PDA

View Full Version : Improving a familiar in 5e



Chalkarts
2019-02-14, 01:11 PM
My library for 5e is very limited.
Are their any feats or abilities that can help a familiar keep up?

I'm looking at a Chain Warlock with a sprite.

Unoriginal
2019-02-14, 01:12 PM
My library for 5e is very limited.
Are their any feats or abilities that can help a familiar keep up?

I'm looking at a Chain Warlock with a sprite.

What do you mean by "keep up"?

nickl_2000
2019-02-14, 01:14 PM
No, there isn't. A familiar is mostly a scouting resource and a way to deliver touch spells from a distance. They are mostly disposable.

Chalkarts
2019-02-14, 01:16 PM
What do you mean by "keep up"?

Not get swatted like a fly, maybe some better hp or a dodge.
I think I remember 3rd having a couple ways to beef a familiar a little, 5e seems light on that.

A sprite has 2hp,
A strong gust can kill it.

Sirithhyando
2019-02-14, 01:27 PM
I think it can attune to magic item.
Transfer the magic from a cloak of protection to a tiny cloak of protection then make a tiny full plate for your familiar and transfer other magic to it?
Not sure how much of what I said is really doable RAW/RAI, but it would definitely be fun to see a tiny imp in a full plate armor and a cape. :smallcool:

Sigreid
2019-02-14, 01:42 PM
You could use wish repeatedly to grant it resistances. Giving it some magic items may help a little.

Raynor007
2019-02-14, 02:27 PM
Unearthed Arcana recently released a Sidekick guide that has three "classes" that can level with your party/character. It would need GM approval, naturally, but it could be what you're looking for.

JackPhoenix
2019-02-14, 02:42 PM
Inspiring Leader or any other source of temp HP helps. Inspiring Leader is nice because it doesn't use up any resource, unlike spells, and while ASI is a cost, the feat is useful for everyone.

stoutstien
2019-02-14, 04:36 PM
Find fimiliar Might already be considered the most powerful level 1 ritual or level one spell period.
Depending on class there create homunculus and tiny servants

*Just saw the line about the chain lock.
The Sprite is the glass Cannon choice for you. At will and visibility and flight makes it more of a scout than fighting focused pick. Don't forget it has opposable thumbs so it can manipulate objects pretty well.

sophontteks
2019-02-14, 04:42 PM
Keep the sprite high in the air. Its invisible, so its immune to reaction attacks and the help action doesn't break its invisibility. It can also deliver a spell without breaking invisibility (It is not casting the spell.)

If you keep it high in the air it will be away from most AOEs. It can swoop down, use the help action, and swoop back up.

Sigreid
2019-02-14, 07:10 PM
Unearthed Arcana recently released a Sidekick guide that has three "classes" that can level with your party/character. It would need GM approval, naturally, but it could be what you're looking for.

I really like the sidekick rules but I'd not let it fly with a familiar. I am, however, thinking of using them to replace the way a beastmaster ranger's beast works.

Snowbluff
2019-02-14, 07:14 PM
I'm playing a mid level game where my pixie familiar was given Sidekick levels in the one that gives bonuses to helping. This let her get more skills and give more assistance to the team, as well as buff her HP. The Sidekick rules were in the UA a while back.

For balance, I'd say the fighting and magic sidekick classes are much too strong for a familiar, and maybe only give the familiar half the HP or levels if it's too strong.

beargryllz
2019-02-14, 08:28 PM
Find Familiar is the most brokenly powerful spell in 5e

It doesn't need any improvements

Naanomi
2019-02-14, 08:34 PM
Plus there is no other easily accessible way for players to find out someone’s alignment besides that sprite; a unique and powerful information/social tool

Trustypeaches
2019-02-14, 08:47 PM
Pact of the chain familiars are all about utility. They should always be invisible about 30 feet away from the player if you don’t want them getting struck down by random AoE

Rukelnikov
2019-02-14, 09:18 PM
My library for 5e is very limited.
Are their any feats or abilities that can help a familiar keep up?

I'm looking at a Chain Warlock with a sprite.

Mage Armor is a 1st lvl spell lasts for 8 hours and is not concentration, if someone in your party can cast it, it will bump Imps and Quasits armor by 3 points, and those are already the "most durable" ones, since they have resistance to nonmagical attacks and poison, the Imp in particular is immune to fire and has 10 HP.

If you wanna improve the impact your familiar has in direct combat, the best way to do it is equip it with magic items, Wand of Magic Missiles is awesome, and only an uncommon item. Later on if you can get a ring of spell storing, or something that lets it cast low level spells, you get an extra source of concentration. Bless is only a 1st lvl spell, counterspell can be as low as 3, you can get both in the same ring with a lvl to spare.

My last char had a cube of force by lvl 16, gave it to my imp, who spent all the time in combat reading its action to activate the cube in case of incoming enemies or spells.

Rukelnikov
2019-02-14, 09:25 PM
Pact of the chain familiars are all about utility. They should always be invisible about 30 feet away from the player if you don’t want them getting struck down by random AoE

Imp, Quasit and Pseudodragon give you Magic Resistance if they are within 10 ft of you.

Naanomi
2019-02-14, 09:49 PM
Imp, Quasit and Pseudodragon give you Magic Resistance if they are within 10 ft of you.
eh... a DM ruling at best

Rukelnikov
2019-02-14, 10:08 PM
eh... a DM ruling at best

Not really, according to MM every Imp that is a familiar grants MR if within 10 ft of the bonded caster, the "variant rule" grants both things at once.

According to JC MM stats are the ones to be used: https://www.sageadvice.eu/2015/09/25/the-warlock-familiar-has-all-monster-manual-stats/

Naanomi
2019-02-14, 11:21 PM
Not really, according to MM every Imp that is a familiar grants MR if within 10 ft of the bonded caster, the "variant rule" grants both things at once.

According to JC MM stats are the ones to be used: https://www.sageadvice.eu/2015/09/25/the-warlock-familiar-has-all-monster-manual-stats/

https://mobile.twitter.com/mikemearls/status/625713874654748672

Mjolnirbear
2019-02-14, 11:37 PM
Not really, according to MM every Imp that is a familiar grants MR if within 10 ft of the bonded caster, the "variant rule" grants both things at once.

According to JC MM stats are the ones to be used: https://www.sageadvice.eu/2015/09/25/the-warlock-familiar-has-all-monster-manual-stats/

That ruling mentions stat blocks.

A) it does not mention the variant, and
B) the variant rule is not part of the stat block

Further that tweet did not mention resistrnce at all, let alone sharing it.

Rukelnikov
2019-02-14, 11:53 PM
https://mobile.twitter.com/mikemearls/status/625713874654748672

Mike Mearl's tweets never had any special authority. Also, he answers what he would rule in his table, when he talks about RAW he gives his interpretation, not rulings.


That ruling mentions stat blocks.

A) it does not mention the variant, and
B) the variant rule is not part of the stat block

Further that tweet did not mention resistrnce at all, let alone sharing it.

The tweet didn't need to mention sharing resistance, it says that MM stats in the stat blocks are to be used are to be used. However, you are right in that it is not in the stat block, so I guess it doesn't work like that.

furby076
2019-02-14, 11:59 PM
why is find familiar considered one of the most broken spells?

Danielqueue1
2019-02-15, 02:40 AM
why is find familiar considered one of the most broken spells?

1st level. No concentration. Lasts until killed/dispelled. Only costs 15 gp and an hour of your time.

Depending on the familiar, you can scout out areas without raising suspicion including being able to see and hear through its senses to a certain range. Read the traitorous visier's notes while he is out of his office while you stand "innocently" outside the palace.

Use the help action to give yourself or an ally advantage without wasting any of your own action economy. 9/10 rogues recomend!

Deliver touch range spells at safe distances and even around corners.

Deliver important (small) items to party members or others. The familiar can go well outside the 100 ft range you can cast spells at.

About to get arrested/captured? Hide your familiar in a pocket dimension. The guard/enemy knowing you are a spell caster can bind you, gag you, take away your components and blindfold you, but once they leave you alone out comes the familiar who can fetch the keys or, if you picked a rodent, gnaw through the ropes.

A little less nice, any attack against the familiar is an attack not directed at the squishy wizard. Also, if your enemy "prepared explosive runes today" why waste the spell slot to dispel it or throw away healing when you can just send your familiar in and boom! No more trap.

And thats all before adding warlock options.
And long, long before the discussion about atunement starts.

Oerlaf
2019-02-15, 05:53 AM
I once had familiar boosted.

Inspiring Leader Cha+level
I cast Aid using a 5th-level spell slot due to cleric/warlock multiclass: +20 hp
The druid casts heroes' feast and the

Blood of Gaea
2019-02-15, 12:43 PM
why is find familiar considered one of the most broken spells?
It isn't, it's just a very versatile 1st level spell you can get a lot of use and is useable as a ritual. People just exaggerate how strong it is.

Sigreid
2019-02-15, 01:06 PM
It isn't, it's just a very versatile 1st level spell you can get a lot of use and is useable as a ritual. People just exaggerate how strong it is.

Well, and I'm sure plenty of DMs let players get away with a lot more than they should with it.

I dont think my current wizard has ever cast it in 10 levels, actually.

Rukelnikov
2019-02-15, 01:07 PM
Well, and I'm sure plenty of DMs let players get away with a lot more than they should with it.

I dont think my current wizard has ever cast it in 10 levels, actually.

cast it and give it a wand of MM, then you will notice why its good.

Sigreid
2019-02-15, 01:14 PM
cast it and give it a wand of MM, then you will notice why its good.

Oh, I know it's good. Just haven't bothered with it and think a lot of people over state it a bit. And currently my 10th level wizard's only magic item is a bag of holding, so no arming a sniper forme. And I dont think any of the wizard familiars can say a command word to activate a wand.

Monster Manuel
2019-02-15, 01:15 PM
Keep in mind that familiars in 5e really are more disposable than in 3.5.

I don't recall the exact details, but the act of re-summoning the familiar in 3.5 was an investment; I think it took like 8 hours and some amount of gold per caster level. It was a non-trivial task.

In 5E, the find familiar spell is a ritual, so wizards don't have to have it prepared, and it can be done in the time it takes to do a short rest for a trivial amount of gold. The flavor text of the spell even encourages it, suggesting that your familiar isn't dead, but just un-summoned, and re-casting the spell summons the same spirit as last time.

The whole thing is set up so that it's OK if the familair goes poof, just mildly inconvenient. So, the tiny allotment of HP is not supposed to be such a big deal.

I used to think that you could cast Armor of Agathys on yourself, and have it also affect your familiar to give them temp HPs, but that only works with the Paladin's mount...the Wizard/warlock familairs don't get the same share spell mechanic anymore.

Beechgnome
2019-02-15, 02:42 PM
A Cleric/Abjurer Wizard can, as earlier mentioned, use Aid to give a HP boost, and since it isn't temp HP, you can Stack it with your Arcane Ward to shield it further from harm as long as it's close enough.

With DM consent, you may be able to fashion a platinum ring your familiar can wear to gain the benefit of Warding Bond (like Aid, also not concentration). Then you could give it another buff like Protection from Energy or Greater Invisibility or Stoneskin.

To do it requires 3 levels of Cleric, so it's not an ideal build. You could do a Favored Soul sorcerer too, but then you lose the Arcane Ward and a lot of spell selection versatility.

As for touch spells you'll likely get the most use out of Shocking grasp, Inflict Wounds and Bestow Curse (particularly with a 5th level slot for no concentration) for attacks, Cure wounds, Invisibility, Fly as buffs and Arcane Lock as my favourite touch utility spell.

Rukelnikov
2019-02-15, 03:12 PM
Oh, I know it's good. Just haven't bothered with it and think a lot of people over state it a bit. And currently my 10th level wizard's only magic item is a bag of holding, so no arming a sniper forme. And I dont think any of the wizard familiars can say a command word to activate a wand.

I'm pretty sure Wand of MM doesn't require command word, I sure can't find it in the description, if that was the case though, only a Raven could do it.

My prob with pondering wizard familiars (I only had one with a chainlock, so never thought of it) was that they are not specially intelligent anymore, so I could see that as a kind of a problem. However in the attunement section in the DMG it says:

"Otherwise, at the end of the short rest, the creature gains an intuitive understanding of how to activate any magical properties of the item, including any necessary command words"

So yeah, its all good and dandy, any familiar can use a wand of MM.

Another nice low level trick is casting Dragon's Breath on your familiar, who now canmake an area attack of 3d6 every round :D

Sigreid
2019-02-15, 03:15 PM
I'm pretty sure Wand of MM doesn't require command word, I sure can't find it in the description, if that was the case though, only a Raven could do it.

My prob with pondering wizard familiars (I only had one with a chainlock, so never thought of it) was that they are not specially intelligent anymore, so I could see that as a kind of a problem. However in the attunement section in the DMG it says:

"Otherwise, at the end of the short rest, the creature gains an intuitive understanding of how to activate any magical properties of the item, including any necessary command words"

So yeah, its all good and dandy, any familiar can use a wand of MM.

Well, my recollection is that wands allow you to cast the spell without material component. I believe the verbal component is still required but could be wrong.

Blood of Gaea
2019-02-15, 03:27 PM
Well, my recollection is that wands allow you to cast the spell without material component. I believe the verbal component is still required but could be wrong.
"The spell is cast at the lowest possible spell level, doesn't expend any of the user's spell slots, and requires no components, unless the item's description says otherwise." -pg. 141 of the DMG.

Verbal and Somatic components are also components.

And while some magic items are useful for familiars, the same would be true of a hired mercenary or the like. It's a useful combination, so long as your DM gives you access to those items.

Sigreid
2019-02-15, 03:39 PM
"The spell is cast at the lowest possible spell level, doesn't expend any of the user's spell slots, and requires no components, unless the item's description says otherwise." -pg. 141 of the DMG.

Verbal and Somatic components are also components.

And while some magic items are useful for familiars, the same would be true of a hired mercenary or the like. It's a useful combination, so long as your DM gives you access to those items.

Fair enough. I have played every edition except 4th and dont claim I never mix up their rules.

Rukelnikov
2019-02-15, 03:55 PM
"The spell is cast at the lowest possible spell level, doesn't expend any of the user's spell slots, and requires no components, unless the item's description says otherwise." -pg. 141 of the DMG.

Verbal and Somatic components are also components.

And while some magic items are useful for familiars, the same would be true of a hired mercenary or the like. It's a useful combination, so long as your DM gives you access to those items.

Yeah, that is true, however lots of familiars can fly, you can communicate telepathically with them, are the most faithful ally possible, and can be revived for 10 gp.

Blood of Gaea
2019-02-15, 04:19 PM
Yeah, that is true, however lots of familiars can fly, you can communicate telepathically with them, are the most faithful ally possible, and can be revived for 10 gp.
Yeah, I agree is a very versatile and useful spell. I just don't buy that it's the most powerful spell in the game, and sure as heck not in every situation.

Rukelnikov
2019-02-15, 11:05 PM
Yeah, I agree is a very versatile and useful spell. I just don't buy that it's the most powerful spell in the game, and sure as heck not in every situation.

It's not, Wish is the most powerful spell in the game, and the game knows that.

However, pound for pound, and with the constant widespread use a familiar can get you, it's for sure at the top or very near it.

Look it this way, the most widespread uses for the familiar are scounting and using it for Aid another every single turn, considering it doesn't take a slot to have (most of the time at least), and it doesn't take concentration, you basically now have a feature that says :

"once per round you can grant advantage to an ally as a free action"

That starts sounding pretty good. Heck Masterminds need to wait 2 more lvl to do it as a BA, and only from 30 ft afar.

Now, tie it a bow with a little barrel, and fill it with the contents of a healing potion. Every round on its turn tell it to administer the contents of its cute barrel to the first ally that falls unconscious. Now our feature would look like:

"Once per round, as a free action, pick one of the following:

Grant advantage to an ally's first attack"

Heal 2d4+2 to a fallen ally (1/combat)"

You can keep adding things to this list if you can come up with them, spread ball bearing, caltrops, set a hunters trap, etc.

Such an always on feature for a measly 10 gp every now and then, its a steal.

JackPhoenix
2019-02-16, 12:12 AM
It's not, Wish is the most powerful spell in the game, and the game knows that.

Well, of course it is. It can duplicate the effect of Find Familiar without the material component and as an action instead of hour-long casting time.