Looking for rules clarification on Turn Undead

[Talothorn]

If a neutral cleric worships a neutral deity, they can choose to turn or rebuke undead.


A neutral cleric of a neutral deity must choose whether his turning ability functions as that of a good cleric or an evil cleric. Once this choice is made, it cannot be reversed.

If they chose to turn undead, then later become neutral evil, do they retain the ability to turn undead? Or does it become rebuke? Or do they lose the ability altogether? They haven't fallen from their deity's favor, and are only one step from the deity's alignment.

I cant find a rule for this.

[BlackOnyx]

From what's listed in the cleric's class entry, it seems that only good or neutral clerics can channel positive energy. This suggests that an evil cleric would likely lose that ability, even if their god was a neutral one.


That said, PHB II includes a section devoted to "retraining."


The subsection "Class Feature Retraining" includes the specifics you're looking for. Basically, if your god allows for both positive and negative channeling (and your DM agrees), retraining may be possible. The costs/time guidelines for retraining a class feature can be found on the table later in the section.


If you're switching deities entirely, the sidebar on "Divine Conversion" describes the process (which is more involved than simple retraining).

[Devils_Advocate]

Not being able to reverse the choice means that you can't decide to switch from turning to rebuking or vice versa. Switching class features as a result of changing alignment is an involuntary change.

(Theoretically, a cleric could deliberately attempt to change alignment in order to change this class feature. The most legalistic, RAWtastic reconciliation of the rules that I can come up with in that case is that such an alignment change is impossible.)

Regardless, undead-turning clerics always spontaneously cast cure spells and undead-rebuking clerics always spontaneously cast inflict spells.

[Talothorn]

Thanks guys, I appreciate it.

Also,

(Theoretically, a cleric could deliberately attempt to change alignment in order to change this class feature. The most legalistic, RAWtastic reconciliation of the rules that I can come up with in that case is that such an alignment change is impossible.)
This is awesome.

[Mordaedil]

From what I remember, sitting at a table with a neutral cleric worshipping an evil deity forced you to channel negative energy. I would at the very least be really careful with regards to how your DM is scowling at you from across the table with this in regard.

[Talothorn]

From what I remember, sitting at a table with a neutral cleric worshipping an evil deity forced you to channel negative energy. I would at the very least be really careful with regards to how your DM is scowling at you from across the table with this in regard.

That is true. A neutral cleric worshiping an evil deity channels negative energy, and a neutral cleric following a good deity channels positive energy. The choice comes in when it's a neutral cleric following a neutral deity.

Given that an evil cleric who follows a neutral deity channels negative energy, it seems that the cleric in my question would change to negative energy, except for the line about not being able to change type once the choice is made.