Out of curiosity: would this local event cause any reaction in your characters?

[Jon_Dahl]

Sometimes I put stuff into my game world just to see how the PCs react. It helps me to estimate their reactions when I ask you about your characters' possible reactions. So here we are.

My PCs are at leveld 11-12 at the moment. I was thinking that I would describe them that the some of the locals have seen an incredibly beautiful adventurer girl around the neighborhood lately. As the DM, I never describe women beautiful or ugly, because I never comment on the attractiveness of my male PCs, but I would make an exception here. Anyway, the PCs won't be able to find this girl, even if they try... Maybe not because of her looks, but just because the PCs get curious about a lone foreign adventurer. At this point, one of the most intelligent NPCs in my campaign briefly meets with the PCs and tells them that she had spoken with the girl and they had a good conversation, and she helped the girl out with stuff just because she's such a person and so the girl told her everything about her past. It seemed like she really wanted to get if off her chest:

The girl had decided to leave her past behind, because she comes from a very poor and troubled background. Her mother is a mentally ill prostitute whose looks the girl inherited, and the girl never knew her dad. Her mom had, on numerous occasions, described the man who most likely is the girl's dad, because the mother had traveled with him just before she got pregnant. This is the description:
https://i.pinimg.com/474x/97/9e/2d/979e2de3bb01521ab1b1dcff8ba1cdfd--wayne-reynolds-dark-warrior.jpg
The NPC says that she has figured out from the description and other details that her dad is the most dangerous warrior the world has ever seen, but she can't say or write his name, because the demon allies of the warrior are rumored to be able to sense when and where the warrior's name is spoken, so she won't take any risks. She tells that they will all be dead if the father ever decides to meet his talented adventurer daughter and that the PCs will all be dead in a second if they meet the dad.

First, I will see how the PCs react and then I will have the girl appear with one of the players' favorite NPC (one that is not too bright) and tell them that they are dating now.

[Seto]

I don't know how much my character would care, but I as a player would definitely investigate, because the alarms in my brain all just lit up for "super important plot-critical NPC". The alarm for "possibly GM's pet-NPC, he seems really invested" also went off, by the way - maybe you should tone it down a bit.

The reaction to the revelation that this super-important beautiful-adventuring-daughter of a demon King is dating a NPC I know would be: "Huh? What the... This wasn't where I thought it would go. Well... okay, I guess? Better roll that Sense Motive to see if my NPC friend is under an Enchantment effect".

[Palanan]

Originally Posted by Jon_Dahl
It helps me to estimate their reactions when I ask you about your characters' possible reactions.

I have some players who would say, “Huh.”

And others who would smell a plot hook and pursue it to the ends of the earth.


Originally Posted by Jon_Dahl
The NPC says that she has figured out from the description and other details that her dad is the most dangerous warrior the world has ever seen, but she can't say or write [his] name….

I assume you meant “his” name?

[Jon_Dahl]

I assume you meant “his” name?

Thank you!

[ezekielraiden]

Prior to the backstory info? Passing interest at most. She can take care of herself, and most of my characters are married, gay, celibate, or some combination of the three.

With the backstory described? Yeah, DMPC is the sound of it. Tragic past, villain link, super pretty, successful solo adventurer...the only other thing she needs is unusually powerful magic and/or magic items. Since I lean heavily LG, my characters would probably have at least mild interest in asking after her to find out if she could help them, but given her long estrangement from her father and the risks of getting any info from her, they'd probably steer clear.

I kinda want to steer you clear of this. Tone the woman down, make her have a compelling but also unnerving aura or something, make her mom a little less painfully tragic (maybe she's bitter and taciturn rather than mentally ill--being abandoned by your lover can do that). Maybe the woman is a travelling performer hanging out with her fellow performers rather than a mysteriously inaccessible competent solo adventurer. Etc. But...it's your game, and you know your players better than I do.

[zlefin]

suspicion; first I'd want independent confirmation that that guy really exists and is THAT dangerous. also that the demon allies clause is true, cuz that sounds atypical, and is also something that would likely be known to quite a few people.

I'd suspect the girl is part of some sort of evil scheme, and to the extent feasible would look her over with true seeing/detection stuff in case of shenanigans.

I'd also find it a bit odd if the person could not be located if we tried; I mean, depending on their level ofc. But a beautiful skilled adventurer is memorable, and should be findable, unless they have strong anti-scrying protection. (and even then gather info should find them unless they're making a point of staying hidden)

[Clistenes]

Most of my characters would suspect a trap and be very cautious. That story sounds too much like wannabe hero bait...

Character 1 was a fatalistic paladin who would be sure that was a trap, but he would investigate anyways because OF COURSE he would be forced into getting involved eventually, even if he tried to avoid it, that is his cursed luck (plus his paladin order act as a rural police of sorts in the untamed, wild frontier, so it is his job to investigate that sort of stuff...).

Character 2 was a civilized, orderly law-abiding citizen who learned to fight only because of the war, and afterwards took jobs as monster hunter, caravan escort and dungeon delver for hire because of a lack of good options during the horrid post-war economy... He would try to investigate, gather information and report to somebody of authority, but he wouldn't do anything else unless ordered to do so... The greatest warrior in the world and an evil friend to demons? That sounds way above his pay grade!

Character 3 was a scholar of ancient forbidden knowledge... he would think that story was obvious trap bait, but he may investigate it anyways, out of curiosity... unless one of his precious treasures was within reach, in which case, f**k that chick and f**k her dad and the demons he f****d! We are going into that undead-infested ancient cursed dungeon NOW!!!

Character 4 was good aligned, but also a traumatized survivalist, who only fought monsters because she was even more scared of hunger and poverty, her aim being to earn enough money to retire in the safest, most boring place in the world. She would run away as fast and possible, unless the rest of the party dragged her...

[ColorBlindNinja]

I can tell that the first thing I'd think as a player is that the girl's father is most likely going to be the BBEG of the campaign (or maybe the story arc). That's a lot of detail to put into a minor NPC otherwise.

Most of the characters I play have Chronic Hero Syndrome in spades and would assist her even if they suspected it was trap.

As for some of the other people I've played with?

I think most of them would sympathize with her plight, except the problem player in our group who'd probably insist on staying behind and get captured/killed by something. :smallfrown:

[Zanos]

Out of character I'd echo what some other people have said and just go "Jesus Christ another Pet/DMPC?". Depends on the DMs track record, though.

In character I tend to play to the south side of Good, so I wouldn't really see much reason to get involved. Nothing in it for me, after all. I don't just glue myself to NPCs because they have an interesting backstory, my characters have their own motivations and individual goals that they pursue and generally "helping a pretty girl with a tragic past" doesn't forward many of those. Even if I was Good I don't see much of a motivation, other than maybe to mess the warrior guy up, but it didn't sound like he was actively doing Evil from the description. Even then I was pretty much told the guy is way out of my league, so that's a pretty good reason to not get involved.



As the DM, I never describe women beautiful or ugly, because I never comment on the attractiveness of my male PCs, but I would make an exception here.
More beefcakes is the answer. I do actually think this is kind of weird rule. No old hags, comely wenches, wretched beggars, disfigured necromancers, or chisel jawed Adonis?

"What's the NPC look like?"
"Well...he's got two arms, two legs, and a head with a face and hair."

[Mildly Inept]

Wizard puts down his bottle of booze, throws up, and gets back to his drink.

Paladin/Fist of Raziel detects evil, senses motive, gets close enough for her Circle of Protection to disrupt any mental control, consults with her party members, does some poking around, and reports to whoever the local authority is and the closest good-aligned heroes of sufficient power to deal with the evil overlord man.

Barbarian rages, power attacks the NPC and cleaves into the barkeep because dude, you've been talking for like, five minutes.

J/K on the last one. Mostly.

[Darth Ultron]

At best I'd ignore it, and at worse I'd just leave the game.

Really this sounds like a bad idea.

I guess the players would be hanging around in town being bored? Then you be like ''oh look pretty girl". And, sure if the player were all like ''ok day we follow the DMs plot railroad", then sure the game would roll on.

Of course if the players don't just ''fall'' for this, I guess you'd just mention the girl a lot more times.

And if we ever got to the Evil Dad Who Shall Not Be Named, THAT would be the spot I'd leave the game. It's great nostalgia, sure....but I doubt it would work out. The typical DM that got all excited about using That Guy (''who is the greatest warrior 4ever, right?) would just be planning a bad time for all...except themselves. Like we fight That Guy and the DM, wearing a fidget spinner on his nose and spinning it, would be like ''he hits and does 1,000 points of damage, hahahahahaha!"

[icefractal]

She tells that they will all be dead if the father ever decides to meet his talented adventurer daughter and that the PCs will all be dead in a second if they meet the dad.
The most important question here is: who does "they" refer to in that sentence? Everyone in the world? The NPC who's saying this? The daughter? The PCs, if they happen to be in the vicinity when this occurs?

[Particle_Man]

I have some players that would have their characters scream the fighter’s name at the top of their lungs, repeatedly, in order to fight the demons that would appear thereby, tpk be damned.

[Alabenson]

For the most part, my characters' reactions would probably range from mild interest to complete disinterest. This seems like the personal issues of an individual who should be capable of taking care of herself.

As a player, however, this scenario sends up so many red flags it's starting to look like a USSR military parade. The scenario you've described has "DM's pet Mary Sue NPC" written all over it and that would be enough for me to actively avoid it at all costs.

[ColorBlindNinja]

I have some players that would have their characters scream the fighter’s name at the top of their lungs, repeatedly, in order to fight the demons that would appear thereby, tpk be damned.

Sounds like a player in my group. :smallsmile:

[Reversefigure4]

It depends on the world setup. Is this sort of thing so common as to be jejune? Every fourth adventurer is the child of a magic hell-demon who can appear whenever is his name is mentioned? My PC previously met somebody with the backstory is 'Has the MacGuffin that can throw meteors at continents"? Another person in town might be the child of the North Wind and a dryad? What have my previous adventures looked like to get to 11th and 12th level?

In a normal campaign, I'd assume that would BE the campaign pitch, and so we'd need to pursue it or stop the campaign (particularly since it seems to be on rails anyway, as we can't find her, no matter how hard we try, until she turns up with Buddy NPC in love with her). I can't say I'd be wildly enthused about playing it, although repitching it so that over the course of the first 11 levels we have this girl as a NPC in town, then a PC is romancing her, then the plot begins to build around her might be a different story.

[Mars Ultor]

My character would feel that it's not his business, there's no reason for him to get involved, he's going to be forced to get involved, and this can't end well. Others in the party are more nosey and they'll want to find out who the ultimate fighting champion dad is, and they'd want to talk to the daughter.

I'd question why the party couldn't find the girl after an active search, that would make me suspicious. I'd also suspect something if the girl has been hanging around with two NPCs I know. There are tons of NPCs I don't know, why would she be making friends with the ones I'm friendly with?

This would confirm my feeling that's she bad luck and I'm not going to be happy about what happens next. Other PCs would be more curious about what it's all about. The argument in the group would likely be to treat her as a potential threat and make an attempted interrogation, or treat her a victim and question her with the idea of helping. It could go either way depending on what the party decides, but my preference would be interrogation.

[ColorBlindNinja]

I must admit, I'm slightly amused by the number of people who wouldn't want to get involved with the OP's NPC.

[Telok]

I have some players that would have their characters scream the fighter’s name at the top of their lungs, repeatedly, in order to fight the demons that would appear thereby, tpk be damned.

Yup. Because "it's more fun that way". Yet they're scared to play Paranioa.

My own characters would have had one of three reactions:
Heroic - "Damsel in distress? No? Who buys the next round of beer?"
Selfish - "How can I use this to my advantagr ot profit?"
Evulz - "Pimped disintegrate, attack roll of yes, no SR, minus eight on the save, dc 43, 240 damage... Why are you looking at me like that? She was unhappy. Unhappyness is suffering, she's not suffering now. It was fast and painless. What's the next artifact on our list?"

[Mordaedil]

More beefcakes is the answer. I do actually think this is kind of weird rule. No old hags, comely wenches, wretched beggars, disfigured necromancers, or chisel jawed Adonis?

"What's the NPC look like?"
"Well...he's got two arms, two legs, and a head with a face and hair."

I dunno if the OP mean it the same way, I would, but I chalked it up to basically "beautiful" being a misleading description, as beauty is in the eye of the beholder and doesn't describe for instance what haircolor they have, what shape their nose is or even anything about her really, besides that some people fancy how she looks.

It's like an old idiom of "tall dark and handsome" being used in a sentence, and refers to a horse, but the players at the table will be looking for someone who is tan or black, depending on interpretation. An old hag and a wretched beggar is still fairly functional for mental imagery because we all have an idea of what a medieval beggar looks like, without realizing they might be as varied as the beggar in our own neighborhoods. And when you describe a chisel-jawed Adonis, you already described a physical attribute and same with disfigured necromancers. Comely wench falls into the same trap as beautiful imo. It says nothing about the character aside from that they might wear an apron because they are working at a tavern.

At least if you used "busty", you'd describe something that would get everyone on the same page.

I don't think the words are entirely pointless, but void of context, they may lack the impact they need. And that's too many words for a tangent.

[Jon_Dahl]

Thank you for the feedback so far, I appreciate it - keep it keeping, please! One clarification and one question. First, I don't use DMPCs. For instance, no NPC is there to help the PCs in combat, ever, and no NPC is there to solve problems for them. Second:


At best I'd ignore it, and at worse I'd just leave the game.



Would you leave before or after the backstory information?

[Troacctid]

"Mysterious beautiful adventurer in town" isn't a quest hook. It's background trivia establishing an NPC in the setting. Information filed away for future reference as a potential clue for the real quest. Will probably have my character decide against all evidence that she is secretly the villain, just to see what happens.

[Florian]

Nice if you took leadership and are looking for a cohort. Else, not really interesting.

[Elvensilver]

My bard would (after checking he is not meant, he disguises himself as a woman rather often) run over quickly and try everything to sweettalk her into joining the party. Particulary if she has a tragic backstory and is good in hiding: good in hiding could be a ranger or druid, just what we need! And a tragic backstory would keep the paladina that tries to have some therapy talks because of bad behaviour of his back. And beautiful? Surely we can exchange clothes and make-up tricks! And of course we would help her, no matter her looks, to keep away from any evil.

[Darth Ultron]

Would you leave before or after the backstory information?

After. The point where the jerk DM said the stupid "She tells that they will all be dead if the father ever decides to meet his talented adventurer daughter and that the PCs will all be dead in a second if they meet the dad" line.

To me that is just the jerk DM saying he wants to kill all the characters and end the game. So, fine, if that is what the jerk DM wants: I'll just leave the game and the DM can sit in the corner and ''kill characters" and laugh.

Really, what is the point of continuing the game with a jerk DM? Even if all the players just ignore the DM's stupid story, it won't matter as the DM will just have dad 'pop' up and kill all the characters. So why bother wating around for that.

THE worst game ever would be like: player ignore the stupid DM threat and just play the game. And for the next couple hours it's a fun game in all ways the DM even puts on a false face and pretends to be 'normal'.

And THEN, right in the middle of the fun, the DM would be like "Dad shows up and kills all your characters! Haha, i'm the best DM ever! I win!"

So, why would any player wait around for that?

[ColorBlindNinja]

After. The point where the jerk DM said the stupid "She tells that they will all be dead if the father ever decides to meet his talented adventurer daughter and that the PCs will all be dead in a second if they meet the dad" line.

To me that is just the jerk DM saying he wants to kill all the characters and end the game. So, fine, if that is what the jerk DM wants: I'll just leave the game and the DM can sit in the corner and ''kill characters" and laugh.

Really, what is the point of continuing the game with a jerk DM? Even if all the players just ignore the DM's stupid story, it won't matter as the DM will just have dad 'pop' up and kill all the characters. So why bother wating around for that.

THE worst game ever would be like: player ignore the stupid DM threat and just play the game. And for the next couple hours it's a fun game in all ways the DM even puts on a false face and pretends to be 'normal'.

And THEN, right in the middle of the fun, the DM would be like "Dad shows up and kills all your characters! Haha, i'm the best DM ever! I win!"

So, why would any player wait around for that?

It could also be an attempt to build up a villain as being extremely dangerous.

[Quertus]

Unless he retrained those NPC class levels, the only threat that the girl's "dad" possess is the party laughing themselves to death.

So, I don't think that my characters would be likely to care, unless it came off as a Nigerian scam. I, however, might find it troubling in a heavy-handed railroading kind of way, depending on how it was presented.

Quertus, my signature academia mage, for whom this account is named, might look for residual magic on the NPC in question. Scry through time to observe the meeting (using True Seeing to see the girl's real form), etc. Obviously, Quertus hasn't been 11th level in quite some time, but, although his tools would be cruder, the end result would the same. If the NPC was the subject of a magical scam, Quertus would act; however, if it was a purely muggle affair, it would be outside Quertus' jurisdiction.

(EDIT - oh, and if he cared, Scry Through Time or read the girl's mind to know the name in question.)

But, since "GM Fiat" is about the only way to hide from his party, the group would probably bail before the next session.

[Darth Ultron]

It could also be an attempt to build up a villain as being extremely dangerous.

If it is, it's a clumsy attempt by a bad DM. At best.

Really to just have the game roll along and the DM just drops the above story with the little ''your characters would be dead" threat is just a jerk move.

Once the DM crosses the line to be an adversarial vs the players DM and say ''my super special NPC will kill your characters", there is no point in playing the game.

And I know this just about never ends well. The DM will sit there day dreaming about using their special NPC to kill the characters every second of the game play...until it happens and the DM does their happy dance.

[denthor]

Wizard would not care. 1/2 orc 10th

Hawk 1/2 elf ranger. Worshipped god of death. He would want to set up a meeting. But disinterested.

Simon hobgoblin cleric of deity todoth. NE friends with an imp sold another cleric to a devil for a 6th level travel spell. Demons can not be trusted. Sacrifice the girl first call daddy and sacrifice as much of his army for power. With final goal to get dad. For good measure mom is on my alter.

Holly human fighter I need a drink.

So most of my characters would not blink an eye.