OOTS #1152 - The Discussion Thread

[The Giant]

New comic is up.

[ErebusVonMori]

Huh. Should have seen that coming really.

[Lexible]

Elan nailed this one. Just too sweet.

[Eldritch Queen]

And with that, Durkon's mother has become my favorite character. :smallbiggrin:

[Peelee]

Elan nailed this one. Just too sweet.

That was actually Roy. :smalltongue:

[LordSith]

Take that, Banishment.

[Fyraltari]

Bazinga!

I'm glad Durkon meets his Ma' again. :smallsmile:

Is Roy supposed to be wrong when he says the vote is scheduled for noon, or is it a slight continuity mistake (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1095.html)? Wait that was a year ago!? How time flies.

[Deuce]

So wait, was Durkon only Vamped for a week?

[BaronOfHell]

Huh. Should have seen that coming really.

Agreed, but it does kind of make me happy to know all this time he has been able to communicate with his loved ones.

Btw. when in the comic was Durkon able to cast sending?

Also here is the four times sending to Roy which Durkon is referring to in the latest strip: http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0733.html

[Rrmcklin]

Nice reunion, it might not ultimately be good that she's here, though. But at least she gets to meet her grandson - and Hilgya...

[The Giant]

Bazinga!

I'm glad Durkon meets his Ma' again.:smallsmile:

Is Roy supposed to be wrong when he says the vote is scheduled for noon, or is it a slight continuity mistake (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1095.html)? Wait that was a year ago!? How time flies.

It's a mistake, I was going by memory, remembering that I had definitely scheduled it for after dawn. I'll fix it.

EDIT: Fixed.

[ChaosOS]

That could've gone worse

[Resileaf]

Belkar channeling his inner Nelson.

[zimmerwald1915]

Can Sigdi not tell humans apart? :smalleek:

[chy03001]

That... both totally made sense and I'm surprised I didn't see it coming by the simplicity of it all.

[Ivrytwr]

Moms are the best. Especially around your friends.
Thanks Giant.

[knag]

I was really wondering if Sigdi was still alive! So glad she is. And hilarious that Durkon knew all along.

[Fyraltari]

So one sending was supposed to be for Sigdi. Who were the other three for?

I'm guessing one for Hinjo, one for Serini and one in case they need it.

[Yirggzmb]

Can Sigdi not tell humans apart? :smalleek:

She's probably never actually seen them - just heard Durkon talk about them for the past many years.

[Pheehelm]

So wait, was Durkon only Vamped for a week?See panel 2 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1136.html).

[Resileaf]

Also I assume that Durkon is meant "murder fer a decent pint" not "murder a decent pint".

Or wait, maybe he means murder as in drink savagely.

[bengator]

And she gets to meet her Grand-Kudzu!

[kivzirrum]

Huh. Never would have guessed that, but... yeah.

That is some delightful undercutting of drama. :smallsmile: The realities of magic in the D&D system have a way of doing that, huh?

[Resileaf]

So one sending was supposed to be for Sigdi. Who were the other three for?

I'm guessing one for Hinjo, one for Serini and one in case they need it.

Probably all four for Sigdi to have a back and forth conversation.

[Fyraltari]

Can Sigdi not tell humans apart? :smalleek:

That rather depends on how much Durkon told her about his friends. I don't describe my friends's looks to my parents either, why would I?

[GregTD]

Durkula talked to Mom?

[HUMVEE Driver]

It's the first time they've met again! LOL

[zimmerwald1915]

Or wait, maybe he means murder as in drink savagely.
It must be this, if only because it would be extremely tactless to go on about how you'd like to murder someone not thirty minutes after you've stopped being an undead murder-machine.

[Yirggzmb]

Durkula talked to Mom?

Even though it's been ages in irl time, in comic time it's only been maybe a week since Durkon died.

[Personification]

Also I assume that Durkon is meant "murder fer a decent pint" not "murder a decent pint".

Or wait, maybe he means murder as in drink savagely.

The latter probably, it is more commonly used for eating, but people definitely say things like "I could murder a hamburger." (or in this case a beer)

[Bluepaw]

Ah, the ol' 'extremely practical and unflashy uses of magic' ploy. Good on ye, Durkon.

[zimmerwald1915]

I wonder where Hilgya, Vaarsuvius, Blackwing, and Minrah's corpse are during all this.

[Fyraltari]

And she gets to meet her Grand-Kudzu!
Sigdi is going to meet Hilgya. Oh boy, oh boy, oh boy.

Probably all four for Sigdi to have a back and forth conversation.
Right, that does sound likely.

Durkula talked to Mom?
No, it has only been roughly a week so Durkon did not fall behind on his calls, especially since he had to wait one more day after the four Sendings incident. Also, if he had she wouldn't be asking about his weight loss. And why would he really?

[Peat]

Belkar's line was perfect. Unfortunately so, as laughter leads to coughing, and I thought coughing was going to lead to vomiting...


Also I assume that Durkon is meant "murder fer a decent pint" not "murder a decent pint".

Or wait, maybe he means murder as in drink savagely.

I presume the latter - fairly common saying in my part of the world.

[137beth]

I'm with Roy on this one: I didn't expect Durkon to be Sending with his mother, but I probably should have.

[Keltest]

In case there was any question that Durkon has the strongest good alignment in the party, he's the only one to actually make an attempt to call his mother.

[Fyraltari]

I wonder where Hilgya, Vaarsuvius, Blackwing, and Minrah's corpse are during all this.

About to step in would be my guess, they weren't far behind (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1151.html). One scene at a time.

EDIT:
In case there was any question that Durkon has the strongest good alignment in the party, he's the only one to actually make an attempt to call his mother.

Roy and Haley have excuses. Maybe Haley asked him to contact her dad and it failed because of the anti-magic cells?

[Personification]

So one sending was supposed to be for Sigdi. Who were the other three for?

I'm guessing one for Hinjo, one for Serini and one in case they need it.

Probably all for Sigdi actually. Twenty-five words each isn't enough room for a conversation between a mother and son as close as the Thundershields. What I don't get is why he couldn't use sending to clear up the confusion with Rubyrock once she became high priestess.

[GregTD]

It's a mistake, I was going by memory, remembering that I had definitely scheduled it for after dawn. I'll fix it.

EDIT: Fixed.

Well, Roy made the same "mistake" here: http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1099.html

[Yirggzmb]

Probably all for Sigdi actually. Twenty-five words each isn't enough room for a conversation between a mother and son as close as the Thundershields. What I don't get is why he couldn't use sending to clear up the confusion with Rubyrock once she became high priestess.


Maybe, as the high priestess, she gets so many sendings that she no longer accepts them unless she's expecting them? I don't actually know if that's possible though.

[Fyraltari]

Probably all for Sigdi actually. Twenty-five words each isn't enough room for a conversation between a mother and son as close as the Thundershields. What I don't get is why he couldn't use sending to clear up the confusion with Rubyrock once she became high priestess.

For one, he didn't know Hurak had died.

For two,he was sent until Hurak called him back, so there was no point in calling Hurak. He probably tried in the beginning and got tired of hearing "No. I'll tell you when you can come back".

[GregTD]

Even though it's been ages in irl time, in comic time it's only been maybe a week since Durkon died.

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1136.html

"When did you croak, like five and a half years ago?"

I'm not going to check, but I'd lay a small bet that Durkon died five and a half years ago, by our calendar. :-)

[jwhouk]

Of course he calls his mother weekly. This is DURKON, after all.

[Peelee]

Probably all for Sigdi actually. Twenty-five words each isn't enough room for a conversation between a mother and son as close as the Thundershields. What I don't get is why he couldn't use sending to clear up the confusion with Rubyrock once she became high priestess.

Because as far as Durkon knew, there was no confusion.

[Angrith]

I'm glad to know that I'm not the only to forget that the sending spell existed. Something tells me that my own characters from now on are probably going to phone home too occasionally.

[Edric O]

That was incredibly sweet, but...


And she gets to meet her Grand-Kudzu!
...it's about to get really awkward really fast.

I can't imagine Sigdi knows about Durkon's "dwarf-on-dwarf action" from back in the day, or that she will approve of it once she finds out.

[Ruck]

Also I assume that Durkon is meant "murder fer a decent pint" not "murder a decent pint".

Or wait, maybe he means murder as in drink savagely.

Yes, certainly the latter.


I wonder where Hilgya, Vaarsuvius, Blackwing, and Minrah's corpse are during all this.

Bringing up the rear.


http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1136.html

"When did you croak, like five and a half years ago?"

I'm not going to check, but I'd lay a small bet that Durkon died five and a half years ago, by our calendar. :-)

I'm pretty confident that not only is this the case, but that the comic originally stated "five years" until Giant went and double-checked it.


In case there was any question that Durkon has the strongest good alignment in the party, he's the only one to actually make an attempt to call his mother.

Well, he's also the only one who has a spell that can do that (aside from Vaarsuvius, who isn't in the contest for "strongest Good alignment in the party," and also we know nothing of V's parentage).

[Riftwolf]

'murder a pint' is a British turn of phrase, it makes sense here.
Also hooray for calling Mum every week! Durkon proving he's the most Good character

[Fyraltari]

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1136.html

"When did you croak, like five and a half years ago?"

I'm not going to check, but I'd lay a small bet that Durkon died five and a half years ago, by our calendar. :-)
Durkon died (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0877.html) the fourth of March 2013 (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?274269-OOTS-877-The-Discussion-Thread); it's been almost six years by now. But Thor's aside (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1136.html) was last August (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?567032-OOTS-1136-The-Discussion-Thread).

[martianmister]

I wonder where Hilgya, Vaarsuvius, Blackwing, and Minrah's corpse are during all this.

Cremated already.

[JumboWheat01]

Remember to Send to your parents when you're out adventuring, you youngins.

[Caerulea]

Excellent burn by Sigdi.

—Caerulea

[Edric O]

But Thor's aside (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1136.html) was last August (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?567032-OOTS-1136-The-Discussion-Thread).
Wait, what? It's been almost half a year (IRL) already since the vampire was destroyed?

My perception of time when it comes to OOTS is clearly way off.

[Rrmcklin]

That was incredibly sweet, but...


...it's about to get really awkward really fast.

I can't imagine Sigdi knows about Durkon's "dwarf-on-dwarf action" from back in the day, or that she will approve of it once she finds out.

I doubt she'd care. "Thor understands these things" and she and her husband were having sex well before they were married, according to their team.

As for whether she'll like Hilgya as a person, I doubt it, but that's entirely reasonable.

[Asmodean_]

I'm not that experienced at D&D so I don't know the ins and outs of types of damage, so I'm gonna ask: what type of damage would Roy be taking from being mistaken for Elan?

[Verappo]

This is the cutest thing ever. Bless Elan for being all of us (well, me at least) and coming to the most tragic and dramatically satisfying conclusion. Especially since that seems to be the trend if you look at his and Haley's family history

[Fyraltari]

Wait, what? It's been almost half a year (IRL) already since the vampire was destroyed?

My perception of time when it comes to OOTS is clearly way off.
Tell me about it!

I doubt she'd care. "Thor understands these things" and she and her husband were having sex well before they were married, according to their team.

They don't care about premarital sex, but they care about adulterous sex. It will be interesting to see if her take on this is more nuanced than Durkon's original was. I bet it will be.

As for whether she'll like Hilgya as a person, I doubt it, but that's entirely reasonable.
I wonder if Hilgya remember that Durkon credited his mother with his sense of duty, because if she does, there is no way she will let her aywhere near Kudzu.

[Edric O]

Tell me about it!
It feels like Erfworld Book One has only been over for a couple of years, too. I bet if I go back to check, it will turn out to have been over 10 years, won't it?

Giant In The Playground: The website that works like Narnia.

[Peelee]

I'm not that experienced at D&D so I don't know the ins and outs of types of damage, so I'm gonna ask: what type of damage would Roy be taking from being mistaken for Elan?

1d12 humor damage. Four of those and you're in a bad shape, back in the day.

[Resileaf]

I'm not that experienced at D&D so I don't know the ins and outs of types of damage, so I'm gonna ask: what type of damage would Roy be taking from being mistaken for Elan?

A death saving throw.

[Ruck]

I'm not that experienced at D&D so I don't know the ins and outs of types of damage, so I'm gonna ask: what type of damage would Roy be taking from being mistaken for Elan?

Nonlethal (Ego).

[DaOldeWolf]

Those are the worst burns. I should know from personal experience.

[Peelee]

Nonlethal (Ego).

Fire damage?

[Michaeler]

I'm not that experienced at D&D so I don't know the ins and outs of types of damage, so I'm gonna ask: what type of damage would Roy be taking from being mistaken for Elan?

2d12 credibility damage.

Also, years ago I was in a campaign with a character who could not tell the truth. Players expressed doubt that he could manage a normal conversation in a tavern and "I could murder a pint!" was my first response.

[Reboot]

So, what's Belkar looking at in panel 4? The floor runes, because surely he saw them already?

[Rogar Demonblud]

And here I thought I was the only one to use Sending for calling home regularly.

[Fyraltari]

So, what's Belkar looking at in panel 4? The floor runes, because surely he saw them already?

He just realized there are six members of the Order and wonders which one Durkon would be even less willing to marry than himself.

[understatement]

I can't believe I forgot that you can just Send to people...

Also, does this show Durkon's lost his 7th spells? Else he would Regenerate her arm now, right? (or more likely, he's "saving" them for the Exarch I guess)

Awesome strip.

Edit: he's tapped out of spells. Whoops.

[Larre Gannd]

He just realized there are six members of the Order and wonders which one Durkon would be even less willing to marry than himself.

Oh gosh. Please don’t start that again, my mind can’t take it.

[KorvinStarmast]

Very much enjoying the use of shadows in the art style these days, panels 4 and 5 were particularly pleasing in that regard.

Belkar's take was amusing, but Sidgi's line came across as funnier on first read.

Like the attention to detail : Roy still needs that stone to open the door.

Reach back to Roy / Belkar in Jail, BRiTF (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0733.html): nice.

[Ruck]

Fire damage?

And Poison damage on an especially strong hit.

[Sylian]

Firok's beard has a different shade of gray in panel 4 compared to panel 6. Is that intended or a mistake?


Also, does this show Durkon's lost his 7th spells? Else he would Regenerate her arm now, right? (or more likely, he's "saving" them for the Exarch I guess)He probably hasn't prepared it.

[Peelee]

Very much enjoying the use of shadows in the art style these days, panels 4 and 5 were particularly pleasing in that regard.

Shame the shadow dancer isn't around to appreciate it.

[Anitar]

I'm not that experienced at D&D so I don't know the ins and outs of types of damage, so I'm gonna ask: what type of damage would Roy be taking from being mistaken for Elan?

Belkar called it a "burn". He's certainly familiar with all manner of insults, so I'm taking his word on this one-- it's Fire damage.

[jmeforonda]

So, what's Belkar looking at in panel 4? The floor runes, because surely he saw them already?

I think he's wondering why the runes didn't zap him? I'm assuming they're there to keep out Evil aligned creatures. So I guess that might be confirmation of Belkar's alignment change now?

[KorvinStarmast]

Shame the shadow dancer isn't around to appreciate it.

Hmm is he somewhere, anywhere, or nowhere? :smallconfused:

[Ruck]

Heh, I just realized that the four Good characters have all had happy reunion moments now. (And if you want to go further, they've each had a reunion with a parent-- I hesitate to call Haley's or Elan's reunions with their fathers "happy" given the circumstances.)

Vaarsuvius has had a reunion moment, but it might be described more as "horrifying" than "happy." And Belkar hasn't had one at all, unless you count meeting back up with Mr. Scruffy after the gladiator fight. (I don't think they were separated long enough for it to count.)

[Rrmcklin]

Haley's reunion with Ian at least started as happy, and they parted on good terms.

[RaveDave92084]

Critical hit in the feels for sure.

Durkon's Mom is very sweet.

And what a funny burn on Roy, definitely a 6d6 burn damage...

[Ornithologist]

How about Buggy Lou when they went out to the desert?

[Ruck]

How about Buggy Lou when they went out to the desert?

Yeah, I guess that could count. He's literally the only person from Belkar's past we've met. Naturally, Belkar ends up killing him.

[Doug Lampert]

I'm not that experienced at D&D so I don't know the ins and outs of types of damage, so I'm gonna ask: what type of damage would Roy be taking from being mistaken for Elan?

Psychic if you want a serious response and think it actually did damage.
Fire if we go by Belkar's claim that it was a burn.
-2 Morale penalty to participating in this conversation would also work.

[Giggling Ghast]

Awww, Critical Hit to the feels!

[Pablo360]

I wonder where Hilgya, Vaarsuvius, Blackwing, and Minrah's corpse are during all this.

Cremated already.

(emphasis added)

I should hope not.

[Leirus]

He just realized there are six members of the Order and wonders which one Durkon would be even less willing to marry than himself.

He is looking at Durkon. And, afterwards, Sidgi. I would guess he is processing who Sidgi is and trying to get an opinion about her. I woulf further guess he has advanced somehow since his hate/desire days.

[Pablo360]

Roy's right, you know. (∀x:~Worry(x)→Worry(x))→(∀x:Worry(x)).

[Fyraltari]

Oh gosh. Please don’t start that again, my mind can’t take it.
[insert evil laugh here]

I think he's wondering why the runes didn't zap him? I'm assuming they're there to keep out Evil aligned creatures. So I guess that might be confirmation of Belkar's alignment change now?

Or maybe they're just part of the door-sealing spell. You are jumping to conclusions a bit here.

[Canuck617]

BWAHAHAHAHA!!!! I haven't laughed that much at a comic in a while! Partically because Sidgi's perfectly fine and apparently knew Durkon was alive and well this whole time!

Plus, "Oh, so ye must be Elan!"
:belkar: Ha ha, unintentional mom burn!

(Is there a Sidgi smily? I know there's a list of nonstandard smilies somewhere)

[Sloanzilla]

I seem to remember some speculation here about Durkon possibly keeping in touch with his mom via sending but maybe that is just wishful recollection.

[Riftwolf]

He is looking at Durkon. And, afterwards, Sidgi. I would guess he is processing who Sidgi is and trying to get an opinion about her. I woulf further guess he has advanced somehow since his hate/desire days.

I'd like to point out that the hate/lust proto brain wasn't an established fact, but a theory set out by an intellectual elitist wanting to belittle someone's mental capacity because, when drunk, he kissed them.


Hmm is he somewhere, anywhere, or nowhere? :smallconfused:

Last seen in Nowhere, I believe, but that was months ago in comic time. They could be Anywhere by now.

[Dungeon-noob]

Firok's beard has a different shade of gray in panel 4 compared to panel 6. Is that intended or a mistake?
Might be lighting at play here.

Also quite forgotten that Durkon would want to call his mother (though not because i didn't think he could :smallsigh:)

[RatElemental]

I'm not that experienced at D&D so I don't know the ins and outs of types of damage, so I'm gonna ask: what type of damage would Roy be taking from being mistaken for Elan?

The cheeky answer would be fire, for the burn, but more likely no damage at all. Being inflicted with a condition such as shaken or nauseated, or most likely just something like a -2 morale penalty to attacks and skill checks makes more sense.

[johnbragg]

I'm not that experienced at D&D so I don't know the ins and outs of types of damage, so I'm gonna ask: what type of damage would Roy be taking from being mistaken for Elan?

BURN damage. Not an actual damage type. Not a serious answer

[gatemansgc]

See panel 2 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1136.html).

still love how the gods perceive real world time over comic time.

[AutomatedTeller]

I love that Durkon is using fairly powerful magic (Sending is higher level than, say, Fireball) to stay in touch with his mom ;)

I don't fully understand why Sigdi didn't go give the High Priest of Thor a piece of her mind, though, after she finally talked to Durkon.

What are the different rings made of in the council chamber? Will we find out before the encounter, or will Rich wait to tell us the effects?

Sigdi vs Hilgya is going to be interesting...

[Jaxzan Proditor]

Awww, that was sweet. Also, I too never wondered about all the Sendings, so I sympathize with Roy. I am interested to here about the layout Durkon almost described...

[BriarHobbit]

I loved the last panel of this comic. So funny. I am glad that we get to meet Durkon's Mom. Of course, Durkon didn't start out on his mission knowing Sending spells so there were undoubtedly some tough years for Mother Durkon.

[CriticalFailure]

Aww, I *did* wonder that at the time and then forgot about it 'til now, lol. How nice.

I wonder what Sigdi will make of Hilgya and Kudzu.

wrt that I think it's pretty easy to be an intellectual elitist when it comes to Belkar; he has a negative wisdom modifier and his int probably below average, though not as bad as Elan's.

[Fyraltari]

I don't fully understand why Sigdi didn't go give the High Priest of Thor a piece of her mind, though, after she finally talked to Durkon.

How do you know she didn't? And if she did what do you think would have happened? Hell, he may simply have refused to talk to her at all.

[Doug Lampert]

I don't fully understand why Sigdi didn't go give the High Priest of Thor a piece of her mind, though, after she finally talked to Durkon.

She may have, and maybe he told her it was Thor's Will or necessary because of a prophesy or something else, and she accepted it.

Sigdi is USED to doing the right thing having a high personal cost to her and her family.

The interesting thing is that she probably would have mentioned to Durkon at some point that Hurak was dead, at which point one might think Durkon could have had her issue another appeal, but there's evidence that that never happened, because Rubyrock was perfectly willing to let him come back when asked.

Note that in 296 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0296.html), Durkon doesn't seem nearly as enthusiastic about knowing that a message will be sent to his home as he is in 333 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0333.html) over the fact that he'll get to go home posthumously. It looks to me like Durkon was convinced the answer from the Thor Temple to the letter would be "No." Which implies he may well have asked at some previous point in time.

[Gwynfrid]

This comic is pure gold on so many levels. Great job, Giant!

I must admit Durkon's preparedness to cast 4 Sendings in a row bugged me at the time, but I let it pass under Rule of Funny. Now it turns out it was impeccable continuity. Love it!

[Fyraltari]

The interesting thing is that she probably would have mentioned to Durkon at some point that Hurak was dead, at which point one might think Durkon could have had her issue another appeal, but there's evidence that that never happened, because Rubyrock was perfectly willing to let him come back when asked.

Note that in 296 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0296.html), Durkon doesn't seem nearly as enthusiastic about knowing that a message will be sent to his home as he is in 333 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0333.html) over the fact that he'll get to go home posthumously. It looks to me like Durkon was convinced the answer from the Thor Temple to the letter would be "No." Which implies he may well have asked at some previous point in time.

Come to think of it he didn't know that either Hurak or his grandfather had died when he wrote (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0305.html). I'm guessing he couldn't send by then*? And once he could the whole "save the world" shtick took priority over "going home".

*Unless both Hurak and granddad managed to die between his last talk with Sigdi and Miko reaching the Dwarven Lands.

[Ruck]

Sending is a 4th-level Cleric spell-- What Cleric level is required to cast that, and also, does anyone more familiar with the history of the Class and Level Geekery thread know when Durkon would have reached it?

[Riftwolf]

Sending is a 4th-level Cleric spell-- What Cleric level is required to cast that, and also, does anyone more familiar with the history of the Class and Level Geekery thread know when Durkon would have reached it?

Pretty sure it's 7th level, meaning Durkon had it before Dorukans Dungeon (as I think they were around 9th level then).
Which makes it surprising that no one noticed. Its not like you get much alone time in a dungeon.

[Rrmcklin]

Pretty sure it's 7th level, meaning Durkon had it before Dorukans Dungeon (as I think they were around 9th level then).
Which makes it surprising that no one noticed. Its not like you get much alone time in a dungeon.

I don't think that's how spell slots work. Being a 7th level spell doesn't mean he got it at level 7.

[gatemansgc]

Awww, that was sweet. Also, I too never wondered about all the Sendings, so I sympathize with Roy. I am interested to here about the layout Durkon almost described...

considering how relevant to the story it is, i'm sure we'll get to it in a few comics.

[aramis604]

Sending is a 4th-level Cleric spell-- What Cleric level is required to cast that

7th level is when a Cleric gains access to level-4 spells. Assuming no multi-classing ,etc.

[Peelee]

Sending is a 4th-level Cleric spell-- What Cleric level is required to cast that, and also, does anyone more familiar with the history of the Class and Level Geekery thread know when Durkon would have reached it?

Note to self: invite Ruck to my next D&D campaign. Dunno if that'll be before or after our podcast.
ETA:
I don't think that's how spell slots work. Being a 7th level spell doesn't mean he got it at level 7.

It's a 4th level spell, so he gets it at level 7, is what was meant there.
Double ETA: ninja sandwich'd!

[CrazyPenguin]

I don't think that's how spell slots work. Being a 7th level spell doesn't mean he got it at level 7.

Riftwolf meant that Clerics get access to 4th-level spells at 7th level (which is correct, by the way). Sending is a 4th-level spell.

EDIT: Ack, I got ninja'd.

[gatemansgc]

I don't think that's how spell slots work. Being a 7th level spell doesn't mean he got it at level 7.

looked it up, it's 4th level not 7th.

[TuringTest]

"ye must be Elan" literally pulled a laugh out loud from me, and I'm not prone to those.

[b_jonas]

Also, does this show Durkon's lost his 7th spells? Else he would Regenerate her arm now, right? (or more likely, he's "saving" them for the Exarch I guess)

Edit: he's tapped out of spells. Whoops. Yup! That's the clever bit. We thought Durkon wouldn't meet his mother until near the end of the story, and possibly never if she dies before that, so she won't be able to cast Regenerate on her. Instead he does meet his mother, but can't cast Regenerate because he's only here for one night, doesn't have a Regenerate spell right now because Greg didn't prepare one, and he'll have to use all of tomorrow's spell slots for the fight against the vampires.

[gatemansgc]

"ye must be Elan" literally pulled a laugh out loud from me, and I'm not prone to those.

especially nowadays where there's less humor and more storyline (but never getting too far from the humor).

it's one of the reasons i'm so into the strip despite not playing D&D at all (closest i've come is playing 40k years ago).

[Fyraltari]

Yup! That's the clever bit. We thought Durkon wouldn't meet his mother until near the end of the story, and possibly never if she dies before that, so she won't be able to cast Regenerate on her. Instead he does meet his mother, but can't cast Regenerate because he's only here for one night, doesn't have a Regenerate spell right now because Greg didn't prepare one, and he'll have to use all of tomorrow's spell slots for the fight against the vampires.

I'm sure he can spare a Regenerate. Also my money is still on them spending Wednesday eveneing with Durkon's family.

[gatemansgc]

Yup! That's the clever bit. We thought Durkon wouldn't meet his mother until near the end of the story, and possibly never if she dies before that, so she won't be able to cast Regenerate on her. Instead he does meet his mother, but can't cast Regenerate because he's only here for one night, doesn't have a Regenerate spell right now because Greg didn't prepare one, and he'll have to use all of tomorrow's spell slots for the fight against the vampires.

wow, i didn't realize how perfect that was. he'll probably offer to make one of his spell slots regenerate too, then his mother will tell him he needs the slots for the battle or something.

[dtilque]

I think he's wondering why the runes didn't zap him? I'm assuming they're there to keep out Evil aligned creatures. So I guess that might be confirmation of Belkar's alignment change now?

Belkar walked out of that door not very long ago when he was definitely still Evil. They didn't zap him then, so they must not be that kind of rune.

[Jay R]

Sigdi vs Hilgya is going to be interesting...

"vs."? Hilgya is about to introduce Sigdi to her grandson.


Which makes it surprising that no one noticed. Its not like you get much alone time in a dungeon.

You get alone time every night, when it's your turn to be on watch.

[jmeforonda]

Belkar walked out of that door not very long ago when he was definitely still Evil. They didn't zap him then, so they must not be that kind of rune.

Oh you're right! I wonder what he's looking at then? 🤔

[Peelee]

Belkar walked out of that door not very long ago when he was definitely still Evil. They didn't zap him then, so they must not be that kind of rune.

Wow, I hadn't even seen that comment somehow. Talk about stretches....

[zimmerwald1915]

"vs."? Hilgya is about to introduce Sigdi to her grandson.
Her bastard grandson.

[Fyraltari]

"vs."? Hilgya is about to introduce Sigdi to her grandson.
I doubt that's going to go well.

[Ruck]

Note to self: invite Ruck to my next D&D campaign. Dunno if that'll be before or after our podcast.

I've never gotten to play a real D&D game, but I'm a lot of fun at parties, so I'm sure it will translate.

I actually do think an OOTS podcast would be super interesting, although I may have over-promised myself on podcasts. Also, I moved recently for a job and should probably wait until I get my equipment back to record, although it doesn't matter too much for distance recording.

[eilandesq]

I doubt that's going to go well.

Indeed. It would be all kinds of awesome if another flame-based Hilgya tantrum was interrupted by a quiet "Counterspell" from V., who has probably had quite enough of this crap from the Chaotic Evil idiot by now.

[Ruck]

Her bastard grandson.

Well, going full Daniel Plainview is a new one, I will admit.

[Rrmcklin]

Her bastard grandson.

I don't see why anyone would think she'd care about something like that.

[dps]

I don't see why anyone would think she'd care about something like that.

Because Lawful.

I'm guessing, though, Lawful enough to care, but Good enough to forgive.

[Lexible]

Belkar walked out of that door not very long ago when he was definitely still Evil. They didn't zap him then, so they must not be that kind of rune.


Doh! 100 quatloos gone!

[LadyEowyn]

Oh you're right! I wonder what he's looking at then? 🤔
It’s possible that Belkar is looking at Durkon or at Mr. Scruffy rather than at the runes.

A few panels later he’s definitely looking at Durkon and Sigdi, and in both of them he’s got an uncharacteristic sad/thoughtful expression on his face, so I’m guessing that witnessing this happy family reunion has sparked some feelings.

[Peelee]

Doh! 100 quatloos gone!

To be fair here, the logic to get there was along the lines of "if this room is actually filled with methane then methane breathing is confirmed." A true statement, but lacking any foundation whatsoever.

You've got to know when to hold em, know when to fold em.

[Caerulea]

Doh! 100 quatloos gone!
200? Both Peelee and I took you up on it. I did first though.

—Caerulea

[CriticalFailure]

wouldn't it be awkward if the baby turned out to be part of a wacky and vaguely love themed conspiracy that involved Sabine teaming back up with Hilgya and shapeshifting into a baby

somehow I don't think this will actually come to pass

[danielxcutter]

"Oh, so ye must be Elan!" Priceless.

[SilverCacaobean]

I love jokes at the expense of Roy, but I never imagined that the most savage one would come from Durkon's mom.

[understatement]

Also, Roy's smile in the 7th panel is so sweet and rare. I love it when characters just smile genuinely.

[jwhouk]

I think Sigdi already knows about Hilgya. He may have mentioned her in at least one Sending. Either that or Sigdi knows about Hilgya from other sources.

[woweedd]

HA-HA! Of COURSE Durkon calls his mom every week! Of course he does! I keep on forgetting that, even if the OOTS world has yet to invent mass communication technology, Durkon is a Near-Epic level Cleric. He has access to communication methods beyond most people, is my point.

[renovator]

Is Belkar's sad face in panel 7 because he is missing his mum/mom?
Does elkar seems to spend most of his time now with a sad or neutral face and has his mood changed as he gains empathy?
The advice to fake character growth seems to have caused real character growth

[Dr.Zero]

For one, he didn't know Hurak had died.


That seems unlikely.

It's like having a son who is a catholic priest on a mission in a forest and when you talk to him once every week, never say: "Oh, the old pope is dead. We have a new pope."

Sure, sending is only 25 words, but for a priest of a god the death of the very high priest of that same god should be quite the big news.

Even more if Durkon said to his mom that it was the aforementioned high priest to cast him away (and I don't see a reason for him not saying that to her, too, but maybe this will be explained in the next strip.)

[LadyEowyn]

I am very much looking forward to seeing what happens when Sigdi and Hilgya meet.

[danielxcutter]

Is Belkar's sad face in panel 7 because he is missing his mum/mom?
Does elkar seems to spend most of his time now with a sad or neutral face and has his mood changed as he gains empathy?
The advice to fake character growth seems to have caused real character growth

I think it's another sign of him developing genuine empathy.

[Keltest]

Is Belkar's sad face in panel 7 because he is missing his mum/mom?
Does elkar seems to spend most of his time now with a sad or neutral face and has his mood changed as he gains empathy?
The advice to fake character growth seems to have caused real character growth

I don't think that's a sad face, I think that's a "mildly confused but largely uninterested" face.

[Particle_Man]

Well if anyone can defuse the Hilgya/Durkon tension it will be Sigdi. But we shall see. It will be nice for her to see her grandchild - maybe she will even get to hold Kudzu.

[danielxcutter]

Well if anyone can defuse the Hilgya/Durkon tension it will be Sigdi. But we shall see. It will be nice for her to see her grandchild - maybe she will even get to hold Kudzu.

I think Sigdi would do a lot better at talking with Hilgya, personally, due to having more experience with, y'know, being a mom.

Also, I wonder if the soldier who gave her the chest of treasure was a Firehelm - he certainly looked like one, so maybe Hilgya's at least heard of Sigdi in passing. Maybe.

[Jay R]

Her bastard grandson.

Her only grandson.

[Basement Cat]

Given that Hilgya killed Durkon right after Resurrecting him Durkon's likely lost 2 Class levels. I hope that doesn't mean that he's lost the ability to Regenerate his mother's arm. :smalleek:



I'm not that experienced at D&D so I don't know the ins and outs of types of damage, so I'm gonna ask: what type of damage would Roy be taking from being mistaken for Elan?

I suspect he'd have to Save vs Stun.

[enh]

I started reading the "standard Mom fussing" panel, ran straight into Are ye getting enuff beer?, and tripped over all my preconceived expectations.

Thank you, Giant. I needed that laughter.

[danielxcutter]

Given that Hilgya killed Durkon right after Resurrecting him Durkon's likely lost 2 Class levels. I hope that doesn't mean that he's lost the ability to Regenerate his mother's arm. :smalleek:

Unlikely. Greg used Symbol of Death, which is an 8th-level spell for Clerics: therefore he had at least 15 levels. Regeneration, is a 7th, however, same as Resurrection, so he should be able to prepare and cast the spell later.

[Xel]

HA-HA! Of COURSE Durkon calls his mom every week! Of course he does! I keep on forgetting that, even if the OOTS world has yet to invent mass communication technology, Durkon is a Near-Epic level Cleric. He has access to communication methods beyond most people, is my point.

I’d be slightly surprised if there isn’t a rudimentary communications network already in place, although I can understand it not being MASS communications due to the level requirements. Bandwidth isn’t great, but there are excellent compression/encoding possibilities (create a custom language with extremely long words that encode complex meanings). I’d expect large organizations could have casters dedicated to just the daily sendings.

[danielxcutter]

I’d be slightly surprised if there isn’t a rudimentary communications network already in place, although I can understand it not being MASS communications due to the level requirements. Bandwidth isn’t great, but there are excellent compression/encoding possibilities (create a custom language with extremely long words that encode complex meanings). I’d expect large organizations could have casters dedicated to just the daily sendings.

There are also a number of magic items that let you use Sending or similar at will, I think, though I don't think they're Core.

[Yirggzmb]

I’d be slightly surprised if there isn’t a rudimentary communications network already in place, although I can understand it not being MASS communications due to the level requirements. Bandwidth isn’t great, but there are excellent compression/encoding possibilities (create a custom language with extremely long words that encode complex meanings). I’d expect large organizations could have casters dedicated to just the daily sendings.

I would legit read a story about just such a system. That sounds really cool.

[Peelee]

Unlikely. Greg used Symbol of Death, which is an 8th-level spell for Clerics: therefore he had at least 15 levels. Regeneration, is a 7th, however, same as Resurrection, so he should be able to prepare and cast the spell later.

If he lost no levels, correct. But he lost two levels by being rezzed twice. So if he was 15, he'd now be 13, and unable to cast Regeneration (or Resurrection, for whatever that's worth). my math sucks.

[Ironsmith]

So, apparently OOtS is in the same universe as Dwarf Fortress, what with beer being a vital part of nutrition and all...

Also, unintentional mom burns are the best kind of burn.

[danielxcutter]

So, apparently OOtS is in the same universe as Dwarf Fortress, what with beer being a vital part of nutrition and all...

Also, unintentional mom burns are the best kind of burn.

Nah, I'm pretty sure the "dwarves need beer" is mostly a multiversal constant.

And yes.

[Rogar Demonblud]

I figured out what the end of the strip reminded me of--Fell's Five, where they run into Khal's girlfriend.

"Oh, so this is the brain damaged halfling!"

"stabbitystabbitystabbity"

John Rofgers is a genius at dialogue.

[Ironsmith]

Nah, I'm pretty sure the "dwarves need beer" is mostly a multiversal constant.

I mean, I know that they like beer is a multiversal constant, but I can't think of many variants that explicitly require beer to function on a biological level (as opposed to just in the sense that an office secretary "needs" coffee).

[Spore]

Despite being entirely in character, Belkar's comment somewhat ruined the joke I am afraid.

[Dion]

Given that Hilgya killed Durkon right after Resurrecting him Durkon's likely lost 2 Class levels. I hope that doesn't mean that he's lost the ability to Regenerate his mother's arm. :smalleek:

The same arm that's still holding his father's hand in the afterlife, and is never going to let go?

Yeah, there's a pretty good chance Sigdi is more than happy with one arm.

[Necris Omega]

Huh, I guess Durkon never described his party members well enough for his mom to differentiate them on sight.

But, again, he's a cleric, not a bard, so those kinds of details probably wouldn't be a priority, especially with the limitations of Sending...



Hm. 25 words. I can only imagine the extended effect this could have on one's vocabulary. I don't know if it would make one obtusely brief, sacrificing "good grammar" for the purposes of brevity, or promote the use of the longest, most pompous words one could, if only to get the most out of the 25 words you get.

"Hello! My exemplary compatriots and I ebulliently defenestrated the contemptible mountebanks from atop their imperious fortification, extricating the beleaguered municipality from the authoritarian antidisestablismentarian regime!"

[Peelee]

The same arm that's still holding his father's hand in the afterlife, and is never going to let go?

Yeah, there's a pretty good chance Sigdi is more than happy with one arm.

You know the spell doesn't dissolve that arm, right? It'll still be holding on under all that rubble.

[The_Weirdo]

"Hello! My exemplary compatriots and I ebulliently defenestrated the contemptible mountebanks from atop their imperious fortification, extricating the beleaguered municipality from the authoritarian antidisestablismentarian regime!"

Easier version:

"Revolution!"

[Ironsmith]

Huh, I guess Durkon never described his party members well enough for his mom to differentiate them on sight.

But, again, he's a cleric, not a bard, so those kinds of details probably wouldn't be a priority, especially with the limitations of Sending...



Hm. 25 words. I can only imagine the extended effect this could have on one's vocabulary. I don't know if it would make one obtusely brief, sacrificing "good grammar" for the purposes of brevity, or promote the use of the longest, most pompous words one could, if only to get the most out of the 25 words you get.

"Hello! My exemplary compatriots and I ebulliently defenestrated the contemptible mountebanks from atop their imperious fortification, extricating the beleaguered municipality from the authoritarian antidisestablismentarian regime!"

Or, as has been joked about in a previous thread...

"HimomhowareyoudoingBelkarsbeingalittlecussagainbut heseemstobegettingbetterRoytellsmewe'regoingtoClif fportsoon...(entire letter in this manner)...Anyway, love ya, mum. Tell Uncle Squeaky I said hi."

[Nephrahim]

So wait, Did Greg send to Durkon's mom too? I assume not, since I assume it'd be obvious he was a vampire.

So she must have been worried! The last message she got was probably about the dangerous adventure he was about to go on!

[understatement]

So wait, Did Greg send to Durkon's mom too? I assume not, since I assume it'd be obvious he was a vampire.

So she must have been worried! The last message she got was probably about the dangerous adventure he was about to go on!

-heading into ziggurat to defend Gate. No way Team Evil and Linear Guild and Vector Legion show up and I get vamped for five years-

Has NONE of the Order, in (I think, two years?) of adventuring together, stumbled upon him Sending? That's some serious failed Spot checks.

[dtilque]

Assuming Durkon hasn't lost too many levels to cast Regeneration, he'll have to prepare it at dawn. Even if he still has some 7th level spells left, it's highly unlikely that Durkula would have prepared that spell.

I'm going to guess that he'll tell Sigdi about it beforehand and she'll outright forbid from him doing so, Her personality type doesn't like to accept that kind of thing, much like now she didn't want to accept the new dress (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1089.html). Oh, she'll have the excuse that Durkon will need the slot for a spell to fight the remaining vampires, but that won't be the real reason she doesn't want it.

[King of Nowhere]

Where is vaarsuvius in this strip? he was the one who could have benefited most from sending to family

[Xel]

There are also a number of magic items that let you use Sending or similar at will, I think, though I don't think they're Core.

Cool. I hadn't thought of increased usability with magic items. Something like the Azure City watchtower warning mechanisms, maybe? http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0370.html

Actually, now that I think about it, a crystal ball would probably work best for fixed routes. It's only one way, but you can simply have it scry on a single location at the message source, and just set parchments in that spot long enough to be copied by whoever is operating the item. Set up one at each location, and you have two-way communication. Teach simple scribes to copy efficiently, and you'll have bandwidth to spare.

Hmm. So how hard would it be to research a Mass form of Sending to simulate radio transmissions (broadcast-only for obvious reasons)?

[Jaxzan Proditor]

I've never gotten to play a real D&D game, but I'm a lot of fun at parties, so I'm sure it will translate.

I actually do think an OOTS podcast would be super interesting, although I may have over-promised myself on podcasts. Also, I moved recently for a job and should probably wait until I get my equipment back to record, although it doesn't matter too much for distance recording.

If that podcast ever becomes a real thing, you’ll have an eager backer. Heck, I’m pretty sure I’d listen to any content you and Peelee could produce.

[Belwynn]

Perhaps Sigdi and Hilgya may yet get along - Sigdi for the sake of Kudzu as many have referenced, and Hilgya for her respect of Sigdi's incendiary repartee. Or perhaps in finding a Dwarf that will not hold judgment over her, Hilgya will find an unexpected family bond.

Or things will go sideways and someone will roll initiative - but I doubt it.

[MReav]

And so, we see more of why V's relationship failed.

I doubt V used Sending to talk with their mate or their children.

[Aquillion]

And so, we see more of why V's relationship failed.

I doubt V used Sending to talk with their mate or their children.Heck, V is a wizard. If they cared enough to do so, they could have set up a Telepathic Bond with their spouse and made it permanent with Permanency.

[Anarion]

I'm enjoying the way that beer is health food to dwarves. Also the image of Durkon and his Mom hugging is very sweet.

[Paleomancer]

I feel a showdown between Hilgya and Sigdi is coming up :smalleek:... their contrasting viewpoints and probable alignments nicely complement the situation with Elan's parents. It would be nice to see Durkon
and Hilgya actually come to some mutual understanding for the sake of their child, in contrast to the warped Solomon-like "split the baby" thing that happened with Elan and Nale :smallfrown:... But then, Hilgya seems the kind of character to learn absolutely nothing from her actions. So I guess we'll se, yes :smallwink:?


Heck, V is a wizard. If they cared enough to do so, they could have set up a Telepathic Bond with their spouse and made it permanent with Permanency.
To be fair, we have no way of knowing if V ever had the opportunity to procure a scroll of Telepathic Bond or Permanency. Certainly he's no cleric, gifted with a large set of spells at each spell level. Frankly, the same question comes up with Durkon and Sending. Surely he could have contacted someone he knew via Sending at any time, be it his mother, his extended family, or even a fellow member of the Church of Thor? After Hurak died, he conceivably could have petitioned the new High Priest for the right to eventually return, rather than relying on Paladin Mail (pun intended). After all, part of the hold the vampire had over him was the memory of being banished before he could even speak with his mother. A lot of the attendant drama goes away the instant he reaches level 7 and can send Sending home. I get the impression that as none of these characters are particularly optimized, a lot of seemingly obvious fixes for their problems simply never occur to them.

[NihhusHuotAliro]

A Sending is still only 25 words. That's not a lot of real dialogue, of life, of how-you-are-doing-and-who-you-are-around.

It's rather telling that, with such limited communication, that Sigdi can tell that "If I worried about all the things I don't worry about, I'd never stop worrying!" is something that Elan would say.

I must say that, before I scrolled down, I thought that that was an Elan line, too.

[factotum]

Btw. when in the comic was Durkon able to cast sending?


All of it. It's only a fourth level spell and I'm pretty sure Durkon has been 7th level or higher since the very first comic.

[danielxcutter]

All of it. It's only a fourth level spell and I'm pretty sure Durkon has been 7th level or higher since the very first comic.

About 10th level or so, I'm guessing; considering that he's been "exiled" for 20 years and the entire comic's only taken one or two, he's probably using that for a looooooong time.

[RMS Oceanic]

Also I assume that Durkon is meant "murder fer a decent pint" not "murder a decent pint".

Or wait, maybe he means murder as in drink savagely.

"I could murder a [foodstuff/drink]" is a common expression round here denoting intense desire for it.

[Steveio]

To be fair, we have no way of knowing if V ever had the opportunity to procure a scroll of Telepathic Bond or Permanency. Certainly he's no cleric, gifted with a large set of spells at each spell level. Frankly, the same question comes up with Durkon and Sending. Surely he could have contacted someone he knew via Sending at any time, be it his mother, his extended family, or even a fellow member of the Church of Thor? After Hurak died, he conceivably could have petitioned the new High Priest for the right to eventually return, rather than relying on Paladin Mail (pun intended). After all, part of the hold the vampire had over him was the memory of being banished before he could even speak with his mother. A lot of the attendant drama goes away the instant he reaches level 7 and can send Sending home. I get the impression that as none of these characters are particularly optimized, a lot of seemingly obvious fixes for their problems simply never occur to them.
You can't send to people you aren't familiar with. So even if Durkon knew Hurak was dead and Rubyrock had replaced him, nobody was able to tell him anything about her that differentiated her from every other dwarf. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0602.html) :smalltongue:

Or telepathically calling to the high priest of an entire religion to ask for something is poor form.

[Fyraltari]

That seems unlikely.

It's like having a son who is a catholic priest on a mission in a forest and when you talk to him once every week, never say: "Oh, the old pope is dead. We have a new pope."

Sure, sending is only 25 words, but for a priest of a god the death of the very high priest of that same god should be quite the big news.

Even more if Durkon said to his mom that it was the aforementioned high priest to cast him away (and I don't see a reason for him not saying that to her, too, but maybe this will be explained in the next strip.)

And yet, Dukon's letter (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0305.html) is written to Hurak, not Rubyrock.
"Just as ye said". So he did believe him to still be alive by then.

[Ciffo]

Loved the comic.

I must confess that in my old D&D game I made a cleric with a backstory very similar to Durkon's one and as soon as he hit 7th level, the first spell he used was a sending for his mother to know how she was. I'm now in some manner impressed that my RP was so similiar to what Durkon did. :smallbiggrin:

[Svata]

Oh. Right. It's only been a week or so in-universe.

[lleffe]

i can't understand how you can write a better comics every issue

[Dr.Zero]

And yet, Dukon's letter (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0305.html) is written to Hurak, not Rubyrock.
"Just as ye said". So he did believe him to still be alive by then.

Eh, then I suppose one of the next strip this will be explained.

[mjasghar]

Also I assume that Durkon is meant "murder fer a decent pint" not "murder a decent pint".

Or wait, maybe he means murder as in drink savagely.
Yes that’s the meaning - desperate for a pint - probably from a shortening of ‘murder for a’
Usually said when reminded of whatever food/drink/entertainment

[hamishspence]

And parodied in a Horrible Histories book (I think Terrible Tudors), with "cereal killer" saying "I could murder a bowl of cornflakes".

[Goblin_Priest]

"Last week"

Reminding us how ridiculously little time has passed after all this time. XD

[Toper]

It's like having a son who is a catholic priest on a mission in a forest and when you talk to him once every week, never say: "Oh, the old pope is dead. We have a new pope."
It does seem weird! Maybe Durkon didn't enjoy chatting about the church that had essentially banished him, and so his mom got out of the habit of sharing any news about it at all. Or maybe he only gained enough levels to cast Sending in the last year or two, by which time Hurak's death was old news that Sigdi didn't think to mention.

[Keltest]

Or maybe she did tell him, and he simply assumed Rubyrock would carry on the same deal as Hurak, and so didn't want to bother her about it, especially if she's busy settling into her new role.

[Kish]

Remember, each of them was limited to 25 words per Sending.

[Larre Gannd]

Remember, each of them was limited to 25 words per Sending.

Maybe Durkon just wanted to chat about nice things, as opposed to speaking ill of high priests.

[zimmerwald1915]

Or maybe she did tell him, and he simply assumed Rubyrock would carry on the same deal as Hurak, and so didn't want to bother her about it, especially if she's busy settling into her new role.
She didn't tell him - he addressed his letter to Hurak, which is what sparked this whole avenue of discussion.

But maybe Sigdi didn't attach any importance to who was leading the Church o'Thor, and assumed Rubyrock would carry on like Hurak.

Incidentally, is Rubyrock a surname? Its construction sounds like other dwarf surnames we've heard, and not like any first names.

[Ruck]

Or maybe she did tell him, and he simply assumed Rubyrock would carry on the same deal as Hurak, and so didn't want to bother her about it, especially if she's busy settling into her new role.

Durkon addressed his letter to Hurak (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0305.html) three years after he died. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0375.html)

My guess would be that with the limitations of Sending, Sigdi didn't have space to catch Durkon up on church matters. Any time left to talk beyond how each other is doing would probably be used on the rest of the family.


Incidentally, is Rubyrock a surname? Its construction sounds like other dwarf surnames we've heard, and not like any first names.

It does indeed. No idea if Hurak was also a surname (it certainly sounds more like a given name when compared to others), or if the current acolytes just feel it more appropriate to refer to the High Priest by last name. (That's how we learned Rubyrock's name (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1094.html), after all. And they refer to Firuk Blackore as Brewmaster Blackore (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1096.html).)

Edit: While researching this I learned something else:

When Hurak tells Blackore what he's done, Blackore responds "Ye've doomed us all!" When he learns Durkon has returned in #1095, he curses Hurak and says "'e's damned us all!!" I was really hoping it would be a direct callback. Oh well.

[Cryos]

PAHAHAHAHAHAHA! OK that last panel made me legitimately laugh, good job.

[Seward]

Entertaining as it would be to see Durkon's mom, Kudzu and H interact, it's entirely likely H will not enter Thor's temple or expose her kid to its moral dangers, so it might not come up.

[GreatWyrmGold]

On one hand, I'd like to see Durkon's mom misidentify the rest of the party. On the other hand, I'm sure everyone's race and gender has been mentioned at some point, so unless she fails to notice that V's ears are pointy and Haley's aren't, there's not much room for that.

[Paleomancer]

You can't send to people you aren't familiar with. So even if Durkon knew Hurak was dead and Rubyrock had replaced him, nobody was able to tell him anything about her that differentiated her from every other dwarf. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0602.html) :smalltongue:.
Actually, I was aware of Sending's restrictions :smallamused:. But a useful rule of thumb here comes from Tort law, where actions should be judged on the basis of "you either knew or should have known." If Durkon can talk to his mother, what's stopping him from using one or more Sendings from asking her or another dwarf in the hierarchy to help him :smallconfused:? Especially when the written message he sent obviously never got through - I get he would have been distracted by the battle, but why not Send while sailing with the Azure Refugees? He used at four Sendings in a day with an imprisoned Roy, so it was hardly something he couldn't have tried. Most likely, it simply didn't occur to him to do so. My point was simply that while V is at fault for a lot, arguing that he should have used a munchkin spell combination (One that isn't obvious in the book and which I first encountered on an online list of player tricks hated by DMs, no less) is unreasonable given Durkon conceivably could have used Sending to bypass a lot of drama in his storyline from the start. Obviously, V, like Durkon, may not have even realized a permanent telepathic bond was a possibility, and as characters seemingly designed to be non-optimal (blaster wizard, healbot cleric) who are only now starting to break free from those molds, that's not really surprising :smallcool:.


Or telepathically calling to the high priest of an entire religion to ask for something is poor form.
If you cannot talk to the highest mortal authority and representative of your order, over a top-secret matter only you, he, and handful of others know, who can you talk to :smallwink:?


Durkon addressed his letter to Hurak (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0305.html) three years after he died. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0375.html)

My guess would be that with the limitations of Sending, Sigdi didn't have space to catch Durkon up on church matters. Any time left to talk beyond how each other is doing would probably be used on the rest of the family.
Ah, but that's where multiple Sendings come in :smallamused::
http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0733.html
It will be interesting to note how long Durkon has been in contact with his mother, and whether he just decided "screw it, I'm calling Mum," after not doing so for far too long, or if he's been doing it semi-regularly over the comic's duration.

[Ruck]

Ah, but that's where multiple Sendings come in :smallamused::
http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0733.html

I was well aware of the four Sendings prepared; I stand by my statement.

[eilandesq]

I feel a showdown between Hilgya and Sigdi is coming up :smalleek:... their contrasting viewpoints and probable alignments nicely complement the situation with Elan's parents. It would be nice to see Durkon
and Hilgya actually come to some mutual understanding for the sake of their child, in contrast to the warped Solomon-like "split the baby" thing that happened with Elan and Nale :smallfrown:... But then, Hilgya seems the kind of character to learn absolutely nothing from her actions. So I guess we'll se, yes :smallwink:?


To be fair, we have no way of knowing if V ever had the opportunity to procure a scroll of Telepathic Bond or Permanency. Certainly he's no cleric, gifted with a large set of spells at each spell level. Frankly, the same question comes up with Durkon and Sending. Surely he could have contacted someone he knew via Sending at any time, be it his mother, his extended family, or even a fellow member of the Church of Thor? After Hurak died, he conceivably could have petitioned the new High Priest for the right to eventually return, rather than relying on Paladin Mail (pun intended). After all, part of the hold the vampire had over him was the memory of being banished before he could even speak with his mother. A lot of the attendant drama goes away the instant he reaches level 7 and can send Sending home. I get the impression that as none of these characters are particularly optimized, a lot of seemingly obvious fixes for their problems simply never occur to them.

A scroll of Sending costs 700 GP--that's a pretty large expenditure for a sixth level or lower PC. I'd be willing to bet that he saved up for one scroll, sent a message to let Sigdi know he was alive and would check back when able, then started memorizing the spell regularly once he hit seventh level (which would cost him nothing but spell slots, since the material component could be handled by a component pouch).


http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/scrolls.htm

[Jasdoif]

My guess would be that with the limitations of Sending, Sigdi didn't have space to catch Durkon up on church matters.Yeah. With the limited volume of back-and-forth each time, everything Sigdi says has the opportunity cost of her not saying something else.

[Paleomancer]

I was well aware of the four Sendings prepared; I stand by my statement.

Fair enough :smallconfused:, but I also stand by mine, that the only thing stopping Durkon from a perfectly valid, in-comic precedent for using Sending to communicate complex plans, is Durkon himself - be it how many Sendings he prepared, how efficiently he uses the word limit, and figuring out who he can contact. Since contact with home was evidently not forbiddenonly access to the right spell slots would be the problem. Since we know for certain he has prepared it up to four times on at least one occasion, and twice on another, clearly this is something he feels comfortable in using a lot of fourth+ level spell slots.

Moreover, for those months he was at sea, he could easily have been in contact with his mother... we don't know right now when he first contacted her and for how long they have been in correspondence. Potentially plenty of time to catch up, and as I am someone who has ridiculously devout relatives, the status of even minor religious events, let along the death of a major religious figure, is a very real subject of concern to the devout (as Durkon is), and something people will arrange time to discuss alongside more intimate family concerns. To argue it makes no sense logically he would care to ask is in fact wrong - it is perfectly realistic for a religious individual to care about their faith's hierarchy, especially if they are or were part of it at one point. Now it could be that Durkon himself wouldn't care to know or ask, depending on his personal feelings... but none of us know now how he would rank that - after all, he would have exiled himself if Hurak had simply told him the truth from the start.

Your point about the 25 word length is a reasonable mechanical concern and on its face could be a significant obstacle, but Durkon is still smart enough to think of a solution to that limit, provided it occurred to him that he needed to overcome it. Multiple Sendings for a kind of magical instant messaging could easily be one such method. Maybe it never occurred to him to ask, maybe he took the lack of a response to his letter as a implicit rejection and he moved on, or in-story real life just took over and he put his own concerns aside to help the greater good (as our stuffy little dwarf is wont to do :smallwink:).

[Ironsmith]

On one hand, I'd like to see Durkon's mom misidentify the rest of the party. On the other hand, I'm sure everyone's race and gender has been mentioned at some point, so unless she fails to notice that V's ears are pointy and Haley's aren't, there's not much room for that.

"Ah, so you're Belkar? You're a lot taller than I expected."

:vaarsuvius: : :smallannoyed:
:belkar: : :smallbiggrin:

[Dion]

You know the spell doesn't dissolve that arm, right? It'll still be holding on under all that rubble.

For all we know Tenrin is holding her hand in Valhalla, the same way Roy’s grandpa held his sword in the afterlife.

And, in those circumstance, I actually would expect it to dissolve in Valhalla if it’s regenerated here.

[TheNecrocomicon]

I feel a showdown between Hilgya and Sigdi is coming up :smalleek:... their contrasting viewpoints and probable alignments nicely complement the situation with Elan's parents. It would be nice to see Durkon and Hilgya actually come to some mutual understanding for the sake of their child, in contrast to the warped Solomon-like "split the baby" thing that happened with Elan and Nale :smallfrown:... But then, Hilgya seems the kind of character to learn absolutely nothing from her actions. So I guess we'll see, yes :smallwink:?

This. I too am getting an "it's quiet, too quiet" sense.

It seems like the final battle against the ex-Exarch and his spawn should be straightforward enough, especially since Lurkon the vampire was probably more powerful than any of the vampires under his control. But, as such, convention in this comic dictates that it will all go straight to Hel in a handbasket as soon as things get going (again).

So what form could that take? Seems like the first likely point of complication is Hilgya encountering Sigdi. Sigdi might end up saying something to Hilgya that Hilgya interprets as scolding or talking-down to her. Hilgya still has a hair-trigger temper, minimal self-control, no tolerance for criticism, and an enduring desire to cause pain to Durkon -- up to and including casual murder.

Further down the line, I fully expect the ex-Exarch to have a lengthy list of backup plans for when he and his associated spawn face off with the Order over the Council vote. Maybe he's already Dominating some or all of the Council members on their way to Firmament. Maybe he's already entrenched somewhere with layer upon layer of traps just waiting for the Order to walk into them. Maybe drama will warp probability again and most of the Order & Co. will promptly lose saving throws that they should have made against nasty debilitating effects.

The book is clearly far from over, and the arc they all seem to invariably take is that things get even more ridiculously perilous right up until the end.

[pendell]

While this is a heartwarming scene, I'm afraid it fills me with dread. Bringing Durkon's mother and his old friends on-panel means there's a potential for them to be killed. With Hilgya and Minrah still outstanding, I expect a house cleaning of some of these minor characters. :(

Respectfully,

Brian P.

[Keltest]

While this is a heartwarming scene, I'm afraid it fills me with dread. Bringing Durkon's mother and his old friends on-panel means there's a potential for them to be killed. With Hilgya and Minrah still outstanding, I expect a house cleaning of some of these minor characters. :(

Respectfully,

Brian P.

The climax of the story has already happened. At this point, I think theyre pretty safe.

[Rrmcklin]

We saw Hilgya still walking with the Order last strip. Just because we didn't see her in this one doesn't mean she's left.

[B. Dandelion]

Forget Hurak. What's weird is that if you take 305 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0305.html) and 375 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0375.html) at face value, Sigdi never told Durkon that his grandfather had died.

[The_Weirdo]

If Hilgya kills Sigdi, I'll admit Hilgya as Evil, but I will still defend her bankrupting her family as a Chaotic Neutral act.

There. You can quote me on that and I will admit it.

[Pablo360]

If Durkon could murder fer a decent pint, he would list the sizes in descending order, as murdering for a smaller amount is more intense. Durkon could murder a decent pint as in he could down it very quickly and eagerly; thus he lists sizes in ascending order.

[Peelee]

For all we know Tenrin is holding her hand in Valhalla, the same way Roy’s grandpa held his sword in the afterlife.

And, in those circumstance, I actually would expect it to dissolve in Valhalla if it’s regenerated here.

Odd expectation, since we know belief is what matters there (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0498.html).

[Psychronia]

I...can't believe I've never even thought of that.

...Huh.

Accidental Mom-Burn is definitely one of the top 5 worst burns to have.

[Ironsmith]

If Durkon could murder fer a decent pint, he would list the sizes in descending order, as murdering for a smaller amount is more intense. Durkon could murder a decent pint as in he could down it very quickly and eagerly; thus he lists sizes in ascending order.

Good means of resolving it in your head. Either way, the base message is the same: "beer, YES, please".

[Ruck]

The book is clearly far from over

Odd statement given the climax has already happened and we're over 200 strips into the current book.


Forget Hurak. What's weird is that if you take 305 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0305.html) and 375 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0375.html) at face value, Sigdi never told Durkon that his grandfather had died.

Eh, Sigdi could have told Durkon, and Rubyrock just didn't know that.


Odd expectation, since we know belief is what matters there (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0498.html).

I like the thought of Tenrin just carrying Sigdi's arm around in Valhalla because he believes it belongs to him now.

[Peelee]

I like the thought of Tenrin just carrying Sigdi's arm around in Valhalla because he believes it belongs to him now.

Yeah, I kind of wanted to address that but it seemed kind of weirdly macabre.

[Dion]

Yeah, I kind of wanted to address that but it seemed kind of weirdly macabre.

In my own personal head cannon, the only reason Durkon didn’t get to meet his dad is because The Giant couldn’t figure out how to draw Sigdi holding his hand.

[Fyraltari]

Eh, Sigdi could have told Durkon, and Rubyrock just didn't know that.

But the Durkon wouldn't say he wanted to see his Ma and grandpappy like that.

[Ruck]

But the Durkon wouldn't say he wanted to see his Ma and grandpappy like that.

Ahh, I guess I should have read closer before answering.

[Snails]

"Ah, so you're Belkar? You're a lot taller than I expected."

:vaarsuvius: : :smallannoyed:
:belkar: : :smallbiggrin:

That would actually be a bit of a burn, but Belkar would probably interpret as a compliment.

[Ironsmith]

That would actually be a bit of a burn, but Belkar would probably interpret as a compliment.

Nah, he knows he is/was a lil crap. He'd probably laugh harder than anyone.

[understatement]

Considering the other books ended shortly after the climax (1, 4, 5) or cliffhanger (2, 3) and the climax with Durkula is pretty much resolved, what are you guys' theories on how the book could wrap up?

(I'm thinking Lien and O-chul sitting on the snowbank, realizing that Team Evil hasn't left the dungeon in several hours -- cut to glimpses of the monster mess they left behind and trail them to standing before the final Gate. Since the ritual takes a few weeks, it's ample time for the Order reach Kraagor's.)

(Or, it could end with Durkon using one of his mama-special Sendings to RC, although I dunno about the latter's recognition the former).

And can the Order take out the Exarch and Co easily? Or will the same thing happen as it did in the previous vampire battle?

[Anitar]

And can the Order take out the Exarch and Co easily? Or will the same thing happen as it did in the previous vampire battle?

That depends, in part, on the important details about the council chamber that Durkon failed to tell them about.

[Basement Cat]

Considering the other books ended shortly after the climax (1, 4, 5) or cliffhanger (2, 3) and the climax with Durkula is pretty much resolved, what are you guys' theories on how the book could wrap up?

(I'm thinking Lien and O-chul sitting on the snowbank, realizing that Team Evil hasn't left the dungeon in several hours -- cut to glimpses of the monster mess they left behind and trail them to standing before the final Gate. Since the ritual takes a few weeks, it's ample time for the Order reach Kraagor's.)

(Or, it could end with Durkon using one of his mama-special Sendings to RC, although I dunno about the latter's recognition the former).

And can the Order take out the Exarch and Co easily? Or will the same thing happen as it did in the previous vampire battle?

I can't see this book ending before the threat to the Dwarven lands is settled. We have to see the Hilgya/Kudzu/Durkon/Mom thing dealt with. We need to see the Godsmoot threat of World destruction being dealt with one way or another: The vote will be decided, after all, once the dwarf Demi-god consults w/ the Elders and Chiefs (or whomever).

I figure after the Vote is dealt with we'll see a closing scene involving Xykon and troupe and maybe something involving Elan's plan to take down his father's Empire (possibly bringing in more of "Daddy's" old adventuring team who cannot be pleased with Malak's death) all leading up to the next book.

[factotum]

But the Durkon wouldn't say he wanted to see his Ma and grandpappy like that.

Barring unusual circumstances we've heard nothing about, Durkon would have two grandfathers, right? One could have died and the other still be alive.

[Fyraltari]

Barring unusual circumstances we've heard nothing about, Durkon would have two grandfathers, right? One could have died and the other still be alive.

I only see one (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1086.html).

[factotum]

You mean, on all those panels that very clearly don't show all the people present?

[Fyraltari]

You mean, on all those panels that very clearly don't show all the people present?

Another grandparent would be sitting next to Sigdi on the front row, no?

[BaronOfHell]

All of it. It's only a fourth level spell and I'm pretty sure Durkon has been 7th level or higher since the very first comic.

Thank you!

I wonder how long it took for Durkon to learn the spell after his exile. I imagine it did make things easier for him to endure from that point on, but on the other hand dwarves are sometimes very different from humans.

[Sloanzilla]

I've been trying to imagine some of Durkon's sendings at various points in the adventure.

"Ma, Roy died and Azure City fell. On boat with Elan and V. These paladins seem nice. Still no beer. Dodge training works on water trolls."

"Ma, cast windwalk and dinnae like it. Found Belkar, Hayley and Roy's body. Group back together now. Random 'Och" goes here. Love you."

[TheNecrocomicon]

Odd statement given the climax has already happened and we're over 200 strips into the current book.

Something we all assume is the climax has now happened. That's nothing truly conclusive. Family drama will probably ensue with Durkon, Sigdi, Hilgya and Kudzu; the ex-Exarch and his spawn still need to be defeated; the Council vote still needs to happen; the result still needs to be conveyed to the Godsmoot which then needs to wrap up; probably another late-book sojourn (like Haley breaking her dad out of prison in the last book); some "oh crap"-level cliffhanger regarding Team Evil, etc. -- I'm easily seeing another couple of years IRL until the book ends.


Considering the other books ended shortly after the climax (1, 4, 5) or cliffhanger (2, 3) and the climax with Durkula is pretty much resolved, what are you guys' theories on how the book could wrap up? [...] And can the Order take out the Exarch and Co easily? Or will the same thing happen as it did in the previous vampire battle?


That depends, in part, on the important details about the council chamber that Durkon failed to tell them about.

This. The Order haven't really conclusively solved any of the issues that led to them getting dominated by Lurkon et al. just a short time ago. I mean, yes, they have Durkon himself back, but he's now diminished thanks to Hilgya's selfishness. The ex-Exarch might even now outdo Durkon for power in combat, since the former still has all his levels and the various boons of being a vampire.


I can't see this book ending before the threat to the Dwarven lands is settled. We have to see the Hilgya/Kudzu/Durkon/Mom thing dealt with. We need to see the Godsmoot threat of World destruction being dealt with one way or another: The vote will be decided, after all, once the dwarf Demi-god consults w/ the Elders and Chiefs (or whomever).

I figure after the Vote is dealt with we'll see a closing scene involving Xykon and troupe and maybe something involving Elan's plan to take down his father's Empire (possibly bringing in more of "Daddy's" old adventuring team who cannot be pleased with Malak's death) all leading up to the next book.

Oh, and there's the not-so-small matter of Belkar's prophesied cessation of breathing forever "before the end of the year" -- though considering that the last week in-universe took something like six years IRL, that may or may not end up in this book at all.

[Verappo]

I've been trying to imagine some of Durkon's sendings at various points in the adventure.

"Ma, Roy died and Azure City fell. On boat with Elan and V. These paladins seem nice. Still no beer. Dodge training works on water trolls."

"Ma, cast windwalk and dinnae like it. Found Belkar, Hayley and Roy's body. Group back together now. Random 'Och" goes here. Love you."

Recapping more than a thousand comic strips of plot in 25 words-long weekly excerpts takes skill, Durkon might have a future as a writer of book cover blurbs if everything goes wrong with the Thor thing.

Oh wow now I'm thinking what his last message before Malack killed him was:

"Ma, we met Elan's long-lost dad in the western continent. Roy fought in a coliseum. Oh, also I made a new friend! Love you.":smallfrown:

[anonynos]

Another grandparent would be sitting next to Sigdi on the front row, no?

Maybe! I mean, the rest of that row seems to be priests so it may be they only make room for the "parents" but since his dad was dead they allowed one other person there. There is very clearly another elderly relative a few rows back so it's hard to know honestly.

[Fyraltari]

Maybe! I mean, the rest of that row seems to be priests so it may be they only make room for the "parents" but since his dad was dead they allowed one other person there. There is very clearly another elderly relative a few rows back so it's hard to know honestly.

You mean (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1086.html) Uncle (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1088.html) Kandro (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1128.html)?

He and Durkon aren't actually related.

[Ruck]

Something we all assume is the climax has now happened.

The main character of the book defeating the main villain of the book is generally a pretty solid event to surmise as the climax. You, on the other hand, simply asserted that the book was "clearly far from over."


That's nothing truly conclusive. Family drama will probably ensue with Durkon, Sigdi, Hilgya and Kudzu; the ex-Exarch and his spawn still need to be defeated; the Council vote still needs to happen; the result still needs to be conveyed to the Godsmoot which then needs to wrap up; probably another late-book sojourn (like Haley breaking her dad out of prison in the last book); some "oh crap"-level cliffhanger regarding Team Evil, etc. -- I'm easily seeing another couple of years IRL until the book ends.

That could all happen in like 20 strips, and some of it doesn't need to be shown. (For example, if/when the Order defeats the Ex-Exarch and the Dwarven Council of Clans votes to save the world, we're probably not going to cut to the godsmoot and get their wrap-it-up procedure.)


Oh, and there's the not-so-small matter of Belkar's prophesied cessation of breathing forever "before the end of the year" -- though considering that the last week in-universe took something like six years IRL, that may or may not end up in this book at all.

I'll bet a substantial amount of money that doesn't happen this book.

[Jaxzan Proditor]

That could all happen in like 20 strips, and some of it doesn't need to be shown. (For example, if/when the Order defeats the Ex-Exarch and the Dwarven Council of Clans votes to save the world, we're probably not going to cut to the godsmoot and get their wrap-it-up procedure.)

I agree with you that I think most of the wrap up would happen pretty quickly, but I actually think that would we will see the Godsmoot at least one more time, at the very least to see the last vote go through and maybe get a little closure from Veldrina.

[Jasdoif]

I agree with you that I think most of the wrap up would happen pretty quickly, but I actually think that would we will see the Godsmoot at least one more time, at the very least to see the last vote go through and maybe get a little closure from Veldrina.Veldrina's supposed to contact Roy if the world is saved spared (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1023.html), so I'm not so sure we'll see the Godsmoot's wrap-up on-panel.

[GreatWyrmGold]

I can't imagine Sigdi knows about Durkon's "dwarf-on-dwarf action" from back in the day, or that she will approve of it once she finds out.
I'd imagine she'd mostly be annoyed Durkon didn't follow up and make sure Hilgya was fine. And that he didn't tell her about the potential grandbaby because he was embarrassed over a little one-night stand.



"vs."? Hilgya is about to introduce Sigdi to her grandson.
Yeah, but do you think Sigdi is going to be thrilled that her grandson is going to be in the custody of a cleric of Loki who doesn't want to see her son? Sigdi's definitely going to want custody. Where are the lawyers when you need them..?
(I joke, I joke)



I think Sigdi would do a lot better at talking with Hilgya, personally, due to having more experience with, y'know, being a mom.
Also, less baggage.


Also, I wonder if the soldier who gave her the chest of treasure was a Firehelm - he certainly looked like one, so maybe Hilgya's at least heard of Sigdi in passing. Maybe.
Ooh, that would be neat. It does make me wonder if the clan Hilgya was married into is one we'll hear from again, though...



So what form could that take? Seems like the first likely point of complication is Hilgya encountering Sigdi. Sigdi might end up saying something to Hilgya that Hilgya interprets as scolding or talking-down to her. Hilgya still has a hair-trigger temper, minimal self-control, no tolerance for criticism, and an enduring desire to cause pain to Durkon -- up to and including casual murder.
Hilgya isn't pissed enough at Durkon to let the murder stick, though. There's no way she'd murder Sigdi just to hurt Durkon; if that was a possibility, she would have just left him dead.
I don't see Sigdi-murder as being likely, but if it happens, it'll be largely her own fault.



In case there was any question that Durkon has the strongest good alignment in the party, he's the only one to actually make an attempt to call his mother.
Roy and Haley don't have easy access to their mothers (neither has speak with dead or their parents' corpse handy), and Elan is probably holding off in case he'd accidentally spoil some kind of dramatic reveal.



Where is vaarsuvius in this strip? he was the one who could have benefited most from sending to family
What, you want to rub their face in it? Geez, and I thought the King of Nowhere seemed like a decent guy.



Maybe Durkon just wanted to chat about nice things, as opposed to speaking ill of high priests.
Seems likely to me. It fits Sigdi's personality well, and explains why Durkon hadn't heard of several sad things that happened.



For all we know Tenrin is holding her hand in Valhalla, the same way Roy’s grandpa held his sword in the afterlife.

And, in those circumstance, I actually would expect it to dissolve in Valhalla if it’s regenerated here.
Why? Greenhilt Senior's sword didn't dissolve when Roy grabbed it. Tenrin and Sigdi are still going to be thinking of Sigdi's first arm, still holding Tenrin's hand.
...Also, I'm pretty sure the Powers That Be of the LG afterlife would frown on people carrying around severed limbs.



What are the different rings made of in the council chamber? Will we find out before the encounter, or will Rich wait to tell us the effects?
I suspect that they're made of grumpy old dwarves, each with their own set of rules. Magic items in use don't seem like a first-thing-to-explain type of thing.



...and maybe something involving Elan's plan to take down his father's Empire (possibly bringing in more of "Daddy's" old adventuring team who cannot be pleased with Malak's death)...
1. Half of Tarquin's surviving team saw Tarquin take vengeance on Nale himself.
2. That storyline's wrapped up. A climactic confrontation between father and son (or their respective teams) is exactly what Tarquin wants, and what he was explicitly denied the last time we saw him.



The main character of the book defeating the main villain of the book is generally a pretty solid event to surmise as the climax. You, on the other hand, simply asserted that the book was "clearly far from over."
Durkon* wasn't defeated, he was just destroyed. He won't be defeated until his plan is foiled.
...And that's assuming that Durkon*, not Hel, is the "real" main villain of the book.



Oh gosh. Please don’t start that again, my mind can’t take it.
Well, since you asked...
I'd guess that he wouldn't want to break up an established relationship. If he hasn't heard of V's divorce, they'd probably be even lower than Belkar.



I'd like to point out that the hate/lust proto brain wasn't an established fact, but a theory set out by an intellectual elitist wanting to belittle someone's mental capacity because, when drunk, he kissed them.
An excellent point. While there wasn't any evidence against the proto-brain argument at the time, Belkar's development since then has established several other possible emotional responses. Either Belkar spent several ability increases on his mental stats, or Vaarsuvius was making their theory with insufficient evidence.
...Though given that it was an attempt to make sure Belkar didn't kiss them again, I don't blame them much for acting rashly.



Nah, I'm pretty sure the "dwarves need beer" is mostly a multiversal constant.
Most things about dwarves are. (https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/OurDwarvesAreAllTheSame)



i can't understand how you can write a better comics every issue
He's probably putting levels into some obscure comic-related prestige class.



Nah, he knows he is/was a lil crap. He'd probably laugh harder than anyone.
Especially if V's told them about the familicide...

[Kish]

What, you want to rub their face in it? Geez, and I thought the King of Nowhere seemed like a decent guy.

The assassins would debate that, but whether he is or not, this is the King of Nowere--the ruler of a domain defined
by its genocidal policies toward therianthropes.

[Riftwolf]

An excellent point. While there wasn't any evidence against the proto-brain argument at the time, Belkar's development since then has established several other possible emotional responses. Either Belkar spent several ability increases on his mental stats, or Vaarsuvius was making their theory with insufficient evidence.
...Though given that it was an attempt to make sure Belkar didn't kiss them again, I don't blame them much for acting rashly.

I'm going with the second. V came up with an explanation of an awkward social situation they could resolve using spells over interaction, because there's no point attempting interaction with people stupider than you.
(Before I get accused of joining the V-Hate Wagon, I'll say *both* characters have changed since then. In that the pair of them actually held a conversation in this book which wasn't based around V outwitting Belkar.)

[GreatWyrmGold]

I'm going with the second. V came up with an explanation of an awkward social situation they could resolve using spells over interaction, because there's no point attempting interaction with people stupider than you.
Fair enough. Though I think her mid-conclusion ("At this point, there is no point attempting interaction with Belkar, specifically") was valid, even if the logic before and after was flawed.

[diplomancer]

it is very bad pacing to have the confrontation with the Exarch be just a mop-up operation of no importance, it drags out the story unnecessarily. Which means that the climax hasn't passed yet.

In book 5, the climax was not the pyramid, or even destroying the gate, but the confrontation with Tarquin afterwards.

Which makes me think that the confrontation with thr exarch will be far more difficult than expected. As the only thing that can make that happen is a betrayal by Hilgya (possibly with a timeout from the fiends for V), Im guessing that is what will happen.

[JumboWheat01]

I've been trying to imagine some of Durkon's sendings at various points in the adventure.

"Ma, Roy died and Azure City fell. On boat with Elan and V. These paladins seem nice. Still no beer. Dodge training works on water trolls."

"Ma, cast windwalk and dinnae like it. Found Belkar, Hayley and Roy's body. Group back together now. Random 'Och" goes here. Love you."


Recapping more than a thousand comic strips of plot in 25 words-long weekly excerpts takes skill, Durkon might have a future as a writer of book cover blurbs if everything goes wrong with the Thor thing.

Oh wow now I'm thinking what his last message before Malack killed him was:

"Ma, we met Elan's long-lost dad in the western continent. Roy fought in a coliseum. Oh, also I made a new friend! Love you.":smallfrown:

And now I suddenly have a desire for the Giant to write a lil' minibook full of nothing but Durkon's weekly Sendings to his mum.

[TheNecrocomicon]

The main character of the book defeating the main villain of the book is generally a pretty solid event to surmise as the climax. You, on the other hand, simply asserted that the book was "clearly far from over."

That could all happen in like 20 strips, and some of it doesn't need to be shown. (For example, if/when the Order defeats the Ex-Exarch and the Dwarven Council of Clans votes to save the world, we're probably not going to cut to the godsmoot and get their wrap-it-up procedure.)

Need I remind you of other works of modern fantasy like The Hobbit, where the big primary villain of the story (Smaug) got shot dead well before the true climax of the story (The Battle of Five Armies). And there was still plenty of getting home and sorting things out afterwards as well.

The Ex-Exarch is still a devout servant of Hel -- probably her single most powerful one now, with Lurkon destroyed -- and will still be gunning for the dwarven Council, putting him and his spawn on an inevitable collision course with the Order, since no one else really has the power to stop them. There's no way that fight goes cleanly.

There's also family drama between Durkon, Sigdi and Hilgya to sort out over Kudzu, and I'd imagine that this will not end up resolved with a quick "meh" when all involved are determined to get their own way. Durkon's not going to let it go, when he made it part of his reason for (re)being that he has to go back and do right for his son. Sigdi will want a safer upbringing for her grandson, either just out of maternal concern or "I'm not losing another family member again". Hilgya will want to do what she wants, up to and including casual murder, because f*** everybody else.

The Council still has to convene and actually vote, and even if all we get from the Godsmoot is a Sending from Veldrina, it seems extremely likely to me that there will be some reaction from at least the Northern Gods wrapping up their immediate conflict over the fate of the world. And then whatever "oh crap" cliffhanger is going to hook us into the next book.

There are plenty of ways that the remainder of this book could still see the proverbial s*** hitting the fan, and Mr. Burlew certainly seems to have a knack for playing those out, regardless of our expectations. I do not trust that the book is truly over until he explicitly says it is and presumably takes a hiatus to tackle other stuff for a bit.

[Seward]

I think it is entirely possible that the final defeat of the vampires will either be a curbstomp or maybe even off-camera. The social dynamics with Durkon's family and his return could be the focus of the post-climax winddown of this bok.

Or it could be totally epic dwarfing the other two big battles (Roy vs Greg, Everybody vs all the Vamp Clerics).

Depends where Rich wants to aim the camera. Frankly I wouldn't mind a nice curb-stomp for the Order now that the band is back together. They get so few clean victories. And some XP so a few more could level up wouldn't hurt. Haley's getting lonely by herself at level 16.

[Ironsmith]

I'd imagine she'd mostly be annoyed Durkon didn't follow up and make sure Hilgya was fine. And that he didn't tell her about the potential grandbaby because he was embarrassed over a little one-night stand.


Maybe she'd react that way at first, but I can't see her responding to Hylgia's murder-quest with anything better than "Well that's just uncalled-for".


Yeah, but do you think Sigdi is going to be thrilled that her grandson is going to be in the custody of a cleric of Loki who doesn't want to see her son? Sigdi's definitely going to want custody. Where are the lawyers when you need them..?
(I joke, I joke)

You joke, but if there's one person in the comic who'll have a stronger reaction to child endangerment in the comic, for the life of me, I can't imagine who it would be.



Hilgya isn't pissed enough at Durkon to let the murder stick, though. There's no way she'd murder Sigdi just to hurt Durkon; if that was a possibility, she would have just left him dead.
I don't see Sigdi-murder as being likely, but if it happens, it'll be largely her own fault.


I can see the two of them getting along just fine at first, up until Hylgia drops something along the lines of "I can't believe your kid grew up to be such a jerk", or reveals her warped worldview in some other way. Kinda like how she and Durkon originally got on.



Roy and Haley don't have easy access to their mothers (neither has speak with dead or their parents' corpse handy), and Elan is probably holding off in case he'd accidentally spoil some kind of dramatic reveal.


Hell, Eugene even made a joke along those lines in an early strip.


Why? Greenhilt Senior's sword didn't dissolve when Roy grabbed it. Tenrin and Sigdi are still going to be thinking of Sigdi's first arm, still holding Tenrin's hand.
...Also, I'm pretty sure the Powers That Be of the LG afterlife would frown on people carrying around severed limbs.


Tenrin himself probably wouldn't be too thrilled, either... not to mention, it probably wouldn't be her whole arm anyway, since, you know, cave-in... it's not gonna be a clean cut. What I imagine is that it'll be more of a tactile thing... if he closes his hand and squeezes, he can feel Sigdi holding on.


I suspect that they're made of grumpy old dwarves, each with their own set of rules. Magic items in use don't seem like a first-thing-to-explain type of thing.

Cue eight panels of Roy facepalming.



He's probably putting levels into some obscure comic-related prestige class.


Or just gaining levels in Bard, along with sinking skill points into Craft(Webcomic).


Especially if V's told them about the familicide...

Given Belkar's new sense of empathy, that might swing back around into "Dude, not funny!" territory.

[Peelee]

Need I remind you of other works of modern fantasy like The Hobbit, where the big primary villain of the story (Smaug) got shot dead well before the true climax of the story (The Battle of Five Armies).
Wheeeeeee!

de·noue·ment
dāno͞oˈmäN
noun
the final part of a play, movie, or narrative in which the strands of the plot are drawn together and matters are explained or resolved.

[zimmerwald1915]

Which makes me think that the confrontation with thr exarch will be far more difficult than expected. As the only thing that can make that happen is a betrayal by Hilgya (possibly with a timeout from the fiends for V), Im guessing that is what will happen.
Why would the fiends time Vaarsuvius out here? Their plan involves the Gates, which will no longer exist if the world is destroyed - and they can't even be planning to try again with the new world, because their memories would be wiped. It is in their interest that the Council of Clans vote not to destroy the world.

As for weakening the Order, Durkon is substantially "tapped out" on spells - not only from all the spellcasting he did as a vampire, and not only from losing two levels, but also because raise dead has a 50% chance of expending each remaining prepared spells. Vaarsuvius was level-drained twice, and that combined with her spellcasting has cost her all her eighth-level and all but two of her seventh-level spells. All that needs to happen is that the Order's timetable be advanced to before dawn by something.

[Hekko]

So one sending was supposed to be for Sigdi. Who were the other three for?

I'm guessing one for Hinjo, one for Serini and one in case they need it.

Are people actually able to fit a call to their mothers in 25 words each? We usually go over ten minutes minimum...

[zimmerwald1915]

Wheeeeeee!
The time before the burning of Lake-Town and the Battle of Five Armies was not denoument, because Smaug was not the point of the story. The point of the story was Bilbo's journey, which culminated in his theft and delivery of the Arkenstone.

The bit with retracing his steps and finding Bag-End occupied by his relatives - that's denoument.

[Peelee]

Are people actually able to fit a call to their mothers in 25 words each? We usually go over ten minutes minimum...

If the call cost an equivalent of $280 dollars for 25 words back and forth if you needed someone else to make the call for you, I doubt it would last nearly so long. Of course it doesn't actually cost Durkon that, but it does have opportunity cost, which is harder to analogize.

The time before the burning of Lake-Town and the Battle of Five Armies was not denoument, because Smaug was not the point of the story. The point of the story was Bilbo's journey, which culminated in his theft and delivery of the Arkenstone.

The bit with retracing his steps and finding Bag-End occupied by his relatives - that's denoument.

Welp, can't argue with that.

[TheNecrocomicon]

It also comes to mind that every single Order protagonist character's longtime nemeses have eventually been killed off within the comic.

Roy vs. Thog? Thog ends up buried under half a building and, for all intents and purposes, apparently dead.

Haley vs. Crystal? Crystal ends up dead, twice.

Elan vs. Nale? Nale ends up dead and disintegrated.

Vaarsuvius vs. Zz'dtri? Z ends up dead and left in a trackless desert to rot.

Belkar vs. ... someone? They all tend to end up dead, from kobolds to Miko to Lurkon.

Durkon vs. ... who? Well, the vampire Lurkon only existed from the latter piece of the previous book, and Malack arose and was dusted within the same book (and they even cooperated for a while). Durkon's nemesis could be more accurately pegged as Hilgya, who seems to be determined to be completely unrepentant and very likely headed for some confrontation over Kudzu's well-being, something over which she has already turned to violence at the drop of a hat.

I can't recall the exact comment(s) by The Giant, but he said somewhere that the downfall of every antagonistic character so far has been a result of their own choices and their failure to realize their flaws and make the right decision. Hilgya seems to be on that same trajectory.

[Skull the Troll]

It also comes to mind that every single Order protagonist character's longtime nemeses have eventually been killed off within the comic.

Roy vs. Thog? Thog ends up buried under half a building and, for all intents and purposes, apparently dead.

Haley vs. Crystal? Crystal ends up dead, twice.

Elan vs. Nale? Nale ends up dead and disintegrated.

Vaarsuvius vs. Zz'dtri? Z ends up dead and left in a trackless desert to rot.

Belkar vs. ... someone? They all tend to end up dead, from kobolds to Miko to Lurkon.

Durkon vs. ... who? Well, the vampire Lurkon only existed from the latter piece of the previous book, and Malack arose and was dusted within the same book (and they even cooperated for a while). Durkon's nemesis could be more accurately pegged as Hilgya, who seems to be determined to be completely unrepentant and very likely headed for some confrontation over Kudzu's well-being, something over which she has already turned to violence at the drop of a hat.

I can't recall the exact comment(s) by The Giant, but he said somewhere that the downfall of every antagonistic character so far has been a result of their own choices and their failure to realize their flaws and make the right decision. Hilgya seems to be on that same trajectory.

Indeed. I haven't seen many fantasy stories that actually portray the messy business of sharing a child with someone you don't get along with. I suspect that shes going to end up doing something that either gets her ended, or has her fleeing without the baby.