Am I the only one who thinks Jim Carrey should play The Joker?

[Traab]

I really think it would be a perfect role for him. Carrey is of course most famous for his crazy roles, but he is surprisingly good at being creepy and disturbing when he wants to be just by changing his expression a trifle. I could see him pull off a solid cesar romero style joker bit with a creepy edge thrown in that makes you edgy about what happens if something ever does wipe that smile off his face. A lethal edge to his humor that straddles the line between pie in the face humor, and pie tin full of acidic sludge to the face "humor"

A deeper character could also work. Ive always said a semi 4th wall straddling joker could be great. He doesnt stare at the cameras or provide winks and nods to the audience like deadpool, but he is fully aware that this is entertainment and he has a job to do, a role to play. Certain things must be done to progress "the storyline" and he is fully aware that the second and third act are going to go downhill for him and it drives him nuts because he wants to WIN dangit! And yet even so things happen that make him almost self defeating. A Joker who is crazy to the other characters but WE know is actually right could be fascinating to see played out and I think carrey can do it. A joker who is constantly warring with narrative convention and his desire to win for a change. Basically this scene (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xAMYHJYesM) but all in his head.

[TaRix]

I really think it would be a perfect role for him. Carrey is of course most famous for his crazy roles, but he is surprisingly good at being creepy and disturbing when he wants to be just by changing his expression a trifle. I could see him pull off a solid cesar romero style joker bit with a creepy edge thrown in that makes you edgy about what happens if something ever does wipe that smile off his face. A lethal edge to his humor that straddles the line between pie in the face humor, and pie tin full of acidic sludge to the face "humor"

A deeper character could also work. Ive always said a semi 4th wall straddling joker could be great. He doesnt stare at the cameras or provide winks and nods to the audience like deadpool, but he is fully aware that this is entertainment and he has a job to do, a role to play. Certain things must be done to progress "the storyline" and he is fully aware that the second and third act are going to go downhill for him and it drives him nuts because he wants to WIN dangit! And yet even so things happen that make him almost self defeating. A Joker who is crazy to the other characters but WE know is actually right could be fascinating to see played out and I think carrey can do it. A joker who is constantly warring with narrative convention and his desire to win for a change. Basically this scene (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xAMYHJYesM) but all in his head.

But he's already played the Riddler. Fairly nicely, as well.

[Peelee]

He should absolutely not play the Joker. He should play the Riddler. Which, I said note, he has not done yet; he played Ace Ventura: Batman Villain. He would be a phenomenal Riddler in any good Batman movie.

[Traab]

He should absolutely not play the Joker. He should play the Riddler. Which, I said note, he has not done yet; he played Ace Ventura: Batman Villain. He would be a phenomenal Riddler in any good Batman movie.

He played frank gorshen riddler from the adam west series. *EDIT* Also, im pretty sure none of that is canon anymore so no reason not to reset. Keep trying till we find an actor who can pull off a proper joker! :smallbiggrin:

[Peelee]

He played frank gorshen riddler from the adam west series.

Watch Frank Goshen Riddler, then watch Ace Ventura: Pet Detective. He clearly plays the latter. Ace Ventura was the bane of his career after it catapulted him to stardom. Hell, my main description of Yes Man is Liar, Liar with 90% less Ace Ventura. Dudes a fantastic actor, great comedic chops, but his ridiculously over-the-top style was a holdover from his previous work.

Jack Nicholson didn't play Caesar Romero Joker. Val Kilmer didn't play Adam West Batman. Julie Newmar Catwoman wasn't emulated by Michelle Pfeiffer. Why would they have wanted Carrey to pay homage to Gorshen when nobody else in that series ever did the same?

Burton clearly tried to distance his Batman movies as far away from the camp series as possible. Don't come at me with a Gorsben homage. Unless Tim Burton or Jim Carrey themselves openly say so, I refuse to believe it. And if they do say so, they did a crap job of it.

[Mordar]

He played frank gorshen riddler from the adam west series.

I don't think so. As "campy" as the TV series was, Riddler had an edge to him that went beyond Joker, Penguin or most of the other villains. Almost as if he and Kitt's/Newmar's Catwoman were the only non-hero characters being played straight. I agree with Peelee. Carrey's effort was much more a retread of his slapstick stupid characters, though certainly less egregious than he could have been. In fact, I rank his Riddler as the second worst portrayal of a villain in the movies (Swenson Bane is the worst).

The funny thing is, I think Jim Carrey is a much better actor than I ever used to think, based on The Truman Show and what little I saw of The Majestic. Still, I wouldn't want to see him touching a Batman villain again. That ship sailed and the casting would only be because someone wanted to see his trademark flavor of crazy again.


Watch Frank Goshen Riddler, then watch Ace Ventura: Pet Detective. He clearly plays the latter. Ace Ventura was the bane of his career after it catapulted him to stardom. Hell, my main description of Yes Man is Liar, Liar with 90% less Ace Ventura. Dudes a fantastic actor, great comedic chops, but his ridiculously over-the-top style was a holdover from his previous work.

Jack Nicholson didn't play Caesar Romero Joker. Val Kilmer didn't play Adam West Batman. Julie Newmar Catwoman wasn't emulated by Michelle Pfeiffer. Why would they have wanted Carrey to pay homage to Gorshen when nobody else in that series ever did the same?

Burton clearly tried to distance his Batman movies as far away from the camp series as possible. Don't come at me with a Gorsben homage. Unless Tim Burton or Jim Carrey themselves openly say so, I refuse to believe it. And if they do say so, they did a crap job of it.

Yup, Peelee is a ninja. But I'm leaving my text there too...because I think Pfeiffer did have some Newmar in her Catwoman.

- M

[Rogar Demonblud]

He'd be a hoot as the menacing Clown Prince of Crime, instead of the psychopath of the week fare we've been stuck with for the last couple decades. Is the makeup and crazy act a front, or is it real?

[Tyndmyr]

Nah. He's...more wacky, when in top form. He doesn't quite have the gravitas to pull it off. And frankly, he's been slipping of late. I'm not sure what's off about him, but he seems to be going a bit crazy, and not as an act. That's unfortunate, but it makes him even less appropriate to play the Joker.

The Joker's a difficult character to nail just right. It isn't enough to merely act crazy, it's a very specific kind of crazy. Hit the wrong note, and the whole affair just feels off.

[Tvtyrant]

I really want a live action Batman Beyond movie where Keaton plays old Batman and either Goldbloom or Hamil playa old joker. Make all of the old robins former Batman actors, it would be hilarious.

[GloatingSwine]

He should absolutely not play the Joker. He should play the Riddler. Which, I said note, he has not done yet; he played Ace Ventura: Batman Villain. He would be a phenomenal Riddler in any good Batman movie.

I suspect the direction for Jim Carrey and Tommy Lee Jones was to have a camera pointed at them and be told "go on then."

[Sapphire Guard]

He'd be good, but we don't need another Joker right now. He's overexposed as it is.

[JoshL]

I used to hate Jim Carrey with a deep and abiding passion. It wasn't until I saw Man on the Moon (years after it came out) that I realized he is a fantastic actor. So I've never actually seen the Cable Guy, but from what I understand, a) I probably should and b) it is the exact blend of wacky and menace that could make a good Joker.

That said, I second the "too much Joker" sentiment, with the exception if they were to do a stand alone movie based on Arkham Asylum: A Serious House On Serious Earth.

[keybounce]

Wasn't he already in the movies with the line, "Your entrance was good, his was better"?

[Kyberwulf]

I don't think he was a good Riddler, for the same reason he wouldn't make a good Joker.

He just goes HAM all the time. His Riddler wasn't good, not because of his acting. As other people have stated, it's cause he just goes goofy.

As Joker though, IF big IF, someone could rein him in, I think he would have a good shot at being the Joker.

I mean, in Kickass 2, he showed he could play something of what I think the Joker is inside. So to answer the question, SHOULD he play the Joker. No. But, COULD he play him? I think the potential is there for him to play the best Joker there is. Who would play a good Batman to his Joker?

[Peelee]

I don't think he was a good Riddler, for the same reason he wouldn't make a good Joker.

He just goes HAM all the time. His Riddler wasn't good, not because of his acting. As other people have stated, it's cause he just goes goofy.

As Joker though, IF big IF, someone could rein him in, I think he would have a good shot at being the Joker.

I mean, in Kickass 2, he showed he could play something of what I think the Joker is inside. So to answer the question, SHOULD he play the Joker. No. But, COULD he play him? I think the potential is there for him to play the best Joker there is. Who would play a good Batman to his Joker?

Played goofy, not plays goofy. Again, watch Liar Liar and Yes Man. Incredibly similar movies, but one sucks and one is awesome because he plays it way better now. I firmly believe it'd be the same for the Riddler, and Jim Carrey would knock it out of the park.

[Fyraltari]

I really want a live action Batman Beyond movie where Keaton plays old Batman and either Goldbloom or Hamil playa old joker. Make all of the old robins former Batman actors, it would be hilarious.

I did not know I needed this but I do.

[Eldan]

So, Keaton is old Batman. That would make... Ben Affleck as Nightwing, George Clooney as ... Damian Wayne? Christian Bale as Jason Todd?

[Tvtyrant]

So, Keaton is old Batman. That would make... Ben Affleck as Nightwing, George Clooney as ... Damian Wayne? Christian Bale as Jason Todd?

I was going to go Clooney as Nightwing (eldest), Afleck as Jason Todd (biggest/most edgy), Bale would be Tim Drake (the good son), Damian doesn't need to be in the movie :/

I suppose if we want Damian we need to add Val Kilmer, so put Affleck as Damian and make Kilmer Jason Todd.

[Eldan]

I guess Afleck is even edgier than Bale, yeah. And I forgot about Tim Drake.

[TeChameleon]

A Batman Beyond live-action movie with Mark Hammill as an older Joker?

Yeah, you had me at Mark Hammill. I don't even care about the rest of the movie- at worst it will be a Street Fighter: The Movie scenario where the villain takes borderline-unwatchable drek and elevates it to pure art every second they're on the screen.

Seriously, have you ever seen video of Hammill doing his Joker voice? The man cannot sit still when he's doing it. It would be a bloody crime if he never played a live-action Joker.

That being said... the entire Batclan coming out of retirement to help Terry McGinnis curbstomp the Joker's Grand Finale? The Robins already mentioned, Barbara Gordon, Stephanie Brown, Cassandra Cain, Helena Bertinelli (and her protege, Helena Wayne :smallamused:), Luke Fox, Kathy Kane... if you want to stretch it a little, Renee Montoya, Jean-Paul Valley, Selina Kyle, Bette Kane, maybe even Sasha Bordeaux and Basil Karlo. Could be fun... and it would necessitate somebody snarking at Bats about him 'working alone' <.<

[Wookieetank]

A Batman Beyond live-action movie with Mark Hammill as an older Joker?

Yeah, you had me at Mark Hammill. I don't even care about the rest of the movie- at worst it will be a Street Fighter: The Movie scenario where the villain takes borderline-unwatchable drek and elevates it to pure art every second they're on the screen.

Seriously, have you ever seen video of Hammill doing his Joker voice? The man cannot sit still when he's doing it. It would be a bloody crime if he never played a live-action Joker.


He'd played the Trickster in the live action Flash show from 2014 and it was fantastic. Had a very Jokery vibe to it, but I'm not sure if that's Mark Hamil, or the source material on that one, since I'm not familiar with the character outside of the show.

[Knaight]

Played goofy, not plays goofy. Again, watch Liar Liar and Yes Man. Incredibly similar movies, but one sucks and one is awesome because he plays it way better now. I firmly believe it'd be the same for the Riddler, and Jim Carrey would knock it out of the park.

I've seen Liar Liar, and the conclusion I've drawn from it is that Jim Carrey should retire.

[Mordar]

I've seen Liar Liar, and the conclusion I've drawn from it is that Robin Williams should retire.

Um...uh...I'm not sure I think that's a great line...

- M

[Kyberwulf]

How did you get Robin Williams from Liar, Liar, and Yes, Man?

Also, Robin Williams ...um.. doesn't have to worry about retiring anymore?

[Traab]

Robin williams would have kicked butt in liar liar.

[Knaight]

How did you get Robin Williams from Liar, Liar, and Yes, Man?

Also, Robin Williams ...um.. doesn't have to worry about retiring anymore?
I have no idea - I'd meant to type Jim Carrey.


Robin williams would have kicked butt in liar liar.
He absolutely would have. I'd generally say that every single Jim Carrey movie could have been improved by using Robin Williams instead. Granted, a lot of them would potentially still be trash (e.g. The Mask), but they'd at least be trash with at least one good actor in them.

Heck, there's a case to be made that you could replace Jim Carrey with Adam Sandler and it would be marginally better.

[Traab]

I have no idea - I'd meant to type Jim Carrey.


He absolutely would have. I'd generally say that every single Jim Carrey movie could have been improved by using Robin Williams instead. Granted, a lot of them would potentially still be trash (e.g. The Mask), but they'd at least be trash with at least one good actor in them.

Heck, there's a case to be made that you could replace Jim Carrey with Adam Sandler and it would be marginally better.

I wouldnt go that far, jim carrey is not that bad of an actor. I actually enjoyed liar liar rather a lot. And while robin williams could have pulled off the character great, I dunno so much about the relationship part as he was starting to look his age. It wouldnt have matched up well with a 63 year old dad and his kid thats like, ten.

[Velaryon]

In fact, I rank his Riddler as the second worst portrayal of a villain in the movies (Swenson Bane is the worst).

I would say Schwarzenegger as Mr. Freeze was the worst. And though it's been some years since I last watched Batman Forever, I think I remember hating Tommy Lee Jones as Two-Face more than I hated Carrey as the Riddler. At least Riddler had some characterization - Tommy Lee Jones pretty much just laughs all the time. Did someone tell him he was playing the Joker?

I assume we're limiting to the Tim Burton/Joel Schumacher films? If not, I can add Anne Hathaway's Catwoman, Tom Hardy's Bane, and Jared Leto's Joker to the list as well (not necessarily in that order).



Burton clearly tried to distance his Batman movies as far away from the camp series as possible. Don't come at me with a Gorsben homage. Unless Tim Burton or Jim Carrey themselves openly say so, I refuse to believe it. And if they do say so, they did a crap job of it.

How much say did Tim Burton have? He was only a producer on Batman Forever, not the director.



So, Keaton is old Batman. That would make... Ben Affleck as Nightwing, George Clooney as ... Damian Wayne? Christian Bale as Jason Todd?

Why would you want George Clooney within 500 miles of another superhero project of any kind? If your aim is just to collect people from all the Batman films, why not use Chris O'Donnell? He wasn't great, but he was 100x more right for his role than Clooney was for his.

[dps]

Why would you want George Clooney within 500 miles of another superhero project of any kind?

FWIW, I think Clooney was fine as Bruce Wayne, he just didn't work as Batman. I'm not sure that I've ever found anyone convincing as both Bruce Wayne and Batman; Keaton was probably the closest.

[Peelee]

I have no idea - I'd meant to type Jim Carrey.


He absolutely would have. I'd generally say that every single Jim Carrey movie could have been improved by using Robin Williams instead. Granted, a lot of them would potentially still be trash (e.g. The Mask), but they'd at least be trash with at least one good actor in them.

Heck, there's a case to be made that you could replace Jim Carrey with Adam Sandler and it would be marginally better.
Wholly agree for old Carrey movies. Which is the point I've been making; once he dropped the Ace Ventura shtick, he was phenomenally better

FWIW, I think Clooney was fine as Bruce Wayne, he just didn't work as Batman.
Ha! I've said that before too. Doesn't hurt that he basically Wayne in real life, minus the orphan bit.

[Fyraltari]

FWIW, I think Clooney was fine as Bruce Wayne, he just didn't work as Batman. I'm not sure that I've ever found anyone convincing as both Bruce Wayne and Batman; Keaton was probably the closest.

Bruce Wayne is not supposed to work as Batman either!

I don't know about Carrey, but I have a good feeling about this Joaquin Phoenix person.

[Wraith]

FWIW, I think Clooney was fine as Bruce Wayne, he just didn't work as Batman. I'm not sure that I've ever found anyone convincing as both Bruce Wayne and Batman; Keaton was probably the closest.

Kevin Conroy. People tend to think of him as a voice actor, but he's quite heavily built and also 6'2" which makes him only second to Ben Affleck in terms of tallest person to portray Batman.

That he also helped pioneer The Voice to portray Bruce Wayne effectively and has a history of acting along side Mark Hamill... Damn, Kevin Conroy as Old Bruce, Mark Hamill as Old Joker and a new comer as Terry McGuinness? That's a movie I'd like to see.

[Peelee]

Kevin Conroy. People tend to think of him as a voice actor, but he's quite heavily built and also 6'2" which makes him only second to Ben Affleck in terms of tallest person to portray Batman.

That he also helped pioneer The Voice to portray Bruce Wayne effectively and has a history of acting along side Mark Hamill... Damn, Kevin Conroy as Old Bruce, Mark Hamill as Old Joker and a new comer as Terry McGuinness? That's a movie I'd like to see.

Conroy Batman is best Batman. Dude's pretty skinny though.

[Wraith]

Huh, I remember him as being pretty big. He is in his 60's now though, so maybe it was an older picture that I was remembering. :smalltongue:

Still, as Old Bruce it still kind of works. He doesn't look frail, but he'd no longer be the barrel-chested Olympic-grade athlete that he used to be.

[Peelee]

Huh, I remember him as being pretty big. He is in his 60's now though, so maybe it was an older picture that I was remembering. :smalltongue:

Still, as Old Bruce it still kind of works. He doesn't look frail, but he'd no longer be the barrel-chested Olympic-grade athlete that he used to be.

I'm a huge fan of Batman Beyond, and I wholly support dude as a live-action Old Bruce.

[Willie the Duck]

Yup, Peelee is a ninja. But I'm leaving my text there too...because I think Pfeiffer did have some Newmar in her Catwoman.

The 1989 Batman movie was almost going to be a comedic take on the subject (don't knock it, at that point, no one knew serious super hero movies could work). There are little bits of that DNA still lingering in the two Burton movies. That's why I'm not sure about Carrey as the Joker. Jack Nicholson used what Carrey would bring to the role as minor subtext to his main portrayal, like he was mostly a serious villain with a bit of a clown quirk after having a breakdown when his face got acidized, but now there's a nugget of a truly insane, Carey-like character in the edges of that madness. I don't know that having a full-on version of that let loose would add anything to that already done portrayal.


And though it's been some years since I last watched Batman Forever, I think I remember hating Tommy Lee Jones as Two-Face more than I hated Carrey as the Riddler. At least Riddler had some characterization - Tommy Lee Jones pretty much just laughs all the time. Did someone tell him he was playing the Joker?

Tommy Lee Jones did the movie because his son loved Batman comics, and it would be a cool way to make a living while also pleasing his son (and if you've seen Jones' imdb page, he clearly thinks of acting as a job and isn't afraid to do something for the paycheck). He got to the shoot and discovered that he wholly and truly loathed Jim Carrey, and realized that it would be a horrible movie and that it could damage his career. So I think what you are seeing is Jones (and or the director) trying to paper over/hide behind a simple mask so no one sees the 'what the hell did I get myself into?'-expression on the actor's face.

[Peelee]

The 1989 Batman movie was almost going to be a comedic take on the subject (don't knock it, at that point, no one knew serious super hero movies could work). There are little bits of that DNA still lingering in the two Burton movies. That's why I'm not sure about Carrey as the Joker. Jack Nicholson used what Carrey would bring to the role as minor subtext to his main portrayal, like he was mostly a serious villain with a bit of a clown quirk after having a breakdown when his face got acidized, but now there's a nugget of a truly insane, Carey-like character in the edges of that madness. I don't know that having a full-on version of that let loose would add anything to that already done portrayal.
If you've played the Arkham games, I basically saw the Riddler of those as exactly what we'd get out of a serious Jim Carrey Riddler. Also, Arkham Riddler is my favorite Riddler, which does support my bias towards Carrey here.

Tommy Lee Jones did the movie because his son loved Batman comics, and it would be a cool way to make a living while also pleasing his son (and if you've seen Jones' imdb page, he clearly thinks of acting as a job and isn't afraid to do something for the paycheck).
All of which, far as I'm concerned, makes Tommy Lee Jones even more awesome.

[Psyren]

I really want a live action Batman Beyond movie where Keaton plays old Batman and either Goldbloom or Hamil playa old joker. Make all of the old robins former Batman actors, it would be hilarious.


I did not know I needed this but I do.

Keaton (or possibly Clooney) as old Bruce in a Batman:Beyond movie would be fantastic.

MovieBob had this very suggestion as a spinoff from the Flashpoint movie as a way to tie it into the DCEU (if that continues being a thing, anyway.)

[Peelee]

Keaton (or possibly Clooney) as old Bruce in a Batman:Beyond movie would be fantastic.

Agreed. I think the biggest challenge in Old Bruce would be the kind of person who could convincingly pull of the "that's not what I call myself" line from the Shriek episode. I can see Keaton and Clooney doing it. Keaton I've always loved as an actor, Clooney's gotten better with age (both his and mine, IMO).

[Willie the Duck]

I can see Keaton and Clooney doing it.

I caught this page load out of the corner of my eye while doing something else, didn't engage fully with the subject, got the last name associations wrong, and then re-engaged with the thread. All that lead my to the idea of a B&W Buster Keaton, Rosemary Clooney take on pre-code, gun wielding, criminal-killing Batman.

[Mordar]

I would say Schwarzenegger as Mr. Freeze was the worst. And though it's been some years since I last watched Batman Forever, I think I remember hating Tommy Lee Jones as Two-Face more than I hated Carrey as the Riddler. At least Riddler had some characterization - Tommy Lee Jones pretty much just laughs all the time. Did someone tell him he was playing the Joker?

I assume we're limiting to the Tim Burton/Joel Schumacher films? If not, I can add Anne Hathaway's Catwoman, Tom Hardy's Bane, and Jared Leto's Joker to the list as well (not necessarily in that order).

I give Freeze more of a pass, particularly since both Freeze and Ivy were done camp-style. That movie's Bane was just a larger-than-average goon doing "monkey work". Bane is one of the three best Batman villains (IMO) and to see him so undercut in Forever was forever flawed. Hardy's Bane was better, right up until you realize he's just being somebody's toadie once again.

I thought Hathaway was fine (her opening sequence made a good first impression, even if that was by far the best we were going to get for her)...I liked Scarecrow a lot. Hrm, now I feel compelled to make a list of worst-to-least-worst Batman film villains. Maybe later :smallbiggrin:

- M

[hamishspence]

I give Freeze more of a pass, particularly since both Freeze and Ivy were done camp-style. That movie's Bane was just a larger-than-average goon doing "monkey work". Bane is one of the three best Batman villains (IMO) and to see him so undercut in Forever was forever flawed.

Freeze, Ivy, and Bane, are all in Batman & Robin, not Batman Forever.

[Darth Ultron]

I don't think Jim Carrey should play The Joker.

Jim Carrey's big strength is his comedy....he is a great comedian. Both in lines and action, he over does it to 11....but it works. He has done some serious stuff, but still that is not his strength.

But as a villain.....worse as a 'funny' villain.....he just does not work. His comedy is just way too typecast: he has not comedy range. He does his brand of comedy great...but only his brand. Pick any good Carrey comedy character: that is what the Joker would be.

Like would Johnny Knoxville be a good joker?

I would like to see a Leonardo Dicaprio Joker myself...

[Mordar]

Freeze, Ivy, and Bane, are all in Batman & Robin, not Batman Forever.

Thank you for the correction. Both of those movies mush together for me...

- M

[Velaryon]

Tommy Lee Jones did the movie because his son loved Batman comics, and it would be a cool way to make a living while also pleasing his son (and if you've seen Jones' imdb page, he clearly thinks of acting as a job and isn't afraid to do something for the paycheck). He got to the shoot and discovered that he wholly and truly loathed Jim Carrey, and realized that it would be a horrible movie and that it could damage his career. So I think what you are seeing is Jones (and or the director) trying to paper over/hide behind a simple mask so no one sees the 'what the hell did I get myself into?'-expression on the actor's face.

I did get a bit of an "I don't want to be here" vibe from Tommy Lee Jones in Batman & Robin, but I get that from him in a lot of movies, so I thought it was just my imagination.



I give Freeze more of a pass, particularly since both Freeze and Ivy were done camp-style. That movie's Bane was just a larger-than-average goon doing "monkey work". Bane is one of the three best Batman villains (IMO) and to see him so undercut in Forever was forever flawed. Hardy's Bane was better, right up until you realize he's just being somebody's toadie once again.

I thought Hathaway was fine (her opening sequence made a good first impression, even if that was by far the best we were going to get for her)...I liked Scarecrow a lot. Hrm, now I feel compelled to make a list of worst-to-least-worst Batman film villains. Maybe later :smallbiggrin:

- M

I honestly didn't even recognize that character as Bane the first time I watched Batman & Robin. There's no possible way Hardy could fail to top that. He was still a long way from good, though, starting with that ridiculous "Sean Connery with a chest cold" voice he was doing.

I didn't find Hathaway believable as Catwoman for even a moment. At no point did it feel like Selina Kyle was on screen, just Anne Hathaway trying to shed her good girl image a little bit.

I totally agree with you about Scarecrow though - he was great, at least in Batman Begins. Less so with each successive appearance, though.

[Particle_Man]

If you want to see Michael Keaton as an old superhero/villain, you could see him as Birdman (in the movie of the same name) and as the Vulture in Spiderman: Homecoming.

And yeah, if Michael Keaton decides to play old Batman, I will see that.

That said, the Joker has gone through so many interpretations in the comics and other media that to answer "Should Jim Carrey play the Joker?" we first need to ask "Which Joker?" The Killing Joke version? The "rip my own face off" version? Another version? I mean, I love Mark Hamill's Joker and Heath Ledger's Joker, but those are two very different takes on the character.

[Rogar Demonblud]

There's a reason I suggested Joker-as-crime-lord. It's a version that hasn't been done in a movie, cartoon or TV show yet. Heck, I don't think it's appeared in the comics in at least 20 years.

[dps]

There's a reason I suggested Joker-as-crime-lord. It's a version that hasn't been done in a movie, cartoon or TV show yet. Heck, I don't think it's appeared in the comics in at least 20 years.

That's probably because the Penguin fits that role better. Not that the Joker can't fit the part. In fact, I'd argue that some of the movie Jokers have elements of it.

[Rogar Demonblud]

Well, the joke is that the Joker was originally a DC take on the 'crime lord with a gimmick' thing from **** Tracy.

[Traab]

Well, the joke is that the Joker was originally a DC take on the 'crime lord with a gimmick' thing from **** Tracy.

You know, my original example of a joker who is aware of the 4th wall, doesnt outright break it, could fit quite well with the crime lord setup as well. After all, his entire strategy would revolve around planning the perfect crime, then obsessing over something he just knows he, or one of his goons, forgot, that will bite them in the rear during "the third act" So he needs minions to work with to pull it off. And if that really was the original reason he was written, it would make for an excellent call back while playing into that original reason for him to exist. Having him be crazy, but brilliant would explain why he HAS all these minions, his obsession with doing everything right in an attempt to defy the whole three act structure of the universe would translate into being a very successful crime lord so everyone wants to work for him. You know, right up until the batman movie starts. :smallbiggrin: