PDA

View Full Version : Build help: Tanky wisdom cleric



MightyMomo
2018-09-25, 06:16 AM
I've been working on a cleric for a new campaign, and could use some ideas / critique on the build I'm planning to run.

First of all, I would like to be able to fill out more than one role and I have no idea whether my current build will work as an all-around or fail in all aspects, since I've never tried playing cleric before.

The plan is to be a tanky wisdom based hill dwarf cleric, which can apply passive damage while constraining one or two mobs and healing when necessary.
I plan to not use a weapon because of RP reasons (Semi paccifist in the sense that I only hurt people with divine powers / divine justice. I would never use brute force to hurt someone)

I will probably play with:
A Bard
A Barbarian
A Rogue

We start at level 6, so here is my current build:


Fighter 1 / Cleric 5 (For heavy armor, con save, 1 AC, second wind)
Hill Dwarf for HP and no movement speed penalty with heavy armor
War caster for con save advantage on OA
Arcana domain Cleric for cantrips and cantrip damage (since I want to use my main action to help/heal)


Stats with all modifiers in level 6:


14 STR
10 DEX
16 CON
8 INT
16 WIS
10 CHA


With this I'd go with a shield and splint armor for early 20 AC. (Can't start with plate)

For cantrips I'd pick Lightning Lure, Ray of Frost from the wizard spell list and my main approach would be the following:


Cast Spiritual Weapon for Bonus attack damage
Cast Ray of Frost to reduce movement speed
Cast Spirit Guardians for passive aura damage and half movement
Cast Lightning Lure as OA if they try to move away (Pull them into aura)
Continue to either cast Ray of Frost or assisting team mates with guiding bolt (for rogue), healing or dodge action while hitting with Spiritual Weapon and Spirit Guardians.


This could potientially reduce a 30 movement speed enemy to 5 / 10 feet depending on what spell they got hit by first, effectively letting me CC them for days. Combining this with spells like plant growth from bard ally could potentially reduce them to 1.25 movement speed. (Rounded down to 1?)

My fears with this build are:
I end up not being able to tank, damage or heal enough.
Ray of Frost can't be cast if they're too close to me, potentially letting an enemy get away (I could use Ray of Frost as OA and then chase them down so they start in my aura, or pull them in as soon as I'm within range with Lightning Lure, but not sure if viable)
I could be better off with an actual weapon?
Most of my heals are bonus actions, not allowing me to attack with Spiritual Weapon.

Do you guys have any ideas of how to improve this build? I like the idea of being able to pull enemies closer and reducing their movement speed while killing them with passive damage, but this might be better done with another class? Since I probably won't be able to heal much anyways while attacking, is there another approach to the kind of playstyle?

Please don't hesitate to ask if I left something or if you have any questions or if I made an "illegal" move that isn't allowed by the handbook.

CTurbo
2018-09-25, 10:23 AM
I like the idea, but I would drop the level of Fighter and Just go pure Tempest Cleric. You get Heavy Armor and some nice reaction damage from getting attacked. Just grab Res(Con) or Warcaster at some point. Do you really NEED both? Spell Sniper + Thorn Whip is a great combo to pull enemies closer.

Nature Clerics get heavy armor and Thorn Whip already but they're not as cool to me as Tempests

viaFAMILIAR
2018-09-25, 07:29 PM
My question for your build is if you're going to tank, what would you do once engaged in close-combat? You'll be at disadvantage with ray of frost, being a ranged attack. Also 14 str is totally feasable for melee options. I don't know how important your character's ethos is to him/her, but tempest domain really has what you're after. Pickup magic initiate for those favorite cantrips and ask your DM if you could use your cleric spellcasting modifier instead. Booming blade works nicely as that opportunity spell attack granted by the war caster feat, and totally suits the tempest domain. Shocking grasp might sound bland, but denying a target's reaction is great for disengaging foes. I totally favor having a familiar for delivering touch spells. I would totally dip into wizard at some point.

Citadel97501
2018-09-25, 07:43 PM
I also really like Lightning Lure, its easily one of my favorite cantrips especially for a Sacred Guardian using Cleric even more fun with War Caster. However on the tankiness side of things may I suggest the Forge Domain from Xanathar's guide to everything, or the Nature Domain? The Forge domain is the epitomy of cleric tankiness, as 22 AC and fire resistance at level 6 is incredible, however you would lose the wizard/sorcerer cantrips. The Nature domain gets the elemental resistances and you could take Thorn Whip instead of Lightning Lure which works just as well but requires an melee spell attack roll instead of a saving throw, this would deal with most of the issues that the previous poster mentioned.

CTurbo
2018-09-25, 11:19 PM
The Tempest domain is easily the tankiest domain IMO. Forge beats it only in AC but falls WAY behind in damage output. A character with super high AC but few ways to punish enemies does NOT make a good tank as they can just be ignored.

Citadel97501
2018-09-25, 11:57 PM
The Tempest domain is easily the tankiest domain IMO. Forge beats it only in AC but falls WAY behind in damage output. A character with super high AC but few ways to punish enemies does NOT make a good tank as they can just be ignored.

Unless I am missing something big, I don't see it. I am only counting up to 14, as I don't see a need to compare the pinnacle abilities as both Forge and Tempest are GREAT, nature is much more DM dependent.

Tempest: That is a good point, but the idea seems to be with Clerics is that you want to be sticky to make Spirit Guardian really good, and strangely the Tempest blasts people away a lot of the time as their schtick is thunder and lightning. Although the Tempest could be an interesting catch 22 with Sentinel and a polearm, attack and me get zapped and knocked away (costs reaction and is Dex save), or try to run away and still likely get smacked dropping your speed to 0 (still costs reaction). Call Lightning also is very good for them due although it does take concentration which basically makes them blasters. (Note you control the distance of the lightning smack making it up to 10' away so you can still use reach weapons.)

Forge, does have some hefty damage output although losing martial weapon proficiency does hurt the basically free searing smite with all attacks makes their melee attacks much nastier than you would expect. Still not "sticky" but the benefits are definitely there, as they still have a great concentration spell with Spirit Guardians.

Nature: Sticky, and has equivalent defenses perhaps even better than a Tempest due to elemental resistance as a reaction, and does better damage with their divine strike than forge or Tempest since its the element you want taking advantage of weakness and avoiding resistances.

All in all, I would say that Tempest clerics are going to be behind unless they get a reach weapon that does lightning damage already, while Forge gets everything in house which kind of makes sense for their schtick of crafting, Nature clerics have more nitch spells and powerful area denial but that druid cantrip, either as Thorn Whip or Shillelagh are incredible but for different builds.

Jamesps
2018-09-26, 12:31 AM
The best tank I've been able to come up with is a straight hill dwarf nature cleric.

Maximize constitution and wisdom and take resilient con at 4th level. Use your club and shield with shilesomethin' to take attacks of opportunity on people that try to get away from you. Cast spiritual guardians the first round of combat, then spend the rest of the combat walking around next to your opponents dodging. You can use your 6th level ability to reduce damage from spells, hopefully maintaining your concentration. You'll have 20 AC and everyone has disadvantage to attack you. Further you do 3d8 damage to all opponents nearby and provide difficulty terrain.

It's hard to get tankier than that.

MagneticKitty
2018-09-26, 06:10 PM
I'm partial to fighter 1 (defensive fighting style) / forge cleric x / envoy warforged
Before asi, With standard array you can do:
Heavy plating
13 Str/ 10 dex/ 16 con/ 16 wis/ 8 int/ 12 cha
Or
Medium or heavy plating (I prefer this for versatility on stealth missions)
10 Str/ 14 dex/ 15 con/ 16 wis/ 8 int/ 12 cha

Medium
You can have 13 + 2 dex + proficiency + 2 regular shield +1 defensive fighting style +1 bless your armor
Ranges 21 - 25 a.c.

Heavy
You can have 16 + proficiency + 2 regular shield +1 defensive fighting style +1 bless your armor +1 wearing heavy at lv 6
23 - 27 a.c.

Resistance to all mundane at lv 17 forge cleric.
Resistance to fire at lv 6
With warforged you can switch to medium for stealth missions at the cost of 2 a.c. if your dex is 14.

Griswold
2018-09-26, 06:29 PM
I'm a big fan of Envoy Warforged for clerics. If you've got heavy armor proficiency, you can get a really high AC, and you can dump strength.

Compared with going dwarf, you're slightly faster and get an extra skill and tool proficiency, but hp is a little lower.