Cerebremancer advice Please

[Chaosticket]

Im looking for a 3.5 group, STILL.

While looking Im thinking up ideas that could work in a group. In particular Im interested in Prestige classes like the Mystic Theurge. They need to have a Single spellcasting stat. a Wizard/Cleric or Wizard/Druid would need permanent 19+ in Intelligence and Wisdom. A Wizard/Archivist could work but so many Scrolls and experience points required to learn would be a major pain.

The Cerebremancer might work because the Wizard and Psion both use Intelligence for spellcasting. I like the Wizard but as a primary class its easy to ruin because a GM doesnt have to have Scrolls to learn spells. A Psion is hard for me to understand. I heavily look at its Power List as worse than the Wizard, copying spells at best and lacking key abilities like Haste.

I dont know the real strength of the Psion because it has a small list or generally short ranged powers. Im worried I would just spam one ability. The Discipline problem restricts useful powers from the other 84% of Disciplines, so no cherry picking. At the same time the limited attack abilities means it would probably just use 1 power and make effectively a Warlock.

What would be a good way to make a Cerebremancer work? a Wizard would be great on utility, but also have strong abilities the Psion cant learn. the Psion's role is something I still havent figured out.

[Kelb_Panthera]

The psion's ability to spam its powers known without preparation -is- its draw. Take the easy, obvious examples of detecting magical and alignment auras; these are abilities you could use once or a dozen times in a day. A wizard has to either guess or leave slots open, a psion just does it.

My go-to strategy for a cerebremancer is to load up the psion side with powers for combat and stuff that you'll need frequently then use the wizard side to cover more situational concerns and down-time tasks.

[Nifft]

The other advantage of a Wizard / Psion / Cerebremancer is that you only use spellcasting for one side, so shenanigans like Precocious Apprentice seem to be well justified.

Wizard 1 (+ Precocious Apprentice) / Psion 3 / Cerebremancer 10 - perhaps with Able Learner as your human bonus feat, since some Psions get useful discipline skills. That'll take you to level 14, at which point you'll need to figure out what to do for the next 6 levels.

What level is your group starting, and how high do you expect to go?

[MaxiDuRaritry]

Once you cap out on cerebremancer, how about taking legacy champion for the remaining levels? Use the +1 level of class ability each level to bump cerebremancer. If epic cerebremancer follows the precedent that epic mystic theurge does, DON'T TAKE IT.

How about mind mage (http://www.angelfire.com/pro/demon_1/prc_mind_mage.htm), from Dragon #313?

[Chaosticket]

I know a Wizard's strengths and weaknesses a great deal more than the Psion's. I regard the Psion like the Sorcerer as it shares many of the ups and down.

Its a good point about the Psion and low level abilities. Having 1-3 Power Point abilities have a huge number of uses is useful. Its more the key powers/spells that worry me. As I understand is the Psion and psionic classes in general have to Augment powers by using additional PP compared to magic that automatically scales up.

A Psion is more limited in the kinds of spells. There is no Psionic Haste for example. If I could, I would pick key abilities for a Wizard in every incarnation, like Grease, Charm, Hold, Haste, and so on. a Psion is limited to non-optional Disciplines meaning about 50% of its entire spell list will always be off-limits. One key detail Im looking for a solution for is learning and unlearning Psion powers. There doesnt seem to be much point to keep low level attack abilities as the cost difference between Energy Wave and Energy Ray would be zero, but Energy Wave would be drastically more effective. There are also little to no Death Powers.

So Its a tricky combination. Normally I would say use the Wizard for utility using spells the Psion has no equivalent for. For the Psion, focus on reusing the more finite abilities. Thats the plan anyway. That would still be the ideal, but In all likelyhood the Wizard would prepare big combat spells like Chain Lightning, while the Psion would have buff spells on all the time.

PS: Im hoping for a level 30 campaign. Any Recommendations for groups would be helpful.

[Kelb_Panthera]

You don't want tthe same "key" effects on both sides of the divide. That's pointless. You'd be better off as a straight wizard. You want to use each class' advantages in selecting which effects to learn.

The psion has ultimate flexibility in how he uses his powers. There's no prep' and how much damage you scale into a power is something you decide at the moment you manifest it. The tradeoff is that you can't really afford niche powers and pulling full damage requires the equivalent of manifesting your highest level power every time.

The wizard, on the other hand, gets to scale damage for free and can get as many niche spells as he likes but the tradeoff is that he either has to guess if he's going to need something today or leave slots open and need 15 minutes to setup before he can use them. If he gets it wrong or doesn't have time, then he may as well not have the spell at all for the good it does him.

Choose the effects you learn for each side by selecting whichever of those paradigms best suits the effect and try to avoid overlap.

[Ramza00]

Just a reminder a psion and his discipline just prevents you from casting other discipline powers.

So for example a Shaper can manifest Daze Psionic for this is a Telepathy Power but this power is on the Psion / Wilder list but the same shaper can't manifest Charm, Psionic for this is a Telepathy power on the Telepath discipline list.

Put another way a Psion can manifest any power on the Psion / Wilder List+ His Discipline List but he can't manifest powers on other Discipline Lists unless he gains access to that discipline list by another method (such as the Feat Expanded Knowledge.)

----

There are over 300 psionic powers general psion / wilder in the various splat books. There are also 6 discipline class lists and these disciplines are roughly 12 to 20 powers long. You got options it is just generally a discipline 4th level power is a little stronger than a general psion / wilder 4th level power.

Also if you are 30th level you have the ability to just psychic chirugery all the discipline psionic powers.

[MaxiDuRaritry]

There are several areas where psions tend to surpass wizards.

1.) Energy conservation and recharging. Psions can choose how much energy to add to any given manifestation, and can lower or raise their output as needed. Stripped naked and need to start a campfire to keep from freezing ASAP? Just use 1 power point on energy ray or matter agitation and you're set. If you're a wizard and fireball is your lowest level fire spell available at the moment, too bad. There are also numerous ways to refill your power point reserve, with new ones still being found semi-regularly (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?177889-Brainstorm-for-Psionic-Tricks-Tactics-and-Combos-Handbook).

2.) Versatility per power. Most powers are far more versatile than most spells. And many level 1 powers are useful into epic due to augmentation -- or because they're just that good. Astral construct, the psionic answer to summon monster, creates bigger and meaner constructs the more you spend on it. Psionic minor creation is a level 1 power that doesn't augment, but if you can't constantly find uses for 20+ cubic feet of plant material at level 20, you're not trying very hard. If an enemy is immune to [fire], the wizard's fireball is useless against it, but energy ball can manifest as [cold] or [electricity] or [sonic]. Most powers have this built in.

3.) Action economy. It's absurdly easy for psionic types to bend the action economy over and subject it to massive amounts of corporal punishment. Its answer to time stop is only 6th level, and the synchronicity + Linked Power combo (which grants extra standard actions) is available at level 2 -- or level 1 if you spend an extra feat on Metapower. Anticipatory strike gives you an entire second turn during a round -- at the expense of your immediate action (which is refreshed as soon as you're done acting again) and next round's turn. Plus, the Expanded Psionics Handbook was the origin of immediate and swift actions, and they're baked right into the system, with numerous powers with those as their manifesting times. Several powers have augments that decrease manifestation times. And Linked Power alone allows you to manifest two different powers with one action. Core simply doesn't have those as options.

4.) Blasting without any particular optimization. Just take a few blasty powers (one ranged touch, one energy AoE, one [Force], and one DoT, and you're pretty much set). Energy powers in particular are nicely versatile, dealing one of four energy types on the fly, unlike most spells, which are set from the get-go. And most powers auto-scale on DCs, which is nice.

5.) Mind-control. Psionic charm and psionic dominate both augment to affect more and different critter types, and the DCs auto-scale as you do so. There are also lots of ways to boost your [mind-affecting] DCs. You don't need a level 9 power known to manifest the psi equivalent of dominate monster. They also don't require you to sing a song and dance the I'm a Little Teapot dance, letting everyone know you just cast a spell on someone. All it requires is a single Concentration check to avoid the psionic display. And then there's thrallherd. Just...thrallherd.

6.) Psicrystals are simply better than familiars in oh so many ways. From their hardness 8 to their granted abilities to their construct traits to the fact that they gain actual HD (and therefore ability score boosts and feats) to the fact that if your psicrystal dies you "get another one" (as you retain the feat, so you retain its benefits) to the fact that they have a ton of options to give them some major boosts right there in the XPH, psicrystals are pretty awesome.

7.) With the ability to boost your manifester level (and thus the number of power points you can augment powers with) and the ability to lower manifestation costs, you can access higher level magic effects earlier. For instance, there are ways to get 9th level astral constructs as early as 4th or 5th level (http://minmaxforum.com/index.php?topic=15897.0).

[Chaosticket]

Those are nice highlights. However some of them have hidden meanings. The best powers as Psion can get are locked up in the different Disciplines.

Egoist has your transformation Powers
Kineticist has your damage Powers.
Nomad has movement powers.
Seer has your divination Powers
Shaper has your summoning and item creation Powers
Telepathy has all he Mind Control Powers.

You only get 1 Discipline and the default General Power List is okay, but really lacking in basics like Charm, Energy Ball, and Fly. Overall that puts a heavy burden on searching for scrolls so the Wizard can cover the gaps..

My concerns are just looking for ways to alleviate the Powers Known problem, and synergizing it with a Wizard. The problem being it may be that without scrolls and picking the wrong Discipline can ruin the character.

[MaxiDuRaritry]

You can go at this a few different ways:

1.) Go specialist wizard and use psion to cover the schools you dropped. Ban the Enchantment school and go telepath. Or ban Evocation and go kineticist (or you could choose a different discipline and simply grab a few of the blasty powers from the psion/wilder list).

2.) Go generalist wizard and prepare your daily loadout around your chosen psion list, covering any gaps.

I've found that the shaper discipline is insanely versatile, able to cover very nearly any non-social situation you could think of, especially when combined with fun stuff you can think outside the box with, such as time hop. Creating matter from thin air is fantastic, just like the wizard's Conjuration school is. It's got minions, blasting, tool/weapon/armor/food/poison creation, can even create new planes of reality, and for social situations, it's got Bluff and Disguise (and UPD to use power stones from other disciplines). When I go shaper, however, I make sure to grab Linked Power to get around some of the more annoying manifesting times.

Make sure to grab vigor, share pain, and a psicrystal. Share the first with your psicrystal, then manifest the second on your psicrystal, and watch as your damage gets cut in half, and is then eaten by your temp hp (and your psicrystal's damage is reduced by its hardness before it eats into those temp hp).

Complete Psionic gives the rules for manifesting from a power stone using your own manifester level. If you're a shaper, buy lots of power stones of powers outside your list and use Use Psionic Device to manifest from them. Use your own pp (and flush the stone) to utilize your manifester level and other stats for augmentation and DC, as CPsi says. This is a nice workaround for your problem with the discipline lists.

There are tons of little things (https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7XkmnK-DY9YRkU5SVhCNWZqS0U/view?usp=sharing)* to make your experiences with psionics more interesting and enjoyable. Don't hesitate to ask if you need help or clarification with something.

Oh, and one last thing. YOU CANNOT SPEND MORE POWER POINTS THAN YOUR MANIFESTER LEVEL. There are ways to reduce costs and to boost your manifester level, but that rule is otherwise basically inviolate -- with one exception, but we don't talk about that. (*Cough*PowerLinkShards*Cough*)



*Download it and open it in Excel.

[Ramza00]

Tome of Ancient Lore (MIC most recent version, older version in Complete Divine.) One feat and you have all the arcane spells in existence. You are level 30 you can afford one feat to buy this divine relic (it has a gp cost) or spend the feats to craft one yourself.

[MaxiDuRaritry]

If you're allowed to take Leadership or hire a cohort, get a Convert-Spell-to-Power (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20070629a) Erudite (the class from Complete Psionic). Have him take all the powers you want to have that are on the non-discipline lists, and whatever spells he can get his hands on. You can use him as a power stone to fuel your own manifestations, and at higher level (once psychic chirurgery is available in power stone form), he can teach you whatever power or spell-to-power you want to have, bypassing your powers known restrictions. If this is, indeed, going into epic, you may want to purchase a few thought bottles for XP nesting (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?217819-Nesting-Thought-Bottles-millions-of-wishes). Then he can teach you every power and spell he knows via psychic chirurgery spam, and he can craft for you on your downtime (if any). If he takes a level in chameleon for the floating feat, he can use it for Expanded Knowledge for whatever power (or spell) he wants.

Once you hit epic, start multiclassing into another manifesting class (and a PrC to progress it; I suggest ardent and anarchic initiate for the stacking manifester level boosters and the ardent's weird power learning mechanic) to boost your power points (which all go into one pool to manifest from) and start going nuts on your manifester level boosters. Gaining additional levels in psion and wizard won't do anything once their ML and CL reach 20 natively, and more spellcasting classes won't do anything, so having additional manifesting levels will grant you significantly more by adding to your pp pool.

If you can take Supernatural Transformation (Psionics), however, start single-level dipping of manifester level classes as much as you can once you hit epic. All of your MLs will equal your HD, and you'll get tons of pp commensurately for each one of them. Vastly moreso if you take mind mage with the Twin Wells, Same Source ability, since it acts as a multiplier, especially with psithief and Master SpellPsithief, below.

You may also want to look at the psionic version of spellthief with the Master SpellPsithief variant of the feat. It'll multiply your CLs and MLs, as well. The Magic Mantle (treat magic and psionics the same for all purposes) should allow Master SpellPsithief to stack your CLs with your MLs.

Also look up the easy bake wizard (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?325933-Easy-Bake-Wizard-Handbook) (including the eidetic wizard ACF).

Also also, https://rpg.stackexchange.com/questions/51028/how-does-a-wizard-achieve-a-very-cheap-spellbook-full-of-spells

[OgresAreCute]

Sorcerer/Healer/Mystic Theurge with the dynamic priest feat is SAD Charisma :smallamused:

[MaxiDuRaritry]

Sorcerer/Healer/Mystic Theurge with the dynamic priest feat is SAD Charisma :smallamused:Neither of those classes is a manifester, and mystic theurge is not cerebremancer.

If you go sorcerer for your arcane class, take Arcane Preparation and Greyhawk Method as your starting feats. Four spells known per level? And you can cast spontaneously from among all of them? Yes please! Now we just need more spell slots to cast them from.

Note that wizards with Eidetic Spellcaster and spell points can cast from their memories, somewhat like sorcerers can, so Arcane Preparation would basically give the sorcerer new spells known like that, which Greyhawk Method ramps up to crazy-town.

Are there feats to make sorcerers Int-centric? I know there is in 3rd party (Lost Tradition, from Bastards & Bloodlines), but are there any 1st party ones?

[OgresAreCute]

Neither of those classes is a manifester, and mystic theurge is not cerebremancer.

If you go sorcerer for your arcane class, take Arcane Preparation and Greyhawk Method as your starting feats. Four spells known per level? And you can cast spontaneously from among all of them? Yes please! Now we just need more spell slots to cast them from.

Note that wizards with Eidetic Spellcaster and spell points can cast from their memories, somewhat like sorcerers can, so Arcane Preparation would basically give the sorcerer new spells known like that, which Greyhawk Method ramps up to crazy-town.

Are there feats to make sorcerers Int-centric? I know there is in 3rd party (Lost Tradition, from Bastards & Bloodlines), but are there any 1st party ones?

I was referring to this part about SAD Theurges.



While looking Im thinking up ideas that could work in a group. In particular Im interested in Prestige classes like the Mystic Theurge. They need to have a Single spellcasting stat. a Wizard/Cleric or Wizard/Druid would need permanent 19+ in Intelligence and Wisdom. A Wizard/Archivist could work but so many Scrolls and experience points required to learn would be a major pain.

[MaxiDuRaritry]

I was referring to this part about SAD Theurges.I'm pretty sure anyone who had to invest heavily in Cha is pretty sad. :(

[Nifft]

I'm pretty sure anyone who had to invest heavily in Cha is pretty sad. :(

But they have a sufficient Bluff bonus that they can fake being happy & confident in front of others, and that's what's really important after all.

[Chaosticket]

Okay obsessive tendencies waning for now. My complaints are more less what you would get against any "Spells Known" type of Caster.

As a single class I would pick the Variant Erudite over the Psion. Difficult, but Awesome.

As a single prestige character I would pick the Psion/Thrallherd and have an Erudite Thrall. I dont know what would be good for a second Thrall.

as a Dual Caster well thats tricky. Im looking at the Psion more for regularly useful abilities, maybe as the Primary class in the build. the Wizard would be the Secondary, to learn any and all spells possible but not reliant if I dont find a Scroll of Haste ASAP. In combination this means the Spells Known problem is supposed to be supplemented by a Spellbook.

Of course a Gestalt would work much better.

[MaxiDuRaritry]

Fusion + astral seed would get you a gestalt+ character. At level 30, it wouldn't even be THAT overpowered, unless everyone else is playing T5 and T4.

Ask your DM if you could play a lower level gestalt character? Maybe play with an LA of +2 for the privilege?

[Chaosticket]

Dual Prestige classes are the closest thing most campaigns will get to Gestalt characters, and then to fully use them it would have to be a level 30 campaign.

Mystic/Eldritch/Psychic Theurge, Arcane Hierophant, Cerebremancer, Ultimate Magus

The trick in most of them is getting Single Attribute Dependency so they only need one stat for casting requirements, DCs, and general benefits. Intelligence is #1 in my opinion for skills. Wisdom is #2 but there are other ways to get Will Saving Throws. Charisma is good for particular skills, but if you dont have them as Class Skills and high intelligence its a waste.

[MaxiDuRaritry]

Dual Prestige classes are the closest thing most campaigns will get to Gestalt characters, and then to fully use them it would have to be a level 30 campaign.

Mystic/Eldritch/Psychic Theurge, Arcane Hierophant, Cerebremancer, Ultimate Magus

The trick in most of them is getting Single Attribute Dependency so they only need one stat for casting requirements, DCs, and general benefits. Intelligence is #1 in my opinion for skills. Wisdom is #2 but there are other ways to get Will Saving Throws. Charisma is good for particular skills, but if you dont have them as Class Skills and high intelligence its a waste.
Err... And...?

[Sleven]

@Chaosticket

Do you understand that you can pick powers from any discipline that are on the general psion/wilder list yet? Because you keep bringing it up, and I'm not sure how to move forward with helping you until you understand how psion works. You should also probably give some kind of indication as to what exactly you want your cerebremancer to be able to do. That way people can help you pick powers and spells (the subject you seem to be struggling with the most).

What I can help you with right now is making sure you don't get misled by any posters in the thread...



Why do I always have to be the bearer of bad news?


If you can take Supernatural Transformation (Psionics), however, start single-level dipping of manifester level classes as much as you can once you hit epic. All of your MLs will equal your HD, and you'll get tons of pp commensurately for each one of them. Vastly moreso if you take mind mage with the Twin Wells, Same Source ability, since it acts as a multiplier, especially with psithief and Master SpellPsithief, below.

Doesn't work because Supernatural Transformation (Psionics) would set your psionic abilities to your HD. Period. It wouldn't do it for separate classes because that's not what you actually took Supernatural Transformation for. There is no separate Psionics/Psionic powers special attack (which is what you're using Supernatural Transformation to modify), regardless of how many psionic classes you take. If you can find an example of this being treated separately, I would be open to changing my mind.


The Magic Mantle (treat magic and psionics the same for all purposes)

Except that's not what the Magic Mantle actually says, and what it does say is open to interpretation. The most conservative reading is "regular transparency rules", the middle of the road is "ML and CL", the next most liberal is "other abilities with parity", and the ROFL TO!?! reading is "even feats like metamagic and Master Spellthief work because lul". People oft forget that Master Spellthief is specific to arcane casters, I guess?

...I never understood why people don't take the ridiculous TO reading to its ultimate conclusion and go Magic Mantle -> Supernatural Transformation (Psionics) -> Spellcasting class -> [???] -> PROFIT! now all my spellcasting is supernatural too!?!?


If you go sorcerer for your arcane class, take Arcane Preparation and Greyhawk Method as your starting feats. Four spells known per level? And you can cast spontaneously from among all of them? Yes please! Now we just need more spell slots to cast them from.

Note that wizards with Eidetic Spellcaster and spell points can cast from their memories, somewhat like sorcerers can, so Arcane Preparation would basically give the sorcerer new spells known like that, which Greyhawk Method ramps up to crazy-town.

C'mon. Did you even read the feat on this one? The first half of the first sentence of the benefits section specifies adding the spells to your spellbook, not your spells known.



Fusion + astral seed

Doesn't work, as much as my little heart wants it to. Not even sure why people keep bringing it up. Reading the power descriptions of Astral Seed and Fusion makes it pretty clear:

and transformed into a living, breathing body that is an exact duplicate of your body at the time you manifested astral seed

You and another willing, corporeal, living creature of the same or smaller size fuse into one being. As the manifester, you control the actions of the fused being.
You are still you, the creature is still the creature, the fused being is something else entirely. The fused being's body is not your body, even though you can control it. And before you bring up Greater Metamorphosis, an exact duplicate would include any remaining spell/power durations.




Sorcerer/Healer/Mystic Theurge with the dynamic priest feat is SAD Charisma :smallamused:

Real optimizers play Phaerimm wilders mind switched with a Lilitu while taking levels in psychic theurge after a cleric dip, for Triple 9s level of SAD.

[Nifft]

Why do I always have to be the bearer of bad news?

Doesn't work because Supernatural Transformation (Psionics) would set your psionic abilities to your HD. Period. It wouldn't do it for separate classes because that's not what you actually took Supernatural Transformation for. There is no separate Psionics/Psionic powers special attack (which is what you're using Supernatural Transformation to modify), regardless of how many psionic classes you take. If you can find an example of this being treated separately, I would be open to changing my mind.

There's a separate monster ability category called "Psionics (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbilities.htm#psionics)", which is unrelated to anything that a Psion gets, in the same way that spell-like abilities are mechanically distinct from what a spellcaster gets -- and the monster Psionics ability is a category of spell-like abilities anyway.

Nobody tries to say you can take Supernatural Transformation (wizard spellcasting) or Ability Focus (cleric spellcasting), because spells and spell-like abilities are pretty well understood, and those assertions wouldn't fool anyone.

But psionics is less well understood, and the monster special ability Psionics is somewhat confusingly named. Thus, some people seem to think that the existence of the Psionics special ability can be used in conjunction with hand-waving to trick a DM into allowing something similarly stupid and unsupported. You're not the first person to correct Maxi about this stuff, and I expect you won't be the last.

[Chaosticket]

@Chaosticket

Do you understand that you can pick powers from any discipline that are on the general psion/wilder list yet? Because you keep bringing it up, and I'm not sure how to move forward with helping you until you understand how psion works. You should also probably give some kind of indication as to what exactly you want your cerebremancer to be able to do. That way people can help you pick powers and spells (the subject you seem to be struggling with the most).

What I can help you with right now is making sure you don't get misled by any posters in the thread...



Only 1 Discipline, not all 6. Thees no way to get a Generalist Psion.

If its not clear already I would prefer a character that has a Spellbook so you can learn your entire list, but more flexibility than preparing every single slot. When playing a Wizard I usually have a "combat book" that is more or less just each slot of Spell level filled with the same spell, and no Metamagics. Basically 9 spells just multiplied.

The problem with Spontaneous is just they have the finite cap on Known. Im always looking for ways to break that.

A Cerebremancer has both a Spellbook, and Spontaneous casting. Sounds perfect, right? The problem is still that the Psion half still cant learn all the best and/or unique psionic powers. An Erudite wouldnt work as a replacement as it has a class feature ruining it as a multiclass, "Unique power per day".

So its not really a synergy between the Psion and the Wizard. For the most part the Psion would just learn alot of basic abilities and spam them, while the Wizard would (try) to learn all the abilities the Psion cant, like Fly, or Charm, but may also learn the same things making the Wizard redundant and still not giving the character a larger list than a regular Psion. So its REALLY easy for a DM to ruin the entire character concept just by withholding scrolls.
------------------------
An Archivist/Wizard/Mystic Theurge has theoretically the greater high point as a Dual-Caster. All Arcane and Divine Spells? If it didnt require over a hundred scrolls and Experience to learn new spells to actually do anything. Why am I not doing it right now? Well I still dont have a 3.5 group, but also because of the Scroll Problem.

Other Dual-Casters have MAD problems.
Clerics and Druids have it easy by comparison. 100% of your spell list known at all times, and when you dont have the right spell prepared you can still use a mace or Wild Shape.

Wait a minute. I think I read about a prestige class that combines Divine and Psions, the Psychic Theurge?

[Ramza00]

Powers Known
A psion begins play knowing three psion powers of your choice. Each time he achieves a new level, he unlocks the knowledge of new powers.


Choose the powers known from the psion power list, or from the list of powers of your chosen discipline.
You cannot choose powers from restricted discipline lists other than your own discipline list.
You can choose powers from disciplines other than your own if they are not on a restricted discipline list. (Exception: The feats Expanded Knowledge and Epic Expanded Knowledge do allow a psion to learn powers from the lists of other disciplines or even other classes.)
A psion can manifest any power that has a power point cost equal to or lower than his manifester level.
http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/classes/psion.htm

I made it bullet points so it is easier to read.

So a Shaper psion can still take Telepathy powers, but he can't manifest powers that say specifically Telepath.

Thus Charm, Psionic is not accessible but Daze Psionic is. That is because Charm, Psionic says Level: Telepath 1 but Daze, Psionic says Level: Psion/wilder 1. Both Charm, Psionic and Daze, Psionic are of the Telepathy Discipline.

Note though expanded knowledge also exists, and Psychic Chirugery even allows you to manifest powers that are of the Discipline where you normally have to be specialized in that Discipline, but Psychic Chirugery is an exception to the general rules.

[MaxiDuRaritry]

I'll get around to responding to other comments later, as I've been under the weather lately, and right now I'm on my phone (and still feeling not so good).

In the meantime, if you want to combo wizard and psion, check out the mind mage PrC, from Dragon Mag #313.

Also, http://www.angelfire.com/pro/demon_1/prc_mind_mage.htm

Wiz 1 (with Precocious Apprentice)/Psion 3/Cerebremancer 4 should qualify you for mind mage easily enough.