With Ravnica's backgrounds allowing bonus spells, what classes can be replicated?

[jaappleton]

For those that don't know, the Guildmaster's Guide to Ravnica has backgrounds in it which allow access to new spells. These spells are considered added to your vanilla class spell list, but aren't automatically known. So if you pick a background that grants Counterspell and you're a Cleric, now Counterspell keys off Wisdom for you, its now a Cleric spell.

Here's the entire list of the spells granted based on each background:

Azorius
Cantrip friends, message
1st command, ensnaring strike
2nd arcane lock, calm emotions, hold person
3rd clairvoyance, counterspell
4th compulsion, divination
5th dominate person


Boros
Cantrip fire bolt, sacred flame
1st guiding bolt, heroism
2nd aid, scorching ray
3rd beacon of hope, blinding smite
4th death ward, wall of fire
5th flame strike


Dimir
Cantrip encode thoughts, mage hand
1st disguise self, sleep
2nd detect thoughts, pass without trace
3rd gaseous form, meld into stone, nondetection
4th arcane eye, freedom of movement
5th modify memory


Golgari
Cantrip dancing lights, spare the dying
1st entangle, ray of sickness
2nd protection from poison, ray of enfeeblement, spider climb
3rd animate dead, plant growth
4th giant insect, grasping vine
5th cloudkill, insect plague


Gruul
Cantrip fire bolt, produce flame
1st compelled duel, speak with animals, thunderwave
2nd beast sense, shatter
3rd conjure animals, conjure barrage
4th dominate beast, stoneskin
5th destructive wave


Izzet
Cantrip produce flame, shocking grasp
1st chaos bolt, create or destroy water, unseen servant
2nd heat metal, rope trick
3rd call lightning, elemental weapon, glyph of warding
4th conjure minor elementals, divination, Otiluke’s resilient sphere
5th animate objects, conjure elemental


Orzhov
Cantrip friends, guidance
1st command, illusory script
2nd enthrall, ray of enfeeblement, zone of truth
3rd bestow curse, speak with dead, spirit guardians
4th blight, death ward, Leomund’s secret chest
5th geas


Rakdos
Cantrip fire bolt, vicious mockery
1st burning hands, dissonant whispers, hellish rebuke
2nd crown of madness, enthrall, flaming sphere
3rd fear, haste
4th confusion, wall of fire
5th dominate person


Selesnya
Cantrip druidcraft, friends
1st aid, animal friendship, charm person
2nd animal messenger, calm emotions, warding bond
3rd plant growth, speak with plants
4th aura of life, conjure minor elementals
5th awaken, commune with nature


Simic
Cantrip acid splash, druidcraft
1st detect poison and disease, expeditious retreat, jump
2nd alter self, enhance ability, enlarge/reduce
3rd gaseous form, water breathing, wind wall
4th freedom of movement, polymorph
5th creation

I've always held the opinion that spells can be immensely thematic. And this enables... a lot. A real lot.

Now, I'm not asking "What's the cheesiest most OP thing we can make with this info?!". Nah, I can do that on my own. :smalltongue:

What I am asking is this: With these backgrounds, can we get certain builds to mimic others, but in a different playstyle?

For example:

A Celestial Bladelock with the Boros background plays very much like a short-rest based Paladin. You get spells that help Celestial's +Cha Mod to Fire & Radiant (though some is already on the Celestial list), you get Blinding Smite much sooner than a normal Paladin can (And IMO one of the best Smite spells), you get d6 bonus action healing in place of Lay on Hands... You're short rest based, and lose Paladin's +Cha to Saves at lv6, but you're a full caster.

Any of these added on to a Bard, especially Lore, improves their already amazing versatility greatly. If you have a particular build in mind, this could alter things quite a bit for a Bard.

Spirit Guardians being available means there's no longer ever a reason to pick Oath of the Crown. :smallbiggrin:

[Spore]

Besides emulating existing classes (which is a pointless endeavor in my eyes), the lists help create stuff that is not on 5e's class roster.

Like the Simic spells just make a perfectly viable shapechanger.


1st expeditious retreat, jump
2nd alter self, enhance ability, enlarge/reduce

You are basically a superhuman with shapechanging abilities. Plus whatever other class features you get. Since warlocks don't necessarily carry so much flavor if you don't get ANY of the other patron spells, you can easily do a psychic superhuman putting Dr Xavier and other X-Men to shame.

GoOlock - 3rd level with Expeditious Retreat, Jump, and Alter Self, Enlarge/Reduce can mimic any humanoid between small and large size, with potentially fitting powers.

[Clistenes]

Let say a paladin from Dominaria arrives to Ravnica, joins the Boros Legion, stays a few years and then returns home... Does he gain and keep the extra spells?

[jaappleton]

Let say a paladin from Dominaria arrives to Ravnica, joins the Boros Legion, stays a few years and then returns home... Does he gain and keep the extra spells?

I don't know nearly enough about MtG to answer this, but my initial response is "I don't see why not".

[D3adgods]

Let say a paladin from Dominaria arrives to Ravnica, joins the Boros Legion, stays a few years and then returns home... Does he gain and keep the extra spells?

I believe it is stated in the book that if you leave the guild you lose access to those spells; so it's a matter of whether or not the powers that influence the guild in question believe that character is still working for their best interest, and if those powers can travel across different planes.

[HappyDaze]

Let say a paladin from Dominaria arrives to Ravnica, joins the Boros Legion, stays a few years and then returns home... Does he gain and keep the extra spells?

For a Paladin, the answer is no. When you leave a Guild, you keep any spells you've already added to your Cantrips and Spells Known or to your spellbook. Clerics and Druids don't get this benefit outside of Cantrips, and Paladins don't get this benefit at all (but they do gain automatic access while with a Guild, so it's a mixed bag)

[Lille]

For a Paladin, the answer is no. When you leave a Guild, you keep any spells you've already added to your Cantrips and Spells Known or to your spellbook.

In that case, could a wizard potentially spend just long enough as part of a guild to add all the guild's spells to their spellbook, before leaving to join a different guild for new spells, repeating the process until they've got all the guild spells? That certainly sounds like something a Dimir-aligned wizard would do, and possibly an Izzet or Simic one as well.

[Spamotron]

In that case, could a wizard potentially spend just long enough as part of a guild to add all the guild's spells to their spellbook, before leaving to join a different guild for new spells, repeating the process until they've got all the guild spells? That certainly sounds like something a Dimir-aligned wizard would do, and possibly an Izzet or Simic one as well.

On paper yes.

In practice the guilds only really accept people who are philosophically aligned with them and expect true loyalty. So it would require a really convoluted and implausible story to pull off and the wizard would be murdered by one of the more ruthless guilds as a traitor 9 times out of 8.

[Divayth Fyr]

In that case, could a wizard potentially spend just long enough as part of a guild to add all the guild's spells to their spellbook, before leaving to join a different guild for new spells, repeating the process until they've got all the guild spells? That certainly sounds like something a Dimir-aligned wizard would do, and possibly an Izzet or Simic one as well.
The issue would be pulling that stunt off - most guilds would have second thoughts about recruiting someone who had abandoned a guild previously. And probably wouldn't consider anyone doing that multiple times.

Of course with enough false identities and preparations one could pull it off, although it would be extremely hard. Possibly slightly less so if you start with Dimir and do it with actual support from the House (as unlikely as it would be), but still extremely hard and dangerous.

[Vekon]

I spy an easier way for full Warlocks to get access to short rest animate dead. Not sure about replicating specific classes, but I think, given enough short rests, this makes a better necromancer than most others.

[HappyDaze]

In that case, could a wizard potentially spend just long enough as part of a guild to add all the guild's spells to their spellbook, before leaving to join a different guild for new spells, repeating the process until they've got all the guild spells? That certainly sounds like something a Dimir-aligned wizard would do, and possibly an Izzet or Simic one as well.

It's not unreasonable to believe that the Guilds might have rules in place that require you to surrender any spellbooks containing copies of their spells. In effect, you don't own them, you just lease them like with some software. Sure, you can try to cheat them, but the Guilds > You, and the entire society of the plane is based on the Guilds, so standards and traditions like this are probably enforced by all just to keep this sort of thing from happening. After all, if you betrayed one Guild, you might just betray them all.

[HappyDaze]

On paper yes.

In practice the guilds only really accept people who are philosophically aligned with them and expect true loyalty. So it would require a really convoluted and implausible story to pull off and the wizard would be murdered by one of the more ruthless guilds as a traitor 9 times out of 8.

All of the Guilds are pretty ruthless, even the hippie-like Selesnya. Moreover, while the Guilds compete with one another, they are all interested in maintaining power, and if that means crushing upstart wizards trying to game the system, that's something that they'll all get behind.

[Clistenes]

I believe it is stated in the book that if you leave the guild you lose access to those spells; so it's a matter of whether or not the powers that influence the guild in question believe that character is still working for their best interest, and if those powers can travel across different planes.

The book only mentions changing guilds, not simply leaving all guilds altogether... But I guess it makes sense it's the same...

[Kane0]

Order cleric with bonus enchantment options?
Sorc with a couple divine spells without having to go favored soul?
Bard getting more spell stealing options?

[Teaguethebean]

How about how the Selesnyan Conclave grants aid as a lv 1 spell what does that even mean

[SVamp]

Can these backgrounds be used in AL play?

[Crgaston]

@OP: Your Celestial build is great thinking! My mind hasn't poured that much thought into emulating other classes, but just looking over the list you posted, I think the Izzet spells would be fun on a Warlock. Heat Metal for 5d8 and Disadvantage on an armored opponent as a Bonus Action for up to a minute with no save is nuts. Ditto for Call Lightning in a major field engagement between armies. Not to mention Animate Objects.

[MrStabby]

So how does this work? Is it whenever you gain a spell so it also works for racial spells? Is it a spell of a level you know or that you have slots for, I.e. how does it play with multiclassing. How does it work with spells that are not known but prepared like the cleric and wizard.

For fun concepts I like things like eldritch knight. The restriction on spell is such that a few more options is welcome. Some spells like heat metal on an eldritch knight could also be pretty powerful.

It also could make some caster dips more attractive. Taking a few levels of Warlock for some short rest spells could be even better if you can pick from a broader pool.

[jaappleton]

So how does this work? Is it whenever you gain a spell so it also works for racial spells? Is it a spell of a level you know or that you have slots for, I.e. how does it play with multiclassing. How does it work with spells that are not known but prepared like the cleric and wizard.

For fun concepts I like things like eldritch knight. The restriction on spell is such that a few more options is welcome. Some spells like heat metal on an eldritch knight could also be pretty powerful.

It also could make some caster dips more attractive. Taking a few levels of Warlock for some short rest spells could be even better if you can pick from a broader pool.

1. You must be some sort of Spellcaster. Pact Magic qualifies.

2. The spells are added to your class list. So if you’re a Cleric with the Boros background, now all the Boros spells are Cleric spells and key off Wisdom.

[Temperjoke]

On a side note, I realized that if a player wanted to justify playing a non-ravnica race they could just call themselves a simic hybrid instead of calling themselves by their regular race name, and claim they're just another experiment.

EDIT: Another note, the book actually call out that you could join a guild with the idea of changing the guild from within. I don't think the guilds are exceptionally picky at initial recruitment, aside from people who abandoned a guild (unless they were recruited, of course). I mean, more people means more power. It's just they're not going to promote you very far if you're not fitting in or following ideals.

[Kadesh]

Short Rest Animate Dead is pretty disgusting for any Necromancer.

[jaappleton]

Just realized the Ravnica spells can be used to give Nature Cleric a bonus list that doesn’t suck.

[Clistenes]

I have re-read the relevant paragraphs about guild spells:

"If you play a character who has the Spellcasting or the Pact Magic class feature, your guild spells are added to the spell list for your class, thereby expanding the spell options available to you." (pag 29).

I interpret it as this: Paladins, Rangers, Clerics and Druids get the spells added to their known spells. Sorcerers, Bards, Wizards, Eldritch Knights and Arcane Tricksters and Warlocks can learn them, and in the Wizards' case, copy them in their spellbook.

"When you change guilds, you lose all the privileges of membership in your original guild, including the background feature granted to you by your original guild and any rank or position you have achieved in that guild. You also lose access to your old guild spells, unless they are already on your class's spell list, among your spells known, or in your spellbook." (pag 31).

Now, reading carefully every word...

"You also lose access to your old guild spells, unless they are already on your class's spell list..."

That is clear; if the spell is in your class's spell list to begin with, you don't lose it because of guild shenanigans...

"...among your spells known..."

This would be the most controversial part, I think this means that Sorcerers, Bards, Eldritch Knights, Arcane Tricksters and Warlocks who have learned a guild spell won't forget them even if they leave the guild.

As for Paladins, Rangers, Clerics and Druids, if they are able to cast up to say, level 2 spells, they keep all the guild spells up to level 2, which they were already able to cast, but they won't learn their former guild's spells from level 3 to 5 when they become able to cast them...

"...or in your spellbook."

I think this last bit is clear. You keep any spell already written in your spellbook.