Explosive runes effect Golems?

[Zellsantal]

The title saids it all, I been looking up just to see if there is a yes or no to this question and have come up with now answer. I know Explosive is a well used spell and I have some more useful ideas how to use it. Such as use the spell on some small stones and place them in a bag and then willy fail on a dispel to trigger the effect (evil grin), no not on me but rather its a way to hide it and use them when needed. However I was wondering if the spell it self could effect a golem. To my understanding spells don't effect golems if you try to cast anything at them, however could you per say set a item or what ever down and set it as a trap with explosive ruins would it work that way? Or would it just be not effected like all spells?

[stack]

Explosive runes is SR: yes. Immunity to magic means you effectively have SR: infinite. Anything with magic immunity is immune to explosive runes unless they have a specific exception.

Can a golem read them without triggering them? Not sure on that. Mindless ones can't read, I expect.

[Zellsantal]

Explosive runes is SR: yes. Immunity to magic means you effectively have SR: infinite. Anything with magic immunity is immune to explosive runes unless they have a specific exception.

Can a golem read them without triggering them? Not sure on that. Mindless ones can't read, I expect.

Don't think so but still use dispel to trigger if your willing to have it fail. That's the combo I use anyways. Though that's what I find it hard to believe that all golems have immunity (that I know of anyways), like a wood golem, if up against a mage the mage would be helpless to stop it.

[Calthropstu]

Don't think so but still use dispel to trigger if your willing to have it fail. That's the combo I use anyways. Though that's what I find it hard to believe that all golems have immunity (that I know of anyways), like a wood golem, if up against a mage the mage would be helpless to stop it.

That is what makes golems so dangerous to low to mid level mages, and exactly why mages spend such exorbitant amounts to make them. It is also an example of why parties are needed.

However, there are spells that work against them. The orbs and lesser orbs for example. Also, summoning spells are also great. They can hold off or even go toe to toe with the golem.

[Anxe]

Explosive Runes is unclear how the SR is applied. Does it count for the object when you cast it or for creatures affected by the explosion?

The SRD has this to say (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicOverview/spellDescriptions.htm#spellResistance), "In many cases, spell resistance applies only when a resistant creature is targeted by the spell, not when a resistant creature encounters a spell that is already in place."

That seems to indicate that SR might not apply in this situation.

The Explosive Rune Field spell from the PHB2 would seem to back this up. It has no target besides an area and SR does not apply.

I'd say that the damage from Explosive Runes is not subject to SR if you're trying to be as strictly by the book as possible. That said, its an edge case and really up to the DM to decide.

[Zellsantal]

Explosive Runes is unclear how the SR is applied. Does it count for the object when you cast it or for creatures affected by the explosion?

The SRD has this to say (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicOverview/spellDescriptions.htm#spellResistance), "In many cases, spell resistance applies only when a resistant creature is targeted by the spell, not when a resistant creature encounters a spell that is already in place."

That seems to indicate that SR might not apply in this situation.

The Explosive Rune Field spell from the PHB2 would seem to back this up. It has no target besides an area and SR does not apply.

I'd say that the damage from Explosive Runes is not subject to SR if you're trying to be as strictly by the book as possible. That said, its an edge case and really up to the DM to decide.

That's very much what I am getting at, its not on the golem but the stone I'm using like a little bomb which I figure would by pass that SR and immunity part.


That is what makes golems so dangerous to low to mid level mages, and exactly why mages spend such exorbitant amounts to make them. It is also an example of why parties are needed.

However, there are spells that work against them. The orbs and lesser orbs for example. Also, summoning spells are also great. They can hold off or even go toe to toe with the golem.

Now the orbs I didn't know about so thanks for the info on that.

[Anxe]

That's very much what I am getting at, its not on the golem but the stone I'm using like a little bomb which I figure would by pass that SR and immunity part.

There's other issues with using your dispel magic to set off your own explosive runes spell. It relies on being able to automatically fail a roll that the rules say you automatically succeed on. I think it makes more in-universe sense to set the runes off by having someone else in the party read them after you throw the stone (write in big letters!). I'm also iffy about combining a bunch of explosive runes together to deal massive damage. In my campaigns I use the combined magical effect rules (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicOverview/castingSpells.htm#combiningMagicalEffects) for explosive runes. Only the highest damage roll of the 6d6 takes effect.

The Orb spells are also a great idea. They were basically designed to work on SR targets (golems). You'll probably get more damage using them as well.

[Zellsantal]

There's other issues with using your dispel magic to set off your own explosive runes spell. It relies on being able to automatically fail a roll that the rules say you automatically succeed on. I think it makes more in-universe sense to set the runes off by having someone else in the party read them after you throw the stone (write in big letters!). I'm also iffy about combining a bunch of explosive runes together to deal massive damage. In my campaigns I use the combined magical effect rules (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicOverview/castingSpells.htm#combiningMagicalEffects) for explosive runes. Only the highest damage roll of the 6d6 takes effect.

The Orb spells are also a great idea. They were basically designed to work on SR targets (golems). You'll probably get more damage using them as well.

If you read the spell it states on a failed attempted it triggers the spell. To what I been told you can willing to fail on a dispel spell if you do it as an area effect part of the dispel spell it would set all those that I willy fail on the dispel to set them off. So no reading is needed.

[Deophaun]

However, there are spells that work against them. The orbs and lesser orbs for example. Also, summoning spells are also great.
Also, if 3.5, dispel magic works due to oversights during the .5 update. If Pathfinder, not so much.

There's other issues with using your dispel magic to set off your own explosive runes spell. It relies on being able to automatically fail a roll that the rules say you automatically succeed on. I think it makes more in-universe sense to set the runes off by having someone else in the party read them after you throw the stone (write in big letters!). I'm also iffy about combining a bunch of explosive runes together to deal massive damage. In my campaigns I use the combined magical effect rules (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicOverview/castingSpells.htm#combiningMagicalEffects) for explosive runes. Only the highest damage roll of the 6d6 takes effect.
The best way to do this is with the other ambiguity: do you dispel in parallel, or in series. If it's in parallel, then they all go off at the same time. If in series, then the first one goes off and destroys all the others before the dispel can continue to the next.

The one sure way of detonating multiple explosive runes is to summon a bunch of fiendish hawks to carry individual runes to the target and read them, one at a time.

[Troacctid]

The Orb spells are also a great idea. They were basically designed to work on SR targets (golems). You'll probably get more damage using them as well.
I like to grab a couple tanglefoot bags to use against golems. Golems tend to have low Dexterity, so you have a pretty good shot at gluing them to the floor, or at least entangling them. A net or lasso can do the trick even cheaper, although they're a bit less accurate.