How would you make a mystic theurge?

[xroads]

The mystic theurge (MT) is one of my favorite prestige classes in D&D 3+. Unfortunately, it’s not likely to reappear in 5e. 5e does not have prestige classes. And I don’t really see it fitting well as a class path.

So how would you create a MT using the current rules?

Personally, I’m thinking the best way to create an MT is to multi-class into Wizard (Divination) / Cleric (Arcane or Knowledge), making sure to flip every four levels in order to keep gaining those sweet ASI levels. It probably won't have the same punch at the high tiers that a MT in 3+ would have. But it would still be a formidable character.

[clash]

It depends on what you want from a mystic thuerge. If it is just spell versatility then the Divine soul has access to most cleric and wizard spells. If you want the prepared spells as well there is Arcana domain for cleric or a divine wizard subclass released in ua. If you want the dual spell slots then you can still get that by multiclassing cleric with warlock and have double the lower level slots.

[Willie the Duck]

It depends on whether you want the mechanics or the there to match up. Clash is right, divine soul sorcerer is 90% there, thematically (unless it being a book-learnin' arcane class that is part of the theme. Likewise, for a toe-dip level arcana and knowledge domain clerics can fill the same story role most of the time. Otherwise, yeah, wizard-cleric multiclass is perfectly doable straight on. You will probably not have the stats to have optimized armor and hp (having enough Strength for heavy armor or Dex 14 for medium will compete with a high Con/high Wis/High Int), but honestly, you can wear armor, which a 3e MT really couldn't, so you are already ahead on that curve.


Personally, I’m thinking the best way to create an MT is to multi-class into Wizard (Divination) / Cleric (Arcane or Knowledge), making sure to flip every four levels in order to keep gaining those sweet ASI levels. It probably won't have the same punch at the high tiers that a MT in 3+ would have. But it would still be a formidable character.

Those sweet ASIs are nothing compared to 3rd level spells. Waiting until 9th level for your first 3rd level will be a huge wait.

[Gorgo]

If your campaign allows Unearthed Arcana, there was also a theurge wizard school that replaces most of the wizard school powers with cleric domain powers and allows you to learn one cleric spell per wizard level. I'm playing one with the life domain and it makes a great backup healer. Fights get a bit harried when I'm the only healer around, though ...

[ATHATH]

Cleric 1/Wizard 19 with the Ritual Caster (Cleric) feat (or the other way around)?

[solidork]

Something else to keep in mind is that the Cleric spell list is heavily front loaded and a lot of their power at later levels comes from casting spells like Spirit Guardians at higher levels, something a multiclassed Cleric/Wizard could easily do.

[Vogie]

Honestly, I'd probably Take the Divine soul sorcerer class features and drape them over the Wizard skeleton.

You'd be an Int caster with ritual casting, a recovery feature, and the Divine Soul Sorcerer features starting at level 2.

2 - Favored by the Gods & Divine Magic
6 - empowered healing
14 - Otherworldly Wings
18 - Unearthly recovery (maybe move this to 10 to match the normal wizard breakdown)

[clash]

Honestly, I'd probably Take the Divine soul sorcerer class features and drape them over the Wizard skeleton.

You'd be an Int caster with ritual casting, a recovery feature, and the Divine Soul Sorcerer features starting at level 2.

2 - Favored by the Gods & Divine Magic
6 - empowered healing
14 - Otherworldly Wings
18 - Unearthly recovery (maybe move this to 10 to match the normal wizard breakdown)

I feel like wizard would be far too strong with this subclass. The reason it is fine on a sorcerer is they have so few spells known it really wouldn't break anything if they got access to every spell in the game. On a wizard that can freely select and prepare cleric or wizard spells it could break a lot.

[Vogie]

I feel like wizard would be far too strong with this subclass. The reason it is fine on a sorcerer is they have so few spells known it really wouldn't break anything if they got access to every spell in the game. On a wizard that can freely select and prepare cleric or wizard spells it could break a lot.

That's true - perhaps limit them to the limited number of spells known like the sorcerer, just without the benefit of metamagic (but augmented by rituals)?

[ImproperJustice]

Something else to keep in mind is that the Cleric spell list is heavily front loaded and a lot of their power at later levels comes from casting spells like Spirit Guardians at higher levels, something a multiclassed Cleric/Wizard could easily do.

This!

Upcasting the level 3 wonderspells like Spirit Guardians, Fireball, etc.... can carry you a long time.
Life Clerics get to add their healing bonus based on the level of the slot, not the spell, which means you can upcast things like Prayer of Healing for greater effect.