Incapacitated condition incomplete

[Dark Schneider]

Well it says:

An incapacitated creature can't take actions or reactions.

And then:
https://www.sageadvice.eu/2017/08/11/cast-hold-person-on-a-humanoid-thats-concentrating-on-fly/

Cast Hold Person on a humanoid that's concentrating on Fly. Paralyzed.

Does it fall out of the sky?

JC: If you paralyze the spellcaster, the spell ends, since being incapacitated ends concentration.

But concentration has nothing to do with actions or reactions. So seems the condition description is incomplete, as it is more like a nullifying condition. Then I suppose it also prevents the incapacited one about perceiving (even passive) or any other thing but moving the base pace.

[PhoenixPhyre]

Well it says:


And then:
https://www.sageadvice.eu/2017/08/11/cast-hold-person-on-a-humanoid-thats-concentrating-on-fly/


But concentration has nothing to do with actions or reactions. So seems the condition description is incomplete, as it is more like a nullifying condition. Then I suppose it also prevents the incapacited one about perceiving (even passive) or any other thing but moving the base pace.

See the basic rules for concentration (SRD 102):

The following factors can break concentration:...
Being incapacitated or killed. You lose concentration on a spell if you are incapacitated or if you die.

[Man_Over_Game]

Well it says:


And then:
https://www.sageadvice.eu/2017/08/11/cast-hold-person-on-a-humanoid-thats-concentrating-on-fly/


But concentration has nothing to do with actions or reactions. So seems the condition description is incomplete, as it is more like a nullifying condition. Then I suppose it also prevents the incapacited one about perceiving (even passive) or any other thing but moving the base pace.

It's not noted in the incapacitated condition page, but it is noted under the Concentration rules. A bit odd, but it's there.

[Edit]Curses! Sniped again!

[Dark Schneider]

Yes, a bit odd indeed.

[PhoenixPhyre]

It's not noted in the incapacitated condition page, but it is noted under the Concentration rules. A bit odd, but it's there.

[Edit]Curses! Sniped again!

The condition summaries are only the general things that affect everybody. Concentration is a more specific thing. Same goes for poisoned. There are lots of abilities that add riders to the baseline (paralyzed, etc) that aren't mentioned in the condition itself.

[Man_Over_Game]

The condition summaries are only the general things that affect everybody. Concentration is a more specific thing. Same goes for poisoned. There are lots of abilities that add riders to the baseline (paralyzed, etc) that aren't mentioned in the condition itself.

Concentration isn't limited to spells though (see Invoke Duplicity, in the Trickery Cleric). It's technically something anyone can do, but spellcasters need it more than most. Plus, every spellcasting class (of which, take up 67% of the class options) has a concentration spell on their list as a level 1 spell.

Hell, Concentration comes up more often than the Incapacitated condition.

[PhoenixPhyre]

Concentration isn't limited to spells though (see Invoke Duplicity, in the Trickery Cleric). It's technically something anyone can do, but spellcasters need it more than most. Plus, every spellcasting class (of which, take up 67% of the class options) has a concentration spell on their list as a level 1 spell.

Hell, Concentration comes up more often than the Incapacitated condition.

But concentration is defined for rules purposes in the spell section. So you should look there first for rules about concentration. I'm AFB, but I'm guessing that's where the index points as well. If you want to know what a grapple is, you look for the definition of the move, not the condition that it imposes. Same deal.

[Particle_Man]

The condition summaries are only the general things that affect everybody. Concentration is a more specific thing. Same goes for poisoned. There are lots of abilities that add riders to the baseline (paralyzed, etc) that aren't mentioned in the condition itself.

I wonder if anyone has bothered to give a more detailed list of everything that various conditions affect?

And now I am curious about poisoned. Am I missing something?

[Man_Over_Game]

I wonder if anyone has bothered to give a more detailed list of everything that various conditions affect?

And now I am curious about poisoned. Am I missing something?

Usually, things that poison you also add an additional effect, like "You are paralyzed while poisoned in this way", or they often do straight up poison damage, but those things are not inherent to the Poisoned condition.

You can technically just be "Poisoned" with no other effects to your well being, but that's rarely the case.

[Jama7301]

Concentration isn't limited to spells though (see Invoke Duplicity, in the Trickery Cleric). It's technically something anyone can do, but spellcasters need it more than most. Plus, every spellcasting class (of which, take up 67% of the class options) has a concentration spell on their list as a level 1 spell.

Hell, Concentration comes up more often than the Incapacitated condition.
This makes me wonder, are there any non-spell Fighter or Rogue abilities that require Concentration? What sort of interesting things could be done with that design space?

[loki_ragnarock]

What sort of interesting things could be done with that design space?
Nerfing GWM or Sharpshooter by making them stances that require concentration?

[Man_Over_Game]

This makes me wonder, are there any non-spell Fighter or Rogue abilities that require Concentration? What sort of interesting things could be done with that design space?

To be fair, Concentration falls under the Spellcasting section of the rules, there just happens to be at least one exception that uses Concentration without actually being a spell.

However, using Concentration for other classes should seem to work just fine. I use concentration for Rogues who hide, or for an Inquisitive Rogue to get his Bonus Action lock on effect (with some other minor benefits I tack on), with the caveat that it doesn't interfere with spellcasting Concentration to continue to make the Arcane Trickster valid.

There's been a few homebrews for classes where a Fighter might use Concentration with Second Wind to heal more over time. I like the idea of a Berserk mode that uses Concentration to grant you the effects of the Dodge action and Advantage on your attacks, but stunning you if your concentration ends (effectively making it a warrior-esc Haste effect).

You could also implement some kind of mechanic for snipers where they can become "focused", granting a +1 to hit and damage each turn, as long as they don't break their concentration.