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View Full Version : DM Help Advice - should I keep or drop my campaign?



AuthorGirl
2018-07-19, 10:44 PM
A few months ago, I started a 5e campaign so that my brother could play a monk (he said he really wanted to do that and was getting frustrated with the lack of opportunities - the group had mostly been playing in other systems).

To be honest, I'm floundering.

I've been trying to learn a lot of the rules as I go. That's working about as well as you might expect.

There are a lot of moments when I can't make myself start talking during sessions (too apprehensive and self-conscious, I guess). I'll just sit there, go over what I'm going to say, open my mouth and . . . say nothing at all.

I planned things out very badly and my players are not at a high enough level to do the next thing in the storyline (which they don't have to do, I know, but I don't have anything else ready for them to do).

I do set aside time to plan. Then I sit in front of a blank page and start crying because I can't imagine writing my ideas down, let alone presenting them to my friends/acquaintances. I just feel inadequate, and stupid for even trying. This sort of thing has happened a lot lately, and frankly I was hoping the pressure of "you need to have something planned by this weekend" would force me past it - that hasn't worked as I'd hoped. It's stupid, yes. Somehow I can't shake it.

Fun fact, I'm reading what I've typed here over and over, hating it and wondering if I'll be brave enough to post the thread at all.

Anyway.

My brother isn't interested in playing, which is understandable.

Two of my players still seem interested and enthusiastic. Frankly, I don't share their enthusiasm. Still, I feel somewhat obliged to keep their fun going.

So there you go, fellow Forumites. I'm doing a bad job and I'm quite unhappy while doing it. Two players seem quite okay with this (at least the "bad job" part). Would it be acceptable/justified for me to just call it quits?

Geddy2112
2018-07-19, 11:21 PM
If you are that unhappy, don't run the game. No game is better than a bad game, and the reason you ran the game(your brother playing a monk) is fizzling out. That said, I would try to end it with a finale vs an abrupt ending. You could also call a hiatus if you need just a week or two off to gather your thoughts.

Being a DM is hard and often thankless work. You have to want to do it and enjoy it. Being a "good" DM is important too, but if your players are enjoying it, then in my opinion that is the only measure of success for a DM.

Honest Tiefling
2018-07-19, 11:47 PM
I initially wanted to agree with Geddy2112, but then I realized that I can't just agree fully with the advice. If the game itself is making you unhappy, apologize to your players and wrap things up as best you can. Saying that you can't go on if that is the truth is always acceptable, and if these players are decent people, they'll understand. If they don't understand, **** 'em.

However, as someone who struggles with anxiety, I do wonder if your lack of enjoyment is due to campaign burn out, or the struggle to get back onto the horse. Not going to lie, it's an ugly, and often painful process. However, only you can decide if you want to take the time and effort to overcome this fear, and if the reward is worth the effort. If it is, then pushing yourself to run something or present some form of creative work to others will be necessary to advance your skills as a DM.

And remember, this forum will always be here for you and others. No matter how stupid your idea is, I'm sure we've all heard worse. You are not alone in getting frustrated enough to cry, and there's no shame in that.

Florian
2018-07-20, 01:42 AM
Ok, so you've repeatedly hitting the same block and get mounting frustration from doing so.

So, ok, why don't you do one of the two things a lot of us do:
1) Grab a published module, reduce your prep work to have read it at least once.
2) Drop the idea of prep and planing something and just wing it from start to finish.

Grod_The_Giant
2018-07-20, 06:50 AM
And remember, this forum will always be here for you and others. No matter how stupid your idea is, I'm sure we've all heard worse. You are not alone in getting frustrated enough to cry, and there's no shame in that.
Very much this <3

As for your specifics...yeah, it's time to stop the game. I'm sure your friends have noticed you struggling; don't even worry about forcing an ending, just give them an honest "hey, I'm sorry, I'm burnt out and can't keep running this game" and step down. It sounds like you've got other DMs in the wings.

zlefin
2018-07-20, 07:27 AM
I'd say stop for now.
And if you haven't already - you might want to seek medical help.
It helped alot for me with my anxiety disorders.

CharonsHelper
2018-07-20, 08:03 AM
I'd suggest that you either stop DMing, or you grab a module and let it do most of the work. You don't have to plan stuff out, and more often than not there's a text box to read rather than having to think of what to say.

Some people dislike modules, but many are quite good and they're a great learning tool until you feel comfortable DMing your own stuff. (Or not - and just keep using modules.)

Quertus
2018-07-20, 10:41 AM
OK, first off, kudos on agreeing to GM - and deciding to post - despite your anxiety!

Only you are in your shoes, so only you can answer how continuing to game will affect your anxiety - whether pushing on will help, or only make matters worse. However, I hope that you do continue making posts here on the forum. They're mostly good people (even if I'm a ****), and I believe that posting here will be helpful.

Further, let me present a quote from Michael Jordan: “I have missed more than 9,000 shots in my career. I have lost almost 300 games. On 26 occasions I have been entrusted to take the game winning shot, and I missed. I have failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why I succeed.”

If I may be a **** and offer a suggestion, I will suggest that you set yourself up for failure. That you go in, accepting that you will fail. Maybe not every time, but accept that you may well fail this time. Maybe don't go so far as to set yourself up with someone like Quertus, my signature character for whom this account is named, whose tactical ineptitude means that he pretty much always fails to make the optimal choice in combat, but... find social things where it's a "safe space", where you can consider it OK to fail. Then fail. Fail a lot. Learn to accept that failure is a thing, and you'll find that trying - and succeeding - come much easier.

/****

Now, ignoring the anxiety...


A few months ago, I started a 5e campaign so that my brother could play a monk (he said he really wanted to do that and was getting frustrated with the lack of opportunities - the group had mostly been playing in other systems).

To be honest, I'm floundering.

I've been trying to learn a lot of the rules as I go. That's working about as well as you might expect.

There are a lot of moments when I can't make myself start talking during sessions (too apprehensive and self-conscious, I guess). I'll just sit there, go over what I'm going to say, open my mouth and . . . say nothing at all.

I planned things out very badly and my players are not at a high enough level to do the next thing in the storyline (which they don't have to do, I know, but I don't have anything else ready for them to do).

I do set aside time to plan. Then I sit in front of a blank page and start crying because I can't imagine writing my ideas down, let alone presenting them to my friends/acquaintances. I just feel inadequate, and stupid for even trying. This sort of thing has happened a lot lately, and frankly I was hoping the pressure of "you need to have something planned by this weekend" would force me past it - that hasn't worked as I'd hoped. It's stupid, yes. Somehow I can't shake it.

Fun fact, I'm reading what I've typed here over and over, hating it and wondering if I'll be brave enough to post the thread at all.

Anyway.

My brother isn't interested in playing, which is understandable.

Two of my players still seem interested and enthusiastic. Frankly, I don't share their enthusiasm. Still, I feel somewhat obliged to keep their fun going.

So there you go, fellow Forumites. I'm doing a bad job and I'm quite unhappy while doing it. Two players seem quite okay with this (at least the "bad job" part). Would it be acceptable/justified for me to just call it quits?

Hmmm... I admire your dedication to consider keeping their fun going, even if it isn't fun for you. But, even if I admire it, I can't really in good faith encourage you to continue in such a state. What I can encourage is, you've already got a group together that is having fun with your ideas. You know that you have met with success (whether or not you've also met with failure). This is potentially a great opportunity to try to have fun failing (and succeeding). But, if you try, and still find that you can't have fun... hmmm...

You say that you stare at a blank page and cry, because you can't imagine presenting your ideas to friends and family. Why not try presenting them here? Actually, you could even do that in addition to running a game, if you can find joy in running the game. Now, to be fair, the Playground can be pretty brutal in critiquing people's work at times, so you'd want to post something like this story as a "please be gentle" warning, to get ****s like me to put on the kiddy gloves, but, otherwise, I'd like to believe that the practice failing, the positive feedback, and the general confidence in knowing which of your ideas the greater community finds as awesome as your players do would work wonders.

I'll also agree that, if creating the content is too great a struggle - especially if the combination of creating and running is too great - that you could instead attempt to run a module. Only you can really answer if it will help you get accustomed to talking in public, saying stuff that other people have written, or if it will drive you away from creating your own content - which some of your players already clearly love.

... and I realize I'm rambling incoherently. Hopefully something in here is of value to you.

/ramble

AuthorGirl
2018-07-20, 01:28 PM
I must admit, I'm surprised to see so many people mentioning anxiety. Not sure what to think about that, really.

As for what to do about the campaign: maybe, clumsy as it will be, I'll find a generic dungeon-crawl module and drop my players into that instead of the next bit of the storyline. I've already essentially taken a hiatus just by cancelling so many sessions.

Once that module is done, I'll see what sort of state I'm in, and abandon the whole thing or not.

Anyway, I want to thank all of you for reminding me that there are options (and for just being kind). <3

Calthropstu
2018-07-21, 11:06 PM
I am going to try to disagree with the others. I would see this as a challenge. I also have some suggestions for you:

If the problem is story ideas, why not ask for some help with writing better a better story?

Also, it might help if you posted "The story thus far" in a separate thread. I was having problems with a published adventure path a while ago and got some decent advise from the playground at large.

Maybe, instead of asking whether you should drop the campaign (a last resort) maybe you could reboot the campaign, or if you are at a good stop in the current story arc just start a completely new one.

Hell, I bet you could come on each week and we could help you with your writing. We could call it "The Adventure Path of the Playground."

Regardless, I advise taking at least a week off to allow you to focus on learning all the rules better.

Pleh
2018-07-22, 05:37 AM
I must admit, I'm surprised to see so many people mentioning anxiety. Not sure what to think about that, really.

Well, don't overthink it in any case. All we're saying is that most DMs seem to get tired rather than anxious about their games and getting what amounts to stage fright at your own table is unusual enough that you might want to ask a professional about it. You could be experiencing a deeper anxiety than you realize and it could be affecting other areas of your life.

But no use getting worked up about a thread with strangers online. If the shoe don't fit, move along. If it makes you worry, just go see someone and get answers.

I wouldn't recommend trying to run your game if it's causing you this much stress.

Calthropstu
2018-07-22, 09:41 AM
Well, don't overthink it in any case. All we're saying is that most DMs seem to get tired rather than anxious about their games and getting what amounts to stage fright at your own table is unusual enough that you might want to ask a professional about it. You could be experiencing a deeper anxiety than you realize and it could be affecting other areas of your life.

But no use getting worked up about a thread with strangers online. If the shoe don't fit, move along. If it makes you worry, just go see someone and get answers.

I wouldn't recommend trying to run your game if it's causing you this much stress.

That's a fair point. Games are supposed to ve fun. If you aren't having fun, why play?

Quertus
2018-07-22, 06:17 PM
I must admit, I'm surprised to see so many people mentioning anxiety. Not sure what to think about that, really.

For myself, I'm loose with my words, and don't necessarily mean it in a clinical sense. However,



There are a lot of moments when I can't make myself start talking during sessions (too apprehensive and self-conscious, I guess). I'll just sit there, go over what I'm going to say, open my mouth and . . . say nothing at all.

I do set aside time to plan. Then I sit in front of a blank page and start crying because I can't imagine writing my ideas down, let alone presenting them to my friends/acquaintances. I just feel inadequate, and stupid for even trying. This sort of thing has happened a lot lately,

Somehow I can't shake it.

Fun fact, I'm reading what I've typed here over and over, hating it and wondering if I'll be brave enough to post the thread at all.

These would be the phrases that triggered my use of the word "anxiety", as it sounds to things that two of my friends (with anxiety, and social anxiety, IIRC) might say.

Whatever you care to call it, it sounds like you're having issues - with producing content, with talking, and even with posting. So, again, kudos on actually posting!

My experience with says, find the thing(s) you are most comfortable producing, and produce that. Alternately, find the thing(s) you are most comfortable failing at, and fail. Fail a lot. Until you are comfortable, and succeed. Then slowly take baby steps towards where you want to be.

Me, I want to understand various parts of human nature. So I create lots of characters designed to help me explore various aspects of humanity. Most, I find I'm not comfortable role-playing. So I keep learning from playing the ones I enjoy, and set myself new stretch goals. Some day, I may even succeed at posting online in a positive, uplifting tone, instead of as a **** - but don't hold your breath. :smallwink:

Chad Hooper
2018-07-22, 06:57 PM
Hell, I bet you could come on each week and we could help you with your writing. We could call it "The Adventure Path of the Playground".

I think that could be a really great suggestion.

AuthorGirl, please do consider at least posting ideas for others to brainstorm with you if you're having a hard time fleshing something out. Or if you're stuck for ideas, you could post, "OK, so the last game went something like this." Give us a summary and ask "where would you take it from here?". Thinking up suggestions for your campaign or even single story points or one-off encounters could give other DMs here (self included) ideas for our own games as well as yours.

And don't beat yourself up too badly over some failures as a DM. I had to restart my initial campaign like three times because I, as a self-taught DM, was applying some rules incorrectly.

Probably the worst was when the PCs were about to starve and have no place to stay because, in my inexperience, rather than giving them XP for the gold they'd gained (D&D Basic Rules back in the day), I was *converting* their gold to XP, leaving each with only a paltry handful of coppers and their equipment to their names. Then it was like, okay, duh!:smalleek: That should have been obvious! Felt like an idiot, truly, but I hit reset and kept going. Still DMing, 36 years later:smallsmile:

AuthorGirl
2018-07-25, 10:34 PM
Hmm. Perhaps I'll run the "fear and inadequacy" thing by my pastor, see if she thinks it's anything unusual.

As for The Adventure Path of the Playground, I expect it'll be up by the time anyone reads this (and a million thank-yous to everyone for the suggestion) :smallsmile:

Faily
2018-07-26, 08:35 AM
Some of the anxiousness can also come from the fact that you said you're learning the rules as you go?

I know some GMs can manage to do that to a certain degree, but I know I personally can't. Being confident in the rules is one of the things I need to run a game myself, otherwise I get worried that I'm doing something wrong and that it will reduce the enjoyment of the game for the players.

I'll agree with the others of either wrapping up the game, or continue with a module. Either way, I think people here will be willing to give feedback to your ideas. When it comes to creating your own scenarios, I find that being able to bounce ideas off of someone is a great help. :smallsmile:

Spore
2018-07-27, 07:13 AM
Imho you should pause. Tell the players you don't know if you ever pick it up, but you'll let them know. Then after a few weeks or months of pause, if it doesn't call you back, it's not for you. If you don't want to present some ideas, don't do it.


A few months ago, I started a 5e campaign so that my brother could play a monk (he said he really wanted to do that and was getting frustrated with the lack of opportunities - the group had mostly been playing in other systems).

That is awefully nice of you but that should NOT be the main reason why you DM. You should want to tell a story and have friends enjoy it.

Velaryon
2018-07-28, 10:00 PM
Others have already given a lot of good advice and suggestions, so I'd like to give a +1 to the ideas of using a module if you aren't comfortable with sharing your own ideas, and to using the Playground as a sounding board. As counter-intuitive as it seems, sometimes it's easier to talk to strangers than to the people that know and love you the best.

I don't know what to say as far as whether you should keep going or stop - the difficulties you've explained sound a lot like anxiety to me, and I don't have any firsthand experience with that.

However, there are a couple specific parts of your post I'd like to respond to.


I planned things out very badly and my players are not at a high enough level to do the next thing in the storyline (which they don't have to do, I know, but I don't have anything else ready for them to do).

I don't know the specifics of your scenario here, but sometimes it's fun to let them try even when there's no realistic probability of their success. Maybe they'll surprise you with some outside-the-box crazy plan that works even when it shouldn't. Maybe they'll go down in flames but have a lot of fun telling a "doomed heroes fighting an impossible battle" story. Or maybe it'll be a total train wreck and you'll hate how it goes and never want to GM again. Maybe it's worth finding out.

On the other hand, maybe you would be better served putting that idea on the back burner and looking for more adventure ideas that can bridge the gap between where your players are now and where you think they need to be in order to handle the next thing you want to happen.




I do set aside time to plan. Then I sit in front of a blank page and start crying because I can't imagine writing my ideas down, let alone presenting them to my friends/acquaintances. I just feel inadequate, and stupid for even trying. This sort of thing has happened a lot lately, and frankly I was hoping the pressure of "you need to have something planned by this weekend" would force me past it - that hasn't worked as I'd hoped. It's stupid, yes. Somehow I can't shake it.

I too have had times where I stare at a blank page for hours on end, and instead of writing anything down I check my Facebook, browse the forums, play games, etc. all in hopes that the dam will break and I'll be able to start putting something down in my planning notes. Sometimes I get something that comes to me, sometimes I show up on game day worried that the players will blow through what I have ready in 30 minutes and then we'll stare at each other uncomfortably until someone breaks out their Magic cards and I pretend I had fun anyway and don't feel like a failure.

For what it's worth, even though I don't know you in real life, based on your posts here I think it likely that you are perfectly capable of putting together an awesome campaign that your players will love and you will be proud of. You'll also have some garbage ideas - we all do. Even the best professional authors still come up with some monumentally stupid stuff sometimes.

Anyway, only you can make the call whether to keep trying or write this game off as a failure. Either way, I hope that if you have the desire to tell a story in RPG format, that you won't let this stop you for good. Whether you're able to put this particular campaign on track or not, I believe you have it in you to run a good game, whether or not it's this one.

AuthorGirl
2018-08-01, 02:05 PM
Well, I can't tell if I'm being sensible or just giving up, but the campaign's been called off. Thanks to everybody for the advice, y'all are lovely.

Mr Beer
2018-08-01, 09:09 PM
Looks like I'm late to this party but if the thought of prepping for the game literally brings you to tears, stop playing. It's supposed to be fun for everyone, including you, it's not a job you are being paid for so feel free to stop running it.

As far as the other stuff goes, next time, if there is a next time, specifically plan to run a published adventure that should take a few sessions, when that ends, it ends. That way everyone going into it knows what to expect when you wrap it up. It's much easier and lower pressure for you.

FYI, if you realise the characters are too weak for the next leg, there a bunch of ways to deal with this on the fly:

- Nerf the enemies.

- Hand out some sweet lootz (a good way to do this is via consumable magic or high level items on loan).

- NPC help (preferably a bunch of mooks or a support caster to avoid stealing the spotlight).

- Side adventure to level them up.

- Tell the players, preferably via information received in game, that they are way outclassed and let them figure out how to deal with it. Not everything is your problem.

denthor
2018-08-02, 02:26 PM
Others have said alot.

I will say anxiety can make you feel as if it is going badly. When in fact your an enjoyable DM.

Your players are enjoying it. Your bother who knows you better decided it was a bad play vs. what he envisioned.

If you have any doubts it's a dice game (of chance). Toss dice and become absurd. I play to throw dice, laugh and forget the real world for awhile.

This isn't real and does not need to be perfect.

Andor13
2018-08-02, 03:33 PM
RPGs should be about having fun with friends.

You called your existing game, but that doesn't mean you have to give up. I would suggest doing something aimed purely at fun. You could do it by pure improv if the rules are bothering you. You can use troupe style play if DMing is too stressful to do regularly (See Ars Magica). Don't aim for Lodoss Wars, aim for Slayers. Use ridiculous accents. Use props. Recycle plots from TV shows. And if something doesn't work, that's okay, it's a game, not CPR.

D&D is honestly not the best system for lighter styles of play. My google-fu tells me Teenagers From Outer Space has been out of print for 20 years now. Anyone have a light system suggestion that wasn't printed on clay tablets?

mephnick
2018-08-02, 04:32 PM
I was hoping the pressure of "you need to have something planned by this weekend" would force me past it - that hasn't worked as I'd hoped. It's stupid, yes. Somehow I can't shake it.

Play a game that realizes this pressure is bull****. The D&D-centric philosophy that the DM is responsible for the fun of the table is a poisonous artifact from days past. A shared narrative game that passes the ball around may relieve some of this pressure. If a player asks a question about a town in Dungeon World that you can't answer, the mechanics of the game tells you to turn it back on the group and say "I don't know, what do you think would be cool?"

I love D&D, but it is easily the game with the most pressure on the DM. It requires prep and rules mastery in a way many TTRPGs don't. It's not the only way.

Kid Jake
2018-08-03, 08:06 PM
Remember that first and foremost you're supposed to be having fun. If that's not happening then go find something else that IS.

Related to that, remenber that your players are there to have fun. They aren't there to critique your plot structure or grade your sense of game mastery; they're there to hang out, be silly and go on adventures. Don't worry about crafting epic stories, just focus on one session at a time until the story grows out of it and let the players unknowingly provide their own hooks as much as possible.

As you grow more confident you can expand your scope, but if it seems overwhelming then you're likely overthinking it and making things far more complicated than they need to be.

Velaryon
2018-08-07, 02:22 PM
Well, I can't tell if I'm being sensible or just giving up, but the campaign's been called off. Thanks to everybody for the advice, y'all are lovely.

Having now seen some of your posts elsewhere in the forum, I think the problems you've had with your D&D campaign are symptomatic of a larger issue. Given that additional information, I think calling off the campaign for the time being is probably the sensible choice. However, I also believe this is due to stressful circumstances, and should absolutely not be taken as a reflection of your creative ability or quality as a DM. This may not be the right time or place for you to run a campaign, but I do hope you feel up to trying again in the future sometime. :smallsmile: