3.5 Full-Caster Paladin?

[PhantasyPen]

So I've played a 5e paladin semi-recently and was reminded why I love playing gish builds so much, which made me want to see what I could do for the 3.5 paladin since this is my favorite edition. One thing that's always bugged me about the 3.5 paladin is the spellcasting, or rather, the way it's weirdly implemented and gimped. So I was wondering: is there a version of the paladin out there anywhere that functions like the mystic ranger and allows you to gain spells over the full 1-20 levels of play? Or am I better off with a smiting cleric and a prestige paladin and pretending it's the real thing?

EDIT: While making a pseudo-paladin is fun and all, this character needs to be able to qualify for the Battle Blessing feat, which means I need actual paladin levels in the build somehow. Since no one knows an "official" way of doing a full-caster paladin, does anyone know of a homebrew that does the same? Anything in the vein of a paladin version of the mystic ranger.

[Buddy76]

I think Mystic Fire Knight substitution levels (Champions of Valor) are the closest to what you want. No casting from levels 1 to 20, but it does give you a few bonus slots, +2 to your paladin caster level and any arcane spellcasting class you have stacks with Paladin to determine your Paladin caster level. Sword of the Arcane Order, a feat from the same book, lets you prepare wizard spells on your Paladin slots.

[Zanos]

Cleric into Prestige Paladin is probably the best you're going to do. Not sure why you don't like it, it's really good.

And honestly a LG Cleric of many LG deities is very close to a Paladin anyway; it's a heavily armored knight blessed by the divine that crusades for justice.

[Luckmann]

As much as I dislike the combo due to having to pass on all the possible Alternate Class Features and such (which I'm a sucker for), in my opinion, a Cleric 3/Fighter 2 or Fighter 2/Cleric 2/Ordained Champion 1-or-more makes a strictly superior chassis for basically any kind of Paladin. For more European-monk-ish (or just pure optimization) you can easily go for a Cloistered Cleric base instead, so there's still lots of options to choose from, and the domains from Cleric also gives a lot of flavor.

As long as a DM allows it, I really see no reason not to go Prestige Paladin, and honestly, I think Paladin should've been a prestige class to begin with, anyway. It's just too bad that even with Prestige Paladin the class features are pretty lackluster and the prestige class support is abysmal.

[Darrin]

Divine Crusader can add 9th level spells, but only from one chosen domain. If you can get ahold of the substitute domain spell (Complete Champion, Cleric 2), you can open up your options a bit.

[PhantasyPen]

Hmm, Divine Crusader might be interesting for a fighter build at a later date, but I was trying to get actual paladin spells. Hmm, has anyone tried homebrewing a "Mystic Paladin" alternate class?

[Anthrowhale]

Wizard/Sacred Exorcist/Silver Pyromancer may also merit notice as something like a full casting paladin.

[PhantasyPen]

Edited the first post to clarify what I'm looking for and why.

[Mike Miller]

Hmm, Divine Crusader might be interesting for a fighter build at a later date, but I was trying to get actual paladin spells. Hmm, has anyone tried homebrewing a "Mystic Paladin" alternate class?

I enjoy the Mystic Ranger. I will gladly put together a similar Homebrew "Mystic Paladin" for you. It may have to wait until Monday before I can get to it though. The big thing to consider, in my mind, is the spell list. Is there a particular type of spell you want to focus? Do you want any changes to the class features? If I were to make it for my group, I would definitely alter the class features. Hence the question.

[gorfnab]

Hmm, Divine Crusader might be interesting for a fighter build at a later date,
Crusader 7/ Divine Crusader 2/ Speaker of the Sovereign Host 9/ Crusader 2
Paladin 7/ Divine Crusader 1/ Sovereign Speaker 9/ Contemplative 1/ Sacred Exorcist 1/ Warpriest 1

but I was trying to get actual paladin spells. Hmm, has anyone tried homebrewing a "Mystic Paladin" alternate class?
There is this homebrewed Mystic Paladin (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?210539-3-5-Mystic-Paladin).

[Anthrowhale]

My reading of Battle Blessing is that you need the ability to cast paladin spells, not paladin levels. Hence, the Silver Pyromancer and the Prestige Paladin are viable approaches.

[Mike Miller]

Here is my take on the Mystic Paladin.
If not otherwise noted, same as default paladin. Mystic Paladin loses the special mount and has most abilities are delayed a level.

Ideas for spells (I am keeping this to the PHB for now, but SpC would certainly be a welcome addition):
level 0: create water, cure minor wounds, guidance, light, mending, purify food and drink, read magic, resistance, virtue
level 1: (standard minus the ones moved to other levels)
level 2: (standard minus the ones moved to other levels), cure moderate wounds, lesser restoration
level 3: (standard minus the ones moved to other levels, minus heal mount), cure serious wounds
level 4: (standard minus the ones moved to other levels), cure critical wounds, greater magic weapon
level 5: atonement, break enchantment, dispel chaos, dispel evil, hallow, mark of justice, mass cure light wounds, raise dead, righteous might, true seeing
level 6: banishment, greater dispel magic, forbiddance, heal, heroes' feast, holy sword, mass cure moderate wounds, undeath to death, word of recall
level 7: dictum, greater restoration, holy word, mass cure serious wounds, refuge, regenerate, resurrection
level 8: discern location, holy aura, mass cure critical wounds, shield of law
level 9: implosion, mass heal, miracle, soul bind, storm of vengeance, true resurrection

class table



Mystic Paladin
Spellsperday



Level
BAB
FORT
REF
WILL
Special
0
1
2
3
4
5
6
7
8
9


1st
1
2
0
0
Aura of good
1
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


2nd
2
3
0
0
Detect evil, Smite evil 1/day
2
1
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


3rd
3
3
1
1
Divine grace, Lay on hands
2
2
1
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


4th
4
4
1
1
Aura of courage, Divine health
2
2
1
-
-
-
-
-
-
-


5th
5
4
1
1
Turn undead
3
2
2
1
-
-
-
-
-
-


6th
6/1
5
2
2
Remove disease 1/week, Smite evil 2/day
3
3
2
1
-
-
-
-
-
-


7th
7/2
5
2
2
-
3
3
2
2
1
-
-
-
-
-


8th
8/3
6
2
2
-
3
3
3
2
1
-
-
-
-
-


9th
9/4
6
3
3
Remove disease 2/week
4
3
3
2
2
1
-
-
-
-


10th
10/5
7
3
3
-
4
4
3
3
2
1
-
-
-
-


11th
11/6/1
7
3
3
Smite evil 3/day
4
4
3
3
2
2
1
-
-
-


12th
12/7/2
8
4
4
Remove disease 3/week
4
4
4
3
3
2
1
-
-
-


13th
13/8/3
8
4
4
-
4
4
4
3
3
2
2
1
-
-


14th
14/9/4
9
4
4
-
5
4
4
4
3
3
2
1
-
-


15th
15/10/5
9
5
5
Remove disease 4/week
5
5
4
4
3
3
2
2
1
-


16th
16/11/6/1
10
5
5
Smite evil 4/day
5
5
4
4
4
3
3
2
1
-


17th
17/2/7/2
10
5
5
-
5
5
5
4
4
3
3
2
2
1


18th
18/13/8/3
11
6
6
Remove disease 5/week
5
5
5
4
4
4
3
3
2
1


19th
19/14/9/4
11
6
6
-
5
5
5
5
4
4
3
3
2
2


20th
20/15/10/5
12
6
6
-
5
5
5
5
4
4
4
3
3
2

[death390]

if a full casting "paladin" with actual paladin spells is what you were looking for do something like crusader/ Archivist. archivist can learn ANY divine spell including paladins. mix that with something that boosts might and magic at the same time for PrC to build a paladin. the only major "downside" is that you prep spells like a wizard using a prayer book and its not spontaneous.