Help me fine tune my DMM: Qicken Melee Cleric Build

[Lelkeki]

Just need some Help with figuring out when best to take which feats.

DM set some rules in place so we dont "break" the game "too hard" as such any character can only have a total of 3 classes for the purpose of multiclassing and im limited to only 2 nightsticks which im fine with and agree. I personally chose to use the Spontaneous caster variant as well as to avoid Persist spell as i dont enjoy using it.

Im playing a Dragonborn (lesser aasimar base) and will be going through the ritual as i pick up my 2nd PrC class level.

My build Progressions is: Cloistered Cleric 4/Ordained Champion 5/Fist of Raziel10/Cloistered Cleric 5 Worshipping Heironeous and chosing the Inquisition and War Domain.


as for Feats :
1 Servant of the Heavens, Knowledge Devotion, Weapon focus+Proficiency Longsword( War Domain)

3 Extra Turning

5 Gain Law Domain and Trade the Domain power for Power Attack

6 Holy Warrior, Diehard, Dragontail (Depends on Gm if he lets me give up the "rest" of the law domain for the Law Devotion ill Trade the Devotion for he Tail, if he doesn't ill trade Diehard)

9 Rapid Metamagic

12 Quicken Spell

15 DMM: Quicken

18 Extend Spell




Personally not a big fan of Delaying the metas that much.

My question is how would you re-arrange the feats to smooth it out a bit better?

I thought about delaying Rapid metamagic to 15th or even 18th level as i allready get Rapid Spontaneous casting from Ordained Champion which covers my most Basic needs (Divine Power/Magic Vestment/Flamestrike and take Extend Spell or the quickens earlier.

Another Idea was to delay Holy warrior essentialy trading Dmg for Utility.


Any Suggestions?

[Troacctid]

Honestly, given that you already get free quickens and multiple good uses for turn undead from Ordained Champion, I don't think you even need DMM. I would scrap it. You could take Awesome Smite instead; it's very good on an Ordained Champion and even better if you're also a Fist of Raziel. I also like Combat Awareness when you can spontaneously cast quickened power words. Minor Shapeshift is good too, but you'd have to take incarnation of evil to power it (not an evil spell, despite the name, but also probably not one you're eager to spend a 5th level spell known on, I'm guessing).

You have Holy Warrior at level 6, but it requires 4th level spells, so you shouldn't be able to take it until level 9. You could take Blade of Force at that level instead if you want a similar effect, although it costs a swift action, which is somewhat bothersome.

On a spontaneous cleric, you really have no business trading away your domains for domain feats, given that each of them represents an additional known spell of each level. Knowledge comes with some very useful divinations, and Law has some real stuff in it too. Knowledge Devotion is great and all, but if you're taking it on a spontaneous cleric, you should be taking it as one of your actual feats IMO. And if you want to trade Law Devotion for Dragon Tail, why not just replace the domain granted ability with a fighter bonus feat and replace that with Dragon Tail? Then you keep the spells.

You should ask your DM if you can still spontaneously cast sanctified spells like prepared clerics can (as per Book of Exalted Deeds, page 84). If so, then you should make sure to take full advantage of spells like celestial aspect, luminous armor, Ayailla's radiant burst, and hammer of righteousness.

[Lelkeki]

Honestly, given that you already get free quickens and multiple good uses for turn undead from Ordained Champion, I don't think you even need DMM. I would scrap it. You could take Awesome Smite instead; it's very good on an Ordained Champion and even better if you're also a Fist of Raziel. I also like Combat Awareness when you can spontaneously cast quickened power words. Minor Shapeshift is good too, but you'd have to take incarnation of evil to power it (not an evil spell, despite the name, but also probably not one you're eager to spend a 5th level spell known on, I'm guessing).

Hmm i like that idea. Dropping the quicken line to focus on the Fighting aspect and Awesome Smite sounds pretty fun.
Combat Awareness: i dont really like the prereqs for it but it does seem pretty good with the power words.
Minor Shapeshift: dont want it mainly for the RP aspect and yeah i dont like the spell either.



On a spontaneous cleric, you really have no business trading away your domains for domain feats, given that each of them represents an additional known spell of each level. Knowledge comes with some very useful divinations, and Law has some real stuff in it too. Knowledge Devotion is great and all, but if you're taking it on a spontaneous cleric, you should be taking it as one of your actual feats IMO.

I actually completly forgot that Domains do that for spontaneous clerics lol.


if you want to trade Law Devotion for Dragon Tail, why not just replace the domain granted ability with a fighter bonus feat and replace that with Dragon Tail? Then you keep the spells.


Oh whoops i was supposed to trade the domain power for a Weapon Focus: greatsword there but i could do that as well since WF is just a +1 anyway.


so the new build would like something like this

1 Servant of the Heavens, Weapon focus+Proficiency Longsword( War Domain)

3 Extra Turning

5 Gain Law Domain and Trade the Domain power for Power Attack Trade Knowledge Domain Power for Random Feat (Imp. Initiative i guess)

6 Knowledge Devotion, Diehard, Dragontail (Trade Imp. Initiative for the Tail)

9 Awesome Smite/Holy Warrior

12 Holy Warrior/ Awesome Smite (depends on what party needs more)

15 Extend Spell?

18 ???? (more extra turnings i guess)


Extend spell would mostly be precombat buffs and i dont mind dropping it for something else

Any other suggestion for the last Feats?


And ill have to ask about the sanctified spells.

[Troacctid]

Imbued Healing, Draconic Aura, Law Devotion, Fell Conspiracy, Stench of the Dead, Improved Critical, Initiate of Heironeous, Summon Elemental, Nymph's Kiss, Leadership, Martial Study, Martial Stance...? Extend Spell is also decent.

[Lelkeki]

Imbued Healing, Draconic Aura, Law Devotion, Fell Conspiracy, Stench of the Dead, Improved Critical, Initiate of Heironeous, Summon Elemental, Nymph's Kiss, Leadership, Martial Study, Martial Stance...? Extend Spell is also decent.

Ill have a look at these Thanks for the help.