Homebrewing a simple spell for Necromancers (and butchers?)

[Klaus Teufel]

Flense
Instant, range 30'
1st Level transmutation (necromancy?)

This spell removes the flesh from a medium-sized corpse targeted by the caster.

Should it just make the flesh disappear, or should the skeleton spring forth from the body?
Should it be transmutation or necromancy? Should it be 1st level, or a cantrip?

Please give suggestions and other ideas!

[Mr.Spastic]

I think it would be more transmutation. Your not animating the bones just removing them. I would make it a cantrip.

[Mr.Spastic]

I think a good 2nd level spell would be instantly animating a fresh corpse/skeleton for a minute

[Galithar]

Cantrip. It has no direct combat application and no extra combat shenanigans would be possible that I can see.

It could be used to block revivify I suppose. Kill someone and strip their bones before the cleric can cast revivify, now you need true Resurrection or reincarnate.

[Klaus Teufel]

Cantrip. It has no direct combat application and no extra combat shenanigans would be possible that I can see.

It could be used to block revivify I suppose. Kill someone and strip their bones before the cleric can cast revivify, now you need true Resurrection or reincarnate.

Make the casting time one minute perhaps?

[Maelynn]

I'd make it a ritual, casting time 1 minute.

Also, I was initially mortified by this idea... until I reread the first post and saw that I had overlooked the word 'corpse'. o.O

[Klaus Teufel]

Flensing Corpse


1st level transmutation
Casting Time: 1 minute (ritual)

Range:
30 feet

Components: V, S, small bone

Duration: Instant

You target the corpse of a creature native to the Material Plane, medium-sized or smaller, that has a skeleton. After one minute of concentration on the ritual, the corps splits allowing the complete, connected skeleton to appear lying atop the corpse.


At Higher Levels: For each level the caster is above 5th level, they can flense an additional creature.

(This matches the Animate Dead progression, because 2 character levels = +1 spell slot level)

[Erloas]

Well for a point of comparison, PF/3.5 has the spell already Decompose Corpse (https://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/d/decompose-corpse/). Level 1, necromancy. Not that it has to stay that way.

This would be about the worse possible spell for a butcher though, that is essentially exactly the opposite of what they want. They want all the fleshy bits without the bones. Even if you're just giving it to your dogs, they would prefer it with a bit of flesh.

This seems like a "hide the body" or "make it much more difficult to identify" sort of use.

[Klaus Teufel]

Well for a point of comparison, PF/3.5 has the spell already Decompose Corpse (https://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/d/decompose-corpse/). Level 1, necromancy. Not that it has to stay that way.

This would be about the worse possible spell for a butcher though, that is essentially exactly the opposite of what they want. They want all the fleshy bits without the bones. Even if you're just giving it to your dogs, they would prefer it with a bit of flesh.

This seems like a "hide the body" or "make it much more difficult to identify" sort of use.

Well, you've got all that meat, lying directly under the skeleton.

[Nifft]

I'd make it a ritual, casting time 1 minute.

Yeah, make it a Ritual.

NOT a Cantrip -- those slots are precious, not to be wasted on fun fluffy flavor things.

[Klaus Teufel]

I'm not clear on rituals. Do they have levels?

[NaughtyTiger]

Some spells have the "ritual" tag.

So you create the spell as though it requires a spell slot... (level 1, prolly druid or cleric)

add the ritual tag

now it can be cast as a ritual (by appropriate class: wiz, bard cleric, druid) - additional 10 minute casting time. no slot burned.
a butcher (needs a level of appropriate caster OR ritual caster feat)

[Sception]

Ritual is a normal spell, cast normally via normal slots, but if you have the 'ritual caster' class ability or feat for the relevant spell list, then you can cast the ritual spell without expending any spell slots, at the cost of adding 10 minutes to the casting time. You still have to have the spell prepared/memorized/whatever to cast it.

And yeah, that's the way to go with this. 1st level ritual. Too niche to be a cantrip, to weak to require spell slots.
Make it a necromancy spell if it rots the flesh away, transmutation or conjuration if it separates the bones from the flesh while leaving both usable. I'd personally go with the necromancy/decomposing version, since necromancers are likely to be most interested in the spell, and the necromancy spell list is rather lacking, from a purely quantitative perspective.

[Man_Over_Game]

I'd just tack it on as a choice to Gentle Repose, which already doesn't see enough use.

Make it so you can either choose to preserve a body, or rapidly decay it. The preservation ability works exactly as Gentle Repose already does (preserve a body for 10 days), but the decay option lets you rapidly decay the flesh off after a minute, and treated as if it has been aged for 10 years (which blocks out most resurrection spells).

It's already a ritual, available to Wizards and Clerics.

[Sception]

Making it an option for gentle repose makes some mechanical sense, but thematically the two effects are so diametrically opposed that I have a hard time seeing them as the same spell. Sort of like deciding 'darkness' and 'light' should be the same spell.

Or, as a better example, 'cure wounds' and 'inflict wounds'.

[Man_Over_Game]

Making it an option for gentle repose makes some mechanical sense, but thematically the two effects are so diametrically opposed that I have a hard time seeing them as the same spell. Sort of like deciding 'darkness' and 'light' should be the same spell.

Or, as a better example, 'cure wounds' and 'inflict wounds'.

There's nothing saying preserving a body isn't a necromancer ability. Raise Dead is, in fact, a necromancy spell, as is Gentle Repose. Wizard Necromancers actually get the spell half-off, due to their Savant ability, so they're more incentivized to get it than most.

The spell focus changes to "Corpse preparation". There's a lot of ways to prepare a corpse, whether that's for embalming, for an open-casket funeral, or for a cremation.

Just because you're composing the flesh doesn't make it inherently an evil act, and preserving the still body of your dark lord for his lichdom ritual may not be a good act.

[Sception]

There's nothing saying preserving a body isn't a necromancer ability.

I'm not saying it isn't a necromancer ability. Just that it doesn't feel like /the same/ necromancer ability. Again, like darkness & light, both can be evocation spells, but they kind of feel like they should be different evocation spells. Or, again, cure and inflict wounds. I know they're not both necromancy spells right now, just that they easily /could/ both be necromancy spells, but even if they were I still think they would make more sense as /different/ necromancy spells, since their effects are diametrically opposed.

Preserving a body vs. instantly decomposing it, while both are necromancy spells, just feels like two different spells to me.

[Klaus Teufel]

Yeah, not going to add it to gentle repose. Flense is a niche spell, but quite useful to those who fit that niche.

More ideas:

Flense Corpse
1st-level Transmutation (ritual)
Casting time: 1 minute
Range: 30 feet
Components: small bone
Duration: Instantaneous


You target the corpse of a Medium-sized or smaller humanoid or beast, that has a skeleton. After concentration on the ritual, the body splits; allowing the complete, connected skeleton to appear lying atop the corpse.


At Higher Levels: For each level the caster is above 5th level, they can flense an additional creature.

(This matches the Animate Dead progression, because 2 character levels = +1 spell slot level)

[Klaus Teufel]

Anyone else want to critique my spell?

[Damon_Tor]

Should it just make the flesh disappear, or should the skeleton spring forth from the body?
Should it be transmutation or necromancy? Should it be 1st level, or a cantrip?

Please give suggestions and other ideas!

I was thinking the other day there should be a spell that increases the rate at which time passes


Time Dilation
1st Level Transmutation
Casting Time: 1 Action
Range: Touch
Components VSM (a sand timer)
Duration: Concentration up to 1 hour

Target one creature or object in range that can be no larger than huge. Until the spell ends, 1 day passes for the object every round. Natural processes like decay, rust and erosion increase in speed accordingly. Magical effects such as items regaining magical charges or the duration of spells are not effected by this magic. The bodies of creatures effected this way age, but don't suffer effects of thirst, hunger, sleep deprivation and other similar effects, and they perceive time passing normally. The spell ends if you are no longer touching the target.

At Higher Levels: When cast using a higher-level spell slot, the amount of time that passes per round increases
Level 2: 1 week
Level 3: 1 month
Level 4: 1 year
Level 5: 10 years
Level 6: 100 years
Level 7: 1,000 years
Level 8: 10,000 years
Level 9: 100,000 years

So at level 1, with a full duration, you've got 600 days worth of decay, easily enough time to clear most of the flesh off a corpse.

[Klaus Teufel]

I've come up with a more accurate name for the spell:

Excarnate Corpse


excarnate in British
(ɛksˈkɑːnɪt, ɛksˈkɑːneɪt)
adjective
1.
with the flesh removed
2. ecclesiastical
divested of a human form
verb
3.
to lose or remove flesh


Whereas 'Flense':
flense in British
(flɛns ), flench (flɛntʃ ) or flinch (flɪntʃ )
verb
(transitive)
to strip (a whale, seal, etc) of (its blubber or skin)