2d6+6: Viable for rolling stats?

[Damon_Tor]

My group typically rolls 3d6, reroll the lowest for each stat. This works fine, but it takes a while to get everyone rolled, and it can result in scores that are too low. At one point I thought maybe it would be fun to have players at the table roleplaying characters of Int 5 or Cha 4 or whatever, but having done so on a few occasions I've changed by mind on that front. It's often just annoying and/or offensive.

To address both concerns, I've decided to simply give everyone a free 6, so the stat roll is 2d6+6. This means no score can be lower than 8. 1/36 stats rolled this way will be an 18. Seems okay to me.

Has anyone rolled stats this way before? Does it result in characters without weaknesses? Too uniform?

[ciarannihill]

My group typically rolls 3d6, reroll the lowest for each stat. This works fine, but it takes a while to get everyone rolled, and it can result in scores that are too low. At one point I thought maybe it would be fun to have players at the table roleplaying characters of Int 5 or Cha 4 or whatever, but having done so on a few occasions I've changed by mind on that front. It's often just annoying and/or offensive.

To address both concerns, I've decided to simply give everyone a free 6, so the stat roll is 2d6+6. This means no score can be lower than 8. 1/36 stats rolled this way will be an 18. Seems okay to me.

Has anyone rolled stats this way before? Does it result in characters without weaknesses? Too uniform?

I would say if you want to do this, which is totally acceptable, allow it for 1-2 stats only, allow for the lower average for non-core stats. Low attributes can make for super fun roleplay moments that you don't want to miss out on.

[Sigreid]

I've done it and it's fine. Abilities will trend slightly higher but not game breakingly so. And they are supposed to be exceptional, one could even say mythic level heroes after all.

[Beastrolami]

For 5e, I usually roll 1d8+7 for random stats. That way your stat line is still balanced to the 5e character creation rules. If you want characters to be more or less powerful give advantage or disadvantage on the 1d8 rolls (roll 2d8 take higher/lower of the two).

In a point buy system your each stat can range from 8-15, so 1d8 +7 will keep you in those parameters.

[DarkKnightJin]

I've done it and it's fine. Abilities will trend slightly higher but not game breakingly so. And they are supposed to be exceptional, one could even say mythic level heroes after all.

I've done this for my Dragonborn Death Cleric.
The other party members did as well. We have some negative modifiers still.

It's fine. It's the same as 3d6, except you have a built-in basement of 8.
It will give a bit of randomness that point buy doesn't have, while still making sure you won't be super awful at any ability checks.

[McSkrag]

Yeah I think that is fine in terms of balance.

Personally I prefer to use the point buy system since it is balanced and let's players customize their stats for the kind of character they want to play.

But you should do whatever is most fun for your game.

[Keravath]

I think 2d6+6 will generate mostly reasonable characters. The average score is 13 for each stat this way.

Personally, I've found rolling just 3d6 to be much too limiting. In general, my take on things is that adventurers are typically "heroic" representing the small fraction of folks who go off and adventure rather than farm or take up a trade. Long term survival while adventuring generally requires above average capabilities over the long term (the leveling process often doesn't represent the "long" term if you think about how long each adventure or module usually takes). In addition, as you commented, having particularly low stats in specific stats often leads to quite offensive and stereotypical roleplaying which I usually find it better to avoid.

However, the biggest issue I find with rolled stats is the variation between players. When you start a game and one player rolls exceptionally well while another does not ... one player ends up with a character that is fun to play no matter what they choose to do while the other has a character that will struggle to keep up throughout the entire campaign. A character starting with an 18 in a primary stat can take feats and otherwise increase the power of their character in ways that a character with a 14 in their primary stat will never be able to do. Maybe your table is fine with that and considers it the luck of the draw but I've played in games with large discrepancies between rolled stats and they generally weren't the most pleasant or enjoyable over the longer term (fine for a one shot though).

Anyway, that's why I have generally become a convert to the point buy system at the moment (though the character stats can wind up a little cookie cutter as a result).

[MaxWilson]

However, the biggest issue I find with rolled stats is the variation between players. When you start a game and one player rolls exceptionally well while another does not ... one player ends up with a character that is fun to play no matter what they choose to do while the other has a character that will struggle to keep up throughout the entire campaign. A character starting with an 18 in a primary stat can take feats and otherwise increase the power of their character in ways that a character with a 14 in their primary stat will never be able to do.

I never understood this perspective. If one player rolls 18 17 18 14 12 16 and the other player rolls 12 14 10 8 7 13, maybe one player winds up a Warbearian (Barbarian 1-3, Fiend Pact Bladelock 1-17) or a monklock and the other winds up a Mobile Sentinel Prodigy (Athletics) Moon Druid 1-20 or a Valentinian (Dex-based Defensive Duelist Sharpshooter Mobile Cavalier 1-11, Diviner 1-9), but they're both going to contribute to the party in their own unique ways and they're both going to have fun. Sure, the Valentinian doesn't have the stats to make a good Warbearian, but the Warbearian can't be a Warbearian and a Valentinian anyway, and Valentinians are pretty SAD so it would be a waste of a good stat array to just make two Valentinians. (And the Valentinian's player may be the one to roll up awesome stats next time, so he'll get to play a monklock or roguesinger or paladorlock eventually.)

Bottom line is that an extra PC always brings something to the table if the player has any clue at all what he's doing. Class abilities count more than stats.

[ad_hoc]

Point buy is the way to go with 5e.

That said, if you want random stats then using playing cards works well.

[Keravath]

Point buy is the way to go with 5e.

That said, if you want random stats then using playing cards works well.

How does the playing card scheme work for stats? A quick try at google didn't turn up what I was looking for since there are too many decks of cards in D&D :)

Edit: Further googling found a reference :) ... seems like a cool way to do stats that offers both variation and consistency across players.

Here is a link to the reference I found ...

http://www.enworld.org/forum/showthread.php?597176-Compilation-of-Alternate-Ability-Score-Generation-Methods

[Louro]

Old school 4d6, drop one, also works fine.
Allocate at players discretion.

If allocated by order allow one reroll.

[Oramac]

The one I've done a couple times that works well is a Grid Type.

Basically, roll whatever you like (4d6, 3d6, 2d6+6, whatever). Do this 6 times and arrange them as a 6x6 grid. Players then get to choose either a line or column to use for their stats.

[GlenSmash!]

The more I play (and DM) the more I've found that any system that is agreed upon by the table will work for generating stats.

This includes "Come with whatever stats you want".

Edit-Forgot to add: So yeah, 2d^+6 is perfectly fine.

[Laserlight]

I've done 2d6+6 at least once. Worked okay except one guy got a string of mediocre numbers-- something like 13 12 12 12 12 11--so I told him to reroll if he wanted to.

[Aimeryan]

Do wonder what d6+9 would play out like - max 15, min 10, average 12.5. Would get fairly close scores for most characters while still being a little more random than pointbuy.

[Man_Over_Game]

Do wonder what d6+9 would play out like - max 15, min 10, average 12.5. Would get fairly close scores for most characters while still being a little more random than pointbuy.

I'd try d8 + 8. Same average, but adds a bit more swinginess (between 9 and 16).

Or d10 + 7 will be super swingy (between 8 and 17).

Our DM had us reroll all of our stats if the sum of your modifiers was below a certain threshold, which could work really well with this kind of swingy system.

+5, I think is what he wanted, which is the equivalent of 12, 12, 12, 12, 12, 10.

Or 18, 18, 10, 8, 8, 8.

[VincentTakeda]

D8+10. maximum swingy, range of 11 to 18. Plenty generous.

[PhantomSoul]

D8+10. maximum swingy, range of 11 to 18. Plenty generous.

Maximum swingy is what 1d20 is for!

[Man_Over_Game]

Maximum swingy is what 1d20 is for!

Average score of 10.5, too boring.

I say as I roll a 1 on my intelligence score, forget how to breathe and die.

[Keravath]

I never understood this perspective. If one player rolls 18 17 18 14 12 16 and the other player rolls 12 14 10 8 7 13, maybe one player winds up a Warbearian (Barbarian 1-3, Fiend Pact Bladelock 1-17) or a monklock and the other winds up a Mobile Sentinel Prodigy (Athletics) Moon Druid 1-20 or a Valentinian (Dex-based Defensive Duelist Sharpshooter Mobile Cavalier 1-11, Diviner 1-9), but they're both going to contribute to the party in their own unique ways and they're both going to have fun. Sure, the Valentinian doesn't have the stats to make a good Warbearian, but the Warbearian can't be a Warbearian and a Valentinian anyway, and Valentinians are pretty SAD so it would be a waste of a good stat array to just make two Valentinians. (And the Valentinian's player may be the one to roll up awesome stats next time, so he'll get to play a monklock or roguesinger or paladorlock eventually.)

Bottom line is that an extra PC always brings something to the table if the player has any clue at all what he's doing. Class abilities count more than stats.

Any PC brings something to the table. 5e is actually a bit better with this than earlier editions so that in many cases you don't absolutely need the best numbers. However, I don't think there is any denying that higher numbers are better ... and the character with the higher numbers will perform better in any role. They will have higher to hit, higher saves, higher DC, more hit points and although they will both contribute and bring something to the table ... the character with lower stats just doesn't bring as much.

No matter which class the first set of numbers chooses, their saving throws will average +2 to +3 higher (the differences in the specific numbers you cite are +2, +1, +4, +3, +3, +2). In the first case, their primary stats both start at 18 which is a +4 modifier, in the second case, their primary stats start at +2 and +1.

This means that the first character will hit 10% more often when attacking, if they are a paladin, ranger or similar then their DCs will be 3 higher as well. Alternatively, they will typically have more hit points. The first character will more frequently make concentration saves. In general, no matter which classes the players choose the first set of number will be BETTER, usually much better over the long term.

I've played both ends of this ... being both the one rolling the over-achiever and the one rolling at the other end (though this was in earlier editions where it perhaps mattered more) and the numbers made a significant difference in the options available to the character, what they could do in game, how they could interact and roleplay, what skills they could use.

In your example, the character with the better numbers will be at least decent at all skills, even ones they aren't proficient at, they can have high social skills even when choosing a class or other option for which charisma is usually a dump stat. Basically, they will be better at anything they decide to try in the game ... perception, investigation, insight, persuasion, deception, tool checks ... the lower numbers can try all these things but they can also expect to fail at them far more frequently than the character with the better numbers ... that is simple math.

Is the character playable sure. Can they contribute to a party. Yes. Will it be as much fun in a group where the character with the better numbers can try whatever they like in terms of role-playing or combat with a much better chance of success? Probably not. That's all I am saying, in my opinion, completely uneven sets of numbers are creating a situation where one player is more likely, in my experience, to not have as enjoyable a time playing, especially over the long run.

P.S. You mention that next time the player might roll better ... that really only makes sense for short games or one-offs. I am currently playing in a ToA run that is up to 23 sessions once every 2 weeks ... this makes me glad we used point buy rather than rolling since in my case the "next time" might be once every two years.

[OutOfThyme]

I always have my players pick from the same array. Typically this means 4d6b3r1 done by each person. If it's below the standard array sum, I bump numbers up. This way they get nice stats, but everyone has a similar spread in attributes.

[obliza]

I can't post links but here is the details.

You increase the average stat from

3d6 = 10.5
4d6 = 12.24
4d6 Reroll 1s = 13.43
2d6+6 Reroll 1s = 14

a 24% chance of getting a 16 or higher when you run it 6 times is usually going to result in some very good stats.

[KorvinStarmast]

Your question reads as follows.

"the game has an easy to understand system for generating ability scores. I want to do something different that results in a higher average score."

Answer: do whatever makes your table happy. This isn't worth losing sleep over.

[CTurbo]

I've tried dozens of stat rolling methods. 2d6+6 works just fine. I like 3d6+5 drop lowest too. I do NOT like rerolling 1s. I DO have everybody roll and anybody can choose anybody's roll.