Spell-blade build: Hexblade or Eldriitch Knight (or something else?)

[Phoenix042]

Me and another player have this concept for a character, inspired by trying to make an eldritch knight, but I'm wondering if Hexblade is going to do it better in the end.

The concept is simply a glaive-wielding, heavily armored spell-blade style character, mixing the SCAG blade cantrips (especially booming blade) with martial features and lots of ASIs to make a main-melee fighter with plenty of magical power that lasts all day.

As an eldritch knight, we'd probably go Half-Elf or Githyanki.

If we go hexblade, I'm guessing we'll go Half-elf, dragon-born, or Fallen Aasimar.

V Human is banned and everyone gets a feat at 1st level in our group's games.

My main problem is I'm worried that the cantrip-then-BA-attack routine will become outclassed by the normal attack action at level 11 - 20, making the Eldritch Knight decision a little disappointing.

I'm hoping the community can help me see what (if any) reason there is to go with Fighter (EK) 20 over Warlock (Hexblade) 20 for this concept.

And should we be looking more closely at paladin instead?

I'd really like to use EK in one of my games at some point as no one's tried it yet, but I'm concerned about the way that none of the core-fighter features really mesh well with magic besides the 2nd level action surge.

[Nhorianscum]

Me and another player have this concept for a character, inspired by trying to make an eldritch knight, but I'm wondering if Hexblade is going to do it better in the end.

The concept is simply a glaive-wielding, heavily armored spell-blade style character, mixing the SCAG blade cantrips (especially booming blade) with martial features and lots of ASIs to make a main-melee fighter with plenty of magical power that lasts all day.

As an eldritch knight, we'd probably go Half-Elf or Githyanki.

If we go hexblade, I'm guessing we'll go Half-elf, dragon-born, or Fallen Aasimar.

V Human is banned and everyone gets a feat at 1st level in our group's games.

My main problem is I'm worried that the cantrip-then-BA-attack routine will become outclassed by the normal attack action at level 11 - 20, making the Eldritch Knight decision a little disappointing.

I'm hoping the community can help me see what (if any) reason there is to go with Fighter (EK) 20 over Warlock (Hexblade) 20 for this concept.

And should we be looking more closely at paladin instead?

I'd really like to use EK in one of my games at some point as no one's tried it yet, but I'm concerned about the way that none of the core-fighter features really mesh well with magic besides the 2nd level action surge.

Ignoring sorcadin because polearm. Same deal for quicken and order cleric6.

Level 11 EK is fine, we can take PAM at 12, and phase out our damaging uses of war magic in favor of eldrich strike. At 13 and 14 we get 3rd level spells and haste to sync up with this. When we start smacking things 4-10 times per turn cantrips for damage fall off hard, but that's OK, we're at the point where we have plenty of actual spells now and we can impose disadvantage at will or double down with AS to really juice them. We're 100% a magic using fighter all the way and we play like one. Straight up EK is one of the best mono-class's out there both for crunch and for fluff.

Hexblade is not really great at mixing magic and mele, we get SOLID damage at any range along with up to 9th level invocations, but as a single class we're either casting or punching. Not both. It's an extremely strong class though and a valid choice.

My personal choice for concept here is EK.

[Specter]

If you plan on attacking with cantrips, I'd EK simply because it's the best way to do so. As for your concern that Extra Attack will become better, don't worry: with the extra damage cantrips pick up, they make up for that third attack, and if you get the riders on (movement/grouped enemies), they're better. I'd be sure to pick up Spell Sniper to increase the cantrips range to 10ft., though.

But also remember that Warlock gets up to 9th-level spells, whereas EK gets up to 4th. That's a huge pro.

[Unoriginal]

With your initial concept, Eldritch Knight seems for the best.

Alternatively, maybe a Fighter/Sorcerer multiclass?

[Keravath]

Since you get a free feat ... start with PAM.
Go EK or hexblade.
Take GWM at 4
Use a glaive.

EK gets three attacks at level 11.
EK has more spell slots .. hexblade has higher level spell slots (which refresh on short rest)
EK has the ability to cast a spell and take one extra attack ... however, I think the attack action often becomes preferable on later rounds. It does let you cast haste on the first round and still get in two attacks. (At level 11 - you'd be looking at three attacks probably at d10+5 (possibly with GWM) compared to d10+5 + 2d8 from booming blade ... which is 31.5 vs 19.5 average ... both a PAM build and War Magic give another bonus action attack so those cancel out ... though PAM gives the possibility of another attack during the opponents turn ... so I would tend to take PAM and just ignore war magic. Even from levels 6 to 10 ... two attacks is probably 2 x d10+4 compared with d10+4 + d8 from booming blade. I am ignoring the damage from moving since the attacker may not be forced to move and so it may not do anything. DMs tend not to move creatures under booming blade unless they need to.) Anyway, I would agree with the OP that booming blade will fall behind.


Hexblade picks up Lifedrinker at level 12 (+5 additional damage on every attack)
Hexblade is SAD ... depends only on charisma and can have improved pact weapon from level 3 if magic is scarce in your game.
Hexblade gets darkness+devils sight followed by shadows of moil at level 7 for always on advantage on all attacks.
Hexblade can be good at social pillar due to high charisma with the right skills.

This hexblade sort of build doesn't have the spell flexibility of the EK since slots are limited but it does get all its slots back on a short rest. You could also dip a few levels in sorcerer or bard at some point for some low level spell slots and additional utility. 3rd level of lore bard offers lots of nice features for example.

Hexblade progression would boost charisma at 8 and 12 ... or take resilient con at 8 and boost cha at 12 and 16.

They can both make good melee glaive magic using types ... flavour is different ... hexblade picks up a lot of at will invocations and will have agonizing eldritch blast as a ranged back up. EK is a bit more limited when they need attack at range.

[Wildarm]

I'd build an EK polearm tank if I got a starting Feat:

Mountain Dwarf - Defensive Fighting + Heavy Armor Master @ LV1 - 18Str/16Con/14Int
Sentinel @ Level 4
Warcaster @ Level 6
PAM @ Level 8
Spell Sniper @ Level 12
GWM @ Level 14
+2 St @ Level 16

You're going to be a very high HP tank with lots of stickiness and very punishing reactions. Being able to booming blade when someone approaches within 10' of you or leaves your 10' range is very nice. If you were allowed to pick Tunnel Fighter(UA Fighting Style) you'd be golden.

Save your spell slots for an array of mainly defensive/mobility spells like Shield/Absorb Elements/Misty Step/Mirror Image/Hold Person/Haste/Counterspell

Your job is to get in the enemies face and stay there and you do it very very well.

[strangebloke]

Paladins are great Gishes, but they can't play with the attack cantrips at all. A sorcadin is probably better for that route, and is of course a very potent build. Remember, too, that Paladins are the best mounted combatants in the game, so if you want to play with a mount, they're an option you should strongly consider.

Hexblades are great, but if you want to focus on the martial aspect, they fall behind in that area past fifth level or so. They don't synergy

Eldritch Knight is probably the best. I'd take Spell Sniper and Mounted Combatant and use the reach with booming blade to lock down the movement of opponents.

You could also go swords bard and grab find greater steed at level 10. Grab booming blade via magic initiate or high elf racial and you're good to go. Be warned that this build is definitely a caster first, and doesn't get the cool mounted synergy until relatively late.

Another nonconventional option here would be the arcana cleric multiclassing into ranger. There's some odd synergies there: For example hordbreaker and colossus slayer both can trigger off of a cantrip attack.

Finally, just take a few levels of fighter and multiclass into literally any caster class that gets the cantrips you want. Arcana Cleric, Sorcerer, hexblade, bladesinger... literally any of these work well. The one thing I will say is that if you're multiclassing into warlock, at least consider the other pacts. I personally think that a fighter warlock is more potent if they go infernal/chain as opposed to hex/blade.

[SleepIncarnate]

You could also go valor bard and grab find greater steed at level 10. Grab booming blade via magic initiate or high elf racial and you're good to go. Be warned that this build is definitely a caster first, and doesn't get the cool mounted synergy until relatively late.

Fixed it. Swords bards don't have proficiencies in any heavy weapons or polearms (unless you count the quarterstaff), so you'd have to MQ to get it. A valor bard, on the other hand, works really well, especially at higher levels. Use your starter feat for magic initiate: sorcerer to pick up your two SCAG cantrips of choice and a spell like shield. Use a quarterstaff or so for the first two levels, then swap to the glaive upon becoming a member of the valor college at third level.

[dejarnjc]

If you have a flexible DM you could add two additional options to your list:



Have an INT based Paladin (spells and all abilities key off INT instead of CHA) and play him as a Githyanki Gish. Just reflavor spells to appear more arcane based which is easy enough.
Have a CHA based Eldritch Knight (spells key off CHA and honestly EK is built more like a CHA caster anyway) and multi-class some sorcerer so you can Quicken/Twin booming blade. Combo this with a feat like Mobile and you'll have a lot of fun on the battlefield.

[KnotaGuru]

The attack cantrips just don't work very well with polearms. The cantrip range is 5' while polearms are 10' so you'd need Spell Sniper feat to extend the range. Furthermore, the PAM bonus attack only works when you take the attack action. Casting BB or GFB is a spell action, so you won't get the bonus attack from PAM.

The question here is, what do you want from your spells? Always refer to the base class BEFORE the archetype. EKs are fighters with a little bit of spell power. Hexblades are full caster warlocks with some melee abilities.


If you want high defense, EK all the way as you'd have shield spell, absorb elements, *haste (available at level 14). You'd also have more HP, heavy armor, CON saves, more feats, more attacks (after level 11), action surge for burst, more spell slots/long rest.

At level 14 (assuming 20 STR, GWM feat, +1 polearm, and precast *haste), your attacks would be: 1d10 +5(STR) +10(GWM) +1(magic polearm) = 21.5 (x4 attacks [3 reg, 1 haste]) plus bonus PAM attack of 18.5 = 104.5 average damage for all 5 attacks. Use action surge for bursting. *Only 2 castings of haste/long rest.


If you want your spells to really augment your attack abilities, Hexblade is the way to go. Your attack stat is the same as your casting stat, WIS saves, hexblade curse ability for more damage, polearm is magical, regain spell slots on short rests, spell are cast at highest level. Armor of Agathys is nice for boosting your HP. An interesting spell choice here is the 3rd level paladin spell "elemental weapon" which is on the hexblade list. At warlock 9, you'd be upcasting this spell to make your polearm a +2 weapon with +2d4 extra damage of any element you choose. This spell lasts an hour so you could get a lot of mileage from it as long as you maintain concentration. With 3-4 attacks every round, the damage could add up very quickly. Lifedrinker invocation at level 12 also increases your damage.

At level 12 (assuming a 20 CHA, GWM feat, and elemental weapon spell), your attacks would be: 1d10 +5(CHA) +10(GWM) +5(lifedrinker) +2(elemental weapon) +2d4(elemental weapon) = 1d10+22+2d4 = 32.5 (x2 attacks) plus bonus PAM attack of 29.5 = 94.5 average for all 3 attacks. Add hexblade curse and/or eldritch smite invocation for bursting.


Do you know how long the campaign will go? Any reason you couldn't go Fighter (EK) 3, Warlock (Hexblade) 12? Start fighter 1 for heavy armor & CON saves, then warlock 5/9/or 12 for extra attack/high spell slots/lifedrinker invocation, then go back to fighter to pick up action surge and EK archetype for shield spell and absorb elements.

[strangebloke]

Fixed it. Swords bards don't have proficiencies in any heavy weapons or polearms (unless you count the quarterstaff), so you'd have to MQ to get it. A valor bard, on the other hand, works really well, especially at higher levels. Use your starter feat for magic initiate: sorcerer to pick up your two SCAG cantrips of choice and a spell like shield. Use a quarterstaff or so for the first two levels, then swap to the glaive upon becoming a member of the valor college at third level.

Yes, you're correct. My bad. Swords bard wouldn't get the movement speed bonus while mounted in any case.