Three stats below 10, what to build?

[Luccan]

So, I rolled this: 16, 12, 12, 9, 7, 6

Which is kind of terrible. Thing is, I don't know if I'll get a reroll. So, if I have to go with this, what can I do with it? I'm genuinely at a loss for anything other than casters that are bad at all mental stats but their casting one or socially inept idiots who can hit things with a stick really well.

[LudicSavant]

So, I rolled this: 16, 12, 12, 9, 7, 6

Which is kind of terrible. Thing is, I don't know if I'll get a reroll. So, if I have to go with this, what can I do with it? I'm genuinely at a loss for anything other than casters that are bad at all mental stats but their casting one or socially inept idiots who can hit things with a stick really well.

Looks about like the stat spread I rolled last time I played a Moon Druid.

Speaking of which, Moon Druid is pretty good with such a stat spread, since they spend so much of their time using a different creature's stats instead of their own anyways.

[Captain Bob]

16, 12, 12, 9, 7, 6


Ok. Time to think about your race pick, my dude. Honestly it's not an optimal stat spread for a MAD build, but SAD? You still have the chance to start with an 18 in your most important stat if you so choose - you're still totally fine.

Moon druid could work since you just ignore your non mental stats when you shape-shift.

You could go Rogue or fighter as well, pick a +2 dex race for the former, and something high-value like a mountain dwarf for the latter. Those classes also give you extra ability score increases too, if you really are worried about feeling the pain of low stuff. In honesty though, 18 in your 'important' stat is more than enough for you to do just fine - think about it, 18's are actually impossible to pick up using point buy.

Barbarian is sort of on the same page, Don't need too much to make it work if you pick a complementary race. If you're worried about the numbers, look at what you can make out of a mountain dwarf or a half-elf, since they get the most significant stat increases outside of vanilla human.

Or, use V. Human to your advantage. Step 1 Pick a caster class, drop the 16 in that stat. Step 2, 12 in dex and con, use plus 1's here. Step 3, use a feat to compensate. Bard or warlock? take Moderately armored or Medium armor master to get dex to 14. Con being low is sad but you don't have to front-line anyways. In the case of bard (or for that matter, rogue and knowledge domain cleric) leverage your expertise to either find your niche, or make you less bad at stuff you still want to be able to do.

**** dude, if it comes down to it, be a god and roll Knowledge cleric 1 / Rogue 1 / Bard X - Skill your balls off and collect all that juicy sweet expertise. Stats almost don't matter in that case. Maybe more realistically, Knowledge Cleric 1 / Rogue X, Rogue 1 / Knowledge cleric X, or Rogue 1 / bard X - avoid needing more than dex and 1 casting stat.


**TLDR - Pick a high stat value race and a single ability dependent class, or get creative with it and lean into being an expertise skill monkey.

[Cwyll]

Adds up to 62; I usually allow re-rolling till you get a total that's 70+, so try asking your DM for that option if possible?
If not, then moon druid who relies on the animals physical stats might work for you, or barbarian with no social/mental skills

[CTurbo]

If somebody rolls that bad, I at least let them take point buy.

But this is why l make everybody roll, and anybody can use anybody's rolls.

[CTurbo]

As far as making a character from those rolls, I'd go Mountain Dwarf Barbarian with 18 Str, 12 Dex, 14 Con, and 6 Cha and he would be even grumpier than your normal grumpy dwarf.

[JackPhoenix]

The common solution is a Moon Druid. Your physical stats don't matter if you're a bear or whatever half the time.

[Whyrocknodie]

Wizard, 6 Con, 7 Dex, green flame blade on a dagger, member of a cult that refuses all medical assistance.

The next character might be luckier!

[some guy]

If you're going with a martial, you could also put the 12 in a mental stat and just have a lower physical stat.
I once played a barbarian with 5 intelligence but 13 charisma, and played him as a loveable, oaf with a positive outlook. He was a lot of fun.

A mountain dwarf barbarian could have 18 str, 12 dex, 11 con, and 12/7/6 in the mental stats. A barbarian would have enough hp to survive such a low con (and a dwarf would give a bonus on saves vs poison).
A mountain dwarf martial who wears heavy armor could also have a lower dex and a good mental stat.

Hill dwarf nature cleric is also an option. 9/12 str, 6/7 dex, 14 con, 6/7/12 int, 17 wis, 6/7/12 cha. Dwarves ignore the speed penalty of heavy armor, a nature cleric can select shillelagh as a cantrip, so the only reason you want str is for carrying capacity and saves. Low strength, but you can still function very nicely in melee.

It's dwarves all the way down.

[Corran]

Here is a suggestion. It's not a very good suggestion though.

Take normal human as race. That sets your stats as: 17, 13, 13, 10, 8, 7.
Then use your first two ASI's to round up the odd stats, so after two ASI's your stats would look like: 18, 14, 14, 10, 8, 8. You could play a fighter (archer) because that means you will only depend really on one stat (and you have one good stat), while also taking feats at a faster rate (bonus feat at levels 6 and 14), allowing you thus to improve your bad stats while also grabbing one or two important feats along the way.

Generally though, my suggestion would be to play an archer (fighter or ranger, probably fighter though cause ranger archer would profit from a good wisdom which you don't have; or rogue even), or a druid as other people already suggested.

[Sigreid]

Those rolls would do just fine as a druid or a fighter. Druid because it's easy to get around bad stats when you need to, fighter because you only really need 2, and you get enough ASI to bring one of those 12s up to a reasonable con.

[Tanarii]

Mount Dwarf Fighter
Str 18
Dex 6
Con 14
Int 9
Wis 12
Cha 7

Or swap Wis and Int.

Looks like a classic to me!

[2D8HP]

So, I rolled this: 16, 12, 12, 9, 7, 6
.


I'd go with a Wood Elf Outlander Rogue, so +2 to to DEX and plus +1 to Wisdom, have expertise in Athletics (or Stealth) and Perception.

STR 12

DEX 18

CON 12

INT 7

WIS 10

CHA 6

Carry a bow and a rapier, I think it could be a viable PC

[jdolch]

You can also ask if you can take the standard array instead of using your rolls. That seems reasonable. BUT these aren't all that terrible.

If you don't want to go pure squishy Caster, these are also perfectly good stats for a Hexblade Sorlock Gish. (Not epic, but perfectly fine.)

Going Half Elf (also gives Darkvision, Sleep Immunity and Charm Resistance) it comes out to:
STR 6
DEX 12
CON 12
INT 8 (7)
WIS 10 (9)
CHA 18 (16)

Sorcer level 1 gives Proficiency with CON saves. Then 2-3 Levels Hexblade gives among other things EB+AB+RB Combo (which is awesome), Medium Armor+Shield+Shield Spell (AC 18+5) and Martial Weapons. All of which mean your lowish CON dosn't really matter. Also CHA replaces STR for Attacks, making you basically SAD. Sorcerer levels later give Quickened Spell.

That is certainly not a weak character by any definition. Well, other than having STR 6, which doesn't matter :smallbiggrin:

[Mr.Spastic]

Hill Dwarf Life Cleric. 18 in you Con 13 in Wis, the rest can be whatever. Due the the healing boost you get from Life Cleric and the great cleric spells that don't require a high casting stat like Bless and Aid and Sanctuary, you don't need a good wisdom. As you level up I would suggest bumping it though. Another great thing is that your strength can be really low if you want it because dwarves ignore movement penalties from armor. With this build you can just sit their in combat and do nothing but stand their casting healing word and giving the help action while you have Sanctuary or Shield of Faith going on yourself.

[Vexacia]

Pick a race with a +2 in it and you can start with an 18 in your attack / spellcasting stat. That's really far from terrible - that's actually pretty good. Sure, you can't really play a Monk or a Paladin, but who cares? You can play almost everything else.

Who cares about your dump stats? They're dump stats. They exist to be dumped. Be stupid. Be socially awkward. Be weak. Be a bit daft if you gotta. I don't care about my dump stats being dump stats, why should you? Besides, really low dump stats can, as always, make for especially interesting characters.

You'll not be able to get a 14 CON unless you're a melee mountain dwarf, but that's fine. Play a ranged character. Ranged characters can reluctantly stomach 12 DEX / 12 CON just fine. It's not ideal, but if you sit in the back you'll survive, and you'll probably really enjoy having 20 in your attack / casting stat at level 4. Hell, if I could point buy to a 16 (even if it meant I was stuck with a max of 12 in DEX/CON), I'd consider choosing that intentionally for especially safe backliners.

Race choice might be a bit limited if you want to play a Druid/Cleric/Wizard, because Firbolg is the only +2 WIS race in normal settings and Gnome is the only +2 INT races in normal settings, but both Firbolg and Gnome are very good races. If your world's open to MTF/WGE/GGR races, there's also Githzerai/Wildhunt Shifters for WIS and Vedalken for INT.

[PeteNutButter]

These stats aren’t bad. In fact given the choice between point buy, standard array, and those I might be inclined to choose your rolled stats (for some characters). You have a 16 which gives you access to an 18 at first level.

The suggested mountain dwarf fighter is a good choice, but really anything SAD works. Any pure caster, rogue, and fighter fit best.

A +2 dex race with a fighter, rogue, or ranger is the safe play. Stay at range to reduce the risk of the slightly below par 12 con.

[MaxWilson]

If somebody rolls that bad, I at least let them take point buy.

But this is why l make everybody roll, and anybody can use anybody's rolls.

It blows my mind that people are treating those as bad rolls. In my book they are pretty good rolls. I'd take them over point buy (partly because point buy is boring). You're SAD-shaped, but still clearly competent.

Eldritch Knight archer is one obvious direction to take this in, but with the mood I'm in I'd actually probably prefer an Arcane Trickster/Enchanter hybrid, aiming for eventual Skulker Alert Moderately Armored AT 9/Ench 11 and a penchant for scouting ahead of the party and using Charm Monster to turn enemies friendly (two monsters for one fourth level spell slot because Ench 10, both saves at disadvantage because precombat and AT 9) and using them to defeat other monsters, plus the usual tricks with Disguise Self/Seeming and Twin Otto's Irresistible Dance/Hold Monster and Greater Invisibility/Fog Cloud + Cunning Action (or just regular darkness + Cunning Action, thanks to Skulker) and/or Booming Blade.

Sure, your Dex is merely good not great, but you're still going to do great things. Expertise will do most of the heavy lifting anyway.

[CTurbo]

It blows my mind that people are treating those as bad rolls. In my book they are pretty good rolls. I'd take them over point buy (partly because point buy is boring). You're SAD-shaped, but still clearly competent.

Eldritch Knight archer is one obvious direction to take this in, but with the mood I'm in I'd actually probably prefer an Arcane Trickster/Enchanter hybrid, aiming for eventual Skulker Alert Moderately Armored AT 9/Ench 11 and a penchant for scouting ahead of the party and using Charm Monster to turn enemies friendly (two monsters for one fourth level spell slot because Ench 10, both saves at disadvantage because precombat and AT 9) and using them to defeat other monsters, plus the usual tricks with Disguise Self/Seeming and Twin Otto's Irresistible Dance/Hold Monster and Greater Invisibility/Fog Cloud + Cunning Action (or just regular darkness + Cunning Action, thanks to Skulker) and/or Booming Blade.

Sure, your Dex is merely good not great, but you're still going to do great things. Expertise will do most of the heavy lifting anyway.


They're not terrible rolls, but they are for the most part worse than point buy or the standard array with the exception of being capable of starting with a 18 in something.

I do agree that point buy is boring which is why I do prefer rolling for stats or even coming up with my own array.

But yeah those rolls aren't TOO bad. I've certainly seen a lot worse. You could make a lot of viable characters from that spread, but it's poor enough to kill a lot of concepts too. Having two different mods with a -2 is not good. You could be a Half-Elf though and make your 3 low stats 10, 8, 8

[jdolch]

TBH I find it much harder to come up with a character for an array of average stats. Sure you can be anything but at the same time you're not exceptional at anything either. And having "high" dump stats is just a waste.

One good stat is really all it takes for many awesome characters. Maybe a second middling stat and the rest are all dump stats anyway. They also provide great roleplay opportunities.

I would take your stats any day over someone who rolled like 11,8,12,14,10,8

[MaxWilson]

But yeah those rolls aren't TOO bad. I've certainly seen a lot worse. You could make a lot of viable characters from that spread, but it's poor enough to kill a lot of concepts too. Having two different mods with a -2 is not good. You could be a Half-Elf though and make your 3 low stats 10, 8, 8

Sure, but high rolls can kill a concept too. It's why you should not pick your concept until after you roll and assign your stats. If you do it the other way around and envision e.g. a haughty, quick-tempered nobleman with an impulsive gambling problem, and then roll Int/Wis/Cha all 12+, your concept isn't going to work now.

In this particular case I'd probably make the Arcane Trickster/Enchanter a Gnome (because why not? I rarely play Gnomes and this concept fits) with low Str (because tiny), Wisdom (adrenaline junkie/Real Lunatic), and Charisma (but he thinks it's above average because Dunning-Krueger effect, plus Fundamental Attribution Error compounded by magic). He's good at making "friends" but not so good at keeping them, and he thinks that's their fault.


TBH I find it much harder to come up with a character for an array of average stats. Sure you can be anything but at the same time you're not exceptional at anything either. And having "high" dump stats is just a waste.

One good stat is really all it takes for many awesome characters. Maybe a second middling stat and the rest are all dump stats anyway. They also provide great roleplay opportunities.

I would take your stats any day over someone who rolled like 11,8,12,14,10,8

Yes, this. I hate rolling 9, 11, 10, 10, 11, 9. Utterly uninspiring. I'd take 9, 6, 7, 10, 4, 6 over that any day.

11,8,12,14,10,8 isn't too bad though. To me that looks like a Str 8 Dex 14 Con 12 Int 13 Wis 10 Cha 8 runty little weasel-faced Cavalier/Diviner sword-and-shield Defensive Duelist bodyguard. In combat, Blur + Defensive Duelist protects you, while Cavalier abilities protect everyone else. Loyal but sarcastic and gruff. Think Valentinian from the Belisarius novels.

[Mikal]

Outside of the fighter and moon druids which i would probably recommend, you could also try a half-elf or +2 cha race as a warlock, probably hexblade if you want to use weapons vs. spells.

I'd go Half-Elf Hexblade myself:
Str 6
Con 13
Dex 13
Int 7
Wis 9
Cha 18

Level 4- Con and Dex to 14
Level 8- Elven Accuracy (+1 to Wis)
Other ASIs to taste

After level 12 if you make it that far multiclass into bard or fighter for blade or battlemaster to add either spell power -or- HP, and maneuvers since Hexblade can be underwhelming after 12 IMO.

Background wise- bitter weakly half-elf, not very bright or intuitive, promised power by his patron, and uses that gift to be a great warrior while quietly sneering at those whose prowess comes... "naturally", without realizing the price of his bargain until it's almost too late.

[StickyZ]

But this is why l make everybody roll, and anybody can use anybody's rolls.

Thats a wonderful idea, stealing that!

[DevilMcam]

With these stats i'll go Hill dwarf Hexblade warlock

put that 16 and CHA and get SAD.
12 to CON becomes 14 with racials plus 1 extra hp per level will make you quite sturdy.
12 to dex for 15 AC with medium or 17 with shield it's not amazing but it's decent.
9 to WIS become 10 with racials, nothing good but nothing bad either.
Then dump STR and INT.
Should be quite playable

[Wildarm]

Play a big dumb fighter. Ogg the Rude - Half-Orc fighter who has a tendency to hack first and ask questions later. 6 Int/7 Cha is appropriate. Chances are you
ll get yourself killed which is always another option for a low stat roll. ;)

[jdolch]

With these stats i'll go Hill dwarf Hexblade warlock

put that 16 and CHA and get SAD.
12 to CON becomes 14 with racials plus 1 extra hp per level will make you quite sturdy.
12 to dex for 15 AC with medium or 17 with shield it's not amazing but it's decent.
9 to WIS become 10 with racials, nothing good but nothing bad either.
Then dump STR and INT.
Should be quite playable

CHA 18 is much more important for a Warlock than CON 14. -> Half-Elf

[Luccan]

I appreciate all the feedback. I'll admit, the low scores were somewhat daunting, but I managed to get some inspiration from this thread and build something I think I'll enjoy playing after all. Again, thanks.

[jdolch]

Care to share?

[Luccan]

Care to share?

Ah, yes. I was leaning heavily towards wizard when I started the thread, since I generally like some form of casting. And I had wanted to play a bard before my rolls for the skill proficiency. Then of course this thread brought up how easy it would be to build a Dex Eldritch Knight or Arcane Trickster.

I went Feral Tiefling Rogue, in the end, with an eye for Arcane Trickster. 16 Dex (bumped to 18), 12 Con, 12 Wis, 9 Int (bumped to 10, my attribute boosts will focus on this for a bit), 6 Str, and 7 Cha. I probably won't get much use out of my racial spells, but I've wanted to play some kind of tiefling for awhile.

Honestly, I was close to going Moon Druid, but I knew I needed a decent Con for casting purposes and I didn't want to completely sacrifice either Int or Dex to do it. Which made me realize there was already a casting skill monkey that benefit from Dex and Int. Not quite what I originally aimed for, but I'm glad for the way it turned out. It's not the best character I can build, but it's one I'll feel happy playing and that's the main thing.