Animate Dead + Help Action = Permanant Advantage?

[Damon_Tor]

So let's say I have an archer bard, likes to use that Swift Quiver spell so he's making 4 attacks every turn. Is there a reason I can't be using Animate Dead to generate advantage for myself?

So let's say I've got 4 skeletons. The MM says they can perform complex operations like fire a catapult as a team, something that requires timing and coordination. So is there a reason the skeletons can't be ordered to ready actions to take the "Help" command in the following sequence:

On the skeleton's turn:
Skeleton One uses "Help" on the target, giving me advantage on my next attack. Straightforward enough. Note he
Skeleton Two readies an action with the trigger "Master completes his first attack on the target" and the readied action is, again, "help" with the same parameters.
Skeleton Three readies an action with the trigger "Master completes his second attack on the target" and the readied action is "help".
Skeleton Four readies an action with the trigger "Master completes his third attack on the target" and the readied action is "help".

Any additional skeletons would be tasked with grappling the target to keep it from moving away from skeletons 1-4.

The skeletons would be trained ahead of time to do this, so they could respond to something simple like "Attack pattern alpha, enemy wizard on the dias!" at the start of combat.

Then on my turn I use my bonus action to make two attacks with my bow, and my standard action to make another two attacks.

(And yes, I know there are much better ways for a bard to get advantage using a level 3+ spell slot.)

[nickl_2000]

I don't see why that couldn't be done, although as a DM I would drop those skeletons pretty quickly if they started doing it all the time.

And if you are going to do it, you may as well be a half-elf with Elven Accuracy.

[Damon_Tor]

And if you are going to do it, you may as well be a half-elf with Elven Accuracy.

Naturally.

[Corran]

Since the undead would need to be 5' of the enemy that you target in order to help you, it would probably be better to aim for zombies rather than skeletons, since zombies are a bit more tanky. That said, zombies are dummer than skeletons, so make sure the DM allows them to perform such a coordinated task. Of course, another way to go about this would be to use zombies that try to grapple and then restrain your enemies. It will take longer for them to give you advantage, but you and your party would enjoy the rest of the benefits that the restrained condition imposes on the enemies (no move, disadvantage on their attacks and disadvantage on their dex saves).

[Damon_Tor]

Of course, another way to go about this would be to use zombies that try to grapple and then restrain your enemies. It will take longer for them to give you advantage, but you and your party would enjoy the rest of the benefits that the restrained condition imposes on the enemies (no move, disadvantage on their attacks and disadvantage on their dex saves).

How exactly does this work? Turning a grapple into a restrain with a second grapple is only possible with a particular feat. A feat zombies don't have. Unless I'm missing something?

[Corran]

How exactly does this work? Turning a grapple into a restrain with a second grapple is only possible with a particular feat. A feat zombies don't have. Unless I'm missing something?
Hmm, you are right, I thought anyone could do it but you do need a feat (or another feature that would let you do that).

[nickl_2000]

Hmm, you are right, I thought anyone could do it but you do need a feat (or another feature that would let you do that).

I think you are confusing the restrained condition with the prone condition. Skeleton most certainly can have 1 grapple, then the next shove prone, then the rest grapple. This is very effective with melee people. The only reason I didn't mentioned it is that is would have the opposite effect with an archer.

[JNAProductions]

It works... Until the skeletons get punched in the face by an Ogre who's annoyed with them.

Undead are powerful in 5E, thanks to numbers, but aren't individually very tough.

[Dalebert]

It works... Until the skeletons get punched in the face by an Ogre who's annoyed with them.

Undead are powerful in 5E, thanks to numbers, but aren't individually very tough.

It's a feature; not a bug. They can be trivially resurrected with a 3rd level slot. Those are hits your party didn't take.

[JackPhoenix]

It's a feature; not a bug. They can be trivially resurrected with a 3rd level slot. Those are hits your party didn't take.

The same slot you've already expended to keep them in control, and you'll need to find new corpses, as Animate Dead only works on humanoid corpses, not undead corpses.

[Damon_Tor]

That said, zombies are dummer than skeletons, so make sure the DM allows them to perform such a coordinated task.

That's why I'd want skeletons for this. The MM is explicit about skeletons being able to perform complex tasks involving timing and coordination.

Skeletons are also generally less objectionable than zombies. The hygiene issues inherent to zombies are difficult to overlook. If the skeletons become important to the build I'll look into a wizard dip for the necromancy school, to buff their HP a bit, and the fabricate spell could be handy to create some custom armor for them. Armor meant to fit a living person is bound to fit a skeleton terribly, it's always going to look "off". Custom fitting armor to the skeletons, armor which obscures their features, would go a long way towards reducing the negative social impact of necromancy. And of course it will help their longevity in combat.

[Damon_Tor]

Animate Dead only works on humanoid corpses, not undead corpses.

Skeletons don't require a corpse at all. They require a pile of bones.

[lperkins2]

The biggest issue I see, RAW, is you need a high dex to hit and do much damage with a swift-quiver build, and a low dex to have your skeletons ready to help. There is no delay in 5e, so if you come up in the initiative order before your skeletons (which you usually will), you're out of luck.

There's a couple solutions, the first is to have more skeletons, increasing the odds of at least some of them getting in front of you to ready help. The other is they will be able to help starting on round 2, meaning you'll just lose out on advantage on the first round. If your average fight is 3 rounds, that's not all that great, you'll only get advantage 2/3 of the time.

Depending on circumstance, there's also the fact that the skeletons could each be making an additional attack, for d8+2 damage or thereabouts. Against something with super high ac, sure, advantage on your slightly more damaging attacks is probably worth it, but most of the time it'll be damage ahead to let the second attack roll carry its own damage too.

[JackPhoenix]

Skeletons don't require a corpse at all. They require a pile of bones.

The bones also must come from a humanoid (https://twitter.com/JeremyECrawford/status/696801091409747968?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5E tweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E696801091409747968%7Ctwgr%5E 373939313b73706563696669635f73706f7274735f61637469 6f6e&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.sageadvice.eu%2F2016%2F0 3%2F13%2Fif-a-wizard-casts-animate-dead-on-the-corpse-of-a-giant-does-it-change-the-stats%2F) and not from an undead, so it doesn't change anything... actually, it makes it harder, as it's easier to find (or create) a corpse than a pile of bones.

[opticalshadow]

The bones also must come from a humanoid (https://twitter.com/JeremyECrawford/status/696801091409747968?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5E tweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E696801091409747968%7Ctwgr%5E 373939313b73706563696669635f73706f7274735f61637469 6f6e&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.sageadvice.eu%2F2016%2F0 3%2F13%2Fif-a-wizard-casts-animate-dead-on-the-corpse-of-a-giant-does-it-change-the-stats%2F) and not from an undead, so it doesn't change anything... actually, it makes it harder, as it's easier to find (or create) a corpse than a pile of bones.

"Animate dead works only on the corpse or bones of a Small or Medium humanoid"

Technically speaking, the bones still came from the original creature, they did not come from an undead, they existed before the undead.

[MaxWilson]

How exactly does this work? Turning a grapple into a restrain with a second grapple is only possible with a particular feat. A feat zombies don't have. Unless I'm missing something?

Throw a net. Cancel out disadvantage by having skeletons Help each other.


"Animate dead works only on the corpse or bones of a Small or Medium humanoid"

That's a misquote. Correct wording: "choose a pile of bones or a corpse of a Medium or Small humanoid within range."

[Dalebert]

That's a misquote. Correct wording: "choose a pile of bones or a corpse of a Medium or Small humanoid within range."

Exactly. Skeletons are easier than zombies. Any bones will do. Bones of a shark? Sweep them into a pile. It might look like a very mishapen and mutated skeleton as the spell reshapes them into a humanoid shape, but you can do that.

[Kadesh]

Exactly. Skeletons are easier than zombies. Any bones will do. Bones of a shark? Sweep them into a pile. It might look like a very mishapen and mutated skeleton as the spell reshapes them into a humanoid shape, but you can do that.

Playing devil's advocate, it can be read as both ways.

[superstrijder15]

The biggest issue I see, RAW, is you need a high dex to hit and do much damage with a swift-quiver build, and a low dex to have your skeletons ready to help. There is no delay in 5e, so if you come up in the initiative order before your skeletons (which you usually will), you're out of luck.

There's a couple solutions, the first is to have more skeletons, increasing the odds of at least some of them getting in front of you to ready help. The other is they will be able to help starting on round 2, meaning you'll just lose out on advantage on the first round. If your average fight is 3 rounds, that's not all that great, you'll only get advantage 2/3 of the time.


Can one ready a multiattack? If you can, I ready a multiattack on the trigger of a skeleton Helping, then take it when the last skeleton I think has good chance to actually make it does the Help action for maximum shots with advantage.

[Maxilian]

To be fair, you can do this with any familiar too, even more useful if the familiar is an Owl, as it can use the help action and move away from the enemy without provoking OA, so in many cases, if you have a familiar, it means a free Advantage on one of your attacks (If its an owl, it will rarely die, as it can easily get out of range and find full cover till the next turn, where you will repeat the same thing again)

Note: For good or ill, i always have a familiar (though i don't always pick the Owl -but i won't deny that by RAW, they are just the best option)

[Maxilian]

The biggest issue I see, RAW, is you need a high dex to hit and do much damage with a swift-quiver build, and a low dex to have your skeletons ready to help. There is no delay in 5e, so if you come up in the initiative order before your skeletons (which you usually will), you're out of luck.

Wouldn't this be a problem only for the first round?

[superstrijder15]

Wouldn't this be a problem only for the first round?

Yes, but 5e expects combat to last about 3 rounds in general. Depending on your DM this may or may not hold, but thus in general cases having something come into effect in turn 2 means the advantage is decreased to 2/3 of the advantage of something available on turn 1.

[JackPhoenix]

Exactly. Skeletons are easier than zombies. Any bones will do. Bones of a shark? Sweep them into a pile. It might look like a very mishapen and mutated skeleton as the spell reshapes them into a humanoid shape, but you can do that.

It's not [pile of bones] or [a corpse of a Medium or Small humanoid], it's [pile of bones or a corpse][of a Medium or Small humanoid]. There's no reshaping going on. The "Medium or Small humanoid" condition applies to both bones and corpses.

And sharks don't have bones anyway.

[Maxilian]

Yes, but 5e expects combat to last about 3 rounds in general. Depending on your DM this may or may not hold, but thus in general cases having something come into effect in turn 2 means the advantage is decreased to 2/3 of the advantage of something available on turn 1.

True, i guess you could use your familiar to solve the turn one problem (As you will most likely always have it out -unless killed-) and then have it use the rest of the turns in combat to give adv to another PC

[Maxilian]

It's not [pile of bones] or [a corpse of a Medium or Small humanoid], it's [pile of bones or a corpse][of a Medium or Small humanoid]. There's no reshaping going on. The "Medium or Small humanoid" condition applies to both bones and corpses.

And sharks don't have bones anyway.

This reminds me... we really need a RAW small zombie and small skeleton (it bothers me how all the zombies and skeletons are medium regardless of the corpse used)

[JackPhoenix]

This reminds me... we really need a RAW small zombie and small skeleton (it bothers me how all the zombies and skeletons are medium regardless of the corpse used)

Just change the size to small. Besides racial ASIs and racial abilities (which don't apply to skeletons and zombies anyway), there's not really any difference between, say halfling and human Guard's stats, so there's no reason why should there be differences between halfling and human zombies.

You can also apply skeleton or zombie template to an NPC statblock, which, while definitely not RAI, isn't against RAW (Animate Dead's "the DM has the creature’s game statistics" part doesn't strictly require the DM to use the generic skeleton or zombie stat blocks from PHB/MM, but necromancers are powerful enough as it is even without giving them skeleton Assassins or zombie Champions)

[Maxilian]

Just change the size to small. Besides racial ASIs and racial abilities (which don't apply to skeletons and zombies anyway), there's not really any difference between, say halfling and human Guard's stats, so there's no reason why should there be differences between halfling and human zombies.

Well maybe the speed should drop by 5 feet too.




You can also apply skeleton or zombie template to an NPC statblock, which, while definitely not RAI, isn't against RAW (Animate Dead's "the DM has the creature’s game statistics" part doesn't strictly require the DM to use the generic skeleton or zombie stat blocks from PHB/MM, but necromancers are powerful enough as it is even without giving them skeleton Assassins or zombie Champions)

Yeah i know, though i wish i have more options for PCs, for NPC is irrelevant (DMs can have anything and it will always be RAI -well mostly, but you get it)

[Damon_Tor]

It's not [pile of bones] or [a corpse of a Medium or Small humanoid], it's [pile of bones or a corpse][of a Medium or Small humanoid]. There's no reshaping going on. The "Medium or Small humanoid" condition applies to both bones and corpses.

Oh god, we've moved from rules lawyering to grammar lawyering. God help us all.


"Choose a pile of bones or a corpse of a Medium or Small humanoid within range."

"Or" is a coordinating conjunction in this sentence. To be a subordinating conjunction, as you suggest, a set of commas would be required: "Choose a pile of bones, or a corpse, of a Medium or Small humanoid within range." Whether or not this is the intent is unclear.

[JNAProductions]

I'd think the intent is pretty obvious. You can't make a humanoid skeleton out of dinosaur bones.

That being said, I'd also argue that a defeated but not destroyed skeleton or zombie is humanoid enough to be reanimated.

[MoiMagnus]

So let's say I have an archer bard, likes to use that Swift Quiver spell so he's making 4 attacks every turn. Is there a reason I can't be using Animate Dead to generate advantage for myself?

So let's say I've got 4 skeletons. The MM says they can perform complex operations like fire a catapult as a team, something that requires timing and coordination. So is there a reason the skeletons can't be ordered to ready actions to take the "Help" command in the following sequence:

On the skeleton's turn:
Skeleton One uses "Help" on the target, giving me advantage on my next attack. Straightforward enough. Note he
Skeleton Two readies an action with the trigger "Master completes his first attack on the target" and the readied action is, again, "help" with the same parameters.
Skeleton Three readies an action with the trigger "Master completes his second attack on the target" and the readied action is "help".
Skeleton Four readies an action with the trigger "Master completes his third attack on the target" and the readied action is "help".

Any additional skeletons would be tasked with grappling the target to keep it from moving away from skeletons 1-4.

The skeletons would be trained ahead of time to do this, so they could respond to something simple like "Attack pattern alpha, enemy wizard on the dias!" at the start of combat.

Then on my turn I use my bonus action to make two attacks with my bow, and my standard action to make another two attacks.

(And yes, I know there are much better ways for a bard to get advantage using a level 3+ spell slot.)

RAW, you are right.

As a DM, here is how I would rule it:
+ As long as the skeleton is threatening enough to the creature, it will works.
+ If the skeleton is "negligible", the creature may chose to neglect him (depend on Int and circumstances).
-> The help action no longer work
-> The skeleton has advantage to its attacks rolls against the creature, and deals damage corresponding to a critical hit if it touch

Yes, undead are powerful. In fact, number is powerful. If you had a group of soldiers it will be the same (in more expensive to raise when killed). But I will remind you that necromancers are usually hated by the society because of the threat they are.
Depending on the settings, it can leads to groups of paladins and cleric from good aligned gods to hunt you and try to kill you.

[Dalebert]

Well maybe the speed should drop by 5 feet too.

There are some mechanical effects of being small, e.g. size of mounts you can use and being able to move through enemy spaces of large creatures, but being small doesn't necessarily lower your speed. Look at goblins.

And FWIW (which I acknowledge isn't much in many folks' eyes) Crawford says the bones are re-usable.

https://www.sageadvice.eu/2015/05/11/healing-undead-minions/

Undead minions can receive temporary hp and can spend HD during a short rest. And animate dead can bring them back!

[lperkins2]

Can one ready a multiattack? If you can, I ready a multiattack on the trigger of a skeleton Helping, then take it when the last skeleton I think has good chance to actually make it does the Help action for maximum shots with advantage.

You can ready Multiattack (if you have it from wildshape), or ready the Attack Action, and then attack twice if you have the Extra Attack feature. But you can't then also take your bonus action attack from swift quiver as part of that reaction. You could ready the attack action, then bonus action attack twice with SQ, which reduces the number of skeletons that need to go first to 2, at the cost of your reaction for the round. If you have more than 4 skeletons, it also somewhat mitigates the first round issue.


True, i guess you could use your familiar to solve the turn one problem (As you will most likely always have it out -unless killed-) and then have it use the rest of the turns in combat to give adv to another PC

Your familiar rolls its own initiative, so same problem as the skeletons, it'll probably go after you.

[MaxWilson]

Exactly. Skeletons are easier than zombies. Any bones will do. Bones of a shark? Sweep them into a pile. It might look like a very mishapen and mutated skeleton as the spell reshapes them into a humanoid shape, but you can do that.

Well, I mean, assuming your DM buys that little bit of technical reasoning. Personally I think it's a little bit rules-lawyery and wouldn't (although I have no problem with re-animating slain skeletons if the players are cool with that). I just want to be clear here about what the text actually says.

Also I would expect the summoner to supply bows, arrows, etc., despite the rules text implying that the spell somehow creates a literal Skeleton from the MM stat block complete with intrinsic shortbow and rotted armor, just because those happen to be in the stat block. On the other hand, I also have no issue with you giving it other weapons that the original humanoid would have been proficient in, e.g. hobgoblin skeletons can use longbows, chain mail, and shields with no problem at my table.

Edit: huh, didn't realize that shark jaws are made out of cartilage. Apparently those who say sharks have no bones at all are actually correct.


It's not [pile of bones] or [a corpse of a Medium or Small humanoid], it's [pile of bones or a corpse][of a Medium or Small humanoid]. There's no reshaping going on. The "Medium or Small humanoid" condition applies to both bones and corpses.

And sharks don't have bones anyway.

[pile of bones][of a Medium or Small humanoid] is ungrammatical and makes no sense.

If it said "a pile of bones from or the corpse of a Medium or Small humanoid," you'd have a slam-dunk case. As it is all we can conclude is that WotC doesn't have very good copy-editors.


Your familiar rolls its own initiative, so same problem as the skeletons, it'll probably go after you.

If you have enough skeletons, it is quite likely that some of them will go before you in the initiative order.

Moving into melee range may be an issue though unless you buy them all horses.

[JackPhoenix]

There are some mechanical effects of being small, e.g. size of mounts you can use and being able to move through enemy spaces of large creatures, but being small doesn't necessarily lower your speed. Look at goblins.

And FWIW (which I acknowledge isn't much in many folks' eyes) Crawford says the bones are re-usable.

https://www.sageadvice.eu/2015/05/11/healing-undead-minions/

He also said that "Animate dead works only on the corpse or bones of a Small or Medium humanoid." (https://twitter.com/JeremyECrawford/status/696801091409747968?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5E tweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E696801091409747968%7Ctwgr%5E 373939313b73706563696669635f73706f7274735f61637469 6f6e&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.sageadvice.eu%2F2016%2F0 3%2F13%2Fif-a-wizard-casts-animate-dead-on-the-corpse-of-a-giant-does-it-change-the-stats%2F) We also know that being turned undead changes your creature type to undead, while mere death doesn't change it back to original. Remains of a destroyed undead are corpse or bones of a undead, not corpse or bones of a humanoid.

[MaxWilson]

He also said that "Animate dead works only on the corpse or bones of a Small or Medium humanoid." (https://twitter.com/JeremyECrawford/status/696801091409747968?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5E tweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E696801091409747968%7Ctwgr%5E 373939313b73706563696669635f73706f7274735f61637469 6f6e&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.sageadvice.eu%2F2016%2F0 3%2F13%2Fif-a-wizard-casts-animate-dead-on-the-corpse-of-a-giant-does-it-change-the-stats%2F) We also know that being turned undead changes your creature type to undead, while mere death doesn't change it back to original. Remains of a destroyed undead are corpse or bones of a undead, not corpse or bones of a humanoid.

We also know that Jeremy Crawford is very fallible, and this is a case in point. Both Crawford claims cannot be true.

The DM will make a reasonable ruling. Crawford is best ignored.

[JackPhoenix]

We also know that Jeremy Crawford is very fallible, and this is a case in point. Both Crawford claims cannot be true.

The DM will make a reasonable ruling. Crawford is best ignored.

One claim clarifies the meaning of the text in the book (I agree on the lack of proofreading, though), the other has no backing. It wouldn't be the first time JC made a response without checking the rules first. Note that the tweet from my post is newer, for what it's worth.

[Kadesh]

We also know that Jeremy Crawford is very fallible, and this is a case in point. Both Crawford claims cannot be true.

The DM will make a reasonable ruling. Crawford is best ignored.

Crawford is best taken as designer intent and ergo, his last comment on a subject should be taken as such, as not only the true Rules as they are intended, but also clarification on the rules as they are written.

What works in your game however is entirely up to you, and his views on what the words say are as relevant as yours if they make the game less fun for my friends to come round and spend an evening playing.

If someone wants to play a Necromancer, sure, I'm not going to gimp them by preventing them from sourcing humanoid skeletons, any more than i will prevent a Polearm Master from finding/purchasing Polearm useable weapons.

[Maxilian]

There are some mechanical effects of being small, e.g. size of mounts you can use and being able to move through enemy spaces of large creatures, but being small doesn't necessarily lower your speed. Look at goblins.

And FWIW (which I acknowledge isn't much in many folks' eyes) Crawford says the bones are re-usable.

https://www.sageadvice.eu/2015/05/11/healing-undead-minions/

True, but as the mention for small skeletons were Halflings, i went with the basics...

Note: In general, more types of undeads would be nice for the Necromancers (Undead horses, undead beasts, etc...)

[Maxilian]

RAW, you are right.

As a DM, here is how I would rule it:
+ As long as the skeleton is threatening enough to the creature, it will works.
+ If the skeleton is "negligible", the creature may chose to neglect him (depend on Int and circumstances).
-> The help action no longer work
-> The skeleton has advantage to its attacks rolls against the creature, and deals damage corresponding to a critical hit if it touch

Yes, undead are powerful. In fact, number is powerful. If you had a group of soldiers it will be the same (in more expensive to raise when killed). But I will remind you that necromancers are usually hated by the society because of the threat they are.
Depending on the settings, it can leads to groups of paladins and cleric from good aligned gods to hunt you and try to kill you.

Why is that? I mean... under this "rule", a familiar could not actually help you with the help action.

[Damon_Tor]

But I will remind you that necromancers are usually hated by the society because of the threat they are.
Depending on the settings, it can leads to groups of paladins and cleric from good aligned gods to hunt you and try to kill you.

Which is why I'd want to take care to disguise them, cover them in concealing armor, use my bardic talents to explain to people how they're an order of knights, sworn to silence and to my cause. Also, I'm a prince. Did I explain that I'm a prince? Because I'm a prince. And your daughter is in terrible danger, best leave her with me for her safety. Great, thanks, good talk.

[Mellack]

You can ready Multiattack (if you have it from wildshape), or ready the Attack Action, and then attack twice if you have the Extra Attack feature. But you can't then also take your bonus action attack from swift quiver as part of that reaction. You could ready the attack action, then bonus action attack twice with SQ, which reduces the number of skeletons that need to go first to 2, at the cost of your reaction for the round. If you have more than 4 skeletons, it also somewhat mitigates the first round issue.



Note: if you ready the attack action, you do not get to use your extra attack feature. That feature specifies that it works on your turn. Since when you take a readied action it is not on your turn, no extra attack.

[Maxilian]

Your familiar rolls its own initiative, so same problem as the skeletons, it'll probably go after you.

Most familiars have a DEX of 2 or plus, so it have a better chance than a skeleton, but yeah, as you lvl up it will become less and less likely for the familiar to go after.

[Bluemanarc]

Once you have them skeleton bones and a bag of holding, should be simple.

"Kill each other till one is left, then pack the bones in my bag over here, then kill yourself by the bag"
"Quietly please"

Nothing a Chaotic Good Life Cleric shouldn't be afraid off.

[MoiMagnus]

Why is that? I mean... under this "rule", a familiar could not actually help you with the help action.

TBF, never had a familiar in my PC group (mainly for RP reasons).
(would have probably allow the help action for the familiar, but did not though about it)

However, I do usually have a lot of NPC of different kinds, and I rarely have fight with less than 20 figurines on the boards. (EDIT: at high level, not at the beginning, of course)
(And at some point, I also had a necromancer in the PC side with 20 skeletons on top of that...)
Thus, a lot of "how to deal with negligible people" rules that were added when things started to look too stupid.

EDIT: More precisely, I always accept the "help action" when it is justifiable enough in a RP way. But I refuse most "systematic help actions". Sure, the first time of the fight, the enemy might get distracted by your "Look! Behind you!". But not the third time in a row.

[lperkins2]

Most familiars have a DEX of 2 or plus, so it have a better chance than a skeleton, but yeah, as you lvl up it will become less and less likely for the familiar to go after.

Better than a skeleton, but remember the question is about swift-quiver, which implies a high dex for the attack rolls and damage. Still, +2 vs +3 or +4 means about 40% of the time the familiar will go first. Which helps with a single attack (of the 4 possible).

[ThePolarBear]

You can ready Multiattack (if you have it from wildshape), or ready the Attack Action, and then attack twice if you have the Extra Attack feature

You can't ready Multiattack (MM, page 11 - clarified here as intended (https://twitter.com/JeremyECrawford/status/786328740657639424) ) to make more than one attack out of your turn. You can't, for similar reasons, make more than one attack out of turn with Extra Attack.

Both require "your turn".

[KOLE]

You can't ready Multiattack (MM, page 11 - clarified here as intended (https://twitter.com/JeremyECrawford/status/786328740657639424) ) to make more than one attack out of your turn. You can't, for similar reasons, make more than one attack out of turn with Extra Attack.

Both require "your turn".

Extra attack does not require your turn. AFB, but I believe extra attack states when you tale the attack action, you can attack an additional time. You can ready the attack action, extra attack is a rider on the attack action.

[MaxWilson]

Extra attack does not require your turn. AFB, but I believe extra attack states when you tale the attack action, you can attack an additional time. You can ready the attack action, extra attack is a rider on the attack action.

Negative, the wording of Extra Attack is always "when you take the Attack action on your turn" [emphasis added]. For example, the Fighter's Extra Attack is:


Beginning at 5th level, you can Attack twice, instead of once, whenever you take the Attack action on your turn.

The number of attacks increases to three when you reach 11th level in this class and to four when you reach 20th level in this class.

It is completely reasonable however for a DM to ignore this limitation as it applies to readying actions. Otherwise, warlocks become better archers in close terrain than fighters are, due to getting 4 attacks where a fighter gets only 1, despite warlocks also getting 9th level spells.