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Particle_Man
2018-09-14, 03:03 PM
I was thinking of a Swordsage/Cleric/Ruby Knight Vindicator, and was wondering how to Tier it, depending on levels.

It would seem that a SS 1/Cleric 4/RBV 10/Cleric 5 (for example), would likely be Tier 1 (at least soon after character level 1), because its almost full of cleric caster levels.

What about SS4/Cleric 1/RBV 10/SS 5? There are only 9 caster levels of Cleric, but Cleric is a Tier 1 class. Where would you put this character, Tier-wise? Would it vary with the character level?

A_S
2018-09-14, 03:17 PM
The tier system isn't well-defined for multiclass characters, so there's no "correct" answer about this.

However, if you're using "tier" as a fuzzy proxy for "about how powerful/flexible a character is," which I assume is what you're asking about, my rules of thumb are:


Take a look at your highest tier class. If you spend most of your career getting most of the important class features of that class (for instance, if your highest-tier class is Cleric, and for most of your career you're at most 1 spell level behind single-classed Cleric spellcasting), then that's your tier. So, I agree that your first example character is a tier 1 character.
If you're significantly behind the curve on the progression of your highest-tier class' features (e.g., your second example build, which is always at least 2 spell levels, and eventually as much as 4 spell levels, behind the curve of Cleric casting), drop it a level on the "power" scale. Note that the tier system isn't a strict stack ranking (tier 2 isn't "tier 1 but less so", it's "as strong as tier 1 but not as flexible"), so dropping a tier this way from tier 1 puts you in tier 3, which is where I'd place your second example build.
If you have some important synergy which makes your character much stronger than their individual classes would suggest, bump your estimate up one tier, to a maximum of tier 3 (synergistic character building can't generally put you into tier 1-2, which are less determined by how good your build is, and more by "are you a full caster?").
If your progression varies a whole lot over the course of your career (e.g., Mystic Ranger, whose spellcasting is on the Sorcerer schedule for the first 10 levels and then just stops progressing after that), then it's probably useful to say something like "acts like tier 1 for the first 10 levels, then falls off into tier 3 after that."

Kayblis
2018-09-14, 04:48 PM
It's not a hard science. The Tier system is more of a general guideline, and the tiers themselves have a lot of variation even when accounting for different subsystems each class uses.

As a starting point, look at your base class. That's the class around which your character is built, be it his main trick or his preferred subsystem. In the cases cited, RKV is a double progression class, so the other classes define your character more. The first example has 17 levels of Cleric casting and use maneuvers as a filler to round up the character - it's a Tier 1 that trades a bit of spellcasting for some nice all-day tricks. The second example though has 19 levels of initiator and 9 spellcasting levels, so it's clear he's using spells as an extra to his maneuvers. He's a Tier 3 character with some extra utility.