Looking for a way to get access to as many different Lists as possible -

[GrayDeath]

with the limitations listed below.

1.: Has to have access to at least different Lists starting Level 5 at the latest (earlier is better).
2.:Must not need more than 3 classes in Total
3.: Cannot use Supreme Chord or similar "Better PRC`s".
4.: Should have more spell Slots/Spells per day than regular" but Ideally caps at Spell Level 6 or 7.
.

To sum it up, I am looking for a really high Versatility, medium Power build.
Sadly the DM has stated a few restrictions (the last one is from me, I dont want to be a power rival for the existing Caster, a Sorcerer, only rule through Versatility.

I am looking forward to Concepts/Ideas. :)

Oh, all First Party 3.5 that is not Dragon magazine (allowed on case by case) or really obscure is in. Pathfinder MAterial may be...or not, depending on if its simply an update to existing classes (out) or something newish (probably allowed).

[Grim Reader]

Archivist. Get cleric spells when you level. Learn Druid, Paladin, Adept and Ranger spells by scribing them into your prayerbook. Maybe Divine Bard.

Also learn a selection of spells from arcane classes through domain spells and other sources.

[ColorBlindNinja]

There's also Erudite Spell to Power, which gets you all Arcane spells as Psionic powers.

[flappeercraft]

If you or your DM don't accept that an StP Erudite can technically access divine spells since they are acquireable as arcane spells then you can make a Psychic Theurge of both StP Erudite and Archivist to access all. StP Erudite can already only access spells of up to one level lower than the powers he can manifest and due to psychic theurging you would both have more access to powers/spells than normal and lesser power spell level wise.

[Menzath]

The base class sha'ir, or the chameleon prc.
I'd personally lean towards chameleon.

[ColorBlindNinja]

StP Erudite can already only access spells of up to one level lower than the powers he can manifest and due to psychic theurging you would both have more access to powers/spells than normal and lesser power spell level wise.

There actually is a way around that.

The Erudite gets two bonus feats and can thus take two ACFs. Take Magic Mantle, which will allow you to take Sanctum Spell.

That allows you to learn spells of the same level as your powers and get 9th level spells at level 17.

It's cheesy and most tables won't allow it, but its RAW compliant.

[GrayDeath]

The base class sha'ir, or the chameleon prc.
I'd personally lean towards chameleon.


Hmmm, true, that might work. Still, it needs CHamaeleoon level 7ish to get 2 Lists iirc?
And doesnt do much for the amount of spells/day (and Shair was my first thought, but I would like to avoid getting 8ths and 9ths, to let the sorcerer shine in regards to raw power, only palyed a Shair once, is there a way to give them more slots and less power?).


There actually is a way around that.

The Erudite gets two bonus feats and can thus take two ACFs. Take Magic Mantle, which will allow you to take Sanctum Spell.

That allows you to learn spells of the same level as your powers and get 9th level spells at level 17.

It's cheesy and most tables won't allow it, but its RAW compliant.


I know, but A: Cheese and B: I am kind of looking for non 9ths (and 8ths ideally) casting in exchange for more slots/versatility anyway ^^

[ColorBlindNinja]

I know, but A: Cheese and B: I am kind of looking for non 9ths (and 8ths ideally) casting in exchange for more slots/versatility anyway ^^

Ah, I see. :smallsmile:

[zlefin]

do the lists all have to be spell-casting lists? or would the initiator lists be acceptable for one of the lists? You could go mystic theurge with a side of one level in an iniatiator cless then ruby knight vindicator.

more generally speaking, it's hard to progress 3 lists at once without cheese, especially since most casting classes require 3 levels in them before the theurge classes are available. so to get 3 lists would require 9 levels; which only leaves 11 for theurging.

the simpler way would be to simply rely on UMD and wbl-mancy to emulate access to the lists as needed.

[ColorBlindNinja]

the simpler way would be to simply rely on UMD and wbl-mancy to emulate access to the lists as needed.

Well, the simplest option would be to go Pun Pun or Use of of Tippy's better Ice Assassin tricks. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=13106654&postcount=1)

Obviously TO, of course. :smallbiggrin:

[Kalkra]

Generic Spellcaster has Wizard, Ceric, and Druid lists. Sublime Chord casts from the Wizard and Bard lists, and Prestige Paladin and Prestige Bard can add their respective lists with a one-level dip. Any way of cheating out Wish, Miracle, or the like gives you most spells. Artificers can create scrolls spells from any list.

[ColorBlindNinja]

Generic Spellcaster has Wizard, Ceric, and Druid lists.

I'm curious, has anyone around here tried playing the Generic Spellcaster?


Artificers can create scrolls spells from any list.

This one is probably the easiest method, to be honest.

[Maat Mons]

Samsaran can get a handful of spells from one other class list. (Using the Mystic Past Life alternative racial trait.) So you could, say, graft spells from the Trapsmith spell list onto the Duskblade spell list.

Shadow Conjuration/Evocation are pretty versatile. Pathfinder also has Shadow Enchantment. (It has Shadow Transmutation, but it isn't quite the same.) There's also a Pathfinder metamagic feat to add +20 realness to a shadow spell.

[ColorBlindNinja]

Shadow Conjuration/Evocation are pretty versatile.

It is worth noting that objects automatically succeed on their saving throws VS those spells. This can be a problem if you want to, say, use Shatter to break a lock.

[Quertus]

I'm curious, has anyone around here tried playing the Generic Spellcaster?.

Arcane Spellcaster into Tainted Sorcerer is kinda my goto, why?

[ColorBlindNinja]

Arcane Spellcaster into Tainted Sorcerer is kinda my goto, why?

I was curious if the class is worth playing.

[Saintheart]

Archivist. Get cleric spells when you level. Learn Druid, Paladin, Adept and Ranger spells by scribing them into your prayerbook. Maybe Divine Bard.

Also learn a selection of spells from arcane classes through domain spells and other sources.

Bonus points added to this: Spell domain out of Forgotten Realms, which gives you access to Anyspell and Greater Anyspell. These then allow you to cast one arcane spell at a time.

[Quertus]

I was curious if the class is worth playing.

Eh, is a Wizard without "all the spells" worth playing?

It's good for customising a character to fit a particular party. Unlike a Cleric or Wizard, it loses that ability if, say, the party changes / it adventures with a new party. Whether this is a pro or con depends on your tastes. Personally, I like the "no character is an island" feel, and the "how do we make this party work" minigame.

[ColorBlindNinja]

Eh, is a Wizard without "all the spells" worth playing?

It's good for customising a character to fit a particular party. Unlike a Cleric or Wizard, it loses that ability if, say, the party changes / it adventures with a new party. Whether this is a pro or con depends on your tastes. Personally, I like the "no character is an island" feel, and the "how do we make this party work" minigame.

Well color me intrigued. :smallsmile:

At the very least, I may have to work such a character into a campaign I'm planning...

[Menzath]

Hmmm, true, that might work. Still, it needs CHamaeleoon level 7ish to get 2 Lists iirc?
And doesnt do much for the amount of spells/day (and Shair was my first thought, but I would like to avoid getting 8ths and 9ths, to let the sorcerer shine in regards to raw power, only palyed a Shair once, is there a way to give them more slots and less power?

For the sha'ir, nothing that I know of.

As for chameleon, yes it's 2 lists.
All arcane spells prepared as a wizard,
And all divine spells prepared as a cleric.
That's alotta spells.

[Ruethgar]

Hmmm, true, that might work. Still, it needs CHamaeleoon level 7ish to get 2 Lists iirc?

Actually Chameleon gets access to all lists(though you need to source the arcane ones) and you can qualify for it before ECL 2 a couple of ways, most easily with a major bloodline. You save yourself from Dragon Magazine content requirements and three first level feats(flaw, flaw, human) if you wait a level and enter at third.

[Rynjin]

Samsaran can get a handful of spells from one other class list. (Using the Mystic Past Life alternative racial trait.) So you could, say, graft spells from the Trapsmith spell list onto the Duskblade spell list.

Shadow Conjuration/Evocation are pretty versatile. Pathfinder also has Shadow Enchantment. (It has Shadow Transmutation, but it isn't quite the same.) There's also a Pathfinder metamagic feat to add +20 realness to a shadow spell.

Yeah, if we're going Pathfinder, you'd want to be a Samsaran Shaman. Shamans are Divine casters with basically a mix of the best spells from the Druid and Witch spell lists, with a smattering of Cleric. Mystic Past Life: Cleric gets you some good Cleric spells, and Wandering Spirit: Lore lets you choose up to your Int mod in Wizard spells every day to add to your list, which can be changed every day (this is why you never take Lore as your primary Spirit). If you're more interested in number of lists than maxing your casting, you could go Mystic Theurge with Shaman 4 (you need Wandering Spirit, which comes on at 4th)/Bard 3 or something, but that sounds kinda dumb. 4 spell lists seems like enough.