Green flame blade change

[Bladewing2013]

For thematic reasons I want to have Green flame blade do lightning damage.
Would there be any balance changes this would cause?
(yes I know booming blade exists, but I don't like how they have to move for me to get the best of it.)

[Sigreid]

I think it would be somewhat more useful since lightning is less resisted. I dont think that in and of itself would break it.

[Spectrulus]

I've let a player have it do cold damage before. As long as it's not radiant or thunder, I think it doesn't hurt too much.

[Fayd]

Depending on your class there could be some interactions, esp. if it has elemental keyed features like adding mods to particular damage types. (Tempest Cleric for example)

I’d not have an objection to it under most circumstances, but I’m fairly generous and liberal with my players.

[nickl_2000]

There is also the possible issue of the tempest cleric maximizing damage with it's channel divinity. Still I don't see that it would be to big of an issue. Talk to your DM.

[Sigreid]

There is also the possible issue of the tempest cleric maximizing damage with it's channel divinity. Still I don't see that it would be to big of an issue. Talk to your DM.

I would expect a tempest cleric to want to do that to a higher damage spell. The max damage potential of GFB wouldn't bother me.

[Sception]

I'd argue that the target choosing not to move /is/ getting the most out of booming blade, but no, as a DM I wouldn't have a problem with a house ruled lightning-damage variant of GFB. I played a cold themed character one with a house ruled cold damage version, and it didn't break anything.

[Vogie]

As long as it's not radiant or thunder, I think it doesn't hurt too much.

Or Force.
Or Psychic.

Actually I wish there was a RAW conversion feat that just gave the option to change all damage types from one commonly resisted type to another commonly resisted type so we could make these things legit without relying on DM fiat.

[Sception]

Or Force.
Or Psychic.

Actually I wish there was a RAW conversion feat that just gave the option to change all damage types from one commonly resisted type to another commonly resisted type so we could make these things legit without relying on DM fiat.

If it's a one of thing like this for thematics, then it probably doesn't warrant a feat, really. And a generally applicable feat might have unexpected interactions that wouldn't be as advisable, or at least not as necessary. For instance, I'm not sure I'd be inclined to allow the same swap for a fireball, not when there are already alternatives like lightning bolt and hail storm in roughly the same level range that better reflect the characteristics of their element.

[ciarannihill]

If it's a one of thing like this for thematics, then it probably doesn't warrant a feat, really. And a generally applicable feat might have unexpected interactions that wouldn't be as advisable, or at least not as necessary. For instance, I'm not sure I'd be inclined to allow the same swap for a fireball, not when there are already alternatives like lightning bolt and hail storm in roughly the same level range that better reflect the characteristics of their element.

I agree with this, I'd probably only allow it at my table if I felt the mechanics of the ability and the classic uses of the element were aligned. In this case it seems fine, cleave and "chain" effects for lightning seem even more aligned than cleaving with fire to me so this change would be A-o-k for my table if a player wanted it.

[Vogie]

If it's a one of thing like this for thematics, then it probably doesn't warrant a feat, really. And a generally applicable feat might have unexpected interactions that wouldn't be as advisable, or at least not as necessary. For instance, I'm not sure I'd be inclined to allow the same swap for a fireball, not when there are already alternatives like lightning bolt and hail storm in roughly the same level range that better reflect the characteristics of their element.

I don't know - If they want a ball lightning rather than a fireball (or, if reversed, a length of flame rather than a ball) I don't see the issue in that.

You're right, as it wouldn't warrant a feat in & of itself. Maybe as a option for Elemental Adept?

[Sception]

Even tacking it on to another feat kind of fails to deliver on the thematic angle, since you're talking about at least a 4 level wait to be able to use it, and possibly more than that if the player isn't looking to hobble their character's primary stat progression.

I see no reason why, say, a colt themed melee caster shouldn't be able to take a cold damage melee cantrip at first level. DM fiat/homebrew can do that. Feats just can't.

Honestly, feats in 5e are a poor mechanic to use for basically /anything/ you might want to add or fix design-wise. They represent a massive cost for characters who select them, you don't even get one until level 4, they're presented as an optional variant rule that some games won't even allow, and there are enough problem child feats that not allowing them at all isn't even an unreasonable decision for a dm to make.

Better would be outright new spells built to be more versatile. ie, a line of 'generic' elemental spells where you choose the element when you learn and/or memorize the spell. Maybe not as strong as the more specialized, set-element spells.

[Derpaligtr]

Or Force.
Or Psychic.

Actually I wish there was a RAW conversion feat that just gave the option to change all damage types from one commonly resisted type to another commonly resisted type so we could make these things legit without relying on DM fiat.

Wizards should have a "build a spell" rules
*. All options would be point based and that would determine the level of the spell. They would have a few stock options they can modify. This would show research part of wizards.

Sorcerers would have the spell list and be able to change these stock options on the fly. While the metamagics can change spell effects, they wouldn't be ablw to change spell damage type or whatever.


* rules, not option.

[Snowbluff]

There is also the possible issue of the tempest cleric maximizing damage with it's channel divinity. Still I don't see that it would be to big of an issue. Talk to your DM.

Well, best would be it triggering the push cleric gets on a cantrip that hits 2 people and also gets weapon damage.

[JNAProductions]

Wizards should have a "build a spell" rules
*. All options would be point based and that would determine the level of the spell. They would have a few stock options they can modify. This would show research part of wizards.

Sorcerers would have the spell list and be able to change these stock options on the fly. While the metamagics can change spell effects, they wouldn't be ablw to change spell damage type or whatever.


* rules, not option.

It's a neat idea.

Now write a balanced system on it. :P

[Asmotherion]

The safest change you can do when tinkering is altering damage types.
Basically, it's a safe bet. Refluff it as "Blue Lightning Blade" or something, and you're ready.

The more you "Deviate" from the core mechanics of a "Core" spell, the more it becomes complicated to calculate it's balance. Since all you're playing with is it's damage type, and there are already Melee Lightning Cantrips Avalable (Shocking Grasp), the game implies that this type of damage is supposed to be avalable for Melee Attacks, thus you won't be breaking any balance by doing so with a Weapon Attack.

[Mr.Garbum]

For thematic reasons I want to have Green flame blade do lightning damage.
Would there be any balance changes this would cause?
(yes I know booming blade exists, but I don't like how they have to move for me to get the best of it.)

i don't really think it would change too much, but you can always ask the DM if it could do different damage types

like, if you are a water elemental and want to do cold damage, just ask the DM

[MeeposFire]

I think it would be somewhat more useful since lightning is less resisted. I dont think that in and of itself would break it.

True though fire also tends to be a type that gets vulnerabilities as well and sometimes some other special effects. Bit of a wash for the the most part.

[Laserlight]

It's a neat idea.

Now write a balanced system on it. :P

Champions / Hero System. Which I'd love to play but don't want to DM.

As far as swapping elements, though, you could just say something like 1d6 radiant or force = 1d8 of most other stuff =1d10 poison or fire.

Or XdN radiant = YdN other = ZdN poison. Then you'd just say "I don't want Fireball, I want Forceball" and subtract a couple of dice from your roll.

[Derpaligtr]

It's a neat idea.

Now write a balanced system on it. :P

Well, as long as enemies were balanced around yhe different damage types (I would say to give each enemy a weakness and a resistance against at least one type) it wouldn't be all that different than how they design and balance spells now I guess.

.

[DracoKnight]

I think it would be somewhat more useful since lightning is less resisted. I dont think that in and of itself would break it.

I'd have to check my spread sheet, but I wanna say that lightning is just as resisted, if not more resisted than fire, actually.

EDIT: both elemental damage types are equally resisted (at 35 monsters), but more things are immune to fire (42 monsters) than Lightning (21 monsters). The tradeoff there being that there's some monsters (9) that're vulnerable to fire damage.

That's just in the monster manual, I'm still working through the other books.

[GoodmanDL]

I would expect a tempest cleric to want to do that to a higher damage spell. The max damage potential of GFB wouldn't bother me.

The Tempest is going to want it for the 6th level ability to push anyone they damage with lightning. You always want sores of area lightning damage as a Tempest.