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View Full Version : Original System Gates of Gehenna - Dark Fantasy-Renaissance-inspired Dagger&Cloak RPG



Mr.Misfit
2018-10-12, 05:19 PM
Hey folks,
my name is Mr.Misfit and for some time now, Iīve been writing this game called 'Gates of Gehenna', for the past......oh, I think 2 years now?
Itīs currently at revision 52 and just sitting and waiting for your input.

Its an Cloak&Dagger-style late Renaissance-Era Game set in Fantasy-NotEurope, after the Not-30YearsWar, using structure and narrative guiding mechanics for stories about personal tragedy and failing in an uncaring world.

The game features:
- General 'Treat Combat, Socials and Abstraction similar' Obstacle system
- Action-ability system (Exhaust Trait, Refresh Trait)
- Simple character advancement system (Roll above current value, improve characteristic)
- Dedication to small numbers and an Ad-/Disadvantage system
- Flaw & Corruption to create drama, narrative opportunities and character-endgame mechanic
- Mostly diceless on referee-side, primarily dice-based on player-side
- A dark and dangerous setting of persecution, plagues and war, where a few bad words can lead to riots and murder

Rules: drive.google.com/file/d/0B9oHoMk8UuEfM293aWNSRGdxVEE/view?usp=sharing
Character Sheet: drive.google.com/file/d/0B9oHoMk8UuEfcU1aNGdqei10a28/view?usp=sharing
Group Sheet: drive.google.com/file/d/1abnpbE4wjfsPiBPC3MjQtokyOwvonnC0/view?usp=sharing

Iīm lurking around most of the time and, of course, willing to answer any questions you might have =)
PS: If youīre willing to playtest for me that would be grand. I realize that it would be easiest for me to run it as Iīve written it, but Iīm rather looking for feedback on whether the mechanics are adequately explained from an outsiders perspective. So, Iīd appreciate any feedback you have =)

Edit (16.10.18): Iīve since uploaded v0.53, based on the first round of feedback. Have fun ^^

nineGardens
2018-10-13, 01:26 AM
It is late here, so I have to head off before doing a full critique, but initial reactions based on a quick glance:

1) The Formatting etc look pretty decent. I would recommend giving the words a little more space between them and the center line.

2) "cloak & dagger-style role-playing game about clashing ambitions, flawed individuals, and survival in an uncaring world."
This uses a stack of words, but doesn't actually leave me feeling like I know what to expect.
Does clashing ambitions mean lots of PvP? How is the uncaringness of the world an important thing? (Heck, in some sense, an actively hostile world sounds more inviting when it comes to roleplaying)
Similarly: "Gates of Gehenna is a Pen & Paper roleplaying game in a twisted fantasy world close to the end times during a development stage not unlike our own late renaissance, when great religious wars are fought within a crumbling empire of old."

I do not know enough history to have a strong picture of what "our own late renaissance" means. The phrase "twisted fantasy" feels evocative, but... well fantasy can be twisted in many different ways, so its unclear what this is supposed to evoke.

And I guess more importantly....
Is this the correct place for this sort of lore stuff. For some readers they'll be sitting there thinking "Wait, whats a Roleplaying Game?"

I think having a "by-line" is good, and important, but your current ones spend a lot of words, and don't paint a clear enough picture in my head.


"For the experienced reader
Gates of Gehenna is a semi-traditional-style..."
I think having something like this early on is a good idea.
I think having it in the main flow of reading might feel like a trap for new readers, and would be tempted to intead go this "Those familiar with other RPGs should skip to ..." as opposed to stick a block early on as a sort of... trap for new readers (In that, they'll trip over on it, and feel intimidated, and that is likely to stop them reading further.)


We can see Ann, Wily and Jerome sitting
around the gaming table that was previously
George ́s dinner table as everyone gets their char-
acters out and George begins.

Example is a good plan. I approve. Given the tone/aesthetic of the rest of this manual, I'd consider toning down the colours of your three players to something distinctive, but a little more sombre.


And... I should go catch some Zzzzzz- will try to give more feedback later.

Also: it might be worth asking for feedback on SPECIFIC things. Do you want to get peoples feelings on the setting? How about a particular mechanic? Or maybe you want to know if something LOOKS right. By asking specific questions you are more likely to get high quality feedback (a lesson I should learn myself one of these days).

Mr.Misfit
2018-10-14, 03:51 AM
It is late here, so I have to head off before doing a full critique, but initial reactions based on a quick glance:

1) The Formatting etc look pretty decent. I would recommend giving the words a little more space between them and the center line.

*thumbs_up* Will look into widening space between blocks and center line.



2) "cloak & dagger-style role-playing game about clashing ambitions, flawed individuals, and survival in an uncaring world."
This uses a stack of words, but doesn't actually leave me feeling like I know what to expect.
Does clashing ambitions mean lots of PvP? How is the uncaringness of the world an important thing? (Heck, in some sense, an actively hostile world sounds more inviting when it comes to roleplaying)
Similarly: "Gates of Gehenna is a Pen & Paper roleplaying game in a twisted fantasy world close to the end times during a development stage not unlike our own late renaissance, when great religious wars are fought within a crumbling empire of old."

Hmmm, true, maybe I should tighten that part up, use a better description and give short explanations of those points, like an overview of talking points? The idea was that these "points" would offer an overview by themselves, offering up an "idea" of what the game is about, without being too clear about it? Definitely have to tighten that up as well.



I do not know enough history to have a strong picture of what "our own late renaissance" means. The phrase "twisted fantasy" feels evocative, but... well fantasy can be twisted in many different ways, so its unclear what this is supposed to evoke.

Think Gunpowder weapons, early mechanic inventions, exploration of the new world and wars of religion.
Kinda like Ālatriste, Wallenstein or Queen Margot.



And I guess more importantly....
Is this the correct place for this sort of lore stuff. For some readers they'll be sitting there thinking "Wait, whats a Roleplaying Game?"

Oh, I see. But thatīs explained in the block afterwards, one the same page ;)



I think having a "by-line" is good, and important, but your current ones spend a lot of words, and don't paint a clear enough picture in my head.

Damnit! Okay, but thatīs to be expected, so what would you suggest, not only for yourself, but in general?



I think having something like this early on is a good idea.
I think having it in the main flow of reading might feel like a trap for new readers, and would be tempted to intead go this "Those familiar with other RPGs should skip to ..." as opposed to stick a block early on as a sort of... trap for new readers (In that, they'll trip over on it, and feel intimidated, and that is likely to stop them reading further.)

Mhmm, instead of "For the experienced reader.." basically to make it more clear. Hmm.



Example is a good plan. I approve. Given the tone/aesthetic of the rest of this manual, I'd consider toning down the colours of your three players to something distinctive, but a little more sombre.

So not Black, Blue, Red Green but something...I donīt...can you give me an example which colours would be more "somber" here? I donīt think I actually get what you are looking for ;)




And... I should go catch some Zzzzzz- will try to give more feedback later.
Also: it might be worth asking for feedback on SPECIFIC things. Do you want to get peoples feelings on the setting? How about a particular mechanic? Or maybe you want to know if something LOOKS right. By asking specific questions you are more likely to get high quality feedback (a lesson I should learn myself one of these days).

2 things actually, feedback on the mechanics and Iīm looking for playtest feedback, it has a lot of stuff in there, a lot of pieces working in tandem but I do need to someone other than me to run it, to see whether that even works out and to check back if, how and what mechanics work for others without my guidance. I know how my game works, but I need a third-party checking back and telling me if "THIS NOT FUN!" in some regards.

nineGardens
2018-10-19, 04:43 PM
Okay, I am running around enough that I can't help you out with a playtest... but I can at least clarify a few of the points you asked for clarity on...


Think Gunpowder weapons, early mechanic inventions, exploration of the new world and wars of religion.
Kinda like Ālatriste, Wallenstein or Queen Margot.
First half of this brings a fair few pictures to mind, second half of it means nothing. I'm guess you are a history buff? That's super cool, and I can see that really allowing you to infuse your world with life and realism... just keep in mind other peoples lack of knowledge.
In some sense, the first half of this is fairly evocative partly because people still HAVE religion, and gunpowder and simply mechanical inventions, so its easier to connect to.


Oh, I see. But thatīs explained in the block afterwards, one the same page ;)
Absolutely- I saw it, I'm just saying, possibly worth switching things around.... so that "What is an RPG" comes earlier. Remember: on the first page doesn't matter if you don't get people past the first line.

And actually now that I think about it, the other approach you COULD take is instead of TELLING us about the world, show us.
Just start right out of the blue with a scene from in universe. Not even a role playing example, but an actual chunk of story. It'd take more words then telling us, but would allow you to communicate the tone straight off the bat in a way that is more engaging. Make players FEEL the end times, the creeping progression of technology, the ambition and betrayal. Don't tell us anything about the rules, or that this is an RPG or anything, just give a paragraph or so to get people emotionally invested.
Don't go with anything complex. Probably only one or two characters, looking out at the world outside.

Not saying that's the best or only way, but its a possibility.



Damnit! Okay, but thatīs to be expected, so what would you suggest, not only for yourself, but in general?
Dunno sorry- by lines are super tricky, and I don't know enough about your system to say what you need. Definitely lean into the "End times" feel probably, but beyond that....????


So not Black, Blue, Red Green but something...I donīt...can you give me an example which colours would be more "somber" here? I donīt think I actually get what you are looking for ;)

Maroon rather than red. Darker blue. Maybe Greeny brown. You can still use the primary colours, but I don't want the brightness of the colours to remind me of a kids birthday party.


And... that's all for now. Back to work for me....