Best / worst titles in media [Archive] - Giant in the Playground Forums

Kato

2018-09-10, 02:03 AM

I have been wondering about the importance of titles in media a bit recently.
While a lot of stuff settles for 'main character's name' or 'important McGuffin' or 'vague plot description' (or 'setting') I've been thinking about the few cases where this doesn't apply. And where it works especially well or poorly.
But.. I had a hard time coming up with a list of examples.

So since I thought I'd ask you what are examples you can think of where the title of any work is especially good or bad, relating to what actually goes on in the work.

BWR

2018-09-10, 06:54 AM

Up to a few decades ago pretty much every non-Norwegian piece of media that was translated was given a Norwegian name, and often not just a literal translation of the original title. While this makes sense for titles that are idioms, puns, etc. it was done pretty indiscriminately and with little care for (and often little understanding of) the work in question.
This gave us things like (literal translation to English for those not fortunate enough to understand Norwegian) "Shark summer" (Jaws), "Worm summer" (Tremors), "Picnic with death" (Deliverence) , "Help, we're in the pop business" (This is Spinal Tap), "Girl with male courage" (True Grit, though this one sounds marginally less bad in Norwegian), and "Pumpkin in distress" (Seven Year Itch), to name a few.
In a case of both good and bad translations, SW: TPM had both. Norwegian is the only language I know with two official versions of the same language (minor dialectal differences and geography determine which the first one you learn is). In one the translation was "The Hidden Menace" and in the other it was "The Phantom/Wraith/Apparition Menace".

In English media, the use of the name "John Carter" for the adaptation of the first of ERB's Barsoom stories a few years ago was an example of how not to do it. With merely a name, especially one that is so average, what can one expect from the movie?
Sure, if you're like me, a Barsoom story was the first thing I though of but for those unfamiliar with it....A comedy? Drama? Horror? Documentary? Had they just called it "John Carter of Mars" it would give at least a vague hint of the content.

Misereor

2018-09-10, 07:53 AM

Jaros

2018-09-10, 08:31 AM

Die Hard 2: Die Harder, has to be one of the best named sequels I can think of

Building off of that, An Evening With Kevin Smith 2: Evening Harder

For another humorous eye-catcher of a title, while I haven't read it, I do know there's a YA book called Hold Me Closer, Necromancer

Eldan

2018-09-10, 08:47 AM

Well, I mean, sequel titles are an entire genre on their own. But I'd like to nominate any movie with "Revolution", "Vengeance" or "The Return" as a title.

Hunter Noventa

2018-09-10, 09:19 AM

Some anime have really nonsensical titles. What does Bleach have to do with...whatever supernatural shenanigans that show/manga is about anyway?

Prime32

2018-09-10, 02:22 PM

Some anime have really nonsensical titles. What does Bleach have to do with...whatever supernatural shenanigans that show/manga is about anyway?It whitens things. Lots of things in Bleach turn white, literally or metaphorically. And the protagonist is frequently mistaken for having bleached hair.

But mainly music references (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bleach_(Nirvana_album)).

Magic_Hat

2018-09-10, 08:30 PM

Do acronyms of a title count? Like I don't like Uncle Grampa, I don't have a problem with the title (or rather I don't have a problem with naming a show after its protagonist), but the initials are "UG." And they acknowledge it in the show. UG - it's like an onomatopoeia for what you feel like when watching it.

Also Game of Thrones. I like the early seasons, am fine with the title, but the acronym is "GOT," (and they acknowledge it in the show) which seems kind of silly for this dark, serious, medieval fantasy drama.

I don't know. The acronym for whatever the series/media is doesn't bother me. Just trying to get people to say the title as an acronym when it doesn't work kind of bugs me. Like when the last Harry Potter films came out: HP7 pt1 or pt2. Sometimes an acronym works, and sometimes its weird to say or think about.

Am I making any sense? Am I alone in this?

Rynjin

2018-09-11, 12:40 AM

Kato

2018-09-11, 12:42 AM

I don't feel like many shows make a point of acronym titles, unless it's very blatant... Or I'm just ignorant. Then again, many shows have such short names shortening them is kind of pointless (?)

Same in Denmark.
I fondly recall "Monkey boy kills indigenous life forms and wants to get it on with hot socialite girl" (Tarzan).
Or "Christmas dinner to be thinks it is Doctor Phil" (Babe).
And my favorite. "Lesbian Nazi Hookers abducted by UFO and forced into weight loss program" (Jerry Springer).
Well, I wasn't specifically thinking of translations, but I guess they qualify. Germany also had its fair share (they mostly stopped translating by now)
(a German comedian claimed that the Spanish (?) title for Psycho was 'the man who was his mother' but I can't find any proof of that)

Well, I mean, sequel titles are an entire genre on their own. But I'd like to nominate any movie with "Revolution", "Vengeance" or "The Return" as a title.
Yes, those are always gems.

It whitens things. Lots of things in Bleach turn white, literally or metaphorically. And the protagonist is frequently mistaken for having bleached hair.

But mainly music references (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bleach_(Nirvana_album)).
Ah, I've always wondered about that. Mystery solved.

Celestia

2018-09-11, 01:22 AM

One of my favorite titles ever is Ghost in the Shell. If you know nothing about the movie, it is a bizarre title that intruiges you, and then after you watch it, you realize the deeper meaning it holds. The name spoils the ending of the movie, but you'll never know until after you watch it. I love names with hidden secrets like that. Kubo and the Two Strings does something similar.

factotum

2018-09-11, 02:08 AM

Some anime have really nonsensical titles. What does Bleach have to do with...whatever supernatural shenanigans that show/manga is about anyway?

I find that the original Japanese episode titles for anime are often just a description of what happens in the episode, which is quite odd to Western ears. They generally get renamed for Western consumption.

Willing to bet that both the best and worst titles of all time come from the James Bond movies. Best: Diamonds are Forever, The Man with the Golden Gun, The World is Not Enough. Worst: Quantum of Solace (what the heck does that even mean?), Octopussy, Thunderball (sounds like a lottery machine).

Eldan

2018-09-11, 02:39 AM

You must really like Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance.

As we all should, it's great.

Oh, that one absolutely loops back around to greatness, even if I have never played a Metal Gear game.

Celestia

2018-09-11, 02:45 AM

I find that the original Japanese episode titles for anime are often just a description of what happens in the episode, which is quite odd to Western ears. They generally get renamed for Western consumption.

Willing to bet that both the best and worst titles of all time come from the James Bond movies. Best: Diamonds are Forever, The Man with the Golden Gun, The World is Not Enough. Worst: Quantum of Solace (what the heck does that even mean?), Octopussy, Thunderball (sounds like a lottery machine).
I can't possibly consider as great a title that is a blatant lie. At normal pressures, diamonds are thermodynamically unstable and decay into graphite over the course of billions of years.

snowblizz

2018-09-11, 03:01 AM

Worst: Quantum of Solace (what the heck does that even mean?),

A very tiny piece of peace of mind, basically. IIRC it had some meaning in the film, Bond getting some closure on some things. Maybe. A lot of those, especially the Craig oens start to flwo together in my mind.

BWR

2018-09-11, 06:58 AM

Spore

2018-09-11, 07:15 AM

Well, I mean, sequel titles are an entire genre on their own. But I'd like to nominate any movie with "Revolution", "Vengeance" or "The Return" as a title.

You must really like Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance.

As we all should, it's great.

And I love its status as a quasi-serious game that jokes about its tropes.

I really like "Star Wars" and its subsequent subtitles. You can say about the movies what you will but the subtitles always hit its content.

As for vaguely confusing I'd like to nominate "Iron Sky". From the trailer I thought it was a piloting film much less about hammy Space Nazis. but in retrospect, Udo Kier should have given it away.

Fun fact: When he doesn't play Yuri in C&C Red Alert 2 or Wolfgang Kortzfleisch (what a surname... Mr Pukemeat likes his Arian name I think) in Iron Sky, he often plays villains in German crime thrillers or kid's shows. Have you ever seen the light-heartedness of kid or early teen live-action series meet something so hammy as Udo Kier's villainous acting? It is delightful.

Iruka

2018-09-11, 07:45 AM

As for vaguely confusing I'd like to nominate "Iron Sky". From the trailer I thought it was a piloting film much less about hammy Space Nazis. but in retrospect, Udo Kier should have given it away.

Fun fact: When he doesn't play Yuri in C&C Red Alert 2 or Wolfgang Kortzfleisch (what a surname... Mr Pukemeat likes his Arian name I think) in Iron Sky, he often plays villains in German crime thrillers or kid's shows. Have you ever seen the light-heartedness of kid or early teen live-action series meet something so hammy as Udo Kier's villainous acting? It is delightful.

Kortzfleisch was acctually the name of a real german noble house, one of them a general in the Wehrmacht. I had assumed the name had its origins in something translating to 'short meat', but apparently the name was originally written as Kotfleisch ... no wonder they changed it.

Boy does Kier do a lot of stuff :smalleek:

The Fury

2018-09-11, 10:26 AM

Up to a few decades ago pretty much every non-Norwegian piece of media that was translated was given a Norwegian name, and often not just a literal translation of the original title. While this makes sense for titles that are idioms, puns, etc. it was done pretty indiscriminately and with little care for (and often little understanding of) the work in question.
This gave us things like (literal translation to English for those not fortunate enough to understand Norwegian) "Shark summer" (Jaws), "Worm summer" (Tremors), "Picnic with death" (Deliverence) , "Help, we're in the pop business" (This is Spinal Tap), "Girl with male courage" (True Grit, though this one sounds marginally less bad in Norwegian), and "Pumpkin in distress" (Seven Year Itch), to name a few.

I actually like some of those. "Worm Summer" ...I'd see that.

As much as it pains me to say it, "Eternal Darkness" isn't that great of a title. The game itself is awesome sure, but the title doesn't give a very good impression of what you're in for and even comes off as kind of generic. I was actually going to pass on it until a friend insisted that I give it a shot.

Eldan

2018-09-11, 10:30 AM

Sanity's Requiem isn't a bad title, though.

McNum

2018-09-11, 10:54 AM

Same in Denmark.
I fondly recall "Monkey boy kills indigenous life forms and wants to get it on with hot socialite girl" (Tarzan).
Or "Christmas dinner to be thinks it is Doctor Phil" (Babe).
And my favorite. "Lesbian Nazi Hookers abducted by UFO and forced into weight loss program" (Jerry Springer).
I'm from Denmark and I don't quite recognize those. Babe was "Babe the Spunky Pig" if I remember right.

I do remember "Maw of Death" (Jaws), "Dad's Awesome Vacation" (National Lampoon's Vacation), and "Driving with Crazy People!" (Cannonball Run). Others get a more literal translation, like A Fistful of Dollars is exactly that, but in Danish. The Good, The Bad, and The Ugly became "The Good, The Bad, and the Cruel", though.

Of course, none can hold a candle to the best worst one. Die Hard with a Vengeance became "Die Hard, MEGA HARD" in Danish. Yes, localized to a different English title.

Dødens Gab (Jaws)
Babe den kække gris (Babe)
Fars Fede Ferie (National Lampoon's Vacation)
Ud at køre med de skøre! (Cannonball Run)
En nævefuld dollars (A Fistful of Dollars)
Den gode, den onde, og den grusomme (The Good, The Bad, and The Ugly)

Velaryon

2018-09-11, 12:33 PM

I second John Carter as a truly awful title. Just having a person's name isn't a great choice for a movie title to begin with, but if your film is sci fi, fantasy, or some flavor thereof, you need to put something in the title that suggests that.

Some anime have really nonsensical titles. What does Bleach have to do with...whatever supernatural shenanigans that show/manga is about anyway?

I can't speak to Bleach specifically, but there do seem to be a significant number of manga and anime whose creators chose the title by sticking their fingers in a random dictionary page and picking whatever word they end up pointing to.

Yora

2018-09-11, 01:29 PM

Why name a movie "John Carter" when the character's days of fame were almost a century ago and only a few fans of obscure early sci-fi know it? Especially when you could use the more recognizable version of his name that is "John Carter of Mars". Now that's a title that is already much more interesting.

Or you could just use the title of the novel you are adapting, which has the awesome name "A Princess of Mars". Seriously! You're first thought is probably "what does a princess do on Mars?" and then "Wait, she's a princess of Mars? How is that possible?!" Already you are curious, and even if it turns out to be something you're absolutely not interested in, you have been thinking about it for a few seconds.
"John Carter" does not mean anything to anyone, and it doesn't have any even mildly interesting associations.

I think Bleach refers to the main character being a Japanese guy with blond hair, which makes people percieve him as a troublemaker who wants to stand out and get attention. Which I believe isn't actually fair as he just happens to be that one japanese person who is naturally blond.
But it's still really not important at all, considering the subject of the series.

Good choices. "Ghost in the Shell" is so much more descriptive, appropriate and evocative than "Mobile Armored Riot Police."
Though before that, he also wrote "Tokyo Tank Police". Now that's a cool title.

While I'm a fan of his third near-future cyborg-police with heavy armor series (almost like that guy's an engineer or something), "Appleseed" is also a terrible title.

BWR

2018-09-11, 01:49 PM

"Dad's Awesome Vacation" (National Lampoon's Vacation),

That was 'Help, we're on vacation', here. Norway went through a period of 'Help, X' as a go to translation for several comedies, such as
'Help, it's Christmas vacation', which can almost be excused for being a sequel.
'Help, we're flying' (Airplane)
'Help, we're filming' (Loose shoes)

And lest you think only foreign movies got this treatment, several Norwegian movies suffered this as well. I will give 'Help, we're in the movie business' a pass since it was a deliberate jab at that unfortunate period in our cinematographical history and poked fun at the state of Norwegian film in general.

Though before that, he also wrote "Tokyo Tank Police". Now that's a cool title.

Is that the same as 'Dominion'/'Dominion Tank Police'? Because that's the name of the manga and anime we have, respectively. And it was a fun title and fun little story.

Pendulous

2018-09-11, 01:55 PM

Some anime have really nonsensical titles. What does Bleach have to do with...whatever supernatural shenanigans that show/manga is about anyway?

Oh, we're going anime here?

"Problem Children Are Coming From Another World, Aren't They?"

"A Place Further than the Universe" (amazing beautiful show, but still)

"Is it Wrong to Try to Pick Up Girls in a Dungeon?"

"Is this a Zombie?" (mentioned for the trifecta of shows that love to be a question)

"When Supernatural battles Become Commonplace"

And for an upcoming one, "That Time I Got Reincarnated as a Slime ".

Berserk Mecha

2018-09-11, 02:40 PM

Anime inspired video games tend to be horrendous at this, especially when the people coming up with this stuff have no idea how any language other than Japanese works.

Examples:

Fate / Stay Night
Unlimited Blade Works
Guilty Gear XX Accent Core Plus R
Melty Blood Re-ACT Final Tuned
Melty Blood Actress Again Current Code

That last one deserves special mention just to try and figure out what in the hell it is supposed to mean.

SirKazum

2018-09-11, 03:18 PM

Melty Blood Actress Again Current Code

That last one deserves special mention just to try and figure out what in the hell it is supposed to mean.

That one's easy - it's about a former actress whose blood has a particularly low fusion temperature (she lives in a really cold place, okay) who returns to the job after making sure her studio is compliant with the newest version of local building safety laws. Did I get that right? :smalltongue:

Kantaki

2018-09-11, 04:31 PM

Is it Wrong to Try to Pick Up Girls in a Dungeon?"

What's the problem with that one?:smallconfused:
Other than the answer being painfully obvious I mean.
By the way, it's „YES!.:smalltongue::smallamused:

"Is this a Zombie?" (mentioned for the trifecta of shows that love to be a question).

Sounds like a good title for a picture book that prepares little kids for the zombie-apocalypse.:smallbiggrin:
Hey, the brats need to know when it's time to shoot daddy in the face:smallamused:

Joran

2018-09-11, 06:28 PM

The Kingdom Hearts game on the 3DS has the worst subtitle ever: Dream Drop Distance (get it?! 3Ds!)

Another game in the series is called 358/2 which makes me think of a math problem...

Chain of Memories, however is an awesome title.

Knaight

2018-09-11, 08:42 PM

On the good side - A Hundred Years of Solitude is just a rock solid title, and I have to give credit where it's due to In Search of Lost Time, for all that the actual writing is not my thing.

Kato

2018-09-12, 01:20 AM

"Is this a Zombie?" (mentioned for the trifecta of shows that love to be a question)
.
Well, I'd say considering the tone of the show it's actually kind of well chosen for the pure weirdness. (also, wasn't it actually "am I a zombie?" my lacking Japanese is showing..)

Sounds like a good title for a picture book that prepares little kids for the zombie-apocalypse.:smallbiggrin:
Hey, the brats need to know when it's time to shoot daddy in the face:smallamused:

Hah :smallbiggrin:

Also, speaking of anime, where does good old Neon Genesis Evangelion fit on the scale?

Noldo

2018-09-12, 01:25 AM

A few movie titles that have really manages to catch my attention were:

Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind

Requiem for a Dream

In terms of horrible titles, especially translations, I have to submit two classic Finnish titles for foreign films (Finnish name translated into English):

Rita Hayworth - the Key for Escape (you guessed it: The Shawshank Redemption)

Avenger with a Harmonica (Once Upon a Time in the West)

The Fury

2018-09-12, 01:38 AM

Sanity's Requiem isn't a bad title, though.

I'll give ya that one. Though if the complete title were "Sanity's Requiem: Eternal Darkness," I might have liked it better.

Well, I'd say considering the tone of the show it's actually kind of well chosen for the pure weirdness. (also, wasn't it actually "am I a zombie?" my lacking Japanese is showing..)

Heh. If there were a series titled "Am I a Zombie?" I'd give it a watch it based on the title alone. I'd be hoping for a set of PSAs for how newly turned undead can determine their new status, and how they can lead a full life death ...whatever.

Eldan

2018-09-12, 02:06 AM

Well, I'd say considering the tone of the show it's actually kind of well chosen for the pure weirdness. (also, wasn't it actually "am I a zombie?" my lacking Japanese is showing..)

Hah :smallbiggrin:

Also, speaking of anime, where does good old Neon Genesis Evangelion fit on the scale?

Isn't that correct-ish Greek? I mean, it's another rather superficial Christian allusion in NGE, but it's not a bad title, I'd say.

Kato

2018-09-12, 02:07 AM

Heh. If there were a series titled "Am I a Zombie?" I'd give it a watch it based on the title alone. I'd be hoping for a set of PSAs for how newly turned undead can determine their new status, and how they can lead a full life death ...whatever.
It's actually... well, I liked it well enough. (Also, I was wrong on remembering the title) It's a very crazy Story about a Boy who gets turned into a Zombie and a magical girl and collects a harem including a ninja vampire (vampire ninja?) and it's pretty much as crazy as it sounds. It's definitely not for everyone but to turn off your head and just enjoy a metaphorical drug trip it's not bad.

Also, what about some classic book titles, rather distant from their subject matter?
"To kill a mocking bird"? "Catcher in the Rye"?

Soepvork

2018-09-12, 03:20 AM

A recent worst title for me would be 'The Commuter' .

To me it evokes images of the following: Watch this movie, featuring a man/woman get stuck in slow-moving traffic everyday!

veti

2018-09-12, 03:59 AM

If you can't think of titles that don't match the protagonist / plot summary / setting, that suggests you don't read enough decent books. Try:

American Gods
The Kindly Ones
The Ogre Downstairs
To Say Nothing of the Dog
An Instance of the Fingerpost
The Remains of the Day
An Artist of the Floating World
Never Let Me Go

Kato

2018-09-12, 04:34 AM

If you can't think of titles that don't match the protagonist / plot summary / setting, that suggests you don't read enough decent books. Try:

American Gods

:smallconfused: American Gods portrays the lives of Gods living in the US... How is that a title that doesn't match its plot?

Knaight

2018-09-12, 04:37 AM

Speaking of these I'd add The Buried Giant to both the categories of good names and those that don't reference a protagonist.

Wraith

2018-09-12, 05:00 AM

Easily the most disappointing film title-to-film quality disparity that I have ever witnessed would be Jesus Christ: Vampire Hunter.

I mean.... just look at it. How could a film with a title like that possibly be anything other than immensely entertaining, even if only in the same way that it's impossible to look away from a really good car-wreck?

And yet, it's really bad. There's nothing redeeming about it except the title - even the musical numbers are, at best, just.... meh. (Oh yes; it's a musical, by the way). 90 minutes of completely wasted potential, if you ask me.

Strangely, despite the foreboding title of Abraham Lincoln: Vampire Hunter was a much, much better affair. It was still quite silly, of course, but once you accept that then there wasn't anything else wrong with it at all and I liked it a lot. :smalltongue:

Iruka

2018-09-12, 06:03 AM

Wardog

2018-09-12, 12:57 PM

There were a bunch of thrillers and action movies recently that had particularly boring jobs as their titles, although "The Accountant" and "The Mechanic" are the only one I can remember at the moment.

Yora

2018-09-12, 02:54 PM

I want to mention Record of Lodoss War and Attack on Titan for being obviously picked by people who don't know English gramar. And they aren't even called that in Japanese. In Japanese they have proper Japanese names. How can translators mess up that badly?

factotum

2018-09-12, 02:56 PM

Attack on Titan for being obviously picked by people who don't know English gramar.

Well, technically "Attack on Titan" could mean an attack happening on Saturn's moon Titan, which is what I always thought that was about until I read a plot summary... :smallsmile:

Velaryon

2018-09-12, 08:29 PM

The Remains of the Day

I don't know whether it's the intended meaning of the title, but it's not hard to make it make sense, after a fashion. The whole novel is about
Stevens coming to grips with the idea that he's wasted his life, and deciding how he wants to make use of the remainder of his day life.

So I think that one makes sense, even if it doesn't tell a prospective reader very much about what they're in for.

Easily the most disappointing film title-to-film quality disparity that I have ever witnessed would be Jesus Christ: Vampire Hunter.

I mean.... just look at it. How could a film with a title like that possibly be anything other than immensely entertaining, even if only in the same way that it's impossible to look away from a really good car-wreck?

And yet, it's really bad. There's nothing redeeming about it except the title - even the musical numbers are, at best, just.... meh. (Oh yes; it's a musical, by the way). 90 minutes of completely wasted potential, if you ask me.

Strangely, despite the foreboding title of Abraham Lincoln: Vampire Hunter was a much, much better affair. It was still quite silly, of course, but once you accept that then there wasn't anything else wrong with it at all and I liked it a lot. :smalltongue:

*double checks to make sure I didn't write this post*

You nailed it. JC:VH sounds like the most epic, amazing B-movie ever when you describe it. The basic plot (Jesus returns to Earth to stop a group of vampires from harvesting skin from lesbians so they can go out in the daylight, and recruits legendary Mexican wrestler El Santo to help) sounds awesome. A lot of the scenes (a car full of atheists challenging Jesus to a fight, God speaking to his son through a bowl of ice cream, and so on) sound like they will be hilarious.

And then you see the thing and realize it was made on a budget of $5, and it looks like a film school student recruited his non-actor friends to play this out and recorded the whole thing on a potato. Great idea, terrible execution.

Not since Ninja Vengeance (https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0095745/?ref_=nv_sr_1) have I seen such a disappointing bait-and-switch.

I want to mention Record of Lodoss War and Attack on Titan for being obviously picked by people who don't know English gramar. And they aren't even called that in Japanese. In Japanese they have proper Japanese names. How can translators mess up that badly?

Reminds me of Corpse Princess, which I often see written as Corpse Princess: Shikabane-Hime (which is redundant since that's literally the same thing, but in Japanese).

The Fury

2018-09-12, 11:17 PM

Also, what about some classic book titles, rather distant from their subject matter?
"To kill a mocking bird"? "Catcher in the Rye"?

I'm not sure that I agree that those in particular are distant from their subject matter. I supposed that I'd say that they relate to their subject matter in a way that's not immediately clear.

"To Kill a Mockingbird" as a line in the book refers to destroying something that's only trying to bring some measure of joy into the world. "...Remember it's a sin to kill a mockingbird." This thematically ties in to Tom Robinson's trial. Tom Robinson being a man that helped a young woman with her household chores because he felt sorry for her, and got accused of a crime he didn't commit for his trouble. As such it's a metaphor for the novel's plot that's not immediately obvious until you've read the book.

"Catcher In the Rye" as a title informs the protagonist more than the plot, (then again, this is a novel that's sort of light on plot.) In this case, "The catcher in the rye" refers to a line from a poem that Holden misremembers, (Phoebe corrects him.) Yet Holden sticks to his (mis)interpretation saying he wants to be "the catcher," that is someone who safeguards innocence. This fits his character perfectly, as Holden is the kind of guy that can never admit to being wrong, and is grasping blindly for meaning in a world that seems bent on denying him that satisfaction.

At least I think so. Someone better versed in American literature can probably correct me.

Eldan

2018-09-13, 02:51 AM

Well, technically "Attack on Titan" could mean an attack happening on Saturn's moon Titan, which is what I always thought that was about until I read a plot summary... :smallsmile:

Yeah. I remember reading that in an "upcoming Anime of the season" title and thinking "Ooh, are they making another big space opera? I liked Legend of Galactic Heroes!"
And then being really disappointed.

As for why we end up there, apparently the Japanese creatores sometimes want to do the translation themselves and then insist on what they think sounds cool.

Eldan

2018-09-13, 02:52 AM

You nailed it. JC:VH sounds like the most epic, amazing B-movie ever when you describe it. The basic plot (Jesus returns to Earth to stop a group of vampires from harvesting skin from lesbians so they can go out in the daylight, and recruits legendary Mexican wrestler El Santo to help) sounds awesome. A lot of the scenes (a car full of atheists challenging Jesus to a fight, God speaking to his son through a bowl of ice cream, and so on) sound like they will be hilarious.

Wait. He actually recruits El Santo for this? How could they screw this up!

Wraith

2018-09-13, 03:43 AM

Wait. He actually recruits El Santo for this? How could they screw this up!

In the credits he's not listed as El Santo; it's Santos, who just happens to be a luchador in a sparkly silver mask, and the "we're totally not violating copyright guidelines"-friendly version of the wrestling legend. That should tell you all you need to know about the role and the quality of the script, to be honest. :smalltongue:

It had a budget of ~$100,000CAD, in all fairness, so making fun of a cheap film for looking cheap is dishonest of me. It's just one of those things that was crying out for a semi-decent budget to make it a true cult classic.

Hunter Noventa

2018-09-13, 08:08 AM

Yora

2018-09-13, 02:32 PM

Shingeki no Kyojin literally translates to "Advance of the Giant(s)" or "Advancing Giant(s)". You can play around with the exact terms to get "Attacking Titans" or "Attack of the Titans", but there's no wriggle room with the gramar. It's just wrong.
Record of Lodoss War is at least containing the correct information, but nobody would phrase it like that in fluent English.

While not a terrible title in itself, I don't understand why they named the game "Dragon Age II"

Dragon Age: Origins
Dragon Age: Awakening
Dragon Age: The Stolen Throne
Dragon Age: The Calling
Dragon Age II
Dragon Age: Asunder
Dragon Age: Inquisition

Did they just forget the naming convention they had established?

Oh, this reminds me of a whole bunch of terrible titles:

Conan the Barbarian (2011)
The Thing (2011)
Thief (2014)
Doom (2016)
God of War (2018)

Don't do that. It's forbidden.

Lord Raziere

2018-09-13, 02:46 PM

I thought the exact same thing and was highly disappointed.

Me too. That was exactly what I thought, a sci-fi flick about an alien invasion upon a human colony of Titan and thought "sweet, alien invasion story of something thats NOT earth for once!" and that you'd get a bunch of setting stuff about what its like to live on Titan and why its so important to defend, and then its just grimdark fighting giants bull with absolutely no creativity put into anything. so disappointing.

Adderbane

2018-09-13, 05:54 PM

Any use of ": The Movie" is particularly bad in my opinion.

Descent: FreeSpace - The Great War (Conflict: FreeSpace – The Great War if you're in Europe) is another overly long title. Thankfully they left the sequel as FreeSpace 2

factotum

2018-09-13, 08:35 PM

While not a terrible title in itself, I don't understand why they named the game "Dragon Age II"

If only that were the only thing about that game where they didn't bother to put much thought into it... :smallbiggrin:

Rynjin

2018-09-13, 09:58 PM

While not a terrible title in itself, I don't understand why they named the game "Dragon Age II"

Dragon Age: Origins
Dragon Age: Awakening
Dragon Age: The Stolen Throne
Dragon Age: The Calling
Dragon Age II
Dragon Age: Asunder
Dragon Age: Inquisition

Did they just forget the naming convention they had established?

I mean, it's not like the convention was established at the time. Origins was a subtitle, yes, but Awakening, Stolen Throne, and The Calling aren't games...one is a DLC, and two are novels which would by necessity NEED a subtitle since they can't just be named "Dragon Age".

Dragon Age II is the second Dragon Age game. Simples.

Velaryon

2018-09-13, 11:06 PM

"Catcher In the Rye" as a title informs the protagonist more than the plot, (then again, this is a novel that's sort of light on plot.) In this case, "The catcher in the rye" refers to a line from a poem that Holden misremembers, (Phoebe corrects him.) Yet Holden sticks to his (mis)interpretation saying he wants to be "the catcher," that is someone who safeguards innocence. This fits his character perfectly, as Holden is the kind of guy that can never admit to being wrong, and is grasping blindly for meaning in a world that seems bent on denying him that satisfaction.

I more or less agree with that interpretation, but you make it sound about 10,000% less whiny than I remember it.

It had a budget of ~$100,000CAD, in all fairness, so making fun of a cheap film for looking cheap is dishonest of me. It's just one of those things that was crying out for a semi-decent budget to make it a true cult classic.

I know $100K isn't a big budget by any means, but what the heck did they spend it on? It sure as heck wasn't professional actors, quality equipment, or a good scriptwriter.

Kantaki

2018-09-13, 11:42 PM

I know $100K isn't a big budget by any means, but what the heck did they spend it on? It sure as heck wasn't professional actors, quality equipment, or a good scriptwriter.

Booze?:smallbiggrin::smalltongue:

Chromascope3D

2018-09-14, 12:50 AM

Bubblegum Crisis always stuck in my memory when I saw it in a full page ad alongside NGE and GitS as a kid. So much so that later on I specifically had to seek it out to satisfy my curiosity. I liked all the 80s OVAs but I couldn't make it past the first few episodes of the 2000s reboot (which, ironically, is what the page had been advertising). However, I did get to find out what the title was referring to...

...Absolutely nothing. It just sounded cool.

Eldan

2018-09-14, 02:17 AM

I more or less agree with that interpretation, but you make it sound about 10,000% less whiny than I remember it.

I know $100K isn't a big budget by any means, but what the heck did they spend it on? It sure as heck wasn't professional actors, quality equipment, or a good scriptwriter.

Well, you have to consider that even semi-professional movie cameras cost a few thousand. (A professional studio film camera can cost hundreds of thousands by itself.) Plus audio equipment. Then, even for a student project, you need a few dozen people. I've been part of some. Absolute minimum for a student film, say, 3 actors, a director, 2 people on sound, 2 people on camera, 2-3 people on lighting, a general gofer or two, someone on makeup who can maybe also double up on costumes... in a student project, the director, sound guy or camera man can also take editing, but then it will take ages. 100k is really gone in no time.

And yeah, speaking of booze, catering. Even if you don't pay your guys, 100 bucks for pizza and coffee a day for a month comes in at 3'000.

AliceKCunningha

2018-09-14, 04:20 AM

Hi. I am a freelancer. I work on the big project for the website now. Help me write my paper. I write interesting article, about horror films with the bad name. Who knows such movies?

Wraith

2018-09-14, 04:40 AM

And yeah, speaking of booze, catering. Even if you don't pay your guys, 100 bucks for pizza and coffee a day for a month comes in at 30'000.

Not to mention, it was filmed on location in Ottowa, Canada - most cities charge exorbitant fees in order to film on locations, more so in public places, and then you have to pay insurance for 20+ people to do so. I can only imagine how much of a mark-up that cost would get since it was from a large, world-renown city.

...Assuming they bothered with such petty things of course, and didn't just load everything into a minivan and head down the local park & rec area without telling anyone... which by the looks of things they might well have done....

Anyways, here's another film which has managed to worm it's way into my brain, for reasons that I'm not too sure about: The Adventures of Buckaroo Banzai Across the 8th Dimension! How's THAT for a title?

It stars RoboCop (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Weller) as a rock star/racing driver/genius inventor/PhD physicist/premiere neurosurgeon/gentleman adventurer who invents a car that can drive so fast that it can travel through dimensions, and in doing so discovers a race of lizard-aliens who are plotting to body-snatch just enough of humanity in order to enact an invasion. Despite sounding - and being - utterly ridiculous, it has a surprisingly impressive cast, including the Kurgan (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clancy_Brown), Dr. Malcolm (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeff_Goldblum), Doc Brown (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christopher_Lloyd) and creepy Gestapo guy (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ronald_Lacey) from Raiders of the Lost Ark as President of the United States.

Just... wow. It's awful, but in that extremely silly way that makes it utterly engrossing.

snowblizz

2018-09-14, 06:31 AM

Not to mention, it was filmed on location in Ottowa, Canada - most cities charge exorbitant fees in order to film on locations, more so in public places, and then you have to pay insurance for 20+ people to do so. I can only imagine how much of a mark-up that cost would get since it was from a large, world-renown city.

Actually most cities tend to be more accomodating than exorbiant these days.

Consider that spectacular blockbusters (ie wellfunded movies) film "New York" in Canada (Toronto I think?) because they can do it more cheaply. It looks close enough but you don't have to deal with actual New York.

It's also quite common to get kickbacks on filming from cities, states/provinses/countries due to the economic side-effects of filming. E.g. financial support on the cost spent locally.

Ninja_Prawn

2018-09-14, 07:37 AM

Any use of ": The Movie" is particularly bad in my opinion.

With the obvious exception of Aqua Teen Hunger Force Colon Movie Film for Theaters. It's the perfect title for that film.

McNum

2018-09-14, 08:02 AM

SirKazum

2018-09-14, 10:18 AM

Anyways, here's another film which has managed to worm it's way into my brain, for reasons that I'm not too sure about: The Adventures of Buckaroo Banzai Across the 8th Dimension! How's THAT for a title?

It stars RoboCop (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Weller) as a rock star/racing driver/genius inventor/PhD physicist/premiere neurosurgeon/gentleman adventurer who invents a car that can drive so fast that it can travel through dimensions, and in doing so discovers a race of lizard-aliens who are plotting to body-snatch just enough of humanity in order to enact an invasion. Despite sounding - and being - utterly ridiculous, it has a surprisingly impressive cast, including the Kurgan (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clancy_Brown), Dr. Malcolm (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeff_Goldblum), Doc Brown (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christopher_Lloyd) and creepy Gestapo guy (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ronald_Lacey) from Raiders of the Lost Ark as President of the United States.

Just... wow. It's awful, but in that extremely silly way that makes it utterly engrossing.

Are you kidding? It's a movie where all said lizard-aliens are named John (regardless of gender), including John Bigboote (it's big boo-TAY!!).

...yeah, it's awful, but it knows it, and it's real fun :smallbiggrin:

Reminds me of the Dark Forces series of Star Wars games which have the best naming convention ever.

Star Wars: Dark Forces
Star Wars: Dark Forces 2: Jedi Knight
Star Wars: Jedi Knight 2: Jedi Outcast
Star Wars: Jedi Outcast 2: Jedi Academy

So basically the last game is "Star Wars: Dark Forces 4: Jedi Knight 3: Jedi Outcast 2: Jedi Academy"

Well, each game is the sequel to the last, right? Makes sense, in an insane kind of way. At least it's consistent.

Hunter Noventa

2018-09-14, 10:25 AM

Actually most cities tend to be more accomodating than exorbiant these days.

Consider that spectacular blockbusters (ie wellfunded movies) film "New York" in Canada (Toronto I think?) because they can do it more cheaply. It looks close enough but you don't have to deal with actual New York.

It's also quite common to get kickbacks on filming from cities, states/provinses/countries due to the economic side-effects of filming. E.g. financial support on the cost spent locally.

I remember, I think it was Spider Man 2 (the second Spiderman 2, not the Raimi one with Doc Ock) filmed in my city, despite us being nowhere near the size or scope of new york. I remember an Oscorp van being parked outside the building I worked in at the time. It was a huge pain for a lot of us and almost certainly wasn't worth it overall.

veti

2018-09-14, 05:25 PM

So basically the last game is "Star Wars: Dark Forces 4: Jedi Knight 3: Jedi Outcast 2: Jedi Academy"

Any title with a colon in is a strong indicator of bankruptcy in the imagination department. Four colons in one title? - suggests "strictly for people who think the prequel was robbed at awards time".

TeChameleon

2018-09-14, 11:12 PM

Any title with a colon in is a strong indicator of bankruptcy in the imagination department. Four colons in one title? - suggests "strictly for people who think the prequel was robbed at awards time".

And yet, ironically, it is by all appearances a pretty good game (haven't managed to play it yet myself- actually bought it at a thrift store not long ago... and discovered the installation disc was missing :smallannoyed:)

As for titles? Hmm I'd say some good ones were

Escape from New York is pretty good as titles go- it neatly encapsulates the driving thrust of the movie and is slightly intriguing- why, exactly, would you want to escape from New York? Well, aside from the obvious reason of not wanting to be in New York anymore, which would be a bit tougher to make an entertaining movie about and probably wouldn't star Kurt Russell.

I Have No Mouth, and I Must Scream (Harlan Ellison)- mouthlessness and wanting to scream are not necessarily the entire focus of the plot (although it's definitely a factor), but the title grabs your attention rather well, I'd say.

On the other end, a title that I am tremendously fond of, but really doesn't relate well to the plot, would be Under a Killing Moon (A Tex Murphy adventure game). On the one hand, a title like that pretty much oozes Noir, and the game is certainly that. On the other hand, it doesn't do much to indicate the presence of the flying cars, oppressed underclass of mutants, and ray-gun battles that Buck Rogers would probably be more comfortable with than Sam Spade would.

Yora

2018-09-15, 04:49 AM

A great title makes you really curious what kind of story could possibly be described accurately by that name.

It makes people want to get a short description of it, which is your foot in the door to get an audience. And as a reader, viewer, and player I also like them because it makes me aware of something I could find interesting that would otherwise have disapppeared in a vast pile of bland mediocracy that comes out every day.

Kato

2018-09-15, 07:11 AM

I Have No Mouth, and I Must Scream (Harlan Ellison)- mouthlessness and wanting to scream are not necessarily the entire focus of the plot (although it's definitely a factor), but the title grabs your attention rather well, I'd say.

I'd say while it's not immediately apparent I'd say the title fits the story quite well, on the one hand the ending, at the other as is touched upon, AM's entire existence.

Also, after having it explained to me, retracting my previous complaint about Mockingjay and Catcher :smallredface:

Prime32

2018-09-15, 01:59 PM

Shingeki no Kyojin literally translates to "Advance of the Giant(s)" or "Advancing Giant(s)". You can play around with the exact terms to get "Attacking Titans" or "Attack of the Titans", but there's no wriggle room with the gramar. It's just wrong.
And then later in the story it turns out that "Shingeki no Kyojin" is the proper name of the story's most prominent Titan, so "The Attack Titan" or "The Vanguard Titan" also work.

Ebon_Drake

2018-09-15, 04:33 PM

Thief (2014)...
For some reason, I had it in mind that this was styled as "Thi4f". After a bit of googling it looks like that wasn't actually the final branding for it, but in any case sticking numbers in the middle of titles is something I'm not at all keen on. Se7en at least sort of works as a leetspeak thing, but Fant4stic is just awful (although I guess that means it suits the movie?).

On a similar note, bands using dodgy spellings to make them easier to search online, like Chvrches and Pvris. I insist on pronouncing them as-written because I'm a cantankerous old git.

Rynjin

2018-09-15, 08:24 PM

On a similar note, bands using dodgy spellings to make them easier to search online, like Chvrches and Pvris. I insist on pronouncing them as-written because I'm a cantankerous old git.

I mean, not old enough, considering that is how V would be used in Old English.

JCarter426

2018-09-15, 09:46 PM

"A Place Further than the Universe" (amazing beautiful show, but still)
That one at least makes more sense in Japanese. A more literal translation would be "sky" rather than "universe" and it's a reference to the lateral distance between Japan and Antarctica being greater than the vertical distance from Japan to space. And I think once the meaning is clear it's a decent title.

It's not exactly fair to throw anime into the mix, though....

I find that the original Japanese episode titles for anime are often just a description of what happens in the episode, which is quite odd to Western ears. They generally get renamed for Western consumption.
Like the title of one episode of I think it was Railgun is an explanation for why one-piece swimsuits only suit slender girls.

Had they just called it "John Carter of Mars" it would give at least a vague hint of the content.

Just having a person's name isn't a great choice for a movie title to begin with, but if your film is sci fi, fantasy, or some flavor thereof, you need to put something in the title that suggests that.

Why name a movie "John Carter" when the character's days of fame were almost a century ago and only a few fans of obscure early sci-fi know it? Especially when you could use the more recognizable version of his name that is "John Carter of Mars". Now that's a title that is already much more interesting.
Maybe they realized the film would bomb and were leaving the door open for a future adaptation to say "No, not that John Carter... this is John Carter of Mars."

To add some bad titles to the mix...

It's not the worst title ever, but the director of The Wrath of Khan hated that and incidentally its original title The Undiscovered Country made much more sense for that movie than for Star Trek VI.

But it's hard to beat 2 Fast 2 Furious.

factotum

2018-09-16, 01:39 AM

It's not the worst title ever, but the director of The Wrath of Khan hated that and incidentally its original title The Undiscovered Country made much more sense for that movie than for Star Trek VI.

How does "The Wrath of Khan" not suit a movie whose entire plot revolves around Khan trying to get revenge against James Kirk for abandoning him 20-odd years ago? And why does "The Undiscovered Country" make *more* sense, to your mind? I'm not seeing it.

Ebon_Drake

2018-09-16, 05:40 AM

I mean, not old enough, considering that is how V would be used in Old English.

Isn't that more a Latin thing? In Middle English it was more a case of using an irritating Romanesque font in titles that uses V for both u and v (for example (https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a1/Leviathan_by_Thomas_Hobbes.jpg)). I could possibly see that argument for Chvrches, but when was Paris ever spelt with a v?

Thinking more about the Thief games, that's another game series with an odd aversion to counting above 2. We have:
Thief: The Dark Project (good title)
Thief 2: The Metal Age (also pretty good)
Thief: Deadly Shadows (another good title, but why not call it Thief 3?)
Thief (2014)/Thi4f (get outta here ya clown)

Rodin

2018-09-16, 12:26 PM

3 pages and no Breakin' 2: Electric Boogaloo? For shame.

Heck, it even named the badly named sequels page on TVTropes.

JCarter426

2018-09-16, 01:19 PM

How does "The Wrath of Khan" not suit a movie whose entire plot revolves around Khan trying to get revenge against James Kirk for abandoning him 20-odd years ago? And why does "The Undiscovered Country" make *more* sense, to your mind? I'm not seeing it.
I said it was like that in Nicholas Meyer's mind. But I do think it's more poignant. The plot is about Khan in that he's the bad guy doing all the bad things, but "The Wrath of Khan" only says that he's the bad guy and doesn't speak to rest of the story's contents. It sounds more like an action film in the way that Bond films are often named after the bad guy (Dr No, Goldfinger, The Man with the Golden Gun, etc). "The Undiscovered Country" is a reference to Hamlet when he's talking about death in the "to be or not to be" soliloquy and the whole film is about the characters facing death amidst Khan's literary references.

Meanwhile, the actual Undiscovered Country, Star Trek VI, doesn't have any of those things. It's about Kirk breaking out of space prison.

Kato

2018-09-16, 01:42 PM

Meanwhile, the actual Undiscovered Country, Star Trek VI, doesn't have any of those things. It's about Kirk breaking out of space prison.

I always guessed it was referencing the peace with the Klingons as the new country that Kirk (mostly) has problems getting used to. Most other Star Trek titles are more direct, though.

JCarter426

2018-09-16, 01:59 PM

Yeah, maybe, but that makes it somewhat of an appropriated metaphor. In the original context, Hamlet's specifically talking about death. It doesn't suit VI nearly as much as it would suit II.

GloatingSwine

2018-09-16, 02:16 PM

Rodin

2018-09-16, 02:45 PM

Yeah, maybe, but that makes it somewhat of an appropriated metaphor. In the original context, Hamlet's specifically talking about death. It doesn't suit VI nearly as much as it would suit II.

It makes a lot more sense when you consider that Star Trek VI is basically an analogue for the end of the Cold War - which the Federation/Klingon conflict was directly referencing throughout the show. The Undiscovered Country is moving into a more peaceful time. It's also a metaphor for the retirement of the characters (and by extension, the actors). There's lots of meaning to it, there just isn't the same specific meaning that Shakespeare was using. Unsurprising, since most movie-going audiences wouldn't get the reference.

Kitten Champion

2018-09-16, 02:53 PM

I always guessed it was referencing the peace with the Klingons as the new country that Kirk (mostly) has problems getting used to. Most other Star Trek titles are more direct, though.

It's a Hamlet quote about... death, I believe. I think it's pretty clever - and pretty Star Trek - to change its meaning to be about the post-Cold War future. I would put it as the best title honestly, whereas Star Trek Into Darkness is my least favourite as it blurs insipid wordplay mixed with trying too hard to be cool/not your father's Star Trek.

DARRKNESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS

As to the topic, I think the worst titles are the ones that I can't remember. I mean, objectively speaking. There are DVD I have in my disc folders where it's just the title written all shiny-like and have genuinely no idea what the movie it describes is without Googling.

Edge of Tomorrow - a movie I personally love though it was a financial flop - had sufficient issues with that title that their marketing changed it with the home media release to Live, Die, Repeat. They kept the Edge of Tomorrow there too, in case you weren't confused. While I don't think Edge of Tomorrow is a bad title aesthetically speaking, it does sound like an early 80's soap opera title you've never heard of. Still, it is a case where the studio clearly believed it lost money because of the film's name.

I still firmly believe they should have just called it All You Need is Kill.

Rodin

2018-09-16, 02:59 PM

Edge of Tomorrow - a movie I personally love though it was a financial flop - had sufficient issues with that title that their marketing changed it with the home media release to Live, Die, Repeat. They kept the Edge of Tomorrow there too, in case you weren't confused. While I don't think Edge of Tomorrow is a bad title aesthetically speaking, it does sound like an early 80's soap opera title you've never heard of. Still, it is a case where the studio clearly believed it lost money because of the film's name.

I still firmly believe they should have just called it All You Need is Kill.

I'd say the biggest problem Edge of Tomorrow has is that it gives no clue what the film is about. Heck, I don't even think the trailers did a good job because the film passed me by entirely until I heard the buzz and picked it up afterwards. For audiences, it just looked like another Oblivion.

Of course, the changed title does give away the twist, and it's clear that the filmmakers wanted it to be a surprise.

GloatingSwine

2018-09-16, 03:04 PM

DARRKNESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS

Now that the Dark Souls series is over, I think we can safely have a moratorium on the word "Dark" in the title of things.

Like a decade or so. Fifteen years maybe.

Then they have it back.

Kitten Champion

2018-09-16, 03:22 PM

I'd say the biggest problem Edge of Tomorrow has is that it gives no clue what the film is about. Heck, I don't even think the trailers did a good job because the film passed me by entirely until I heard the buzz and picked it up afterwards. For audiences, it just looked like another Oblivion.

Of course, the changed title does give away the twist, and it's clear that the filmmakers wanted it to be a surprise.

Kinda. The trailer (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vw61gCePictures2oqI&ab_channel=WarnerBros.) does show Tom Cruise dying several times and waking up, and kind of explaining the premise. It even flashes "LIVE", "DIE", "REPEAT" several times.

The second official trailer (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yUmSVcttXnI&ab_channel=WarnerBros.Pictures) explains his death and return pretty clearly however.

What wasn't clear is much of the context beyond that. The Mimics and the war are nearly completely undefined, for instance. Also it's a really gloomy trailer - both of 'em - and Edge of Tomorrow is actually pretty funny in a dark gallows humour kind of way. They were leaning pretty heavy into this being a Tom Cruise movie as their chief marketing tool, that the trailers make clear.