Sphere of might bleed build, is it possible?

[astrerouge]

Hi all,
While looking at sphere of might, I saw the duelist sphere and noticed the focus on bleed, which bring loads of quality of life to bleed but I was wondering if it was worth it to build around that specifically?

And if it is good, what options would go well with the sphere, be it class, feats, race?

More specifically, I would like your opinion on what is good with the bleed option in SoM, what is wrong, what you would change, and why?

I like the idea of dot build but dnd rarely offers the possibility for such build to shine and from what i've seen, to get moderate bleed damage, you usually need to just get loads of attacks, which then do so much more damage than the bleed that it might as well not be there, but since spheres focuses on standard action attack, it wouldn't work like that.

[PhantasyPen]

Dual wielding, and the new Blood sphere (which is built specifically around doing things with bleed damage) make Bleed builds more viable.

[Dr_Dinosaur]

Additionally, the Duelist sphere itself lets you augment bleed damage a bit, removing immunities and even getting better at maneuvers against bleeding enemies if that’s your thing!

[Manyasone]

I did a bleed build with an antagonist to toss at my PC's, It was brutally efficient, this was before the synergy with the new Blood sphere.
Top of my head, it was a coiled fighter archetype fighting with a scimitar/shield combination. I think it had the mercurial flow, balanced blows and Focusing Defense with the Dual wielding sphere; bashing shield, deflecting shield, hardened shield and sacrificial shield with the shield sphere, greater shove from the brute sphere, and from the duelist sphere defensive slice, long cuts (this is a must), scar tissue, clouding cut, debilitating injuries, open vein, bleed air and jugular cut. Equipment sphere he had Versatile Shield. Coupled with the vital strike tree, Lvl 16 fighter i think.
They sweated blood, pardon the pun

[Hal0Badger]

In Lancer sphere, basic ability impale does bleed damage equal to weapon dice when you remove the weapon. If you can get a big dice weapon ( like butcher axe ) it is considerably high.

Bleed damage from duelist sphere also stacks with this.

[astrerouge]

Thank you all for the replies.
So, if i were to use the duelist and blood sphere, i would need to take a champion class, which one would be good? Reaper is 3rd party but circumvent bleed immunity which could be good. Is there any other champion class that would be useful for a bleeder?

Other than class, talents would be something like :
-duelist sphere
-long cut
-ooze ichor (unless going reaper)
-iai slash
-open vein

and magic talent would be in blood sphere i suppose, something like:
-blood sphere
-crimson vortex
-exsanguinating strike
-hemorrhage
-improved bleed
-lingering control

Is there anything else? AS for feats, i suppose bloodmonger and spell strike would be nice
I'M not sure about the lancer sphere for bleed, since I feel like it would be a bit too slow, in the sense that it would take a whole turn to add a meager bleed, but i might be wrong (draw as quick, to get iai slash, impale, adding blled, then move action to remove adding other bleed, which would require me to always be adjacent to my enemies)

[khadgar567]

Thank you all for the replies.
So, if i were to use the duelist and blood sphere, i would need to take a champion class, which one would be good? Reaper is 3rd party but circumvent bleed immunity which could be good. Is there any other champion class that would be useful for a bleeder?

Other than class, talents would be something like :
-duelist sphere
-long cut
-ooze ichor (unless going reaper)
-iai slash
-open vein

and magic talent would be in blood sphere i suppose, something like:
-blood sphere
-crimson vortex
-exsanguinating strike
-hemorrhage
-improved bleed
-lingering control

Is there anything else? AS for feats, i suppose bloodmonger and spell strike would be nice
I'M not sure about the lancer sphere for bleed, since I feel like it would be a bit too slow, in the sense that it would take a whole turn to add a meager bleed, but i might be wrong (draw as quick, to get iai slash, impale, adding blled, then move action to remove adding other bleed, which would require me to always be adjacent to my enemies)
well prodigy has a blood sphere option and you can get nice synergy with duelist sphere in the class.

[Fallenreality]

You can also give any non-full casting class proficient Spheres of Might progression by sacrificing every other feat (1, 5, 9, 13, 17) I believe. I think if your DM allows it you can also take a martial tradition if you do that

[Dr_Dinosaur]

You can also give any non-full casting class proficient Spheres of Might progression by sacrificing every other feat (1, 5, 9, 13, 17) I believe. I think if your DM allows it you can also take a martial tradition if you do that

No, you have to give up the weapon/armor proficiencies your level 1 class gives to get a Martial Tradition

[Fallenreality]

No, you have to give up the weapon/armor proficiencies your level 1 class gives to get a Martial Tradition

Yeah but anyone can do that with DM permission, if you're giving up your feats for progression then no reason not to give up profs for the tradition as well

[Hal0Badger]

If you are going for a champion class, having destruction sphere with drawbacks for energy blade and a blast type that deals bleed damage as well ( there should be one as far as remember ), with improved energy blade feat, might be a nice boost. You can use energy blade as a swift action which means no AoO, and it can be combined with a special attack action.

[astrerouge]

If you are going for a champion class, having destruction sphere with drawbacks for energy blade and a blast type that deals bleed damage as well ( there should be one as far as remember ), with improved energy blade feat, might be a nice boost. You can use energy blade as a swift action which means no AoO, and it can be combined with a special attack action.

Could this be used with exsanguinating strike from blood sphere too? If so that would be really nice, granted its not a lot but it stacks up.

AS for the classes, i'm really tempted with reaper for its ability to overcome bleed immunity, but the rest is just so boring to me, whereas prodigy seems to be generally better, its duelist opening letting me stack a second bleed as a touch attack using a move action, so not alway usable depending on positioning, but quite a bit of added damage when it comes up.

The option to replace feats with sphere of might progression seems interesting but i think i am too much in love with feats to give that up, given the existence of champion classes.

A thought that came to me, would the use of a feat similar to practiced spellcaster (+4 to caster level, up to your HD) be used with a character with midcaster or low caster progression? Does such a feat exists for sphere of power? Would it be too strong to apply it? I am thinking about it mainly to up the bleed from blood sphere

[Hal0Badger]

For destruction sphere, for a chosen blast type, with a feat you can get +5 to your caster level up to your HD, it is under sphere specific feats. For war sphere, there are a couple of options that counts your BAB as CL for various effects of the totems, but I cannot remember if they are feats or class abilties.

I am talking about war sphere because with gyroscopic totem, you can easily make others prone ( as well as a boasted AoE control ), and with " and Stay Down!" Talent + muscular reflexes you can make it really hard for them to stand up, as well as getting an AoO any enemy drops prone near you.

[Dr_Dinosaur]

Could this be used with exsanguinating strike from blood sphere too? If so that would be really nice, granted its not a lot but it stacks up.

AS for the classes, i'm really tempted with reaper for its ability to overcome bleed immunity, but the rest is just so boring to me, whereas prodigy seems to be generally better, its duelist opening letting me stack a second bleed as a touch attack using a move action, so not alway usable depending on positioning, but quite a bit of added damage when it comes up.

The option to replace feats with sphere of might progression seems interesting but i think i am too much in love with feats to give that up, given the existence of champion classes.

A thought that came to me, would the use of a feat similar to practiced spellcaster (+4 to caster level, up to your HD) be used with a character with midcaster or low caster progression? Does such a feat exists for sphere of power? Would it be too strong to apply it? I am thinking about it mainly to up the bleed from blood sphere

Duelist has a talent that lets you bypass bleed immunity, at least from creature type iirc

Practiced Spellcaster and other 1st party CL increasing effects are incompatible with SoP, per the creators.