(3.x/PF) Ritual Feats(PEACH)

[Tyndmyr]

Ritual Feats
Rituals grow more costly the more of them you perform. Acolytes of such dark paths often assure would be ritualists that the costs are small, but the further you venture down this dark path, the more unseemly the price required of you.
Ritual feats trade off an aspect of your character, permanently reducing one stat or bonus in return for gains elsewhere.

Ritual of Constitution
You have permanently traded a small amount of your life essence for otherworldly durability.
Cost: Skill points lost equal to the number of ritual feats taken, including this one.
Benefit: +1 HP, +1 Con.
Special: This feat may take the place of a Fighter bonus feat.

Ritual of Intellect
The damned knowledge that fills your brain filled your world with a bloody haze when it entered. After a time, the pain seems normal.
Cost: HP permanently lost equal to double the number of ritual feats taken, including this one.
Benefit: +2 to a knowledge skill of your choice, +1 Intellect.

Ritual of Popularity
Your smile seems a little too sharp, and your eyes a bit inhuman now, but nobody else seems to care, so why should you?
Cost: HP permanently lost equal to the number of ritual feats taken, including this one.
Benefit: +2 Diplomacy, +1 Charisma.

Ritual of Wisdom
As the wisdom of ages flows through your brain, you swiftly realize that performing this ritual was most unwise.
Cost: A penalty to initiative equal to the number of ritual feats taken, including this one.
Benefit: +1 Will save, +1 Wis.

Ritual of Strength:
The unholy strength courses through your veins, burning like fire. You try to remember what you’ve lost, but with power like this, does it really matter?
Cost: A penalty to will saves equal to the number of ritual feats taken, including this one.
Benefit: +1 Str, +1 unholy bonus to attack rolls.
Special: This feat may take the place of a Fighter bonus feat.

Ritual of Dexterity:
The ripples under your skin are unsettling, and you’re pretty sure bones shouldn’t bend that way. Joints, either.
Cost: A penalty to HP equal to the number of ritual feats taken, including this one.
Benefit: +2 Escape Artist, +1 Dexterity.

Ritual of Knowledge
The information flowing into your mind nearly makes you black out. On second thought, that might just be the blood loss.
Cost: HP permanently lost equal to the number of ritual feats taken, including this one.
Benefit: Skill points permanently gained equal to the HP lost plus three.

Ritual of Allegiance
In return for the secrets of more power, your eternal loyalty must be pledged.
Cost: Your alignment shifts one step along each axis towards Chaotic Evil. HP permanently lost equal to the number of ritual feats taken, including this one.
Benefit: Immediately gain two additional feat slots, usable only for ritual feats or feats requiring a chaotic or evil alignment.

Ritual of Spellfire
Sure, you could just study to get ahead, but the honest path to wizardry would have you with a grey beard by the time you were done. The ritual takes only ten minutes and a newborn child.
Cost: A penalty to constitution saves equal to the number of ritual feats taken, including this one.
Benefit: Spellcasters gain one additional spell slot of the highest level they can cast. Spontaneous spellcasters additionally gain one spell known of the highest level they can cast. Whenever you gain access to a new level of spells, you can opt to replace your current benefits with identical benefits of the new level.
Special: This feat may take the place of a Wizard bonus feat.

Design Intent: To dial up the power of a feat slot, and provide some extra kicks you can't easily get to play up the "power has a price" theme. Of course, they're all pretty evil-themed, but that's acceptable, I think. Hopefully the mechanics are clear enough, and they offer a compelling tradeoff.

[rferries]

I like the flavour. Depending on your level, the hp and skill points you gain from stacking Ritual of Constitution and Ritual of Intellect (or Ritual of Knowledge) multiple times might still give you a net benefit, though you'd be using up quite a few feat slots.

[Tyndmyr]

Yeah, it shouldn't generally come out negative unless one embraces extreme shenanigans...a feat slot is still worth a fair bit, after all.

Contemplated having some sort of capstone that gives rather more, requiring several of these, but in return, irrevocably advancing one's age category. Gotta tweak it to make it not *too* munchkinable, tho.

[Holya]

Hm ritual feats are interesting. I like some of this but for most of the creatures that would take this? Casters in particular you end up in a fairly painful place since the health lose is perm which has lowered your max health. Though I think you mean perm hp lost for the Dex one instead of penalty?

If we go con and then int.. You have lost 1skill point and gained 1hp and con.. But you have perm lost 4 hp but gain a +2 to a knowledge skill and 1 int. If you repeat it you have now lost 3 skill points and gained 1 hp and con.. So two hp with the next con ritual unless the last one put you at a even modifier. If you do the int ritual again you now lose 8hp for a bump to your int which more then likely grants you another skill point next level or that level depending on how your dm rules perm int ups.. And another +2 to a knowledge skill Which is a untyped bonus. You have in total lost 9 hp, 4 skill points. And gained either a +4 to a knowledge skill or a +2 to two knowledge skills and 2 points of int. You eventually get into a real nasty downward spiral here that can trap players who don't think about what the feats is costing you. Like with the aberration inheritor feats and their negatives to interactions or was it the abyssal ones.. Either way you know what I mean.

Why you have the int one be double the rituals taken when the one which gives you diplomacy is just the rituals taken in perm hp lose. I don't know because pumping diplomacy can be one of the most broken things in 3.5e if your DM lets you get away with it. I'm not saying change the bonus just possibly rethink the negatives?

I like wisdom as it is.. Giving up your initiative to get a bonus to will saves and a +1 to wisdom is good for a good chunk of classes. Sure going later in the turn order can hurt but that one can be worked with easier then perm hp lose as there is no way that I know of without homeruling or some real cheese to get rid of perm hp lose. And in my personal opnion if a feat is going to hit me where it hurts. I should either be able to mitigate it at least a tiny bit by getting enchanted items that up my initiative or it should be something that hurts bad when it comes up but isn't something that is always looming like perm lowering somethings hp with no way to restore it.

Wisdom and strength can actually be taken together to fairly off set the other.

Again not sure about dex since it says penalty to health? Do you mean perm like the other hp effecting ones or is a penalty that happens are certain times?

Knowledge completely covers the constitution ritual. Since it gives you skill points times three the hp you lose upon taken the ritual of knowledge.

So lets say you burn your first.. four feats by being human and with two flaws. A bonus from the human, two from flaws, and one for your first class level. So lets say you take ritual of con three times. thats a bonus of +3 hp and +3 con at level one for the cost of 1,2, and 3 skill points. Since the ritual specifically states you lose skill points equal to number of rituals feats counting this one. So in total its five. Now you for your fourth feat at level one take ritual of knowledge. Thats 4 perm hp lost. But you have earned more then 4 hp with your three rituals of con. So you have a net gain of hp and skills thanks to it being 4 times 3 so you gain a additional 12 skill points at level on.. Which when applied to the cost of the con rituals lowers that to 7 extra skill points. So for four feats you get a final result of 7 bonus skill points and possibly a extra hp point. If my math is right. Now if you are a tank or a class which has no use for skills them a few of this get alot better. Like just taking con alot.

Allegiance is.. Weird to me. You either give up a good chunk of hp because you have to take ritual feats which either hits your saves, skills, or hp. But you also have to shift your alignment towards the CE. If you are CG you become CN but then you can't take evil feats because all feats that are specifically tagged as evil are vile feats. You can still take chaotic feats which I am going to assume you mean abyssal heritor feats? Those only turn you chaotic after you take two of them. You can have one and be any alignment. I checked before typing this.

Ritual of spell fire is nice.. I honestly can't see anything wrong with it. I mean its only a penalty to con saves.. Its not even anything that bad and if you only take that one? Then you only have a -1 to con saves but a extra spell slot or spell known of your highest level. I would do that in a damn heartbeat as a full caster. Even more so if your in a game allowing for lost traditions or other feats which let you swap out your caster stat.

Eh.. Sorry if I rambled here.. I'm not good with staying on track but. I like the idea behind them. I like feats which can do really cool things. Hell I'm good with feats that have down sides as long as the bonuses match up to the negatives but.. It just seems like most of this wouldn't be taken by the people who should be taking them like full casters.. Because of their already low hitdie. Sure you will end up with a ritual to hell and back martial for the bonus strength and con.. Or pumping your will as a cleric if you don't care about going first in combat.. Or pumping your wisdom as a white raven tob class.. Because going last is actually useful for you. But for most? It seems like the cost is a bit to sever compared to the bonuses thanks to how quickly they can scale.. Maybe a feat chain with the first one of the chain being the punch to the gut and the rest being the soothing dark power of death and destruction? Hell you could make it where fiends know your doing this. Dark rituals etc.. Or you could have it tie your soul to dark powers of raven loft.. There are a lot of cool things you can do for the costs besides. Your hp goes down.