Undead PC Race.

[Beckett]

So, we are going to be starting up a new 5th Ed game with everything official open. I decided I wanted to aattempt an old 3E character I had, and went with a Death Knight Cleric working towards redemption, but am not familiar enough with 5E to really balance it too well for a 1st Level character. That is to say, depower the Death Knight significantly.

The other side of that is I have no clue yet just what sort of base power range the DM is thinking of here as MM is allowed.

Firstly, is there any official guidance on doing things like this? Unearthed Arcana? Anything I could read up on.

An idea I did have is to make minor tweeks to a Warforge and reflavoring as Undead. Any thoughts on that? Or are there any other Undead that might work better?

The general idea Im going for is to conceal my Undead nature from the party as long as possible, pretending to be a weaker human cursed to resist healing, but struggling to once again gain their honor and soul, (ultimately dying climactically). Im not trying to screw over the party as much as hide it out of shame, but also want to play up how random undead seem drawn to us for some reason.

Another question I had is a reliable way (as a Forge Cleric) to keep most of my Undead nature concealed. Possibly Minor Illusion (a lot) but that too seems unlikely. Ideas?

[GreyBlack]

So, we are going to be starting up a new 5th Ed game with everything official open. I decided I wanted to aattempt an old 3E character I had, and went with a Death Knight Cleric working towards redemption, but am not familiar enough with 5E to really balance it too well for a 1st Level character. That is to say, depower the Death Knight significantly.

The other side of that is I have no clue yet just what sort of base power range the DM is thinking of here as MM is allowed.

Firstly, is there any official guidance on doing things like this? Unearthed Arcana? Anything I could read up on.

An idea I did have is to make minor tweeks to a Warforge and reflavoring as Undead. Any thoughts on that? Or are there any other Undead that might work better?

The general idea Im going for is to conceal my Undead nature from the party as long as possible, pretending to be a weaker human cursed to resist healing, but struggling to once again gain their honor and soul, (ultimately dying climactically). Im not trying to screw over the party as much as hide it out of shame, but also want to play up how random undead seem drawn to us for some reason.

Another question I had is a reliable way (as a Forge Cleric) to keep most of my Undead nature concealed. Possibly Minor Illusion (a lot) but that too seems unlikely. Ideas?

In 5e? No. That doesn't mean that there aren't ways.

https://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Necropolitan_(3.5e_Template)

Providing the link to help provide a basis for how you might create this theoretical undead race.

So what you would do, instead of creating a whole new race, is instead creating a sub subrace of whatever they were in life. Let's say they were an elf in life. Instead of gaining high elf or wood elf traits, they might, instead, gain +1 constitution, resistance to radiant damage, and be affected by turning attempts but have advantage when making those saves.

Just spitballing, you can go from there.

[Finback]

Firstly, is there any official guidance on doing things like this? Unearthed Arcana? Anything I could read up on.

Maybe use the Revenant template (https://dnd.wizards.com/sites/default/files/media/upload/articles/UA%20Gothic%20Characters.pdf)?

I mean, if it's about seeking redemption, that'd be one reason to return from the dead.

[Trask]

I think you could refluff the new race warforged as undead pretty easily. Just add immunity to poison and disease, remove any need to sleep, remove the built in ac, and add resistance to necrotic damage

[Unoriginal]

I think you could refluff the new race warforged as undead pretty easily. Just add immunity to poison and disease, remove any need to sleep, remove the built in ac, and add resistance to necrotic damage

Not all undead are resistant to necrotic damage.

[Greywander]

So, we are going to be starting up a new 5th Ed game with everything official open. I decided I wanted to aattempt an old 3E character I had, and went with a Death Knight Cleric working towards redemption, but am not familiar enough with 5E to really balance it too well for a 1st Level character. That is to say, depower the Death Knight significantly.
This sounds like either an Oathbreaker (or Vengeance) paladin, if you really want a death knight, or a Death cleric. Grave cleric might also work, but YMMV. That said, an Eldritch Knight might be a better option. Warlock could be viable, too. There's a lot of ways to do this.


Or are there any other Undead that might work better?
I've been hammering out my own undead race, but it's still a work in progress. I did manage to create a template that I believe is "zero sum", i.e. you are neither stronger nor weaker with the template than without it. Here it is:

Undead Nature, Benefits. You are immune to disease. You do not need to eat or breathe, but you can ingest food or drink if you wish. Although you are still able to sleep, you do not require sleep, and can choose to remain awake while resting.

Undead Nature, Penalties. Your creature type is undead.
While spells and effects that only target humanoids, such as hold person, no longer work on you, spells and effects that target undead, such as detect evil and good, protection from evil and good, and Turn Undead now affect you.
Most magical healing specifically does not affect undead, and therefore does not affect you.
Most humanoids that learn of your undead nature will assume you are evil and a monster.

Darkvision. Even the most elementary undead are able to see in the dark. You have darkvision out to 60 feet.

Immunities. You are immune to the exhausted and poisoned conditions, poison damage, and to disease.

You can layer additional features on top of this as needed, with DM approval. Turn resistance/immunity might be a good idea. Another feature, although this would depend heavily on what your DM will allow, might be one that either lets you reform your body if you are destroyed (like a lich with a phylactery) or automatically stabilize whenever you drop to 0 HP (this helps balance the lack of healing by making you harder to perma-kill). I used the latter option with my homebrew undead race, but allowed a number of exceptions that would allow undead characters to be killed, several of which are fairly common and readily available to a mob of peasants or a party of 1st level adventurers (notably fire).


Another question I had is a reliable way (as a Forge Cleric) to keep most of my Undead nature concealed. Possibly Minor Illusion (a lot) but that too seems unlikely. Ideas?
I'd recommend Disguise Self for this, but I don't believe it's on the cleric spell list. If you went warlock, you'd be able to get at-will Disguise Self. Or you could just wear an actual disguise (or just never take off your heavy plate armor, the one with the skulls and spikes). It also kind of depends on what kind of undead you are; a skeleton would be obvious, but you could also just have pale skin. Healing is a pain, but the Celestial warlock's bonus action heal will work on you, as will healing potions, the Healer feat, the Goodberry spell, and Aura of Vitality. Resting, of course, still works for you. You can always "pretend" to be healed when someone tries to heal you, provided they aren't able to perceive the spell isn't working.

[DragonBaneDM]

I’m gonna second the suggestion for Revenant from the gothic UA.

[Asmotherion]

Been wanting this for a long time as well. The closest thing currently avalable is the UA Revenant. Arguably there is the Vampire from Magic, but it's not undead. I hope they publish something for a PC version of a Necropolitan as a generic template for role playing a Lich/Death Knight/Vampire Race etc.

I mean, "everyone must be a humanoid" should be lifted when the DM agrees to allow something more exotic for a campain. And I'd certainly like to have the option pre-made in my app instead of homebrewing it :P

I know that a lot of people like to RP as Undead. Perhaps not the Creepy undead of the "I look like a walking decaying corpse and eat your brains" type, and more the "I look alive but I'm actually dead" kind (or something in between), but still. It's an RP trope people like, and I believe 5e will eventually catch on to it.

[AHF]

If you do something like immunity or resistance to poison, you should probably balance with vulnerability to radiant damage. Party needs to learn not to catch you in aoe radiant spells.

[Beckett]

In 5e? No. That doesn't mean that there aren't ways.

Providing the link to help provide a basis for how you might create this theoretical undead race.

So what you would do, instead of creating a whole new race, is instead creating a sub subrace of whatever they were in life. Let's say they were an elf in life. Instead of gaining high elf or wood elf traits, they might, instead, gain +1 constitution, resistance to radiant damage, and be affected by turning attempts but have advantage when making those saves.

Just spitballing, you can go from there.

Thank you. I am familiar with 3E versions. I was really hoping for a 5E version of Savage Species or anything along those lines.

Among the many issues in 5E is there doesn't seem to be any basic logical consistency. It is what it is, I guess.

[Angelalex242]

I don't think vulnerability to radiant is required. Most Monster Manual undead aren't vulnerable to radiant. Vulnerability is really gone by the wayside these days. However, Turning should affect the PC normally, when done by any enemy clerics or devotion Paladins. ...Including the Destroy Undead class feature if a big enough enemy cleric walks by.

"The high priest notices what you are and uses turn undead. Roll a new character."

[GreyBlack]

I don't think vulnerability to radiant is required. Most Monster Manual undead aren't vulnerable to radiant. Vulnerability is really gone by the wayside these days. However, Turning should affect the PC normally, when done by any enemy clerics or devotion Paladins. ...Including the Destroy Undead class feature if a big enough enemy cleric walks by.

"The high priest notices what you are and uses turn undead. Roll a new character."

I was basing things on the Necropolitan (link above). You're absolutely right that these things aren't necessary, just that they're tied to the Necropolitan.

[Theodoxus]

I modified the Revenant into a feat:

Chosen of [God of the Grave]You died and were returned to a semblance of life by the [God of the Grave]. The reason remains a mystery but being Chosen has left an indelible mark upon your body and soul. Not fully alive, but not truly undead, you have aspects of both:
Your Constitution score increases by 1.
You don't need to breathe, drink, eat or sleep. You can, if you so desire, but gain no benefits or detriments for doing so. You automatically gain the benefits of a Long Rest at [Dawn or Midnight, as per the God of the Grave] every night regardless of your current activity.
You are no longer considered a humanoid for things like Charm or Hold Person, but you are affected by things like Turn Undead.
You gain +60 feet of low light vision Darkvision. If your race, but not your class, grants Darkvision, you can see in darkness as if it were bright light in full color, and in magical darkness as if it were dim light and in shades of grey.
If you are below half your Hit Point maximum at the start of your turn, you regain 1 Hit Point.
If you die, you return to life 24 hours after death. If your body is destroyed, you reform within 1 mile of the place of your death, at a spot determined by the DM. If your equipment was also destroyed, you do not regain it.
Remember, the [God of the Grave] gives and the [God of the Grave] takes away. Your unlife is in his hands, and he might rescind his gift when you've accomplished his goal, or if you fail to often.

[AHF]

I don't think vulnerability to radiant is required. Most Monster Manual undead aren't vulnerable to radiant. Vulnerability is really gone by the wayside these days. However, Turning should affect the PC normally, when done by any enemy clerics or devotion Paladins. ...Including the Destroy Undead class feature if a big enough enemy cleric walks by.

"The high priest notices what you are and uses turn undead. Roll a new character."

Not required but the ideas tossed around like immunity poison, immunity exhaustion, immunity disease, immunity to drowning / suffocation, etc. needs some serious drawbacks to balance.

I would think of balance like the Drow have. They pick up a few spells and get disadvantage in direct sunlight. Undead need similar balance if you are implementing them.

Doesn’t have to be radiant vulnerability but those are some powerful immunities along with other mechanics being tossed around on this thread. That requires some offsetting penalties that are practical and meaningful.

[Corpsecandle717]

Thank you. I am familiar with 3E versions. I was really hoping for a 5E version of Savage Species or anything along those lines.

Among the many issues in 5E is there doesn't seem to be any basic logical consistency. It is what it is, I guess.

This has been a major sticking point for me too. Basically everything is a unique monster. Gone are the days of templates and shared traits for creature types.

As others have suggested, starting with WF with a few tweaks is probably your best bet. I don't think the Revenant has enough mechanical difference from the base race to suite your purposes.

[Angelalex242]

I modified the Revenant into a feat:

Chosen of [God of the Grave]You died and were returned to a semblance of life by the [God of the Grave]. The reason remains a mystery but being Chosen has left an indelible mark upon your body and soul. Not fully alive, but not truly undead, you have aspects of both:
Your Constitution score increases by 1.
You don't need to breathe, drink, eat or sleep. You can, if you so desire, but gain no benefits or detriments for doing so. You automatically gain the benefits of a Long Rest at [Dawn or Midnight, as per the God of the Grave] every night regardless of your current activity.
You are no longer considered a humanoid for things like Charm or Hold Person, but you are affected by things like Turn Undead.
You gain +60 feet of low light vision Darkvision. If your race, but not your class, grants Darkvision, you can see in darkness as if it were bright light in full color, and in magical darkness as if it were dim light and in shades of grey.
If you are below half your Hit Point maximum at the start of your turn, you regain 1 Hit Point.
If you die, you return to life 24 hours after death. If your body is destroyed, you reform within 1 mile of the place of your death, at a spot determined by the DM. If your equipment was also destroyed, you do not regain it.
Remember, the [God of the Grave] gives and the [God of the Grave] takes away. Your unlife is in his hands, and he might rescind his gift when you've accomplished his goal, or if you fail to often.



Well. If the god is Vecna, that's one thing. Kelemvor, on the other hand, doesn't tolerate undead, and wouldn't allow this.

[Theodoxus]

It's a homebrew campaign. The original god of the grave was the Overgod that created the crystal sphere, but didn't really have a knack of running a plane, so he hired out for gods. The player's former characters (all 18-20th level) became those gods. The player who chose Grave asked me if we could use the Revenant concept. I wrote up the Chosen feat out of it.

But yes, you're otherwise correct... Doomguides would surely be seeking out and quashing Revenants as best they could.

[Beckett]

Revenant isn't really what I want besides a few superficial aspects. Something the DM suggested is this Death Knight

.dandwiki.com/wiki/Death_Knight,_Variant_(5e_Class)
<can post link yet>

But I'm just not sure. It does some cool stuff, and a few things Im going for, but misses a lot, too.