It's been a while... let's brainstorm pros and cons: Ancients Paladin 5+ w/ MC

[Arkhios]

Hi!

As the title says, it's been a while since I brought my current (*cough* only *cough*) character up in here.

The short of it is: Paladin Oath of the Ancients, fluffwise a mix between a Viking and a Celt, with a pinch of North American Indian*


Appearance-wise, the character is somewhere between a Viking and a Celt, but in cultural sense, he belongs to the Wolf Clan; his people being somewhat reminiscent to American Indian Tribes, but their spiritual side leans towards The Old Faith, in the traditional Celtic druids' way. Wolf Clan is one of the major clans in the North, and by far considered to be the most civilized, mostly because their permanent settlement is considered as de facto capital of the North, but also because the Chieftain of Wolf Clan is also seen as the High King of the Tribes.

My character is a direct descendant to a legendary archmage who brought two long-divided branches of the Wolf Clan back together. To seal the two clans' reunion, the archmage married the Wolf King's daughter, so my character is a distant relative to the royal family, although he has no official position in the court. However, his lineage still holds respect throughout the North, not only because the clans' reunion, but also because the late archmage, along with his companions at the time, ended a long war between local dwarves and elves, and were celebrated as Heroes of the Realm.
Because the Northern Tribes didn't formerly have any arcane traditions, the archmage taught everything he knew to his son before he mysteriously disappeared and was never seen since.
As a Legacy of sorts, the archmage's son passed his knowledge down to his own descendants, and thus there is a family tradition to teach the basic principles of arcane knowledge to everyone in the archmage's immediate family, even if they didn't choose to become magicians. My character was one of those who chose a different path, and became a Paladin of the Oath of the Ancients, initially serving as a guardian of the local Circle of the Moon.

https://db4sgowjqfwig.cloudfront.net/images/4991936/DW_Arkhios.jpg



Str 18, Dex 9, Con 161, Int 11, Wis 10, Cha 16 (rolled with 4d6b3)
Dual Wielder (Variant Human feat)
Tavern Brawler1 (4th level)
Protection Fighting Style (Yes, fighting as a "sword&board" quite literally ...with DM's approval)


Currently, I'm at level 5, so I'll definitely take 6th level in Paladin at the very least before branching out (probably 7 as well, because Aura of Warding is just so good!)
Recently I had this idea that I could take a few levels (maybe 6, maybe 8) in Warlock. Patron would be Celestial, and when I mentioned this idea to the DM, he said that a thematic fit could be Kharash the Stalker (http://gamelore.wikia.com/wiki/Kharash) (Neutral Good Paragon of Lupinals; Book of Exalted Deeds); a werewolf-like creature with topaz eyes.

As for the Warlock features I'd like to have:
I'm not a huge fan of Eldritch Blast, so I would be perfectly fine with not having it at all. Plus, it leaves more room for other thematically appropriate invocations, since I wouldn't get too many of them anyway. I'm most interested in the Aspect of the Moon, because I was thinking of going with the Pact of the Tome for thematic reasons (see the spoiler above, if you wish), but Eldritch Sight and Eyes of the Rune Keeper are also very interesting and could fit well. Also, Ghostly Gaze, if I get that high, would be weirdly appropriate as well. On the other hand, Book of Ancient Secrets could be useful, if I took 8 or more levels in Warlock, because that way I could still have Find Greater Steed (for Dire Wolf, obviously), since it's a ritual spell.

Pact of the Tome would also let me learn Shillelagh, which would be very appropriate considering the character's background and connection to druidic circles, and because I'm pretty certain I'll be taking Kharash as the Celestial Patron, if I take Warlock levels, Primal Savagery has amazing synergy with the Lupinal Paragon.

If I took Book of Ancient Secrets, the 1st-level rituals I'd take would most likely be Find Familiar and Identify, for obvious reasons.

As for the Warlock spells, I probably wouldn't take anything that has a fiendish connection, because it matters. To me, if not for anyone else. In other words, I would take every Patron spell I could, and then something fairly "neutral" or nature-y.



Light (Celestial Patron) @1st-level
Sacred Flame (Celestial Patron) @1st-level
Booming Blade @1st-level
Lightning Lure @1st-level
Shillelagh (Pact of the Tome) @3rd-level
Primal Savagery (Pact of the Tome) @3rd-level
Vicious Mockery (Pact of the Tome) @3rd-level
Thunderclap @4th-level


Cure Wounds (Celestial Patron) @1st-level
Guiding Bolt (Celestial Patron) @1st-level
Protection from Evil and Good @2nd-level


Protection from Evil and Good -> Lesser Restoration (Celestial Patron) @3rd-level
Flaming Sphere (Celestial Patron) @3rd-level


Revivify (Celestial Patron) @5th-level
Daylight (Celestial Patron) @6th-level


Guardian of Faith (Celestial Patron) @7th-level
Wall of Fire (Celestial Patron) @8th-level



On the other hand, Divine Soul Sorcerer could also be interesting fit, because it would let me pick (mostly) cleric spells and still use charisma for them, but I can't help and think that it would be more because of mechanics rather than flavor. Actually, I just recalled a neat bit about the ancestor (who was a character I actually played before this one). He had a moniker of "Stormbearer", because the character was destined to become a conduit for a perpetual winter storm with unnatural origins that had tormented the region for centuries, and these gifts were granted to him by a semi-divine entity in birth. Note, this game occurred when D&D Next was in early playtest, so there were no sorcerers or wizards separately - let alone storm sorcerers, only the mage class. This link to a divine entity could indeed manifest itself as sorcerous origin for the paladin. So, it's definitely not out of question.

[Keravath]

I would think either fey warlock or divine soul sorcerer could fit with your background. Divine soul would have to do with your lineage and whether you could have any divine blood or a connection to the divine in the past of your family of which you are unaware. Fey warlock is an obvious fit with oath of the ancients paladin.

Mechanically, both classes will bring spell slots for smiting, additional utility and some nice features.

You could look at something like paladin 11 with either sorcerer 9 or warlock 9 as the end point if you think it would get that far since then you would have improved divine smite. Or you could stop at paladin 7 with either sorcerer 13 or warlock 13.

[Arkhios]

I would think either fey warlock or divine soul sorcerer could fit with your background. Divine soul would have to do with your lineage and whether you could have any divine blood or a connection to the divine in the past of your family of which you are unaware. Fey warlock is an obvious fit with oath of the ancients paladin.

Mechanically, both classes will bring spell slots for smiting, additional utility and some nice features.

You could look at something like paladin 11 with either sorcerer 9 or warlock 9 as the end point if you think it would get that far since then you would have improved divine smite. Or you could stop at paladin 7 with either sorcerer 13 or warlock 13.

I appreciate the thought, but I did think about Archfey Patron long ago, and it didn't fit for what I wanted; not then, not now. For a while I was going to multiclass with the playtest version of Favored Soul, but then my DM said it was not allowed, so I kinda dropped the idea of multiclassing altogether.

Only recently, when I sat down and read about the Celestial Patron more thoroughly, I got this idea that it could fit perfectly. As I said, Archfey features don't sit right for my idea of the character. My paladin is honorable, not mischievous like fey often are. He reveres the Light, almost to a fault, and Celestial Patron seems second best choice to cleric. But alas, my stats don't work with the cleric multiclass.

That said, Divine Soul could be great as well, and it's a strong contestant for the Celestial Tomelock, which I'm pretty certain will be my choice if I choose Warlock over Sorcerer.

As for the level splits, I feel like any Warlock levels beyond 8th are a waste for a paladin, because, when used to smite, Divine Smite caps at 4th level spell slots. If you have 5th level spell slots from Warlock, I wouldn't use them for smiting at all at that point (and, no, I wouldn't take Blade Pact so that I might use Eldritch Smite with them). From paladin, I'd definitely want at least 11 levels, regardless of the other class, purely because of Improved Divine Smite (because I tend to spare my spell slots for critical smites only).

[Corran]

Heh, I remember this character. In fact, it's one of the two characters that I've seen in this forum and still remember (the other one was another ancients paly, a gnome riding his mount -was it a giant toad or a dog, not sure about that- with a wooden lance (made by Tieren). Enough with the pleasantries though.

So, good, honorable, protector, from the North.... wait a minute.... *gasps*. You are a Stark! Grrrrr!!!

Seriously now, I promise.
I can't help you much. That's cause you know far better than me what kind of flavor you are going for (since it's your character and not one of mine), also cause I haven't looked at the celestial warlock all that much. But! I can say a few good things about a couple of the paladin's features that await you, probably making the decision/thought to multiclass a bit more difficult.

Now, we all pretty much know that there are some very good 3rd level paladin spells waiting for you at level 9. Among them, revivify. I wont go into stuff like ''if no one at your party has it then it's a very good spell and very much necessary'', though I will say that if someone has it and it's their trademark thing, then you might want to avoid stepping on their toes by taking it. But all that aside, does bringing the fallen back to life feel like an ability that would suit and bolster your character's theme? For most people playing a good aligned paladin, it would.

Then it is aura of courage, at level 10. Personally, and I really mean it, THIS is the defining paladin feature. More than lay on hands, more than smite, more than the old detect evil, more than the mount. THIS! There is just something about it. Something supernatural, something inhuman, just because it is so very contrary to a real person quality (even the bravest one I would say). It is the feature that can change a paladin's personality completely (should you choose not to ignore it from an rp angle). And a great rp tool for those who want their paladins to transition to the dark side (but I suspect you are not interested in that, so I will not try to tempt you :p). So yeah, IMO aura of courage is the most defining personality feature from level 10 and onwards). Would you like o have your character say, just like another Dr Manhattan, ''This was the last time I felt fear.''? And from a less egotistical point of view, how important would you consider the ability to ''spread courage'' to your allies? Maybe you prefer not to take it, to leave your character with some ''human weaknesses''. Up to you.

Mechanically speaking, only a few words. IDS would play well with your fighting style (I am assuming you can apply it on your shield attack/''bash''). That would substantially increase your dpr. You don't need to be an alpha gamer to value the benefits of increased dpr. Better dpr leads both to damage prevention and to drawing more attention to your character, at least theoretically.

I realize this is probably of little help, but that's all I have.

ps: If I were you, and if I was allowed to do that, I would swap DEX with WIS. Because what is the most distinctive trait of a real hero? A lack of caution and common sense! :smallbiggrin:

pps: I missed the edited parts (specifically about the split), so most of what I say is redundant as far as your decision making goes.

Edit:
Some good spell you could aim for (not sure which ones of them a warlock gets access to, as I was picking them for a divine soul with a similar theme), might be the following:
Spirit guardians (very flavorful spell)
Zone of truth
Banishment
Flame strike (worse than fireball but more thematic)
Commune
Mass cure wounds
thaumaturgy
sacred flame
guidance
spare the dying

And daylight (and lesser restoration), didn't see it at first glance as I hadn't picked it, only cause the race was an aasimar.

And if you went for less than 11 paladin levels, then depending on the split, some other thematic spells might be:
True seeing
Divine word
Conjure celestial (Pegasus)/ though summon greater steed is just better
Holy aura
True resurrection
Wish (to replicare thematic spells that didn't get picked, like sunbeam, tsunami, etc; pairs well with subtle, if sorc, to do away with the castery hocus pocus and have it play like a manifestation of your will)

[rbstr]

I don't really get your fighting style...you're fighting with a shield off-hand as an improvised weapon?

Celestial warlock works pretty great with Paladin in my experience. Bonus-action heals and some good spells. Short rest slots can really help the Paladin stretch the adventuring day. Sacred Flame makes a decent ranged attack option so you can avoid EB if you want.
But, I don't see any point in taking all these combat cantrips/tome pact. Shillelagh is a trap since you have better strength than charisma. You're just wasting a bonus action to use it, essentially: If you want a magic sword go Blade Pact.
Extra attack w/ TWF is flat out better than any cantrips for attacking. So you'd only want to use them you've got Warcaster and can use it as an opp. attack. (Also, you really want to get Improved Divine Smite for the +1d8 to all your attacks)
Tome Pact is mostly good for Ancient Secrets and the ritual spells. I get the flavor, but you're really just gonna waste either the cantrip picks or all the combat stuff you've already got most of the time, as you have it planned.
Also, Find (greater) Steed is not a ritual spell.

Let me suggest Chain Pact and the Gift of the Ever-Living ones invocation as an alternative as well. You'll roll max healing on yourself, really letting you stretch those healing lights.

On your spell selections:
Given you can take them from Paladin, I'm not sure you want to learn cure wounds/lesser restoration/revivify.
I would take Armor of Agathys or Mirror Image as a defensive spell. Maybe both. Mirror Image is great against the big bad stuff, AoA works very well against small things.'
Counterspell or Disspell Magic might be useful.
Sickening Radiance and Banishment are worth thinking about too.

[Snowbluff]

Yeah I second Chain Pact as well. Personally, I like pets, and while it's probably stereotypical, having a spiritual pet would go well with the basic concept.

[Vogie]

I would also switch Dex & Wis if possible, but if not, it isn't the end of the realm.

I'd keep the Pact of the Tome - the ritual casting and extra cantrips are far better for your concept than an invisible companion. Find Steed/Greater steed aren't actually rituals, just spells with a casting time of 10 minutes, but being able to pick up level 1-3 ritual spells will be fantastic.

You probably won't want more than 6 levels in warlock - once you get the +Cha to fire/Radiant damage , there isn't much else that's tasty. I would love Ghostly Gaze if it wasn't just 1 minute per rest.

I'd swap out Daylight for either Dispel Magic or Counterspell, unless there's an story or campaign reason for you to have it. You can call either of them a "Cleansing Light" so they fit your concept while being incredibly useful.

I'd swap out the Shillelagh with something else - Druidcraft, Thorn Whip, Produce Flame, Guidance - because if you're actually "literally" sword & board-ing, you won't ever need it, as it's club/quarterstaff only.

[Arkhios]

I don't really get your fighting style...you're fighting with a shield off-hand as an improvised weapon?
Yes. It's a 'gain some, lose some' deal. I get Dual Wielder's +1 to AC when I use the shield to attack (which is almost every turn), and according to Sage Advice Compendium (https://media.wizards.com/2017/dnd/downloads/SA-Compendium.pdf) (page 6): Attacking with a shield doesn’t deprive you of the shield’s bonus to AC, which effectively means that the AC from Dual Wielder stacks with shield's +2 (as a houserule).
On hindsight, the damage is only 1d4 and doesn't get the strength modifier as a bonus on damage rolls. But all in all, considering I had to take two feats for this combo, I think it's a fair trade. The Protection Fighting Style I took because I don't have many uses for my reactions otherwise. And even when I later do via War Caster, I think having many options is better than having just one option, because the circumstances exclude each other.


But, I don't see any point in taking all these combat cantrips/tome pact. Shillelagh is a trap since you have better strength than charisma. You're just wasting a bonus action to use it, essentially: If you want a magic sword go Blade Pact.
Extra attack w/ TWF is flat out better than any cantrips for attacking. So you'd only want to use them you've got Warcaster and can use it as an opp. attack. (Also, you really want to get Improved Divine Smite for the +1d8 to all your attacks)
Shillelagh is chosen pretty much only for flavor. But there are situations when we have been unable to have our weapons at hand, so basically being able to grab a stick in the forest and make it a magic weapon in a pinch has its benefits. Even if only small ones. I wouldn't say it's a trap only because my Charisma is lower than Strength. Shillelagh says RAW: "you can use your spellcasting ability instead of Strength". It doesn't say: "you must use your spellcasting ability instead of Strength". I can still choose to use Strength with it. I know it's really just a glorified magic stick, but Shillelagh has a lot of traditional value for real world druids as well as for the druids in the game's history.

Regarding the other cantrips, there are situations when some cantrips can be better than other methods, so I see value in having more options. But, Booming Blade is mainly chosen for War Caster opportunity attacks, when I take the feat.

I do want to get IDS. There's no second thoughts about that.



Also, Find (greater) Steed is not a ritual spell.
Huh. I could've sworn that both of them had the Ritual tag. Although, admittedly I didn't bother to double check it, so the woe is me. That does definitely change things and I might indeed take only 6 levels in Warlock (and use the Pact Magic slots for something else than smites anyway).


Let me suggest Chain Pact and the Gift of the Ever-Living ones invocation as an alternative as well. You'll roll max healing on yourself, really letting you stretch those healing lights.
True, it certainly is a powerful option. It's a point I did consider, but eventually felt like Aspect of the Moon is more fitting for the potential identity of my Celestial Patron. (Likewise, the Patron in question is the reason why I would take Primal Savagery cantrip.)
Plus, I can't decide which "improved familiar" I'd take :P. Definitely not an Imp or a Quasit, that's for sure. Regardless of the fact that the Familiar is only a spirit that takes the form of that creature, instead of actually being that creature. In other words, I'm aware that Chain Pact's Imp could very well be a Celestial Spirit. It's just.... ehh...


On your spell selections:
Given you can take them from Paladin, I'm not sure you want to learn cure wounds/lesser restoration/revivify.
I would take Armor of Agathys or Mirror Image as a defensive spell. Maybe both. Mirror Image is great against the big bad stuff, AoA works very well against small things.'
Counterspell or Dispell Magic might be useful.
Sickening Radiance and Banishment are worth thinking about too.
To be fair, the spell selections are not set in stone, but on the other hand, if I choose Cure Wounds as a Warlock spell known, I'll have it always prepared and thus I can choose to prepare something else from the paladin's spell list. Same applies to all spells that are on both lists. But, agreed. There are better spells to choose purely from Warlock's list, such as Counterspell. Since Dispel Magic is also on Paladin's list, it could be another spell to learn in order to free space for prepared spells.

Armor of Agathys refers to the sixth and last layer of Carceri: "Agathys consists of a single orb of black ice alone in the void, almost completely devoid of light and sound, with only the shifting and breaking of ice and the slow, crushing agony of petitioners frozen in it being heard", and is definitely not a place from where a "Lightsworn" Paladin of the Oath of the Ancients would look for magical aid. Carceri itself is an evil-aligned plane of existence, which "kinda" does ruffle the feathers of a good-aligned character with a potentially good-aligned patron. So, yeah, no. As good as the spell might mechanically be, I have my principles.

Mirror Image is definitely a good one on paper. Unfortunately it's only a minor speed-bump, because those mirror images would have ridiculously low AC: 9, so the spell is bound to end early. But I suppose it's still worth considering.

[Arkhios]

Back to the drawing board. I asked my DM whether I could make a few changes to the character, and he gave me green light for them, should I want to do it.

Potential changes in the order of priority:

Fighting Style: Protection → Defense
Tavern Brawler → Resilient (Constitution)


The changes wouldn't affect my ability scores in any way, as I took +1 Con with Tavern Brawler, but my total AC would drop by 1, if I decided to cease using my Shield as a weapon and instead start using two weapons (as I do want to keep Dual Wielder).
On the other hand, if I kept TB, my maximum AC could potentially increase by 1 instead, but then I'd be stuck with lower base damage for my off-hand attacks.


Do note that I still plan to take War Caster eventually.

PS. I specifically don't want to play a "paladunce", and don't want to swap dex with wis.

[Mjolnirbear]

Edit: if, of course, you decided against Tome and went Chaim.

So given your characters history, you could pick a sprite and flavour it as your semi-divine ancestor, or the part of him or her that's allowed to act in the physical realm. Heart Sight is an excellent excuse for moral guidance, it can remain invisible (you're hearing his voice from beyond the grave) and it can act as, basically, a luck charm using the Aid Another action.

Given your proposed patron, you can instead take a look through a bunch of supplements for a canine of the right type to take instead of the standard chain pact familiars. Your DM seems likely to approve it. It could be a simple mastiff, or a wolf companion. Then Find Greater Steed could be a dire wolf. You could Princess Mononoke your way through the campaign at that point. In this option, your familiar is less your moral guide and more a follower you've earned the right to lead as Alpha (apparently new research says wolves don't actually do the alpha/beta thing as originally thought, but then, you're dealing with wolf-shaped followers, not wolves).

[Arkhios]

Edit: if, of course, you decided against Tome and went Chaim.

So given your characters history, you could pick a sprite and flavour it as your semi-divine ancestor, or the part of him or her that's allowed to act in the physical realm. Heart Sight is an excellent excuse for moral guidance, it can remain invisible (you're hearing his voice from beyond the grave) and it can act as, basically, a luck charm using the Aid Another action.

Given your proposed patron, you can instead take a look through a bunch of supplements for a canine of the right type to take instead of the standard chain pact familiars. Your DM seems likely to approve it. It could be a simple mastiff, or a wolf companion. Then Find Greater Steed could be a dire wolf. You could Princess Mononoke your way through the campaign at that point. In this option, your familiar is less your moral guide and more a follower you've earned the right to lead as Alpha (apparently new research says wolves don't actually do the alpha/beta thing as originally thought, but then, you're dealing with wolf-shaped followers, not wolves).

Sprite as an ancestor isn't actually a bad idea for Pact of the Chain. Especially with the possibility for it to remain invisible indefinitely. I will consider that.
But the familiar would have to be someone else than the legendary archmage, because his fate is shrouded in mystery. At some point, he just vanished, never to be heard from again. No one knows what happened to him. It's possible that he never actually died. But that's something I left for my DM to decide, and I have no idea what he came up with it, if anything.

I'm waiting for the Find Greater Steed specifically because I can get a dire wolf with it :smallbiggrin:

[Mjolnirbear]

It need not be the archmage, or the king of the wolf clan. It could be someone (something?) *sent* by one of those. It could be a simple ancestral spirit, Guardians of your noble lineage. It could be the archmage's personal familiar, ensuring the archmage's legacy remains enact while he's...away.

And it could be fluffed as a flying wolf pup because reasons lol. It doesn't need to be invisible, it was just a way to fluff how you get guidance from your ancestors or something and a way to get said guidance in mysteeeeeeerious ways from you-don't-know-what. Wasn't Mushu invisible to Mulan's family?

[Captain Bob]

This is a cool idea. I'll throw my hat in the ring with an alternative - go college of swords Bard. You can nab two weapon fighting since you're already using two weapons, as well as a nifty bonus to your AC, move speed and damage once a turn - this is in addition to jack of all trades, expertise in skills (I.E. Athletics - shove for days!) and magical secrets eventually. You even get a limited form of war caster for bard stuff when your weapons can act as spell foci. Best thing about it is that you get benefits from the subclass pretty quick and with basically every level. First is skills spells and slots, second is jack of all trades, third is TWF and spending dice in combat. I'm sure there's much more to be said about the combo, but given your preference lies elsewhere I'll end this post here. Cheers.

[Angelalex242]

First:

If you're Ancients Paladin, do not even THINK about multiclassing out till level 7. You WANT Ward of the Ancients.

And you can always take the 8th level if the urge for another ASI strikes you.

[Toofey]

I would make sure there isn't some miscommunication with the DM as to what stacking those feats would do. That definitely wouldn't work RAW (a shield is not a weapon, dual wield works with a weapon in the off hand and that is explicit iirc). I would straighten all that out into something less complicated, and would actually recommend you ditch the shield and go full 2 weapon, as you would benefit from increased crits for smiting.

[Arkhios]

This is a cool idea. I'll throw my hat in the ring with an alternative - go college of swords Bard. You can nab two weapon fighting since you're already using two weapons, as well as a nifty bonus to your AC, move speed and damage once a turn - this is in addition to jack of all trades, expertise in skills (I.E. Athletics - shove for days!) and magical secrets eventually. You even get a limited form of war caster for bard stuff when your weapons can act as spell foci. Best thing about it is that you get benefits from the subclass pretty quick and with basically every level. First is skills spells and slots, second is jack of all trades, third is TWF and spending dice in combat. I'm sure there's much more to be said about the combo, but given your preference lies elsewhere I'll end this post here. Cheers.

I have considered taking bard, for all the same reasons you brought up. It's still an option with the College of Swords being available. But given that I want at least (all) 4th level spells from paladin, Magical Secrets will have to go. Unless I choose Lore instead of Swords.


First:

If you're Ancients Paladin, do not even THINK about multiclassing out till level 7. You WANT Ward of the Ancients.

And you can always take the 8th level if the urge for another ASI strikes you.

I'm in no hurry to obtain the second class, and likely will wait for 8th level for War Caster and possibly 9th level as well for 3rd level spells before I multiclass.


I would make sure there isn't some miscommunication with the DM as to what stacking those feats would do. That definitely wouldn't work RAW (a shield is not a weapon, dual wield works with a weapon in the off hand and that is explicit iirc). I would straighten all that out into something less complicated, and would actually recommend you ditch the shield and go full 2 weapon, as you would benefit from increased crits for smiting.

Note: I have played this character starting from 3rd level, with DM's consent in regards to tavern brawler+shield+dual wielder.

....I thought that saying "fighting as a 'sword&board' quite literally ...with DM's approval" made it clear that we're on the same page with the matter.

However, that being said, I came to the same conclusion that it would be less complicated if I would just drop the shenanigans, and be a clear dual wielder with two weapons. I know there'll be some action economic issues with casting spells until I have War Caster and/or Ruby of the War Mage (XGtE), which I intend to either craft myself (because it's possible) or find somewhere if DM decides to drop one for us.

[McSkrag]

Don't forget about the Find Steed and Find Greater Steed spells.

Your steed can add another whole level of fun and flavor to your character. Ask your DM if you can get creative with the steed animal.

Out of combat they are fun for RP, travel, and carrying things.

In combat, steeds are squishy so get a lance, some barding, and cast a buff spell like Aid to toughen yourselves up. Then use hit and run tactics with 10' reach and d12 damage. Your steed can move and dodge, dash, or disengage while you attack.

It's still a bit sketchy since they can be easily killed but with room to maneuver it can be very effective.

Also it feels great to charge into combat with a lance on your steed.

[Arkhios]

Don't forget about the Find Steed and Find Greater Steed spells.

Your steed can add another whole level of fun and flavor to your character. Ask your DM if you can get creative with the steed animal.

Out of combat they are fun for RP, travel, and carrying things.

In combat, steeds are squishy so get a lance, some barding, and cast a buff spell like Aid to toughen yourselves up. Then use hit and run tactics with 10' reach and d12 damage. Your steed can move and dodge, dash, or disengage while you attack.

It's still a bit sketchy since they can be easily killed but with room to maneuver it can be very effective.

Also it feels great to charge into combat with a lance on your steed.

There is a place and time for a Lancer with a mount, but it's not what I want from this character.

I have not forgotten Find Steed or Find Greater Steed. In fact, I'm waiting to get the Find Greater Steed for the sole purpose of being able to ride a dire wolf eventually. But that's all I intend to do with it. Only travel, and look cool while doing so.

[Toofey]

It's not really an action economy problem, you may get other bonus actions but ultimately as Paladins tend to be a DPS build it doesn't matter as your bonus action (unless you go sorcerer and start dropping quickened or ... damn't forgot the term for the double casting thing) will most often be most useful from a damage perspective shopping for crits to smite on.

[Arkhios]

It's not really an action economy problem, you may get other bonus actions but ultimately as Paladins tend to be a DPS build it doesn't matter as your bonus action (unless you go sorcerer and start dropping quickened or ... damn't forgot the term for the double casting thing) will most often be most useful from a damage perspective shopping for crits to smite on.

It's an action economy problem for as long as I'm unable to cast spells while I'm also holding a weapon in my both hands. It's not entirely free (action-wise) to sheath and draw weapons during your turn. As it is, you can either draw or sheath a weapon once per turn for "free". Another time you must spend an action for it, or wait for next turn. At least with Dual Wielder I can draw or sheath two weapons for free at the same time.

Of course, Bard (College of Swords) would allow me to use a melee weapon as a spellcasting focus, but that's for bard spells only.