Options for a "Techie" mage.

[tadkins]

A spellcaster with an affinity for devices, engineering, and inventing. Would probably be taking some craft feats. Basically, the kind of character that wouldn't look silly with a toolbelt and goggles. So far I've found two.

Impossible Bloodline Sorcerer
Nanite Bloodline Sorcerer

If I wanted to play that sort of character, with a technological and slightly futuristic flair, what are some other options I might be able to look at?

[Florian]

Totally wrong approach. Go Alchemist.

[tadkins]

Totally wrong approach. Go Alchemist.

Honestly I don't know too much about the PF Alchemist. What kind of damage potential do they have? What is their utility like? Can I do much of the same stuff with an alchemist as I can do with a wizard?

[inuyasha]

I think totally wrong is a little harsh. People shouldn't be bound by their class if they want to have a particular interest, and Pathfinder's got thousands of options.

As for being a crafting-techie-sorcerer, if you want another suggestion for bloodline I could easily see the Arcana bloodline working. Some of the spells work well for a mad genius, and can easily represent classic tech like teleporters, cloaking devices, and grand miracle machines. The wondrous nature of your technology could be represented by "Wizard Spells" taken to a crazy extreme, with you having only a select few of them, but being able to use them a lot before you run out. You'd also get the bonded object to represent your artifice, or a familiar that can be enhanced by Evolve Familiar (to make them a cyborg or something) (Or I think there's even a way to make it clockwork).

If you aren't restricted to Sorcerer alone, the concept of a class getting power by items alone is also fulfilled by the Occultist if you just give it some scientific flair, and while there is the Alchemist, the rules technically don't let you count as a spellcaster for crafting feats unless you invest in Master Craftsman, which isn't super efficient.

[tadkins]

If you aren't restricted to Sorcerer alone

I'm not. Just looking for an effective full caster that'd fit the theme, for the most part.

[Florian]

Honestly I don't know too much about the PF Alchemist. What kind of damage potential do they have? What is their utility like? Can I do much of the same stuff with an alchemist as I can do with a wizard?

Google a bit. N. Jolly has written a very good guide on the class.

Broadly speaking, Alchemist is quite nuts. Basic Bard framework, with bombs and mutagen as direct offensive as well as BFC option, with a good mix of Cleric and Wizard spells as a backup.

[Ellrin]

Honestly I don't know too much about the PF Alchemist. What kind of damage potential do they have? What is their utility like? Can I do much of the same stuff with an alchemist as I can do with a wizard?

There’s two main paths to damage with the alchemist—the self-buffing melee monster, and the bomb chucker. Alchemists don’t have a lot of direct damage extracts (which are their versions of spells), but they get an awesome assortment of buffs, as well as a bunch of in-class options to buff themselves and make potions better, all of which lends itself to a capable frontliner, despite average BAB and a d8 HD. Unfortunately metamagic doesn’t work on extracts, so you’ll have slightly less flexibility than a traditional caster for actually spending the time needed to buff; fortunately, extracts can be placed in items like poisoner’s gloves and, with the right equipment/discoveries, you can combine two extracts in one, meaning that by mid-levels you could conceivably get four or more self-buffs off in a single round. Combine that with the fact that (if you take the right discovery) you don’t have to waste your own actions to buff your companions (extracts are drunk sort of like potions), and you’ve got a really fast buffer with the right preparations.

Bombs are sort of a different beast, and I don’t know as much about them (I’m more familiar with the investigator class, which doesn’t get that feature). They’re half level d6 AoE damage, which isn’t that impressive, but you can take various class options to add other effects (and maybe increase damage?), and I think they count as thrown weapons, meaning you may be able to full attack with them. I’ve heard they get pretty powerful, but like I said, never really looked into it, and I’ve never seen it in play.

[Florian]

Ok, I can fill in there. Bombs follow the basic Rogue Sneak Attack advancement and can be upgraded to iterative attacks. That's solid, but nothing to write home about in comparison to what a decent melee can dish out. The thing with bombs is the incredibly good range of BFC options that they can be upgraded to, most of which will put a God Wizard to shame. A) Because of precision use and B) because they will deal damage and the effect simultaneously.

No other class can inflict a no-save dazed condition starting with level 2.... Blackstar. Dread and Madness are also extremely powerful.

To bring madness to method, start here: http://www.aonprd.com/ArchetypeDisplay.aspx?FixedName=Alchemist%20Winged %20Marauder and proceed here: http://www.aonprd.com/ArchetypeDisplay.aspx?FixedName=Alchemist%20Grenad ier

[Rynjin]

Going away from Alchemist, since he DID specifically request a full caster, any of the Technology Guide options work.

Arcanist:
Arcane Tinkerer (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/hybrid-classes/arcanist/archetypes/paizo-arcanist-archetypes/arcane-tinkerer-arcanist-archetype/) works just as well against magical constructs as Robots.

Cleric:

Iron priest (https://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/cleric/archetypes/paizo-cleric-archetypes/iron-priest-cleric-archetype). Brigh (http://aonprd.com/DeityDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Brigh) and Cixyron (http://aonprd.com/DeityDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Cixyron) are especially appropriate deities, along with any with the Artifice Domain.

Wizard:

Clocksmith (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/wizard/archetypes/paizo-wizard-archetypes/clocksmith-wizard-archetype/) and Spellslinger (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/wizard/archetypes/paizo-wizard-archetypes/spellslinger/).

Prestige Classes:

Technomancer (https://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/prestige-classes/other-paizo/s-z/technomancer/) (as wlel as all of the spells listed under Technic Spell Mastery).

The Technologist, Craft Technological Arms and Armor, and Craft Cybernetics Feats are appropriate/necessary for any tech savvy character. Several classes likewise have unique Talents and etc. that make them interact differently with technological equipment, which may include some Wizard Discoveries or Arcanist Exploits I didn't list.

If you go 3rd party there are even more, but I'd be here all day listing those.

[Erloas]

While there isn't a lot of actual clockwork options standard and you would have to get a DM to make it actually useful, there is the Clocksmith archetype for wizards. Every clockwork item I've seen so far requires CL12, but not for any obvious reason, so I think many DMs would work something out if the theme is good.

It would also be pretty easy to get disable device and take the Technomancer PrC that most arcane casters should be able to get into.
The Technology Guide also has Tech archetypes for Fighter, Gunslinger, Rogue, Cleric, and Barbarian.

[tadkins]

Much appreciated y'all. You've given me a ton to work with and think about. :)

Honestly the Technomancer sounds pretty cool, and has a lot of what I might be looking for. As that option is a PrC, would any of you guys have a recommendation for a basic base build for it?

[tadkins]

So after doing a lot of reading on these options today I've come to find that the Technomancer, while very cool, is extremely campaign-specific and wouldn't fare at all well outside the Iron Gods setting. I think of all the choices I might stick with a Nanite Bloodline (https://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/sorcerer/bloodlines/bloodlines-from-paizo/nanite-bloodline-sorcerer-bloodline/) sorcerer. It's cool, flavorful, powerful, and the Borg were always my favorite villains from Star Trek anyway. xD

The only issue I have with it is that it seems to be geared toward a more melee-based sorcerer, based on observation and what a guide says. Would I be pigeonholed into that? Can I build a Nanite Sorcerer into something that's more suitable for ranged combat?

[Ninjaxenomorph]

Unless your campaign actively uses technology, I'd shy away from the actual technomancer. I love the class, its just focused on hybridizing magic and tech.

If you aren't aware, Pathfinder has the Technology Guide, a splatbook that adds a bunch of supertech options. They are possible to manufacture, but it requires massive amounts of power (something added in the book) and manufacturing facilities. In general, the technomancer is focused on taking scavenged tech that is timeworn or broken and either repairing it or salvaging it. It's not something that is easily added to a setting.

[Rynjin]

So after doing a lot of reading on these options today I've come to find that the Technomancer, while very cool, is extremely campaign-specific and wouldn't fare at all well outside the Iron Gods setting. I think of all the choices I might stick with a Nanite Bloodline (https://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/sorcerer/bloodlines/bloodlines-from-paizo/nanite-bloodline-sorcerer-bloodline/) sorcerer. It's cool, flavorful, powerful, and the Borg were always my favorite villains from Star Trek anyway. xD

The only issue I have with it is that it seems to be geared toward a more melee-based sorcerer, based on observation and what a guide says. Would I be pigeonholed into that? Can I build a Nanite Sorcerer into something that's more suitable for ranged combat?

Quite frankly, there is no such thing as a "melee based Sorcerer". or a "ranged based Sorcerer" for that matter.

Sorcs are full casters; you're never going to be fighting with a weapon if you're actually trying to acocmplish something. You'll be casting spells.

A lot of Bloodlines have crappy "grow a natural attack" abilities (grow claws X times per day, gain a Bite attack, etc.). Nanite Strike is similar, and only marginally better. You will never use it. You are never meant to use it; it's there to be a pointless ability to pad out your early levels. Forget it exists outside of the specific scenario of you fighting scrubs (like you're level 5 and fighting a pack of class-less goblins) and want to assert your dominance.

The real power of a Bloodline at 1st level comes from the Arcana (you get a free Extend on Transmutation spells that target yourself), and Nanite's is pretty good. Even at 1st level spells you have excellent options like Ant Haul, Expeditious Retreat, Crafter's Fortune, Monkeyfish, reduce Person, and Touch of the Sea. It only gets better as you level with powerhouse spells like Echolocation and Overland Flight getting the 50% duration boost.

Nanite's other abilities, especially the excellent Nanite Surge are much better for basically anything you want to do. Please live long enough to use them by not trying to make a Sorcerer that's a melee brawler. =)

[tadkins]

Nanite's other abilities, especially the excellent Nanite Surge are much better for basically anything you want to do. Please live long enough to use them by not trying to make a Sorcerer that's a melee brawler. =)

I was mostly wondering if there were just ways to make use of that Nanite Strike ability without trying to turn myself into a melee brawler. Figured the experts here would have some tricks. I have the mindset of trying to make the most of my entire toolkit and just feel a little weird when there's something that's just kind of sitting there doing nothing, hah.

[Rynjin]

I was mostly wondering if there were just ways to make use of that Nanite Strike ability without trying to turn myself into a melee brawler. Figured the experts here would have some tricks. I have the mindset of trying to make the most of my entire toolkit and just feel a little weird when there's something that's just kind of sitting there doing nothing, hah.

There are a few things you could do, but it's difficult to work around a caster's inherent limitations: 1/2 BaB and a lack of armor.

You'd basically be building your whole character around making use of it by the time it became useful. You could go into Eldritch Knight or Hellknight Signifier (Prestige Classes) for instance, raise your Str, Dex, and Con, and fill your spell list with spells like Long Arm and the more pound-y Polymorph spells (primarily Monstrous Physique and Undead anatomy; may be some good options in Fey Shape as well but I haven't looked into it).

It's good to keep a spear or something (depending on race, maybe you get Weapon Familiarity with some kind of Martial Reach weapon, which is even better) on hand to make short work of scrubs when you're in the 3-5 level range, but unless you build for it it's firmly in the realm of "I use this when there are no better options".

[tadkins]

Fair enough, I can accept that. Just figured I'd ask.

I am specifically trying to avoid turning this character into a melee fighter. Closest thing I might do is throw a wrench at someone if options are exhausted or I just want to be funny. xD I intend to be a caster through and through.

[Florian]

In the very low level range, more or less all classes can be at least a little bit effective in melee/ranged combat, at least when you don't have chosen to min/max the relevant attributes away.
Something like the Dragon Bloodline/Dragon Disciple Claw/Claw/Bite or the Nanite Strike ability has an entirely different worth based on whether we talk about, say, a E6 situation or the full 20 level potential of a class.

[tadkins]

In the very low level range, more or less all classes can be at least a little bit effective in melee/ranged combat, at least when you don't have chosen to min/max the relevant attributes away.
Something like the Dragon Bloodline/Dragon Disciple Claw/Claw/Bite or the Nanite Strike ability has an entirely different worth based on whether we talk about, say, a E6 situation or the full 20 level potential of a class.

Oh for sure. Every wizard I've played in a D&D or Pathfinder game would shoot a crossbow during those first few levels.

[Florian]

Oh for sure. Every wizard I've played in a D&D or Pathfinder game would shoot a crossbow during those first few levels.

I´m a fan of the classics, so when playing a Wizard, it will mostly be an Elf. Longsword and longbow it is, mostly never dumping STR below 12. That said, have you given thought about using VMC Magus?

[tadkins]

I´m a fan of the classics, so when playing a Wizard, it will mostly be an Elf. Longsword and longbow it is, mostly never dumping STR below 12. That said, have you given thought about using VMC Magus?

I pretty much stick with humans. I like the mix of a magical class combined with a more "down to earth" race. Never been great at RPing with elves. xD

I had a Winter Oracle concept a while back that used VMC Magus. I was trying to create something similar to a Frost Death Knight from WoW. I don't think it'd be something I'd use with this sorcerer though.