Dipping warlock from a RP POV. How do you justify it?

[Klorox]

It’s often suggested dipping any CHA-based class into warlock, specifically hexblade warlock for a couple of levels is an “optimal” choice.

One level (correct me if I’m wrong, I’m AFB) gives you a the best CHA based ranged cantrip in the game, medium armor proficiency, shield proficiency, and allows you to make melee attacks using CHA instead of STR or DEX.

Two levels gives you invocations, so you can either see in the dark better than anybody, or add CHA to the damage of eldritch blast, or a bunch of other fun things.

That’s all well and good, and sure seems powerful, but I have a question:

How do you justify, from a RP sense, leaving that patron you just decided to “dip” into and follow your career as a bard, or paladin, sorcerer, ect.? I always have a hard time with this.

Thank you.

[Malifice]

How do you justify, from a RP sense, leaving that patron you just decided to “dip” into and follow you.

Depends on how you fluff it.

[Dwoops]

You could always do something along the lines of starting to get power from this entity(not necessarily evil, but most-likely) and after you gain some of the power you realize the terrible price that comes with it. From that point on you decide you cannot bargain for more power because the price is too great. The problem is, you already struck a bargain for this initial power and now you are stuck with both the power and the price. This could also lead into the campaign story a bit such as the entity trying to get you to become his faithful servant again through any means or becoming a villain that is hell bent on destroying you because you spurned his/her/its "gift".

[SociopathFriend]

That’s all well and good, and sure seems powerful, but I have a question:

How do you justify, from a RP sense, leaving that patron you just decided to “dip” into and follow your career as a bard, or paladin, sorcerer, ect.? I always have a hard time with this.

Thank you.

I believe that the Hexblade follows a patron that dwells in the Shadow Domain or something similar? And deals with fate and death? As such it's rather easy imo to fluff that your sheer force of personality is having an effect on fate itself and draws at least a cursory glance from her in order to get a bit of power to better keep track of you. How fascinating is it to see someone forging their own destiny through sheer force of will?

[Millstone85]

How do you justify, from a RP sense, leaving that patron you just decided to “dip” into and follow your career as a bard, or paladin, sorcerer, ect.? I always have a hard time with this.First, I would reject the notion that I am *leaving* the patron in any way. You do not stop being a warlock when you take a level in another class. Whatever pact held you still holds you. If anything, the patron now has a servant of level 3+ for the investment of a 3rd-level warlock.

[Bundin]

My character is very selfish and he fears repercussions from earlier decisions. An easy prey for Hadar, The Dark Hunger, who promised power and the protection that brings as an easy "fix".

[1Pirate]

There's a tendency to view warlocks and their patrons as arcane versions of clerics and their deities, but it's not really the same. The patron can't take back the power it has already given. So the way to view a dip would be the result of a narrow agreement between the warlock and patron. Perhaps a fiend just needed a rival in the Prime to be dealt with. An Archfey's grove had to be protected briefly. Or a Great Old One...didn't really care to begin with. An Undying realized they just plain sucked as a patron. I've found hexblade patrons to be a little more vague, but you can still fluff out a minor agreement with the entity.

(of course if the DM wants to have a "Hell hath no fury..." arc in their campaign, their welcome to).

[Man_Over_Game]

There's a few directions you can go:


The bargain is already finished. You've completed the assignment you were told about (in some ancient book, by a mysterious whisper, by a close one, whatever), and now you have some additional power you didn't have before.
It's part of a merger with the entity you were already working with. Perhaps your God defeated one of its enemies and acquired a new power for their worshippers.
It's a sacrifice as part of your duty. There is tainted magic swelling in the Weave related to your deity's duties, and several of its worshippers have been asked to carry some of the burden. You obliged, and the darkness occasionally proves useful to you.
It's a gift from your deity. Rather than providing you with the standard blessings and powers of a normal acolyte, you've been rewarded an "experimental" power to better perform your duties. However, this goes beyond what the deity is normally allowed to do, so the power is not technically "divine". Ao has been punishing the Gods over the last millennia for their abuse of mortal affairs, and so they use a proxy to champion you without showing obvious favoritism.

[nickl_2000]

So, I started a similar thread recently (although from a Paladin point of view). Check it out, it may give you some insight from a Paladin to a Warlock

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?580443-What-caused-your-Paladin-to-make-a-warlock-pact

[Vogie]

The main difference between the Warlocks and the other classes is the power transfer is completely one-way. You took a level of Warlock? You've now got those abilities, regardless of your feelings or actions after that point.

In fiction, the Dresden Files did this really well. (No real spoilers, even though the books been out for 15 years) Their main protagonist, a wizard, has a collection of Fallen Angel BBEGs who are bound into coins. He grabs one to stop an innocent child from grabbing it, but doesn't actually use it - instead burying it in cement in his basement. That being said, just touching it gave him a glimpse of that power, and it kept talking to him, in his head, continually tempting him with more power. In a D&D setting, they would have taken a level of warlock for whatever reason, even one as innocuous as picking up a coin or using something accidentally, then not following that road that is opened up before them.

[Ganders]

Maybe the original deal was for only two levels, and that's all you're entitled to.

It doesn't always have to be selling your soul forever. Sometimes it's just "I'll teach you how to hide in shadows and see in the dark if you help me find an anniversary gift for my lover, and then we'll part ways."

Maybe Oberon was walking down a country road one night, drunk as can be. Your character just happened to have a barrel of ale. Oberon was all like "Dude... I REALLY need a drink! I'll give you anything you want. I know all the secrets in the universe, man!"... and a deal was struck.

[Shuruke]

You could always have it be a student teacher relationship
The warlock stuff is just some of tricks your being taught. Their also showing you some of the stuff from your other classes.

Maybe a sorlock is better learning how to utilize their bloodline magic from this ancient being.

Or the patron bestowed power upon you for a future favor, or because some day you'll do something insignificant to u but aids a plan in motion they have, and they want you to have the power to get to that step eventually.


Maybe the patron giving you power will help you change a life or event for a stronger more obedient warlock to come along hundreds of years from now. A seed falling from your pocket. Some ones purse being taken by your greedy fingers. Etc.


In the end your character could just be a small piece of a much much larger puzzle and their willing to bestow a small amount of power into u as a reward.


I had a player who for rp wanted to be a chainlock devotion palladin
Their imp familiar was always on their shoulder tempting them. Sometimes the palladin would go with the imps ideas because at the time it was the best option and he hated that.

The Paladin had almost died defending a town in the name of Pholtus. A voice called to him. Asling if he believed that those he could save with a longer life was more important than him resting peacefully. He answered yes and thus a nicely dressed being stood above him with a contract. With his dying moments he signed with his blood. He saved thee village and saved many more only to spend eternity being dragged through hell when his short human life ended.

Was a fun character to dm for and I'd gladly allow something like that again

[Samayu]

How do you justify, from a RP sense, leaving that patron you just decided to “dip” into and follow your career as a bard, or paladin, sorcerer, ect.? I always have a hard time with this.


It depends on the contract. As long as you're still working towards the goal, it doesn't matter whether you're gaining more power from your patron or learning it on your own.

[Klorox]

It depends on the contract. As long as you're still working towards the goal, it doesn't matter whether you're gaining more power from your patron or learning it on your own.

I’m mostly looking at hex blade dips. They seem to really give the most insane boosts from just a level or two.

[Son of A Lich!]

In my predominate home brew setting, Lysandra the Ever-mother is the Patron Saint who formed Paladins as to what we know them today ("Today" being AD&D, in this case). However, in life, Lysandra was a bit of jerk-face.

There are numerous hints to this in my campaign world, where this beacon of hope and pillar of fortitude has... curious... attitudes towards Dwarves and Dwarven alliances (Her empire rose from the ashes of a slave state economy after a Dwarven Slave rebellion brought it to it's knees in a very horrifying state, but this was to explain why Dwarves can't be paladins in the rules set). Court trials are more of a ritualistic pyre and witch hunt - In Lyra, if you are accused by the church, you would be taken to a holy site and placed in the pleading grounds (A large bale of wheat and incenses, basically) and it would be lit. If your prayers are heard, you'd be spared from burning to death (Although you may have grievous wounds in repentance depending on your guilt) and if your prayers weren't heard, well you were probably guilty and at least your family got to say good bye before your death.

Lyra was largely inspired by 40k's Sisters of Battle. For the Ever-Mother.

If I were running a 5e game in Lyra, I would gladly allow Fiendish Pacts as a rough equivalent of The Ever-Mother's blessing, even above the Divine Patron.

Good is not Nice. While I would hesitate to call Lysandra a Lawful Good 'Deity', I think the majority of her followers are working on behalf of good in light of (or despite) the Ever-mother's cruelty and ferocity. It was important when she ruled in a time of war, but history can be a hard rut to shake.

[Yunru]

You... made a pact with a weapon for power.
Not a lot to it.

Sword: Hey, want to be more powerful?
PC: Sure! What's the catch?
Sword: You must use me... and maybe something about fighting undead when you find them.
PC: Deal!

[LibraryOgre]

For a dip, you might also post it as an enticing gift.

"Look at this Paladin, so holy and pure. Let's give him just a BIT of power, and see if he remains so..."

[Fryy]

There's a few directions you can go ... The bargain is already finished...

That sounds like a perfectly valid option which I think is usually not considered because people seem to think the 'contract' is always ongoing, but... benefits gained for services rendered prior to gaining your first level in Warlock seems really valid as well as flexible. I.e. You pulled a thorn out of a (proverbial) lion's paw... and now you are reaping the benefits of a prior good deed.

You could RP future/ongoing burdens (or not, as above) for any class... It's your character's story.

To use bards as an example. Bards go to college. I have yet to see a bard player RP'ing paying back their student loans, having to contribute to the annual alumni fundraiser, or having sold their soul to the board of regents. But if the player wants to RP something like that and the DM doesn't mind helping out... why not?


It's a gift from your deity. Rather than providing you with the standard blessings and powers of a normal acolyte, you've been rewarded an "experimental" power to better perform your duties. However, this goes beyond what the deity is normally allowed to do, so the power is not technically "divine". Ao has been punishing the Gods over the last millennia for their abuse of mortal affairs, and so they use a proxy to champion you without showing obvious favoritism.

Wow. I really like that. Your whole post, actually.

[thorgrim29]

I've been toying with a bard dipping into warlock for 2 or 3 levels (3 levels gets me the free familiar and level 2 warlock spells but I miss out on level 9 magical secrets) because he got into debt with a fey creature (probably a nymph, wisdom would not be his high stat...) who sold that debt to a winter Archfey (why yes I read the Dresden Files why do you ask?).

The Archfey doesn't like her court being seen as evil when she just represents a facet of nature so she sends him out to sing her praises and do good deeds in her name and come back to report and entertain 1 week a year. The powers are a representation of his status as an Emissary of Winter. He'd have a familiar that's essentially there to spy on him to make sure he keeps up his end of the bargain, probably some kind of minor fey creature. But since he's kind of bitter about the whole thing and low-key looking for an out he won't want to go back into debt by asking for more power from her.