Good Omens Miniseries (2019)

[The Glyphstone]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ZSXlNRRoGU


Somehow, I had no idea this was even a thing. Anyone else looking forward to it who knew about it earlier?

[Brother Oni]

Definitely looking forward to it and very glad it was turned into a miniseries rather than a movie, so there's more time and scope to build on the necessary relationships in a very character focused book.

As an aside, I really hope the subtitlers are fans of Terry Pratchett and Death SPEAKS IN ALL CAPITAL LETTERS.

[Lethologica]

Well, I wasn't looking forward to this, but I am now that I've heard about it.

American Gods, Good Omens...oh man, could we be heading towards a Discworld adaption? Now that's an intimidating prospect.

[Brother Oni]

Well, I wasn't looking forward to this, but I am now that I've heard about it.

American Gods, Good Omens...oh man, could we be heading towards a Discworld adaption? Now that's an intimidating prospect.

We've already had a number of Discworld adaptations - my favourite is Going Postal.

[thorgrim29]

It looks good, but I'm a bit concerned by the lack of Witchfinders and the Them in the trailer.

I'm pulling for an Anansi Boys adaptation personally. Apparently the only that kept it from being made in previous years is that Gaiman is really adamant not to change the fact that all of the cast bar 2 or 3 characters (and half of 1 I guess...) are black. Hopefully that's less of a stumbling block as it used to be now.

[Grey_Wolf_c]

It looks good, but I'm a bit concerned by the lack of Witchfinders and the Them in the trailer.

They have been cast, so they will be in the series. This is a teaser, so they concentrated on the most famous actor they hired, as one would expect.

Not sure about Crowley's characterization, though. In the book, he is most definitely not evil. His problem (as indeed Aziraphael's, to a lesser degree) is that he has gone native - he is too human. Here, he comes across as still a devil with devil outlook on life. ALso, the hair looks ridiculous.

Grey Wolf

[Fyraltari]

I'm not really sold on the casting of Aziraphale and Crowley. I probably just need to get used to them. Particularly Tennant. Otherwise I think this has serious potential.

They have been cast, so they will be in the series. This is a teaser, so they concentrated on the most famous actor they hired, as one would expect.

Not sure about Crowley's characterization, though. In the book, he is most definitely not evil. His problem (as indeed Aziraphael's, to a lesser degree) is that he has gone native - he is too human. Here, he comes across as still a devil with devil outlook on life. ALso, the hair looks ridiculous.

Crowley likes to pretend to be eviler than he really is though, as you said, this is a teaser, can't expect much characterization too slip in. Also the hair is positively ridiculous.


Nitpick: Crowley and Aziraphale with black and white wings? Come on...

[Grey_Wolf_c]

I'm not really sold on the casting of Aziraphale and Crowley. I probably just need to get used to them. Particularly Tennant.

I'm guessing you haven't seen Jessica Jones? If anything, my problem with Crowley right now is that it is too much Kilgrave still in my head.


Nitpick: Crowley and Aziraphale with black and white wings? Come on...

Err.. that's canon.

Grey Wolf

[Fyraltari]

I'm guessing you haven't seen Jessica Jones? If anything, my problem with Crowley right now is that it is too much Kilgrave still in my head.
I have not. Which means Tennant is still Ten in my head. Which is weird.


Err.. that's canon.

Grey Wolf
Err, no? During the climax, their winchs are described as identical except that Crowley takes care of his.

[Grey_Wolf_c]

I have not. Which means Tennant is still Ten in my head. Which is weird.

Well, I do recommend it, and he will stop being the goofy Doctor for you after that particular palate cleanser, I would imagine.


Err, no? During the climax, their wings are described as identical except that Crowley takes care of his.

"As he sat beside Aziraphale, the angel's white wings brushed against Crowley's black. One like pearl, the other like an oil slick"

Grey Wolf

[factotum]

I didn't know about this, but colour me interested for sure! They've got some talent aboard, by the looks.

[Grey_Wolf_c]

It just occurred to me they might answer the "is it a dalek or is it R2D2" question.

Probably not, but one can hope.

Grey Wolf

[Anonymouswizard]

Not sure about Crowley's characterization, though. In the book, he is most definitely not evil. His problem (as indeed Aziraphael's, to a lesser degree) is that he has gone native - he is too human. Here, he comes across as still a devil with devil outlook on life. ALso, the hair looks ridiculous.

Grey Wolf

I kind of have to agree. Neither seem anything like their book counterparts for me, while Crowley certainly tried to act more evil than he was he was very, very good at blending in with humanity, to the point where I ended up that he dressed as if he was evil and performed acts of pettiness*, but in his social interactions didn't come off as utterly evil in the way the teaser suggests (especially as he's got to contrast the lower downs in the demon hierachy, who more come off as more stereotypically evil). I'll hold off my judgement on this aspect until the series comes out, but he also didn't seem to be acting as friendly towards Aziraphael as in the book, where they could be mistaken for consenting bicycle repairmen.

* Note that although his actions in spreading evil can be as petty as 'shut down the phone network for five minutes' (in a time period where that would cause much less chaos than it would now), they are never significantly less in quality than the ones other demons shown use. His difference is that instead of magic sure he gets one person over the course of a decade he casts his net wide and banks on the fact that there are some people he'll be affecting again and again.


Err.. that's canon.

Grey Wolf

I don't remember it being specified, but it's been years since I read the book. It is however annoying that Crowley's wings don't look nicer than Aziraphael's.

[The Glyphstone]

Aziraphale looks just like i imagined he would. Crowley looks more like a Johnny Depp character than anything, but maybe he will grow on me.

My worry is the runtime. 6 hours means theyll have to cut a lot of the side plots and vignettes, which I found was one of the best things Good Omens had going for it. It was Gaiman's ability to make you believe a world existed outside his core cast overlaid on Pratchett's capacity for humor.

[factotum]

I kind of have to agree. Neither seem anything like their book counterparts for me, while Crowley certainly tried to act more evil than he was he was very, very good at blending in with humanity, to the point where I ended up that he dressed as if he was evil and performed acts of pettiness*, but in his social interactions didn't come off as utterly evil in the way the teaser suggests

It's entirely possible they cherry-picked the most demonic parts of his performance for the trailer in order to make it obvious what he is in the short runtime. In the actual 6-hour series they can hopefully give him a lot more nuance. Also, Neil Gaiman is directly involved in this, so we can but hope he'll keep things on track as far as characterisation goes.

[The Glyphstone]

They are apparently devoting an entire hour (episode 3) to showing A+C's relationship through the ages of history, so presumably that will be where he gets fleshed out most.

[huttj509]

It's entirely possible they cherry-picked the most demonic parts of his performance for the trailer in order to make it obvious what he is in the short runtime. In the actual 6-hour series they can hopefully give him a lot more nuance. Also, Neil Gaiman is directly involved in this, so we can but hope he'll keep things on track as far as characterisation goes.

Not only is he directly involved, but he's commented he's more hands on than he normally would be if it were adapting something that he considered just "his."

I'm sure there will be differences from the book, things changed for time/pacing, probably some things where a particular reader's view of things didn't match the author's, or some other readers, etc. But I'm looking forward to seeing the end result, and taking it for what it is.

[The Glyphstone]

I also read that he wrote a different ending, one that doesnt drag quite so long.

[Kato]

I'm not sure how I feel about the trailer... I get the impression it focuses too much one A&C. Which is not a bad thing per se, but there's more to the book and it'd be a shame if they cut it down like that. Of course, that might just be themm using Tennant to sell the thing.


We've already had a number of Discworld adaptations - my favourite is Going Postal.

Really? I always felt Hogfather was far superior. GP isn't bad but has some obvious flaws to me that feel unnecessary.

[Anonymouswizard]

It's entirely possible they cherry-picked the most demonic parts of his performance for the trailer in order to make it obvious what he is in the short runtime. In the actual 6-hour series they can hopefully give him a lot more nuance. Also, Neil Gaiman is directly involved in this, so we can but hope he'll keep things on track as far as characterisation goes.

Six hours? They can remove the mini from the title, that's a full blown series. #British TV


I also read that he wrote a different ending, one that doesnt drag quite so long.

I didn't feel like the ending dragged on in the book. One of my favourite endings really, we need more like it.

[Brother Oni]

Really? I always felt Hogfather was far superior. GP isn't bad but has some obvious flaws to me that feel unnecessary.

I liked GP more simply due to the time it came out (2010) and its relevance to the fallout of current events at the time which were starting to really bite. The sheer charisma of the actor who played Moist also sold it for me.

I'm not saying GP is better than Hogfather (the casting for CPL Nobby Nobbs was perfect), just that I liked GP more.

[factotum]

Six hours? They can remove the mini from the title, that's a full blown series. #British TV

In the UK, maybe, but we're known for our brevity (and no, I'm not going to link the TV Tropes article, you can find it yourself and lose an afternoon :smallwink:)--by US definitions, 6 hours is a very short series indeed.

[farothel]

I'll probably see this two years after it comes out, but I'm definetely interested. I still have to finish the book though.

There is also going to be a series about the Ankh-Morpork city watch in the same 6x 1 hour format. I'm really looking forward to that one.
See link to newspaper article here (https://www.theguardian.com/books/2018/mar/02/discworld-terry-pratchetts-city-watch-headed-for-tv-adaptation)

[tiornys]

"As he sat beside Aziraphale, the angel's white wings brushed against Crowley's black. One like pearl, the other like an oil slick"
Can you give me some sort of reference for this quote? I wasn't able to find it after a quick search, but I did find this one (from the ending pages of Saturday): "Contrary to popular belief, the wings of demons are the same as the wings of angels, although they're often better groomed."

[factotum]

Can you give me some sort of reference for this quote? I wasn't able to find it after a quick search, but I did find this one (from the ending pages of Saturday): "Contrary to popular belief, the wings of demons are the same as the wings of angels, although they're often better groomed."

Seems to me entirely possible that both quotes exist in the book. It was written by two people, after all, and a completely consistent vision isn't necessarily possible.

[Rodin]

A quick Googling shows that exact line in a fanfiction drabble. I was also rather surprised to find the entire book turn up within the first few hits.

A search for wings throughout shows that the color isn't mentioned, or at least not obviously. The implication of the line about them being the same is certainly that they would be the same color.

On the other hand, it's such a minor detail that I don't mind them changing the color as a bit of artistic license to make them fit Crowley's wardrobe. Especially since the color isn't actually stated definitively.

[Kato]

Hm... curious. I would assume the quote more references the fact that demon wings are still feathery, not leather like often depicted. Then again, the title image at least of my edition seems to have Crowley with black leather wings.
Of course biologically it doesn't make sense that changing sides would change the color of your wings, but biology and angels...

[Serenity]

Who's to say that both angels and demons don't have wings of both colors and it just so happens that Az and Crowley have the 'expected' colorations?

[Fyraltari]

On the other hand, it's such a minor detail that I don't mind them changing the color as a bit of artistic license to make them fit Crowley's wardrobe. Especially since the color isn't actually stated definitively.

I did say it was a nitpick. However, that their wings look the same is part of the whole "Hell and Heaven are not that different" theme.

[Anonymouswizard]

Who's to say that both angels and demons don't have wings of both colors and it just so happens that Az and Crowley have the 'expected' colorations?

Considering that angels and demons might manifest their wings as needed (otherwise it would be very difficult to hide them) they might even be able to choose the colour.

Noticeably the ending contains multiple lines suggesting it's difficult to tell angels and demons apart by looks, which would make me annoyed by Crowley's looks but he's been on Earth so long it's likely that he's intentionally styling himself demonic.

As a side note I'm hoping the series has a narrator, if only so we can get the line 'gayer than a treeful of monkeys on nitrous oxide'. As well as the @#£%&- All This Bible.

[factotum]

Considering that angels and demons might manifest their wings as needed (otherwise it would be very difficult to hide them) they might even be able to choose the colour.

Slightly off topic, but I always liked the way the Archangel Tyrael's wings were represented in the original cutscenes for Diablo 2--as individual strands of bright white energy, rather than feathered anything. They "upgraded" them in the Lord of Destruction cutscenes to a sort of see-through feathery thing which I thought actually made them worse.

[tiornys]

Seems to me entirely possible that both quotes exist in the book. It was written by two people, after all, and a completely consistent vision isn't necessarily possible.
Absolutely. However, there aren't that many scenes where Crowley and Aziriphale interact under circumstances where they might be in their true forms, and I didn't find that quote during a quick scan of every such scene I could think of. And I just re-read the book last week after the trailer dropped, so my memory of it is fairly fresh.

I can absolutely believe that quote comes from a fan-fiction though.

Another quote that suggests that the angel and demon wings are similar is this somewhat more spoilery one:

"In one sense there was just clear air overhead. In another, stretching off to infinity, were the hosts of Heaven and Hell, wingtip to wingtip. If you looked really closely, and had been specially trained, you could tell the difference."

Also, I agree that it's a potentially reasonable change for artistic licence. Adaptations do need to adapt things after all.

[Leewei]

I'm looking forward to it. I really enjoyed Vivaldi's "You're My Best Friend" being used on the soundtrack. Wait, that's Queen? Well, now it is.

[Fyraltari]

It just occurred to me they might answer the "is it a dalek or is it R2D2" question.

Probably not, but one can hope.

Grey Wolf

They will probably go with something like that:
https://i.ytimg.com/vi/FIYT9Pn2E84/hqdefault.jpg

I doubt they'd get the rights to either, anyway.

[Millstone85]

I... erm... I didn't like Good Omens. :smalleek:

It was nice seeing Discworld-style horsemen and witches on Earth, but the antichrist was the sourcerer all over again.

[hamishspence]

I... erm... I didn't like Good Omens. :smalleek:

It was nice seeing Discworld-style horsemen and witches on Earth, but the antichrist was the sourcerer all over again.



I found Adam's personality somewhat different from Coin's.

[Sinewmire]

It was nice seeing Discworld-style horsemen and witches on Earth, but the antichrist was the sourcerer all over again.

You can't help what you like ;)

I don't really remember any personality at all to Coin, except he was basically a nice kid.

Adam, on the other hand, is a love letter to Just William and Stig Of The Dump that any kid in the UK in the 80s will have grown up on. I feel he's a lot better developed too.

I do wonder how well a lot of the references will translate. Star Wars is still around, sure, but The Omen and other Hammer Horror era films are pretty obscure. Still, it worked for Hot Fuzz.

[Rodin]

You can't help what you like ;)

I don't really remember any personality at all to Coin, except he was basically a nice kid.

Adam, on the other hand, is a love letter to Just William and Stig Of The Dump that any kid in the UK in the 80s will have grown up on. I feel he's a lot better developed too.

I do wonder how well a lot of the references will translate. Star Wars is still around, sure, but The Omen and other Hammer Horror era films are pretty obscure. Still, it worked for Hot Fuzz.

There's two ways you can go with it. The first is simply to update the references. However, a lot of the story is restricted by the date of the film - nobody has cell phones, the kids spend all their time playing outside with no parental supervision, etc.

So, the other way to go is the Stranger Things method. Explicitly set it when the original movie was set, and go whole hog on the references. Your audience is mainly people who read the book, after all. You can go in for the full nostalgia route.

A lot of the jokes are pretty universal too, like the idea of digging a hole to China.

[Leewei]

David Tenant's Crowley is shown in a phone booth - a bit of a shout out to one of his well-known prior roles.

[Sinewmire]

There's two ways you can go with it. The first is simply to update the references. However, a lot of the story is restricted by the date of the film - nobody has cell phones, the kids spend all their time playing outside with no parental supervision, etc.

So, the other way to go is the Stranger Things method. Explicitly set it when the original movie was set, and go whole hog on the references. Your audience is mainly people who read the book, after all. You can go in for the full nostalgia route.

A lot of the jokes are pretty universal too, like the idea of digging a hole to China.

Good point - it might be set in the 90s or late eighties, which would explain crowley's outrageous fashion.


David Tenant's Crowley is shown in a phone booth - a bit of a shout out to one of his well-known prior roles.

Nice catch! I never pick up on stuff like that until it's pointed out.

[Kato]

David Tenant's Crowley is shown in a phone booth - a bit of a shout out to one of his well-known prior roles.

I didn't know purple man was famous for using phone booths :smalltongue: I'm not sure if this is the idea behind it but it might be, I assume.
Or it could be a hint the story actually takes place in the 90s, not today.

On a somewhat related note... The Watch series is happening. I'm not sure how I feel about this.

[thorgrim29]

Oh boy.... I feel like there are a lot more ways for a Watch series to go poorly than well. Especially since Ankh-Morpork and it's watch go through about 200 years of IRL history in half a dozen books.

[farothel]

Well, I know Narrativia is involved in it, and both Rhianna Pratchett and Rob Wilkins are part of that. We also had a talk about this during the last Discworld Convention and from what I heard there, I don't feel too bad about this project. It will depend also on casting choices and things like that.

There will also be a series based on the Wee Free Men.

[Fyraltari]

David Tenant's Crowley is shown in a phone booth - a bit of a shout out to one of his well-known prior roles.

Should have been a police box then. :smallmad:

Fingers crossed about the Watch serie. I want to believe in it but I fear the worse.
Just like this one.
Or the Foundation serie.
Or the Lord of the Rings one.

[factotum]

Should have been a police box then. :smallmad:

Two issues there:

1) Blue police boxes don't exist on the streets anymore--they were already largely obsolete in the 60s, when Dr. Who started. It would thus be extremely strange to see a character going into one.
2) Following on from (1), the BBC actually owns the rights to the blue police box image, having won a case against the Metropolitan Police in the early 2000s--the thing was so iconically identified with Dr Who, rather than its original usage, that the fictional depiction won out. Thus, to use it in this series Netflix would have to get permission from the BBC, which I suspect would not be forthcoming.

[Rodin]

Two issues there:
2) Following on from (1), the BBC actually owns the rights to the blue police box image, having won a case against the Metropolitan Police in the early 2000s--the thing was so iconically identified with Dr Who, rather than its original usage, that the fictional depiction won out. Thus, to use it in this series Netflix would have to get permission from the BBC, which I suspect would not be forthcoming.

That is just plain hilarious to me.


Fingers crossed about the Watch serie. I want to believe in it but I fear the worse.
Just like this one.
Or the Foundation serie.
Or the Lord of the Rings one.

Discworld adaptations have generally been pretty good, so I have faith that they can do right by it. The description indicating that it will be new stories is slightly worrying.

Overall though, I think I've yet to see a bad adaptation, be it the earlier animated works or the later TV movies that Sky did. I'm hopeful for both Good Omens and the Watch series.

[Kato]

new[/I] stories is slightly worrying.

Overall though, I think I've yet to see a bad adaptation, be it the earlier animated works or the later TV movies that Sky did. I'm hopeful for both Good Omens and the Watch series.

I'm rather more interested to see new stories than attempts to adapt the books. Pratchett's writing isn't easy to turn into a good moving picture. So writing something new is likely much better.

The old animated movies are fine but while the art style kind of suits the stories I would very much prefer a better looking one.

[Rodin]

I'm rather more interested to see new stories than attempts to adapt the books. Pratchett's writing isn't easy to turn into a good moving picture. So writing something new is likely much better.

The old animated movies are fine but while the art style kind of suits the stories I would very much prefer a better looking one.

The reason I'm more leery about new stories is that, well, Pratchett isn't writing them. We've seen that people can do a good job of taking his stories and translating them to the screen. Whether someone can take his characters and write plots that do them justice remains to be seen.

[Anymage]

Two issues there:2) Following on from (1), the BBC actually owns the rights to the blue police box image, having won a case against the Metropolitan Police in the early 2000s--the thing was so iconically identified with Dr Who, rather than its original usage, that the fictional depiction won out. Thus, to use it in this series Netflix would have to get permission from the BBC, which I suspect would not be forthcoming.

Nitpck: Good Omens is going on Amazon, which seems to have more BBC stuff and has Bezos money if they really wanted a Who box to make a cameo. Not that I expect a blue box to show up, mind.


Overall though, I think I've yet to see a bad adaptation, be it the earlier animated works or the later TV movies that Sky did. I'm hopeful for both Good Omens and the Watch series.

GO has the advantage that one of its authors is still very much alive and very much engaged in the production. I'll be guardedly optimistic about the other adaptations of Pratchett's work, but having Gaiman participating has me more generally optimistic about this one.

[Fyraltari]

Two issues there:

1) Blue police boxes don't exist on the streets anymore--they were already largely obsolete in the 60s, when Dr. Who started. It would thus be extremely strange to see a character going into one.
2) Following on from (1), the BBC actually owns the rights to the blue police box image, having won a case against the Metropolitan Police in the early 2000s--the thing was so iconically identified with Dr Who, rather than its original usage, that the fictional depiction won out. Thus, to use it in this series Netflix would have to get permission from the BBC, which I suspect would not be forthcoming.
I know, but if you can't do the joke right, then don't do it.

[Thufir]

Of course those red phone boxes are now about as obsolete as the police box.

https://twitter.com/neilhimself/status/1048981303620771842

[Anonymouswizard]

Of course those red phone boxes are now about as obsolete as the police box.

https://twitter.com/neilhimself/status/1048981303620771842

I remember phone boxes from my childhood. I saw like one red one, all the ones actually about were the clear BT-branded ones, which were finally removed from streets about four to six years ago. Although considering how up to date Crowley seems to be I'd fully expect him to be using a mobile phone if the implications of that tweet of the scene being ~2007 are true (my siblings and I finally got mobile phones in secondary school, so ~2004 for me, because it was the first time we'd be far enough away we might need to call and phone boxes were already disappearing). As said in the followup tweets they only exist in areas with bad mobile coverage (which would explain why Crowley might be using one).

[lunaticfringe]

I... erm... I didn't like Good Omens. :smalleek:

It was nice seeing Discworld-style horsemen and witches on Earth, but the antichrist was the sourcerer all over again.

Yeah, me too. I love a lot of Pratchett & Gaiman but Good Omens just didn't do it for me. I'm going to give the show a shot though because I did like some bits and am a fan of Tennant & Sheen.