What Cleric Domain for this situation?

[jaappleton]

My old home group is reforming.

It’s their first time with 5E, basically. We played a one shot about two years ago, and that’s their only experience with it so far.

I’m the most experienced player far and away, however, we used to play 4E. And I got a reputation as a bit of a power gamer, and... It was a deserved reputation.

I will also basically be kind of a Co-DM. Someone else will be the DM, but for any rules questions, they’re going to defer to me until everyone is a bit more acclimated to 5E. So if someone says “I want to grapple the bandit.... John, how do I do that?” and then the DM and player will roll their Athletics checks.

For these reasons, I very much want to be in a Support role. Let them shine, and I shine by making them shine brighter.

So, obviously, Tempest is out. I want them to get the glory of the kills, not just me maximizing Shatter all the time and ending fights no problem.

Here’s the party, you tell me what you think I should go with:

Starting at lv3

Eldritch Knight Fighter
GOO Tomelock
Myself
???? (Undecided, likely melee of some sort. I’m going to suggest Barbarian, Rogue or Paladin, but it’s their choice)

As you can see, there’s no healer, or even anything Wisdom oriented. So I think Cleric works really well here, I just need suggestions for which Domain. All material is available except Plane Shift.

I’m leaning Life, because who doesn’t love having one as an ally, or Grave maybe to cancel out Crits, plus their Curse ability to make a party member REALLY shine. Light has Warding Flare to keep people alive, and what party doesn’t love Faerie Fire? But I’m open to nearly anything.

[KorvinStarmast]

I’m leaning Life, because who doesn’t love having one as an ally, or Grave maybe to cancel out Crits, plus their Curse ability to make a party member REALLY shine. Light has Warding Flare to keep people alive, and what party doesn’t love Faerie Fire? But I’m open to nearly anything. Life domain has bless and cure wounds always prepared as domain spells. Bless the martials in their slaughter of monsters. Suggest life domain.
I have come full circle.
My first ever cleric was life (the original Korvin died, though).
After a number of other choices, I am playing with the same group of friends again, but a different one is DM. I am a life cleric again. This time I took a feat and got magic initiate for goodberrycheese/shillelagh on a club/guidance. My whole objective is to support the rest of the party, to heal, and to when whack things while my shield is up. Bless is my default.
I act as my DM's encyclopedia of rules, since I have copious notes and references in my notebook where I keep my PHB. (It had the lousy binding/first printing, so I now keep it in a three ring binder).

[nickl_2000]

So when I hear support roles for a party as a cleric there are lots of options.

Life - Super healing is always loved by everyone. Then you cast bless as a buff
Light - As you mentioned
Nature - Lets you tank due to heavy armor and an extra cantrip, plus dampen elements is pretty awesome.


A few other options that are worth considering
Grasslands Druid - Druids get some great battlefield control spells and arguably heal better than Cleric due to healing spirit. They tend to be more background spells that allows other to shine. Grasslands gives invisibility, and haste which are awesome.

College of Glamour Bard - They don't do damage, but the bardic inspiration for temp HP and safe movement is amazing (especially at early levels). Also charms are great in general, then you have a lot of debuffs with vicious mockery, suggestion, and all the other bardic goodies. And they heal as well as clerics (plus you can grab healing spirit if you want it).

Lore Bard - Bard debuff spells, more magical secret spells to choose whatever you like, and cutting words (sweet, sweet debuffs from cutting words). Additionally you get some many skills that allow you to fill in with the social and exploration tiers.

Valor Bard - If you play a valor bard as a grappler (which is very doable), you can easily play a support role and do less damage. Buff others to attack with inspiration dice, can tank somewhat due to armor profs, add all the other base class bardic goodies.

[jaappleton]

College of Glamour Bard - They don't do damage, but the bardic inspiration for temp HP and safe movement is amazing (especially at early levels). Also charms are great in general, then you have a lot of debuffs with vicious mockery, suggestion, and all the other bardic goodies. And they heal as well as clerics (plus you can grab healing spirit if you want it).

Lore Bard - Bard debuff spells, more magical secret spells to choose whatever you like, and cutting words (sweet, sweet debuffs from cutting words). Additionally you get some many skills that allow you to fill in with the social and exploration tiers.

Valor Bard - If you play a valor bard as a grappler (which is very doable), you can easily play a support role and do less damage. Buff others to attack with inspiration dice, can tank somewhat due to armor profs, add all the other base class bardic goodies.

Trying to avoid anything Charismatic, ESPECIALLY Bard. I know they rule, I played a Lore Bard for awhile prior in another game. But with Expertise, I’m going to really outshine the GOOLock in conversations, and I don’t want to step on toes. Let him be the Charismatic one.

[nickl_2000]

Trying to avoid anything Charismatic, ESPECIALLY Bard. I know they rule, I played a Lore Bard for awhile prior in another game. But with Expertise, I’m going to really outshine the GOOLock in conversations, and I don’t want to step on toes. Let him be the Charismatic one.

Fair enough, that still leaves you with the cleric domains and druid domains I mentioned. Also as a side note, there is nothing saying that you have to choose social skills as expertise. You can easily pick the histories, or athletics, or arcana, etc.

[Nifft]

Knowledge and Arcana also fill a lot of potential holes, and Trickery might allow a tiny bit of stealth in your party of clanking metal. Forge is usually cited for its ability to self-buff, but you could buff some of your melee friends instead.


There really isn't a bad Cleric domain, and even without any domain (if that were possible) the core Cleric list is more than sufficient to buff a party. So choose Life.

[Spectrulus]

I would Second gave domain, situational healing boost plus the crit negation, it's a solid bundle. If you RP, go for an older character who's seen a lot to tie into the flavor.

[jaappleton]

I'm leaning either Light or Grave at the moment.

Due to the only arcane caster being a Warlock, and their spellcasting style, its entirely possible we'll be getting into some combat scenarios where he won't have any slots available.

This means I may have to handle the role of both buffer and blaster, doesn't it?

[Nifft]

I'm leaning either Light or Grave at the moment.

Due to the only arcane caster being a Warlock, and their spellcasting style, its entirely possible we'll be getting into some combat scenarios where he won't have any slots available.

This means I may have to handle the role of both buffer and blaster, doesn't it?

A Warlock with no slots is still one of the best blasters in the game, thanks to Eldritch Blast + Agonizing Blast.

A Warlock with no slots is still one of the best controllers in the game, thanks to Eldritch Blast + Repelling Blast.


You should feel good about blasting + buffing, if that's what you want to do -- but you've got a Warlock in your party, so don't worry too much about blasting.

[Ventruenox]

Well, if you really want a broken support character, I happen to have one sitting on the bench.

Rogue Mastermind 3/Order Domain Cleric X

Start off Order Cleric (https://media.wizards.com/2018/dnd/downloads/UA_OrderDomain.pdf) 1, Rogue 2. Use buff spells and cunning actions to survive and provide support for one level, then take Mastermind to use bonus actions to give your allies reaction attacks with advantage every time you cast a buff spell. (Rogue Sneak Attack 2x/round anyone?) The rest of the levels as Cleric.

vHuman for Magic Initiate feat: Message, Friends, and Disguise Self/Find Familiar

Now to make it a character instead of just a build. Choose the Charlatan Background. Have him be a slick faith healer peddling a fake religion. Adopt a bad southern accent and play him as a cross between Colonel Sanders, Benny Hinn, and Foghorn Leghorn. Casting Command (which will happen a lot at Cleric 6) in that voice could potentially bring immense laughter at the table.

You can justify the domain as worship towards a forgotten Greek deity: Eunomia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eunomia), a minor goddess of law, legislation, and springtime fields. I see a scam artist saying something like "You know me, uh, I will lead you to greener pastures!" You don't have to be charismatic, just clever.

[Honest Tiefling]

I'm leaning either Light or Grave at the moment.

If you have selected two domains you think will work well, why not select them based off of 1) What would make the more interesting character in terms of the plot and other party members or 2) Which god you'd rather roleplay following?

Through I still think Grave and Life would be better choices. You might accidentally blow the warlock out of the water if you take the light domain, so unless you have a very good concept I'd lean to healbot supreme.

[GorogIrongut]

I'd go for a multi class. Halfling Cleric of Knowledge 1/Divination Wizard 2. At the first opportunity take Bountiful Luck. You now have a character who can use portent to strengthen/save the party in their actions. You can use bountiful luck to strengthen/save the party in their actions. You have a character who can fill the gaps in their knowledge as a skill monkey. Just like you can fill up on rituals to help the party in appropriate spots. You have a character who can heal. You have a character who can be armoured, but being small will seem unimposing. And that's before we even talk about using Bless to increase their chances of success.

You can essentially spend all your time making them succeed at whatever they're trying to do.

[jaappleton]

If you have selected two domains you think will work well, why not select them based off of 1) What would make the more interesting character in terms of the plot and other party members or 2) Which god you'd rather roleplay following?

Through I still think Grave and Life would be better choices. You might accidentally blow the warlock out of the water if you take the light domain, so unless you have a very good concept I'd lean to healbot supreme.

A very fair point.

The only knock I have on Life is that I'm not a big fan of Divine Strike. Just don't like it. I'm much more a fan of Potent Spellcasting.

Though Life, having its healing be superior, means that I spend less resources to heal more. My heals go farther. Not to mention its Channel Divinity.

I suppose I could live with the Divine Strike part.

[igor140]

The other advantage of Life is that it essentially denies you the utility to do something else. Given the situation, and the fact that you're trying to get your party invested and engaged, focusing ONLY on healing and support means that they HAVE to step up and be the real "heroes". Most other domains focus on or provide some cross-utility; great for most parties, but might make you too versatile/ powerful in this situation.

[jaappleton]

The other advantage of Life is that it essentially denies you the utility to do something else. Given the situation, and the fact that you're trying to get your party invested and engaged, focusing ONLY on healing and support means that they HAVE to step up and be the real "heroes". Most other domains focus on or provide some cross-utility; great for most parties, but might make you too versatile/ powerful in this situation.

Although that also gives me little in out of combat utility.

Graves has a slight exploration aspect in being able to detect Undead. It's not Knowledge or Trickery's level of utility, but its something. Although if the other player goes Paladin, that renders Grave's Detect Undead ability useless.

[CaptAl]

I'll throw my two cents in for Grave domain and the Arcana or Knowledge domain. Grave is fantastic at keeping everyone from dying, while not being as focused on healing as Life. Arcana/Knowledge will fill that arcanist role that your group touches on with warlock and EK but doesn't really embrace, especially if the GOO focuses on social skills/pillar. Any of the three get you potent spell casting, decent armour class due to medium armor and shields, and solid spells from the domain.

At this point, in your shoes, I would look at the gods who provide those domains and choose based on which dogma gives you the best role-play opportunity to fit your style.

I wish you good luck and fun travels

[Naanomi]

When playing with newer players, a Knowledge Cleric is a good way to inform players about the *setting* as well... that trolls are vulnerable to acid, or that metallic dragons are usually good... a Knowledge Cleric is a good place to provide that information legitimately

[Honest Tiefling]

Graves has a slight exploration aspect in being able to detect Undead. It's not Knowledge or Trickery's level of utility, but its something. Although if the other player goes Paladin, that renders Grave's Detect Undead ability useless.

Have you asked your DM? If they are running an undead heavy campaign they might want you NOT to take it to overshine the others, or they might want you to take it for plot reasons. Asking them might not be a bad idea at this point.

I'd shy away from the Knowledge Cleric, because if used right...It could very well put the social spotlight onto the cleric which is what we are trying to avoid. You could use it to feed info to the GoOlock, but it'd require careful handling, in my opinion.

[solidork]

I think Light would shore up the party's weaknesses the best, but you will for sure take the spotlight whenever there are a bunch of mooks to kill. Though every Cleric gets Spirit Guardians, so The Blender(TM) is gonna decimate lots of weak enemies no matter what.

[CTurbo]

Avoid Light as you'll have the spotlight on you too much. Probably the second flashiest domain after Tempest.

I vote Life or Forge for the best supporting Cleric and I'm gonna throw out a 3rd option that never gets talked about but is actually pretty good... the Protection Cleric.

[Sol]

Order Domain from UA (literally google "UA Order Domain", to find it freely available on wotc's site) is a very solid support domain, if your DM allows playtest materials.

Its primary features are:

starting from level 1, allies you cast spells on get an extra attack using their reaction
starting from level 6, casting enchantment spells (admittedly not many great high level cleric enchantment spells) refreshes a slot of one lower than the slot used.
starting from 17, if you hit an enemy with a weapon attack (which triggers your Divine Strike for 2d8 force damage) on your turn, that enemy *also* takes an extra 2d8 force damage the first time each turn that one of your allies hits it with a weapon attack.


That's a *very* solid level 1 feature, and one of the best cleric domain capstones.

Also note that both Divine Strike and the capstone work fine with bows. At first glance WIS+DEX+STR (heavy armor) may sound a bit MAD, but honestly if you're going Bow/Dex, you can reach the same AC levels as Heavy Armor with Medium Armor.

CTurbo is also right that the Protection Domain is pretty decent. It's in an older UA article, and was the only domain in its batch to not get a published release, which is probably why it's discussed less.

[Beechgnome]

For role play reasons, I prefer Grave over Life, but your RP desires may differ. For pure support utility, they both get the job done, though grave is more proactive and life more reactive.

As an earlier poster suggested, if the fourth player doesn't choose rogue, you may find your party lacking in stealth/exploration. Trickery's blessing, plus your channel ability, can really help out there. Take magic initiate for find familiar and you can cast touch spells through your familiar or your illusory double, useful when you want to cast cure wounds/lesser restoration/enhance ability etc etc without entering the fray. The downside is it's a bit show-ey, their spell list is more about you then your allies and the divine strike is bleh.

[sophontteks]

Grave is a great support cleric. Something you would really appreciate is their ability to counter mistakes your players may make, which would have otherwise killed them.

Circle of Mortality-Healing in 5e is not very strong. You don't want to be spending your time healing in combat, but the grave cleric can stop an unconscious player from dying basically for free with spare the undying, and their healing spells are maximized in the one scenario when healing in combat is actually a good idea.

Path to the grave- This support ability empowers other players. Doubling the damage of your dps at a key moment will make them feel epic.

Sentinal at death's door- This is the reason I suggested this archtype. You can cancel a critical hit as a reaction multiple times per long rest. Crits are player slayers and at level 6 you practically remove the mechanic from the game. Its even better if your group, like the groups I play with, run brutal crits (Crit damage is max roll plus regular roll.)

All this and you get potent spellcasting to be a good blaster in the back.

[jaappleton]

I'm still a bit stuck.

Due to party composition, and the Warlock going GOO Tomelock, he's not exactly the best blaster. We all know how pact magic works, he could go in ready to blow stuff up with things like Shatter OR he could have no slots by the start of a fight because they were used in exploration / utility.

Fighter EK is 2h weapon, with defense and utility spells.

I think the last character is going to go Monk. I'm going to try to edge them toward Sun Soul or Open Hand.

Not gonna lie, Light is my favorite Domain. I also think it has the most RP, but that's a strictly personal opinion. Light has a lot of damage dealing spells, which... I don't know if I want or not.

So, I don't know if I should go for a Domain like Light.

I think its a question of, what role do I fulfill? Buffer and Healer? Or Buffer, Healer AND Blaster? By being a Blaster, I certainly risk overshadowing party members. But... I mean, shouldn't SOMEONE be the Blaster in the party? I know its entirely dependent upon the DM and how he runs combat, but that's a massive question mark.

If I don’t go Light, it’s either Grave or Life. One I think is Proactive, one is Reactive. I’m likely going for Grave if not Light because Grave gets more bonus spells, and Life, while it RULES at healing, offers nothing outside of Combat while Grave at least can detect Undead.

So.... Grave or Light?

[sophontteks]

GOO tomelock will be a fine blaster. One of the best.
Monk is an excellent choice to work with the tanky EK.
Nothing changed at all. Party could use a wis-based support, like a cleric or a druid.

[CTurbo]

If you like Light, go Light. All Clerics can be a great support character cable of healing, buffing, utility, and DPR when needed.

[Honest Tiefling]

Not gonna lie, Light is my favorite Domain. I also think it has the most RP, but that's a strictly personal opinion. Light has a lot of damage dealing spells, which... I don't know if I want or not.

So, I don't know if I should go for a Domain like Light.

1) Can you roleplay a character following a god of Light? If no, don't do this.

2) Can you speak with the Warlock player? They might not even WANT to be a blaster, and be perfectly fine with this. Tempering expectations might help a scootch.

3) Speak with the DM. Maybe you can engineer a situation that the DM can use to introduce your character to the party or to use later that will shut down your character or otherwise put them at a disadvantage. For instance, give them some ideas of monsters that will play to the strengths of others, and maybe have your character wander in injured to the tavern with some thugs following them as their introduction. Bleedy McBleedyface probably won't seem like the best combatant at first.

4) You have to actually LIKE the character. You WANT to play a Light Cleric. Is it the optimal choice in terms of not overshadowing the others? No. But I think if you adjust your tactics and roleplay, you can do it.

[jaappleton]

1) Can you roleplay a character following a god of Light? If no, don't do this.

2) Can you speak with the Warlock player? They might not even WANT to be a blaster, and be perfectly fine with this. Tempering expectations might help a scootch.

3) Speak with the DM. Maybe you can engineer a situation that the DM can use to introduce your character to the party or to use later that will shut down your character or otherwise put them at a disadvantage. For instance, give them some ideas of monsters that will play to the strengths of others, and maybe have your character wander in injured to the tavern with some thugs following them as their introduction. Bleedy McBleedyface probably won't seem like the best combatant at first.

4) You have to actually LIKE the character. You WANT to play a Light Cleric. Is it the optimal choice in terms of not overshadowing the others? No. But I think if you adjust your tactics and roleplay, you can do it.

I WANT to make fire and light based puns all the time :smalltongue:

I do like Protection. Life works but its fairly boring.

I'll talk with the Warlock.

[Honest Tiefling]

I WANT to make fire and light based puns all the time :smalltongue:

A kind-hearted cleric of Lathander who is loyal to his friends but also annoys them with Light and Fire puns sounds like a good character concept to me, just saying.

[JellyPooga]

When playing with newer players, a Knowledge Cleric is a good way to inform players about the *setting* as well... that trolls are vulnerable to acid, or that metallic dragons are usually good... a Knowledge Cleric is a good place to provide that information legitimately

I know it's not really on the radar, but I can't second this hard enough; Knowledge Domain is great for being a "second fiddle" style character; able to shine in his own right, yes, but also able to fill the gaps left by other characters as well as providing essential lore that newer players may not be familiar with.

[jaappleton]

Knowledge does give me a very solid identity, it gives me Expertise so I know things....

Really, a Halfling Knowledge Cleric would be an excellent way to portray Tyrion Lannister.

"I drink, and I know things."

[nickl_2000]

Knowledge does give me a very solid identity, it gives me Expertise so I know things....

Really, a Halfling Knowledge Cleric would be an excellent way to portray Tyrion Lannister.

"I drink, and I know things."

It wouldn't be bad. I would be him as a solid Hill Dwarf Inquisitive Rogue personally, with expertise in History and Deception and proficiency in Persuasion and Perception.

[jaappleton]

UPDATE:

Here is the full party.

Warforged Blood Hunter - Ghost Slayer - Dual Wielding STR
Tortle Rogue - Arcane Trickster - Both STR and DEX at 14
Human Warlock - GOO Tomelock
Half Elf Fighter - Eldritch Knight - 2H Weapon

So... They're missing a blaster and a healer. I think Light is perfect, though I still worry about the blasty-ness. I think as long as I'm not a dink, they'll likely be of the same team mindset and will appreciate my ability to incinerate foes. After all, they're all pretty much single target.

I think the both Kalashtar or Warforged would be good with it. I love Kalashtar but I don't want to double up on the telepathy, with the GOOLock.

So Warforged Light Domain...?

[CaptAl]

UPDATE:

Here is the full party.

Warforged Blood Hunter - Ghost Slayer - Dual Wielding STR
Tortle Rogue - Arcane Trickster - Both STR and DEX at 14
Human Warlock - GOO Tomelock
Half Elf Fighter - Eldritch Knight - 2H Weapon

So... They're missing a blaster and a healer. I think Light is perfect, though I still worry about the blasty-ness. I think as long as I'm not a dink, they'll likely be of the same team mindset and will appreciate my ability to incinerate foes. After all, they're all pretty much single target.

I think the both Kalashtar or Warforged would be good with it. I love Kalashtar but I don't want to double up on the telepathy, with the GOOLock.

So Warforged Light Domain...?

Warforged Light Domain cleric sounds awesome to me. You fill in a gap that's needed, and get to play something that you will enjoy playing. Go for it.