Is a multiclass Wizard/Rogue worth it?

[IndyJay53]

I am playing a Drow School of Necromancy Wizard with the Urchin background, with a slightly homebrewed subclass to focus more on vampiric/HP-stealing abilities than zombification.

I have started the campaign as a level 1 wizard, but due to my character's backstory, it would make sense to dip into a few levels of rogue as well. Is it mechanically worth it to sacrifice 2 wizard levels for 2 levels of rogue, for instance?

If so, when should I multiclass? I feel like because it is backstory related and also due to the mechanical benefits, it would be best to add the rogue levels in the first 4 levels of play, however, this would set me back in spellcasting compared to other casters in the party for the rest of the campaign. However, a helpful compensation for this is the racial Drow Magic, and I was generously given High Drow Magic as a free 1st level feat, with the caveat that I get the free spell uses when I have access to that level of spell. Additionally, I doubt the campaign will last get past level 10-15 by the end of play, if that makes a difference. From what I can tell, these are the pros and cons of taking 2 levels of rogue early on:

Pros:

2d8 versus 2d6 hit dice
Light armor proficiency (will save on mage armor and other defensive spells)
At least 1 rogue skill proficiency (2 if my DM lets me substitute the overlapping thieves' tools proficiency for another rogue skill)
Expertise in 2 skills
Sneak attack 1d6 (useful because I may use throwing daggers occasionally for flavor reasons)
Thieves' Cant
2nd level: Cunning Action (won't need expeditious retreat or shocking grasp, and will have a useful bonus action every turn)


Cons:

Lose one 6th and one 7th level spell slot
Lose 1 ASI/Feat (I rolled pretty high stats so don't desperately need this, but it wouldn't hurt)
Lose Signature Spells
Be underpowered by 1 spell level and a few spell slots/spells known compared to other casters


This is my first time multiclassing, and would love to hear others' experiences and advice with similar multiclass characters. Are there any pitfalls I am missing or different multiclass options/feats that could make this build more viable?

[R.Shackleford]

MC Rogue is always worth it.

2 or 4 levels really brings your ability to survive up.

Just depends on if it fits your character.

Edit: Also, it depends on how long thr campaign really will last. Most don't go 1 - 20, be lucky if you hit 10 levels.

Wizard 2/Rogue 2/Wizard more

[Spectrulus]

Rogue 3 for Arcane Trickster combos well too, starting cantrips, basic casting start, even if only at a later level.

[Arkhios]

I am playing a Drow School of Necromancy Wizard with the Urchin background, with a slightly homebrewed subclass to focus more on vampiric/HP-stealing abilities than zombification.

I have started the campaign as a level 1 wizard, but due to my character's backstory, it would make sense to dip into a few levels of rogue as well. Is it mechanically worth it to sacrifice 2 wizard levels for 2 levels of rogue, for instance?

If so, when should I multiclass? I feel like because it is backstory related and also due to the mechanical benefits, it would be best to add the rogue levels in the first 4 levels of play, however, this would set me back in spellcasting compared to other casters in the party for the rest of the campaign. However, a helpful compensation for this is the racial Drow Magic, and I was generously given High Drow Magic as a free 1st level feat, with the caveat that I get the free spell uses when I have access to that level of spell. Additionally, I doubt the campaign will last get past level 10-15 by the end of play, if that makes a difference. From what I can tell, these are the pros and cons of taking 2 levels of rogue early on:

Pros:

2d8 versus 2d6 hit dice
Light armor proficiency (will save on mage armor and other defensive spells)
At least 1 rogue skill proficiency (2 if my DM lets me substitute the overlapping thieves' tools proficiency for another rogue skill)
Expertise in 2 skills
Sneak attack 1d6 (useful because I may use throwing daggers occasionally for flavor reasons)
Thieves' Cant
2nd level: Cunning Action (won't need expeditious retreat or shocking grasp, and will have a useful bonus action every turn)


Cons:

Lose one 6th and one 7th level spell slot
Lose 1 ASI/Feat (I rolled pretty high stats so don't desperately need this, but it wouldn't hurt)
Lose Signature Spells
Be underpowered by 1 spell level and a few spell slots/spells known compared to other casters


This is my first time multiclassing, and would love to hear others' experiences and advice with similar multiclass characters. Are there any pitfalls I am missing or different multiclass options/feats that could make this build more viable?


Rogue 3 for Arcane Trickster combos well too, starting cantrips, basic casting start, even if only at a later level.

As Spectrulus, I would recommend Rogue 3 for Arcane Trickster, but I'd spread the rogue levels a bit too farther apart.

Access to 3rd level spells (not just spell slots) is huge thing. It's more or less equal to getting that first (and most of the times, only) extra attack for the "warrior" classes.

So, I would take one rogue level as soon as possible, but continue with wizard until you get the 3rd level spells (at 6th character level). Then, take second rogue level, after that, either wait for maybe 4th or 5th level spells before you take the third rogue level, and leave it there. As primarily a wizard, you're unlikely to need that much dexterity (it's great if you can afford it, but not mandatory) while both the wizard and arcane trickster benefit from high intelligence, so you won't need to spread your ASI's wide. or at all.

[LudicSavant]

I am playing a Drow School of Necromancy Wizard with the Urchin background, with a slightly homebrewed subclass to focus more on vampiric/HP-stealing abilities than zombification.

I have started the campaign as a level 1 wizard, but due to my character's backstory, it would make sense to dip into a few levels of rogue as well. Is it mechanically worth it to sacrifice 2 wizard levels for 2 levels of rogue, for instance?

If so, when should I multiclass? I feel like because it is backstory related and also due to the mechanical benefits, it would be best to add the rogue levels in the first 4 levels of play, however, this would set me back in spellcasting compared to other casters in the party for the rest of the campaign. However, a helpful compensation for this is the racial Drow Magic, and I was generously given High Drow Magic as a free 1st level feat, with the caveat that I get the free spell uses when I have access to that level of spell. Additionally, I doubt the campaign will last get past level 10-15 by the end of play, if that makes a difference. From what I can tell, these are the pros and cons of taking 2 levels of rogue early on:

Pros:

2d8 versus 2d6 hit dice
Light armor proficiency (will save on mage armor and other defensive spells)
At least 1 rogue skill proficiency (2 if my DM lets me substitute the overlapping thieves' tools proficiency for another rogue skill)
Expertise in 2 skills
Sneak attack 1d6 (useful because I may use throwing daggers occasionally for flavor reasons)
Thieves' Cant
2nd level: Cunning Action (won't need expeditious retreat or shocking grasp, and will have a useful bonus action every turn)


Cons:

Lose one 6th and one 7th level spell slot
Lose 1 ASI/Feat (I rolled pretty high stats so don't desperately need this, but it wouldn't hurt)
Lose Signature Spells
Be underpowered by 1 spell level and a few spell slots/spells known compared to other casters


This is my first time multiclassing, and would love to hear others' experiences and advice with similar multiclass characters. Are there any pitfalls I am missing or different multiclass options/feats that could make this build more viable?

Generally speaking it's hard for much to compete with straight Wizard in terms of optimization. That said if you do want to multiclass, Rogue isn't a bad choice.

Rogue 2 is good for Cunning Action. Also, getting Light Armor means you qualify for the "Moderately Armored" which will bump you up to 19+ base AC for half a feat, which combined with proper Necromancy tactics makes you pretty tanky. You can also take War Caster to threaten double Booming Blade / double Sneak Attack for some very punishing resourceless damage.

[Keravath]

One minor item to keep in mind is that arcane trickster at level 3 not only gets you a few cantrips and additional lower level spells, it also counts as a level in a spellcasting class so that in the end you would have the spell slots of an 18th level caster even though you are 17 wizard/3 arcane trickster rogue. You also pick up mage hand legerdemain (invisible mage hand which you can manipulate as a bonus action and use to disarm traps/open locks at a 30' range) so it also might tie in well with your back story.

[R.Shackleford]

Rogue 3 for Arcane Trickster combos well too, starting cantrips, basic casting start, even if only at a later level.

I actually wouldn't touch AT.

Wizard is already gonna wiz well enough.

I would go with something that will expand the "well, I'm not casting right now" time. Mastermind is my favorite Wiz/Rog subclass...

Thiugh, I wouldn't even touch Rogue 3 unless you go for Rogue 4... But really that is taking a lot off from Wizard so I prefer to stay Rogue 2 if I want to primarily be a caster.

[PeteNutButter]

The thing to realize about rogue combining with a primary caster is rogue scales excellently with martial attacks due to sneak attack. Essentially if you aren't doing much martial attacks rogue will put you behind in combat (at least offensively). Say you toss a dagger and now get to add another 1d6 to the dagger damage. Now your dagger is doing 1d4+1d6+ ~3. That's decent damage, but the firebolt at level 5-10 is doing more at 2d10. Due to the mechanics of 5e you'll never be as good at offense as if you were single classed in either rogue or wizard. You'll have weaker spells and your martial attacks will be weak. Getting an extra couple hp and two thirds of mage armor isn't really going to help your survivability much. You'll get much more mileage out of hiding as a bonus action.

That's not to say don't do it. The benefits are real, but if you cast spells most rounds they are primarily on the noncombat side (other than cunning action) . IMO to be optimal you have basically two options: 1) Take just two levels of rogue and exploit cunning action. In danger? Fog Cloud > Hide > giggle quietly as enemies are mostly helpless to find you. 2) Have your wizard levels focus on buffing your martial prowess. Take no more than 5-6 wizard levels to cast things like Haste and throw the rest in rogue. Haste along with a good amount of sneak attack dice is amazing (ready attack to double sneak attack dice). Using option 1 puts you a couple levels behind on offense for a defense boost and out of combat utility. Option 2 is more optimized in the long run, but will have growing pains in tier 2 and may not be what you are looking for.

It might be helpful to know what the homebrew changes were to your wizard, so we can advise if they are worth delaying. If they are OP, just stay in wizard. :smalltongue:

[CTurbo]

Is it worth it to take a couple levels of Rogue?

Yes probably.

If you're a large party with several meat shields, and think you can successfully hang out in the back casting spells all day, I'd say still to pure Wizard.

If you're a small party, and you think you may get caught up in the thick of things more than you care to, then definitely take a couple of Rogue levels.

Cunning Action alone can be HUGE for a Wizard

[Laserlight]

Sort of depends on your DM. I was a gnome support wizard in (well, "behind") a party with a barbarian and a tempest cleric. Most NPCs saw the two "big weapon, in your face" PCs as the threat rather than "the harmless little guy way back there"; I probably threw Shield less than ten times from L6-L10 and only took significant damage once or twice. If your DM operates like that, Rogue is unnecessary.

[rooneg]

Honestly, I like Rogue dipping Wizard (for Bladesinger, specifically) a lot more than Wizard dipping Rogue. Putting yourself an entire spell level back is a huge deal for a character who's primarily a caster IMO, especially in the early game (2nd and 3rd level spells are big power boosts). I'd be more likely to do this in a game where I started at a higher level, or could skip some levels (say an AL game where I had DM credit to burn).