes with full BAB that offer arcane casting: Duskblade (PHBII) and Hexblade (CompWar), but in both cases 3rd level spells are a long ways off. You'd have to take 9 levels of Duskblade or 11 levels of Hexblade. And while you could dip and then build up your spellcasting with Jade Phoenix Mage, in both cases you'd pretty much have to finish JPM before you could get into Ruby Knight Vindicator.

You're much better off just taking 4 levels of Paladin or eating the +0 BAB for the Cleric dip.

[goat]

Someone, somewhere, has probably designed an elf which gets racial turn undead attempts.

[Douglas]

That would be, what, the Super Sun Elf? ISTR there already is a Sun Elf which does not get turning.

[Shhalahr Windrider]

There was an issue of Dragon a long time ago—sometime around when 3.5 was released—that had a number of feats for religious non-clerics. I think one of them may have allowed the user to Turn Undead 1/day. I don't recall the exact number.

The content of that article might also have been released as Open Game Content. A number of articles from that time period had that.

I'll let you know when I figure out which issue it was in.

[Darrin]

There was an issue of Dragon a long time ago—sometime around when 3.5 was released—that had a number of feats for religious non-clerics. I think one of them may have allowed the user to Turn Undead 1/day. I don't recall the exact number.

Hey, good call... much more efficient and rules-friendly than trying to get Kin Mastery.

Dragon #305 (which would be 3.0 material, but still officially usable), in the article "Faith and Honor: Piety for Non-Clerics", by Skip Williams. It requires two feats: God Touched and Divine Channeler.



The content of that article might also have been released as Open Game Content. A number of articles from that time period had that.


Nope, that article was never intended or released for OGL. But Realmshelp has 'em:

http://realmshelps.dandello.net/cgi-bin/feats.pl?God_Touched,Dragon

http://realmshelps.dandello.net/cgi-bin/feats.pl?Divine_Channeler,Dragon

Add Extra Turning, and that's 5 turn attempts per day. Considering how useful turn attempts can be, especially to a RKV... that might be worth investing in three feats.

Hmmm. It looks like Divine Fervor and Divine Conduit (from the same article) did make it into the Dragon Compendium, but they've been drasitcally reworked and God Touched, Divine Channeler and Divine Fortification have disappeared. Still, both God Touched and Divine Channeler as they appeared in Dragon #305 should still be considered official, and I don't see anything in there as being particularly broken.

I'm not sure if RKV requires divine spellcasting, but that's something you might want to consider picking up... no reason to let all those +1 caster levels go to waste. The easiest way to add divine spellcasting would be dipping one level of the Wild Defender ranger variant from Dragon #324 (you lose Track, Favored Enemy, and Combat Style for earlier spellcasting and smite evil).

If you want to pick it up via PrC, looking through Complete Divine... Holy Liberator doesn't quite work, and Pious Templar is a waste. Consecrated Harrior works, and requires only one feat (Track). Hunter of the Dead (Complete Warrior) should also work, and requires no feats.

Looking through the 3.0 PrCs that grant divine spellcasting... Flame Steward (Dragon #283). Knight of the Middle Circle (Defenders of the Faith) is slightly broken but might be interesting. Windrider (Masters of the Wild) might also work.

The build I'd recommend:

1) Wild Defender 1, Feat: God Touched, Human Feat: Combat Focus
2) Crusader 1
3) Fighter 1, Feat: Divine Channeler, Bonus Feat: Combat ???
4) Fighter 2, Bonus Feat: Combat ???
5) Crusader 2
6) Ruby Knight Vindicator 1, Feat: Extra Turning

[Shhalahr Windrider]

Dragon #305 (which would be 3.0 material, but still officially usable), in the article "Faith and Honor: Piety for Non-Clerics", by Skip Williams. It requires two feats: God Touched and Divine Channeler.
Wow! Thanks for finding it. I was having trouble. I seem to have missed it when I skimmed through the issues entry on Paizo's website.


Nope, that article was never intended or released for OGL.
Eh, I was only about 10% certain about that anyway.