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View Full Version : DM Help General DMing tips, I neeed them



Spore
2019-02-27, 06:12 AM
So, half my old group moved one country over and we will be visiting them in a month. As no concrete game plan popped up, I volunteered to DM. I do not like DMing as much since I don't do well in new situations (and heck if DMing is nothing but improv after 2-3 hours even IF players stay on the beaten path).

I will refluff the The Hidden Shrine of Tamoachan to fit an ancient Egyptian theme. It is basically a dungeon crawl, they are a guild (basically an adventuring party with official right to loot anything they find) of adventurers. The area is heavily trapped and filled with very typical dungeon monsters.

In the end, they will find the (cursed) crown of the old God Pharao (a long dead lich) to ensure the rightful heir to rule against the warlords. The final area will include a boss fight against their 'tour guide', a self proclaimed hero and member of their guild, who is actually just a thief without combat abilities that hides as soon as combat or danger starts out. He will stay to guard the camels outside, but actually sneak in after the heroes and take the crown, by force if needed.

What do I need?
1) General tips how to keep players engaged. One could easily say: "That is your dungeon, deal with it." but my players tend to roam and split apart. They are especially bad at puzzles. Is it bad form to drop hints OOC?

2) How do I keep myself calm? I tend to start throwing out hints too early when I get frustrated or bored. Stuff is always obvious when you know the solution. Combat I can deal with, I just have to try to allow the players to shine and not go the "DM PC" route via the monsters just to make them seem extra scary. I am skilled at forming certain welcoming environments as I work with a lot of customers for a living, but exciting or dangerous I have never "created".

3) I do not know the player's builds beforehand. I might go hard on some brittle builds, and easy on guys that oneshot stuff. So far we have a "Pandaren" Rogue, a (presumably human or goliath) barbarian, likely a cleric (of a Not!-Egypt deity no less) and one wild card. The wizard player could not come due to his wife being in the last week of her second pregnancy, so I strongly assume the wild card will do something arcane but she likes a variety of stuff. They play in "niches" so I assume nothing will be doubled up on.

I do not fear for nova builds as they are still starting out on 5e. The barbarian player might actually build a Sorcadin someday, but not for this game.

4) What can I do to shorten the adventure subtly so the players can actually finish this in a 8-10h session? I am not worried about finishing early, but I want the finale to be seen. It would be a shame if not.

5) General tips? I am not an experienced DM but I know my players a bit. Still, they surprised me with a few "brute force" moments. In past sessions they already tortured an NPC I inserted as an informant, simply bashed my encounter's head in in 2 turns because they had prep time and if I hadn't made it abundantly clear there is a large organization behind the inquisitor spy they encountered, they would've held her hostage as well.

EggKookoo
2019-02-27, 07:19 AM
1) General tips how to keep players engaged. One could easily say: "That is your dungeon, deal with it." but my players tend to roam and split apart. They are especially bad at puzzles. Is it bad form to drop hints OOC?

You have a few things here. Getting the players motivated to run your scenario is a core element of DMing. Did you have them generate backgrounds? You could play off of their selected traits/flaws/ideals. But it seems like this is a single long session, so it's not a terrible thing to simply provide some obvious hooks to get them invested.

Keeping them from splitting up can be handled by dropping threats that a single PC will have trouble with.

Regarding puzzles, those are always tricky. If they're stumped, consider letting them roll past -- e.g. they make Investigation checks or even some homebrew "eureka" roll (have a player roll a d20, if the result is less than or equal to their PC's Wis, drop a hint). Players think they like puzzles but once they get stumped it drains a lot of the fun.


2) How do I keep myself calm? I tend to start throwing out hints too early when I get frustrated or bored. Stuff is always obvious when you know the solution. Combat I can deal with, I just have to try to allow the players to shine and not go the "DM PC" route via the monsters just to make them seem extra scary. I am skilled at forming certain welcoming environments as I work with a lot of customers for a living, but exciting or dangerous I have never "created".

For one, don't be afraid to potentially kill a PC. Players need to understand they could die, even if the chance is remote. There are some tricks for pulling dead PCs back, but worst case the player rolls up a new one. Maybe even have some backups?

But also, dangerous doesn't need to mean a high likelihood of death. If the PCs can succeed 90% of the time, but feel like the consequences would be really bad for the 10% of the time they fail, the players will get that sense of danger. So you don't need to make monsters extra tough so much as try to hang the threat of possible death over the players' heads, even if they're pretty sure they'll succeed.

Also, mood mood mood. When you describe the environment, go beyond clinical details. How do the rooms smell? What's the lighting like? Does the PC get a vague, creepy feeling along their spine when they crawl into that tight spot? Are some monsters kind of gross and nasty? Is that goblin unexpectedly smart and competent, and stares at the PCs with contempt? Mix in some ambiguous descriptions and try to let the players' imaginations do the heavy lifting.


3) I do not know the player's builds beforehand. I might go hard on some brittle builds, and easy on guys that oneshot stuff. So far we have a "Pandaren" Rogue, a (presumably human or goliath) barbarian, likely a cleric (of a Not!-Egypt deity no less) and one wild card. The wizard player could not come due to his wife being in the last week of her second pregnancy, so I strongly assume the wild card will do something arcane but she likes a variety of stuff. They play in "niches" so I assume nothing will be doubled up on.

I do not fear for nova builds as they are still starting out on 5e. The barbarian player might actually build a Sorcadin someday, but not for this game.

Their builds shouldn't matter too much in aggregate. Just expect that sometimes a given PC might have a "get out of jail free" feature that upends a given encounter. You might have to think on your feet there, but there's nothing wrong with altering the game on the fly (although I suppose some might disagree).


4) What can I do to shorten the adventure subtly so the players can actually finish this in a 8-10h session? I am not worried about finishing early, but I want the finale to be seen. It would be a shame if not.

I would say first pick out the key elements you want to make sure the players get to see. Eight-10 hours is a long session, but you should be able to fit 4-5 showcase moments in there. Then the rest of your adventure should be in the service of getting the PCs from one key element to another. Don't be afraid to skip over stuff or jump forward. Don't ask for rolls unless you need to. Let combats end early (maybe the NPCs surrender or run when they start to lose?).

Definitely decide on the ending and do everything to get the PCs there. You have a target you're moving toward. If you're going too fast you can always add some content to fill it out, such as a random encounter. And keep in mind things often take longer to resolve than you might expect. Bad die rolls can cause a combat to stretch out.


5) General tips? I am not an experienced DM but I know my players a bit. Still, they surprised me with a few "brute force" moments. In past sessions they already tortured an NPC I inserted as an informant, simply bashed my encounter's head in in 2 turns because they had prep time and if I hadn't made it abundantly clear there is a large organization behind the inquisitor spy they encountered, they would've held her hostage as well.

When I construct an encounter or point in the adventure, I don't try to predict exactly what my players will do, but rather try to imagine categories of response. They kill everyone, they sneak past, they ignore it, and so on. Then I try to plan out what would happen in response to each category. When they players do something, I fit it into the best category and go from there.

So for example, they encounter your informant. You have "they kill her," "they question her" (which would cover torture perhaps), "they ignore her," maybe "they ally with her" (which could mean bribing or persuading, or even convincing her to join the party). Think of the possible results of the party's actions -- and really there should only be a handful -- and then fit their actions into one of those results during gameplay.

Good luck!

Toofey
2019-02-27, 08:22 AM
So here's my $.02

Do a session 0, either with everyone together or individually. Ask directly what the players like, and what they're interested in doing. Let them know what you're interested, and give them some general background on the settings your using for coming up with their character backgrounds which you should insist on getting. Not the character sheet book background, but what happened in the characters life up until the point the campaign starts.

First few sessions you should set up an encounter (which you should later spin into being related to the grand plot) but it's really about letting the players feel each other out. You really don't need much other than a monster you want to use, and a 3 act structure for this. (first encounter, meeting of the party and RPing that out, final boss). If you start at first level you should level up at the end of this (potentially twice, once to 2nd at the end of the first session and once to 3rd at the end of the arc, but that's all color) so the players get a taste of reward, and the characters should as well in the taste of a little loot.

From here there's the campaign and the arc or adventure. The Campaign is the big story, the arc or adventure is the immediate challenge or problem. A not terrible way to view these is a thing I heard somewhere that I don't remember the source at all but it's something like 'the story is what happens when the heroes get in the way of the villain getting what they want' and this is a great way to look at an RPG game. In every situation, and in the larger campaign, you should understand what the villain wants to happen, and understand who the villain and the minions are/what their resources are. You should also have a working understanding of the setting you are using (who has power, what is it like on the streets, what are the people like, etc...) You will have a plan for what you want to happen in each story, but this will not always happen, but if you understand the world around the characters you will know how to react when they surprise you, which they will.

Finally, embrace the players surprising you and their agency, it's a lot of fun and a lot less work when the players are taking charge of the plot (note: *if you have done the work on the bad guys and the setting*). The game is about crafting a story ultimately and the PC's are the characters in this story. Embrace them taking actions and making decisions. If they want to try something let them. Not only does this make more fun for everyone, this perspective ultimately serves to short circuit a lot of common DM problems like railroading, over rules dependence, etc...

oooh, one more finally no DMPCs, none. It's not good for the game. If you have a character that you really want to play go play them, in fact keep playing could really be a whole other 'one more thing'.

Spore
2019-02-27, 08:28 AM
It is a one shot, i hope as much was obvious. I will read all your responses tonight. I thank you for the extensive tips so far.

Toofey
2019-02-27, 09:35 AM
Give the answer you want to give

Man_Over_Game
2019-02-27, 12:24 PM
For puzzles, you can make them as complex as you want, but then litter the hell out of the area with clues that are locked behind skill checks. Writings on the wall that require a specific language that indicate where a hidden panel may be, and the hidden panel can be found with a high Perception check, and the panel contains the gears that handle the locking part of the door and are easily understood with a successful Intelligence check. There's a corpse with a note on him that is written in some kind of magical script, a "diary" of his last thoughts before he died, and it provides clues as to what DOESN'T work.

Have each clue provide another clue, getting that much closer to unlocking the door. Maybe they don't need to control the door, but just destroying the locking mechanism is enough to get them to pass (although they couldn't prevent anything from following them, resulting in a harder encounter later when enemy reinforcements show up).

Beyond puzzles, have a few generic events take place that provide threats and clues on how to advance. Maybe some enemies are patrolling the area and have part of a map of the area laid out with where their patrols are going (because they're stupid and need a map).

Don't give the players a clue, have them work for it. If they roll for a skill that you didn't plan for, don't say "Nothing happens". Instead, create something that they helped avoid or something to improve their situation.

Maybe they searched for a trap that wasn't there despite them rolling high. Instead of just saying they didn't find a trap, say they DID! And finding/disarming it helped them understand how most of the traps in the area are going to be designed (Advantage to find/disarm future traps for the module).

Spore
2019-02-28, 06:52 AM
While I understand DMing is sometimes smoke and mirrors, I did not anticipate it being THAT much of it.

EggKookoo
2019-02-28, 07:23 AM
While I understand DMing is sometimes smoke and mirrors, I did not anticipate it being THAT much of it.

It's mostly smoke and mirrors. Back in the 90s I would do zero prep -- just have a rough idea of the "plot" and make up NPC stats on the fly. I plan a bit more now but that's because I'm older and lazier.

It has to be heavily improv-based because the players can do anything, and you can't possibly prepare for that. Once you get good at coming up with content on the fly to handle their more left-field behavior, you can also use those skills to handle conventional stuff. Not saying you shouldn't prep -- you definitely should if for no other reason than to give yourself a mental break from time to time -- but just don't be locked down to what you prep. You'll have ideas that you never get to. That's fine, recycle them for the next adventure.

MoiMagnus
2019-02-28, 08:27 AM
While I understand DMing is sometimes smoke and mirrors, I did not anticipate it being THAT much of it.

To be fair, there are a LOT of different DMing styles, and a lot of them cannot be compared to each other because they target different kind of players. If you can get away with smoke and mirrors, this is definitely the easiest way to go, and the easiest way to "maximize the enjoyment". However, some players have too much understanding of what is happening, and using smoke and mirrors with them will make they feel they have no agency.
("What's the point of succeeding at something if the fight are balanced to be winnable whatever the number of failure beforehand?")

My main DM had a classification of players (note that most players are in two categories, not one):
1) The Actor. The actor want to experience the life of its character. He will not like spoilers, or meta discussion that give him information he isn't supposed to have. To please an actor, you have to use the plot hooks he gives to you, and make sure the technical part of the game doesn't contradict too much the character he want to play. He is the kind of person to take powers that are objectively bad, because they felt like "of course my character knows how to do that".
2) The Explorer (me). The explorer want to discover stuff. It can be the universe, the story, the characters. He is the kind of person that read the wiki about games he plays even before finishing the game, so he has no problems with non-major spoilers, or having information he isn't supposed to know. Around the end of the campaign, he will probably have a better knowledge of the universe than the DM itself, and will try to help filling the blanks, and ensuring internal consistency. To please an explorer, you need to have an interesting setting and/or story, and be open to input about improvement.
3) The Power Gamer. The power gamer want to feel powerful or important in the universe. He will optimize its character, but doesn't particularly enjoy doing so, so will not be very happy if you nerf the power he chose (because he optimized for nothing). So if he find something OP or broken, rather than immediately nerfing it, letting him have some fun, and then explain that it was fun but not really balanced so it needs to be nerf is a better course of action. To please a power gamer, give him occasion to feel that his character is more powerful than what it should be.
4) The Munchkin. Contrary to the power gamer, the munchkin want to be powerful at the meta level. He want to optimize, and showing he is good at optimizing. But unless he is also a power gamer, he will be fine at optimizing a support role (making the rest of the group OP), and will be fine with nerfing the things he broke (finding an exploit and forcing the DM to nerf it is a "victory" against the game). The munchkin is probably the player the most likely to see trough your smoke and mirrors, because he is actively searching for how you could exploit the rules to TPK the whole team, and how he should prevent that. To please a munchkin, you have to give him things to optimize, and make the world react as rationally as possible.
5) The Instigator. The instigator wants stuff to happen. He like chaos, unpredictability, and unexpected consequences of choices. The range go from the "looney tune" to the "traitor that backstab the team". To please an instigator, you have to give him chaos, either uncontrolled, or due to its actions. And make sure this chaos don't affect too much the players that don't want chaos (so that the other players don't hate him for the chaos he produce).
6) The Mind. The mind like to solve puzzle, find solutions, understand what is happening. While he will not optimize as much its character as the munchkin or the power gamer, he will be more efficient than them when there is an actual problem to be solve by optimizing and/or finding RP solutions. To please the mind, you need to have secrets, prophecy to decrypt, or just put some problems open enough to have a lot of different solutions.
7) The Social. The social don't care all that much about the game itself. He like to have fun with friends (and future friends), have some good memories to talk about later ("You remember when Jack did 3 critical hits on a raw and the boss was killed in a single round?"), but it could be a board game or a film, that would be mostly the same. The more people enjoy the evening, the better for him, so he will gladly take the role nobody else want, or make the sidekick that doesn't have a lot of influence on the campaign (except maybe being a comic relief). To please the social, make sure everybody have fun, and don't force him to be a main character, don't shame him for not participating enough.
8) The Jerk. Some people just like when bad stuff happen to other peoples. Try to avoid those players, or try to please them trough the other categories they might fall into. Or use a non-cooperative RPG instead of D&D.

Man_Over_Game
2019-02-28, 12:08 PM
It's mostly smoke and mirrors. Back in the 90s I would do zero prep -- just have a rough idea of the "plot" and make up NPC stats on the fly. I plan a bit more now but that's because I'm older and lazier.

It has to be heavily improv-based because the players can do anything, and you can't possibly prepare for that. Once you get good at coming up with content on the fly to handle their more left-field behavior, you can also use those skills to handle conventional stuff. Not saying you shouldn't prep -- you definitely should if for no other reason than to give yourself a mental break from time to time -- but just don't be locked down to what you prep. You'll have ideas that you never get to. That's fine, recycle them for the next adventure.

Heh, this is exactly how I DM right now. Entire dungeons made up on the fly, puzzles that I vaguely understand that get fleshed out as players search for clues, bad guys who's plots get more interesting and complex as the players unravel them.

The fact is, you could write 50 pages of notes and end up using 5. Rather than that, I just come up with generalized notes about specific events/people/places so that I can give clues or create things as needed. Rather than creating an entire dungeon that won't ever come up, I just jot down some notes about it, like:


Cauthon Stronghold. Currently held by Orcs. Has secret passageways in the basement that Orcs probably don't know about. Players learn about the passageways as a rare rumor. The Orcs finally figured out where all the traps were for the main area, but the passageways are heavily trapped. Was intended to be a mausoleum for a lord, before he died in it prematurely by raiders. CR 6. Should take about 2 Orc skirmishes, 2 Orc battles inside, one Orc boss fight. Hidden passageways have 2 trap encounters and one Undead boss fight. Makes a good base for players, unless some Cauthon douche demands it back.

EggKookoo
2019-02-28, 03:41 PM
Heh, this is exactly how I DM right now. Entire dungeons made up on the fly, puzzles that I vaguely understand that get fleshed out as players search for clues, bad guys who's plots get more interesting and complex as the players unravel them.

One of my most successful recurring Werewolf: The Apocalypse villains was named after the brand of pencil (https://www.berkleyjensen.com/product/berkley-jensen-hb-2-pencils--96-ct-/3000000000000061569) I was holding during gameplay. To this day my players look back on Jensen the werebear with fondness.

Great Dragon
2019-02-28, 09:52 PM
Sporeegg - they are a guild (basically an adventuring party with official right to loot anything they find) of adventurers.
This could be the main reason they stick together, because they are IC Friends and have a common Goal.
But, who sent them to the Temple? What do they want the PCs to find and retrieve, and what is the reward?
How much do the PCs know IC about the Temple? How much is truth, and how much exaggeration?
Do they know of rumors that imply that wandering around alone is a Bad Idea?


ChrisBasken - Did you have them generate backgrounds? You could play off of their selected traits/flaws/ideals.
If they are making their PCs away from the table, and then informing you afterwards - this should not be too much of a problem.


Toofey - Let them know what you're interested, and give them some general background on the settings your using for coming up with their character backgrounds which you should insist on getting. Not the character sheet book background, but what happened in the characters life up until the point the campaign starts.
you can also recommend Xanathar's Guide to Everything for Character History.

Since it's a one-shot, you'll have to decide if Backgrounds and History are really important, since these are meant for Plot Hooks and Side Quests in Long Campaigns. Sure if the PC has a Flaw/Ideal that they Roleplay, reward them with Inspiration.

As for burn out, remember to take breaks when you or the Players are stuck or frustrated.
Even a 15 min break can be enough of a breather to refocus and get back into the game.
It's been awhile since I've DMed Long Games, but I did need to take breaks every few hours.