Making Use of Racial Hit Dice (3.5) (Player Help)

[Skullruss]

In another post, http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?578145-Cannibal-Character-(Help)-3-5 , I've received a ton of help for my soon-to-be cannibal. I was also learned that the Hit Dice obtained through abuse of the Feed supernatural ability the character possesses grants him racial hit dice.

What I want help with is:
1. What kind of Hit Dice do I get? Does it rely on whatever race I am (human-> human HD, orc->orc HD, or perhaps as a monster through shenanigans, mind flayer->mind flayer HD)
2. Regardless of which HD I get, in the end all I get is some hp and minor stat adjustments, what are some ways to put the egregious waves of incoming HD to use (I eat creatures=free HD)

3. Also if you know of a solid way to allow said cannibal to eat as much as he wants to get as many HD as possible, that would be appreciated as well.

As always help is very appreciated.

[KillianHawkeye]

The type of Hit Dice you gain are determined by your creature type. Humans and orcs both gain Humanoid racial Hit Dice. Mind flayers would gain Aberration Hit Dice.

[WhamBamSam]

You gain HD based on your creature type (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/typesSubtypes.htm#types). This is presumably humanoid, but you could improve on this by choosing a non-humanoid race (Neraph, Savage Progression 0 Tiefling, or Otherworldly for Outsider type or Dragonwrought Kobold for dragon type) or using type-changing magic (Polymorph works, natch, but for a lower-level option you might consider UMDing a wand of Essence of the Dragon) before feeding. They likely don't have any class skills besides ones that apply to all your HD, so you might want to look into the Alternative Ways to Get New Class Skills (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?451088-Alternative-ways-to-get-new-Class-skills) thread.

The buckets of HD will increase your ECL and thus prevent you from gaining other levels, but you may be able to eat your way to faster leveling than your compatriots. This could get you some feats and boost things that only depend on character level. This recent thread (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?578382-The-Humanoid-Optimization) is largely a thought exercise on what to do with a huge bucket of HD with no class features. Martial Study is particularly noteworthy with regard to the above skill issue in that it also gives you a discipline skill as a permanent class skill.

[Seerow]

The buckets of HD will increase your ECL and thus prevent you from gaining other levels, but you may be able to eat your way to faster leveling than your compatriots. This could get you some feats and boost things that only depend on character level. This recent thread (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?578382-The-Humanoid-Optimization) is largely a thought exercise on what to do with a huge bucket of HD with no class features. Martial Study is particularly noteworthy with regard to the above skill issue in that it also gives you a discipline skill as a permanent class skill.

Seeing that being discussed so many years later makes me happy.

[Skullruss]

You gain HD based on your creature type (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/typesSubtypes.htm#types). This is presumably humanoid, but you could improve on this by choosing a non-humanoid race (Neraph, Savage Progression 0 Tiefling, or Otherworldly for Outsider type or Dragonwrought Kobold for dragon type) or using type-changing magic (Polymorph works, natch, but for a lower-level option you might consider UMDing a wand of Essence of the Dragon) before feeding. They likely don't have any class skills besides ones that apply to all your HD, so you might want to look into the Alternative Ways to Get New Class Skills (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?451088-Alternative-ways-to-get-new-Class-skills) thread.

The buckets of HD will increase your ECL and thus prevent you from gaining other levels, but you may be able to eat your way to faster leveling than your compatriots. This could get you some feats and boost things that only depend on character level. This recent thread (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?578382-The-Humanoid-Optimization) is largely a thought exercise on what to do with a huge bucket of HD with no class features. Martial Study is particularly noteworthy with regard to the above skill issue in that it also gives you a discipline skill as a permanent class skill.

That last link was incredibly helpful, thank you.
However do you have a source for ECL giving me slowing progression? Maybe even two, we all know wotc reprints stuff. It's not that I don't believe you, it's that I want to read the material verbatim, maybe even find a neat loophole.

[Jeraa]

That last link was incredibly helpful, thank you.
However do you have a source for ECL giving me slowing progression? Maybe even two, we all know wotc reprints stuff. It's not that I don't believe you, it's that I want to read the material verbatim, maybe even find a neat loophole.

Don't know the page, but you cn find it in the Monster Manual part about monsters as races.


Level Adjustment and Effective Character Level

To determine the effective character level (ECL) of a monster character, add its level adjustment to its racial Hit Dice and character class levels.

Use ECL instead of character level to determine how many experience points a monster character needs to reach its next level. Also use ECL to determine starting wealth for a monster character.

Racial hit dice are effectively a "class level" in whatever creature type you are. A Humanoid with 2 racial hit dice basically has 2 levels in the "Humanoid class". Those hit dice affect everything from skills to feats to experience points, just as a level in a normal class does.

[WhamBamSam]

That last link was incredibly helpful, thank you.
However do you have a source for ECL giving me slowing progression? Maybe even two, we all know wotc reprints stuff. It's not that I don't believe you, it's that I want to read the material verbatim, maybe even find a neat loophole.The amount of exp you get from an encounter and the amount of exp necessary to reach the next level are based on your ECL. There's an encounter calculator (http://www.d20srd.org/extras/d20encountercalculator/) in the SRD and all these rules are covered in the DMG. Also, your exp total doesn't change when you gain a HD from Feed, so you end up even further away from your next class level.

[Skullruss]

The amount of exp you get from an encounter and the amount of exp necessary to reach the next level are based on your ECL. There's an encounter calculator (http://www.d20srd.org/extras/d20encountercalculator/) in the SRD and all these rules are covered in the DMG. Also, your exp total doesn't change when you gain a HD from Feed, so you end up even further away from your next class level.

Well that sucks. Pretty clearly written, especially for wotc. Don't suppose you know a loophole?

[Telonius]

Well that sucks. Pretty clearly written, especially for wotc. Don't suppose you know a loophole?

The only loophole I know of involves losing HD you've already gained. You need a wight (or some other creature that gives negative levels). The idea is that you allow it to drain you, and voluntarily fail the save so that the HD loss is permanent. Do this enough times, and you'll be back where you started before you used the Feed ability, and gaining XP at a normal rate to level up with the rest of your party. This is rules-legal, but is generally considered horribly cheesy. (Also mostly used on high-Racial Hitdie, low-Level Adjustment monsters that have nice abilities).

[ShurikVch]

Also, your exp total doesn't change when you gain a HD from Feed, so you end up even further away from your next class level.Please, excuse me, but can you quote it?

Because I'm always considered the XP as one of inherent properties of having certain number of HD - along with hit points, skill ranks, feats, and save bonuses

If racial HD wouldn't come with a number of XP, then how, exactly, monsters without a single class level are crafting their magical stuff?

[Jeraa]

Please, excuse me, but can you quote it?

Because I'm always considered the XP as one of inherent properties of having certain number of HD - along with hit points, skill ranks, feats, and save bonuses

If racial HD wouldn't come with a number of XP, then how, exactly, monsters without a single class level are crafting their magical stuff?

The onlything I can find is this, under Monsters & Class Levels in the Monster Manual.


Level Adjustment and Effective Character Level

To determine the effective character level (ECL) of a monster character, add its level adjustment to its racial Hit Dice and character class levels. The monster is considered to have experience points equal to the minimum needed to be a character of its ECL.

So if racial hit dice go up, the monsters effective character level goes up, and it is considered to have the minimum number of experience points needed for that ECL.