Max Damage per Swing

[samduke]

so with the limitations of a few things I am attempting to help create a fighter based character for a 1st timer to our local for this friday, who's only thought was wanting massive damage as a fighter.

So Race: Human with Str 18 base, Base Class Fighter probably 5 or 6 levels to get into most PRC's, Max level 17, no templates, no human paragon class, no bloodlines, no dragon magazines, basically only 1st party books are open

so far my suggestion they liked was warhulk 5 for extra strength, leaving room for other options
with warhulk 5 netting Str +10 - and at least 2 level ups going into Str for 30 total

now weapon wise the player is wanting a sword type I think is the best overall base damage sword options 1 or 2 handed are: Bastard sword M 1d10, Courtblade M 1d10 and Greatsword M 2d6 - are there others that are better?

now I know weapon wise we can make it 2 sizes larger and use monkey grip and strongarm braces, to increase base damage, and then to boost that damage output with these add-ons, But this is looking for just actual sword damage presuming a critical hit will occur every swing

Mercurial: increase critical hit multiplier by 2
Heavy Weapon: damage die as size +1 larger

so what we are looking for is suggestions for class/PRC, feats ect. for pure damage output via the sword without magical spells, special effects like shocking ect. - thanks

[Rebel7284]

google ubercharger.

Using things like Shock Trooper and several ways to multiply damage on a charge (Headlong Rush, Valorous Weapon, Leap Attack, Power Lunge, a dive), you can deal thousands of damage on a charge. Lion Totem barbarian gives you pounce so you can apply those bonuses to your full attack.

[MommaGoose505]

The problem with War Hulk is it doesn't increase BaB, you will get more single hit damage using power attack, moreso with leap attack.

[flappeercraft]

The problem with War Hulk is it doesn't increase BaB, you will get more single hit damage using power attack, moreso with leap attack.

Minor Schema of Divine Power + UMD says otherwise. Get that and you get best of both worlds.

[Menzath]

I think this thread on hulking hurler would be useful if they don't mind tossing things and not actually swinging a weapon.

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-166459.html

Otherwise if you want massive damage with a weapon the doesn't use odd race's/templates/items, your best bet might actually be a Gish.(preferably with sorcerer spellcasting)
Enlarge weapon and (greater)mighty wallop gives a bludgeoning weapon an effective size increase of 2-5(6) to a total of gargantuan+(as described in epic level handbook).
And that's not even including any other buffs to strength or damage, which can push it a bit farther.

If you are going for a "simple" swing and hit stuff build, use an Uber charger instead, unless your table is playing at an optimization point where the fighter won't be outshined in every encounter. In that case I suppose a fighter is fine, but if you want BIG hits, a rouge wouldn't be a bad choice either, and with extra skills they would have more options to do things out of combat.
Maybe a mix of fighter(acf thug from unearthed arcana) and rogue, that would get you the best of both while not leaving you feeling gimped completely in other areas.

[MommaGoose505]

so what we are looking for is suggestions for class/PRC, feats ect. for pure damage output via the sword without magical spells, special effects like shocking ect. - thanks

I think minor schema might conflict with what the OP was looking for.

[samduke]

thing with the uber charger is it is a one turn mass damage what we are looking for is consistent round after round maximum damage per swing, the BAB issue is being solved in other ways and yes no magic spells, to be counted on for buffing or otherwise and certainly not going to dip any caster class because we are running heavy metal armor.
was hoping more for possible weapon options but looks like I have named the big guns already

[Rebel7284]

thing with the uber charger is it is a one turn mass damage what we are looking for is consistent round after round maximum damage per swing, the BAB issue is being solved in other ways and yes no magic spells, to be counted on for buffing or otherwise and certainly not going to dip any caster class because we are running heavy metal armor.
was hoping more for possible weapon options but looks like I have named the big guns already

An uber charger can often charger can often charge round after round with things like Sudden Leap maneuver and possibly Travel Devotion/Belt of Battle/Chronocharm or simply, by killing everyone within reach (a reach weapon to extend reach is VERY useful here.)

There are a number of casters that do just fine in heavy armor. The most powerful of those is Cleric, but there are other options like Runesmith or just using a Feycrafted+Githcrafted+Thristledown armor with a Spellsword dip. You don't HAVE to use a caster, but if you want a wizard in full plate, you CAN in 3.5

I think for highest damage outside of charging builds or Hulking Hurler builds, you have shapeshifters like Master or Many Forms, king of smack builds with Psionics and after that, just a simple Warblade. If you are okay with some casting, Ruby Knight Vindicator is one of the best tanks in the game.

Also small note about the original post: Strongarm Bracers and Monkey Grip don't stack.

[Zaq]

Pick up a die of Sneak Attack somehow and take Craven. Easy, scales with level with no further investment, and the Craven damage is even crit-friendly. If this is for a first-timer, snag Island of Blades for easy-mode flanking (which gets downright hilarious while mounted, not that you want to inflict the nightmarish mounted combat rules on a newbie).

[Buufreak]

The issues I see with warhulk is human isn't large by default, and it also makes you incapable of making certain skill checks, including UMD. Just a thought.

[finaldooms]

also if your looking to deal more damage on a crit using a sword i recommend the executioners blade? same as a great sword (2d6 19-20) but it comes witha x3 crit instead and its still a martial weapon ..and if you make it large then its 3d6 huge is 4d6 i think?
and as stated monkey grip and SAB dont stack sadly, plus if you want war hulk you need to have perma enlarge person cast on you to meet the requirements for LARGE

...another option is to make a ..minotaur or half minotaur? i dont play with monster races/varients in my games normally so im sure someone else on here can explain the benifits

[samduke]

Also small note about the original post: Strongarm Bracers and Monkey Grip don't stack.
reference source book & page where it states they do not stack please


The issues I see with warhulk is human isn't large by default, and it also makes you incapable of making certain skill checks, including UMD. Just a thought.
yes I know the human is getting large from other sources


executioners blade
reference source book & page please


another option is to make a ..minotaur or half minotaur? i dont play with monster races/varients in my games normally so im sure someone else on here can explain the benefits
well with the half minotaur/ogre template its a +1 LA cost to gain large size with bonuses to some attributes with other abilities so trade 1 ECL for that is choice of player if allowed by gm - in this case it is not

[Buufreak]

yes I know the human is getting large from other sources

Well, you hadn't exactly listed that out. Sorry to assume that someone was capable of overlooking basic RAW.

[samduke]

Well, you hadn't exactly listed that out. Sorry to assume that someone was capable of overlooking basic RAW.

its not overlooked at all and if it was not related to the portion of the question involved it was not really needed to list, it simply was not part the question.

the question was is there a "SWORD" weapon with better damage than those listed & if via class/prc & or feats
is it possible to increase that swords damage on a consistent round by round basis as magic and charge are in some cases not useable or situational

most of the answers given were known so far, those unknown or questioned have been asked about.

[MommaGoose505]

The Kensai (CW 49) is based around improving a single weapon. The lvl2 ability Power Surge adds +8 strength with a con check which doesn't interfere with War Hulk's No Time to Think(ex).

[Menzath]

I will one up your executioner's sword, with a mercurial greatsword from arms and equipment guide(3.0 material).
Same as greatsword but x4 crit multiplier, and is an exotic weapon.

If getting the weapon enchants you want might not be possible, then the feat ancestral relic(ya sword) would allow you a bit more freedom and be less hassle, combine with a few levels in kensai for an epic weapon pre-epic levels.

As for strong-arm bracers and monkey grip not stacking, saddly it is true due to monkey grips wording

"You can use melee weapons one size category larger than you are "

Strong-arm bracers do not actually give you a size increase, or an effective size increase due to it's wording. Since you aren't a large(r) size what weapon you can effectively wield does not increase again.

[Maat Mons]

presuming a critical hit will occur every swing

Why are we assuming that?

Also, a full 1/3rd of creature types inherently grant immunity to extra damage from critical hits. And there are magic items that give immunity to extra damage from critical hits. ... And spells too.




warhulk 5 for extra strength

If you're doing that, might as well go the full 10 levels of Warhulk, and compensate by buying a Skillful weapon. That will give him a base attack bonus of +12/+7/+1 at 17th level, in spite of the fact that Warhulk doesn't advance base attack bonus. As a bonus, Skillful also removes the need for Exotic Weapon Proficiency.

Anyway, power attacking for 12 should be feasible, since the strength bonuses from Warhulk give him +10 to hit relative to other characters. That's +24 damage with a two-handed weapon. And the +20 strength also gives +15 damage. Not great, but okay, I suppose.

At least you'll hit the 50-damage threshold that forces a DC 15 fortitude save vs death on every hit. Someone will probably roll a 1 eventually.



Alternately, you could go Frenzied Berserker. Even when not charging, power attacking for full would deal +68 damage. But if you're not going to charge, I can't think of any good tricks for working around the attack penalty.




reference source book & page please

If I recall, executioner's mace is from some issue of Dungeon magazine or another. Or maybe "executioner’s blade" is actually a thing, and I've just never heard of it.




I will one up your executioner's sword, with a mercurial greatsword from arms and equipment guide(3.0 material).
Same as greatsword but x4 crit multiplier, and is an exotic weapon.

That was errated and updated.